Jump to content




Welcome to Unexplained Mysteries! Please sign in or create an account to start posting and to access a host of extra features.


- - - - -

Scam or Religion


  • Please log in to reply
58 replies to this topic

#1    GreenmansGod

GreenmansGod

    Bio-Electric sentient being.

  • Member
  • 10,639 posts
  • Joined:23 Jun 2004
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:The Hurricane State

  • May the laughter ye give today return to thee 3 fold.

Posted 12 July 2013 - 06:31 PM

How do you know what is religion or a scam.  To me most religions seem like scams. A while back, 1979, Issac Bonewits (RIP), one of the great leaders of  the Pagan religions wrote a paper on how to tell the difference.
I will say it is little long so, here is the link to it.   http://www.neopagan.net/ABCDEF.html

Quote

Events in the last several decades have clearly indicated just how dangerous some religious and secular groups (usually called “cults” by those opposed to them) can be to their own members as well as to anyone else whom they can influence. “Brainwashing,” beatings, child abuse, rapes, murders, mass suicides, military drilling and gunrunning, meddling in civil governments, international terrorism, and other crimes have been charged against leaders and members of many groups, and in far too many cases those accusations have been correct. None of this has been very surprising to historians of religion or to other scholars of what are usually labled “new” religions (no matter how old they may be in their cultures of origin). Minority groups, especially religious ones, are often accused of crimes by members of the current majority. In many ways, for example, the “Mormons” were the “Moonies” of the 19th century — at least in terms of being an unusual minority belief system that many found “shocking” at the time — and the members of the Unification Church could be just as “respectable” a hundred years from now as the Latter Day Saints are today.

Nonetheless, despite all the historical and philosophical warnings that could be issued, ordinary people faced with friends or loved ones joining an “unusual” group, or perhaps contemplating joining one themselves, need a relatively simple way to evaluate just how dangerous or harmless a given group is liable to be, without either subjecting themselves to its power or judging it solely on theological or ideological grounds (the usual method used by anti-cult groups)

He put little test at the bottom, How does your religion or belief system stack up. I haven't done it yet so I'll get back with y'all.

"The moment you declare a set of ideas to be immune from criticism, satire, derision, or contempt, freedom of thought becomes impossible." Salman Rushdie

#2    JMPD1

JMPD1

    Child of the Universe

  • Member
  • 6,022 posts
  • Joined:10 Mar 2005
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:upstate New York

  • you want to know the answer? Hell, I'm still working on the question!

Posted 12 July 2013 - 06:59 PM

If you have to be told what to believe, and if you are asked/told/demanded/commanded to "donate" funds, then in my opinion, it is a scam.  It is my belief that if you follow a preacher/priest, what have you, you are not following god; you are following one individuals idea of god.  God, however you define the word, does not need a middleman or spokesperson.

What need does god have for money?  "Oh, but we need to build churches/temples/cathedrals, so that god will be pleased!"  or "Well, ya know that the reverend/pastor/priest/rabbi/imam needs to be paid"  or  "But, we have these charities, and we help the less fortunate."


If I choose to help the less fortunate, I will give money and or time directly to an orgazization that I trust.  NOT to a church or other religious outfit.


So to answer the post, I belief that 'religion' is a scam, and priests are the conmen.   Just my two cents worth.


Corrected for typos

Edited by JMPD1, 12 July 2013 - 07:23 PM.

Quote of the Year 2006: HAY! I did more then just say I wanna be ina a man sammich! - SC

You have the right to remain silent.  You might want to think about exercising that right more often

Not Another Moment Lost To Seizures

#3    Mystic Crusader

Mystic Crusader

    Poltergeist

  • Member
  • 2,466 posts
  • Joined:22 Apr 2008
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Arizona

  • "What would you rather be, a bus driver, or a super terrorist?"

Posted 12 July 2013 - 07:07 PM

It's a charade, a mask, to present to the world a false interpretation of themselves.  For very selfish reasons, money, fame, power.

"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious
conviction." - Blaise Pascal

#4    markdohle

markdohle

    Alien Abducter

  • Member
  • 5,029 posts
  • Joined:21 May 2006
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Atlanta area

Posted 12 July 2013 - 07:08 PM

If someone belongs to a parish, coven, temple,  etc., and they worship there and take part, then to be asked to leave a stipen is ok, to be asked to give everything, or to be threatened over it, then it is time to move on.  Religion is a good thing if there is deep spritruality that goes with it, without that, religions becomes rigid and lifeless.  Spriturality without a community can tend towards shallowness and self delusion.  I believe it is hard to find the middle ground, I still sturggle with it.

peace
Mark


#5    and then

and then

    Abyssus Abyssum Invocat

  • Member
  • 15,800 posts
  • Joined:15 Dec 2011
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Land's End

  • Because what came before never seems enough...

Posted 12 July 2013 - 07:22 PM

View Postmarkdohle, on 12 July 2013 - 07:08 PM, said:

If someone belongs to a parish, coven, temple,  etc., and they worship there and take part, then to be asked to leave a stipen is ok, to be asked to give everything, or to be threatened over it, then it is time to move on.  Religion is a good thing if there is deep spritruality that goes with it, without that, religions becomes rigid and lifeless.  Spriturality without a community can tend towards shallowness and self delusion.  I believe it is hard to find the middle ground, I still sturggle with it.

peace
Mark
Some of the items in the test I could honestly rate zero but gave a one.  On rigidity of dogma I gave a ten.  On acceptance of sexual preferences I gave an 8.  Totalled out at 36.  I was looking at MY individual Baptist church family.  For me the issue here is less about a person's faith and more about the fellowship he/she has chosen to be a part of.  No doubt many "churches" are led by people who I would never choose to follow.  Bottom line for me is that if any man or woman stands in a pulpit and says ANYTHING that does not line up closely with God's word as I am able to understand it then I'm out the door.  It isn't about the society of people, it's about trying to follow God's word.  In the end I will have some "splainin' to do if I've followed some nut job instead of trying my best to do what I'm instructed in the word of the Creator.

  We've cast the world, we've set the stage,
  for what could be, the darkest age...
“This is like playing poker with a guy who cheated you twice before. You know who does that, a moron.

#6    kannin

kannin

    Punisher of the wicked

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,772 posts
  • Joined:04 Jun 2013
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:canada

  • the secret to change is to focus all of your energy,not fighting the old, but building the new

Posted 12 July 2013 - 07:27 PM

hmmmm this is a pretty deep and hard hitting post


#7    Q-C

Q-C

    BugWhisperer

  • Member
  • 5,533 posts
  • Joined:06 Mar 2012
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Tejas

Posted 12 July 2013 - 08:07 PM

Not quite on topic, but like the old saying goes (with a little rewording):

"If you find the perfect religion, once you join, it is no longer perfect."

Bigfoot is in the eye of the beholder

Scottish Scientists Only!

#8    StarMountainKid

StarMountainKid

    Cheese

  • Member
  • 4,898 posts
  • Joined:17 Feb 2007
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Star Mountain, Corporate States of America

  • We have problems because we stray from what is innocent and pure.

Posted 12 July 2013 - 09:01 PM

Another question on the test could be, "Would you buy a used car from these people?"

The acceptance of authority does not lead to intelligence.
A mind untouched by thought...the end of knowledge.
To see reality loose your opinions.

#9    GreenmansGod

GreenmansGod

    Bio-Electric sentient being.

  • Member
  • 10,639 posts
  • Joined:23 Jun 2004
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:The Hurricane State

  • May the laughter ye give today return to thee 3 fold.

Posted 12 July 2013 - 09:10 PM

I came up with a 19 for Reformed Druids, but the guy who wrote that was one of the founding members.

"The moment you declare a set of ideas to be immune from criticism, satire, derision, or contempt, freedom of thought becomes impossible." Salman Rushdie

#10    prophecycryptoresearcher

prophecycryptoresearcher

    Alien Embryo

  • Member
  • Pip
  • 5 posts
  • Joined:13 Jul 2013

Posted 13 July 2013 - 09:42 AM

I wouldn't trust a pagan to decide what makes a good religion for a christian, jew, catholic or even an atheist.


#11    Arbenol

Arbenol

    Psychic Spy

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,113 posts
  • Joined:09 Aug 2011
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:New Zealand

Posted 13 July 2013 - 09:53 AM

View Postprophecycryptoresearcher, on 13 July 2013 - 09:42 AM, said:

I wouldn't trust a pagan to decide what makes a good religion for a christian, jew, catholic or even an atheist.

What would be a good religion for an atheist?


#12    Beckys_Mom

Beckys_Mom

    Sarcastic Muppet..!

  • Member
  • 51,196 posts
  • Joined:01 Nov 2005
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Ireland

  • "I hate pretentious people. I mean, what is the point in applying exorbitantly extensive vocabulary, it is just straightforwardly unnecessary".

Posted 13 July 2013 - 05:33 PM

View PostArbenol68, on 13 July 2013 - 09:53 AM, said:

What would be a good religion for an atheist?

You just know what the answer will be  lol

Posted ImageRAW Berris... Dare you enter?

If there's a heaven...I hope to hell I get there !

#13    Purplos

Purplos

    Majestic 12 Operative

  • Member
  • 6,577 posts
  • Joined:03 Apr 2005
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:Fighting ennui in suburban NJ

  • Everything important is infinite.

Posted 13 July 2013 - 06:29 PM

To me, 'scam' only comes into it when there is money involved and that giving money is mandatory to be 'saved' or participate or anything.

I have no problem at all with preachers etc. being paid money. They impart knowledge they studied to get just like teachers and provide services for people who wish to take part in those services.

It's a scam when the group uses subterfuge to convince people that they must give money or that they must do a particular thing for the benefit of the group or the leader without real benefit for themselves.

Embrace the impossible.

#14    GreenmansGod

GreenmansGod

    Bio-Electric sentient being.

  • Member
  • 10,639 posts
  • Joined:23 Jun 2004
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:The Hurricane State

  • May the laughter ye give today return to thee 3 fold.

Posted 13 July 2013 - 06:59 PM

View Postprophecycryptoresearcher, on 13 July 2013 - 09:42 AM, said:

I wouldn't trust a pagan to decide what makes a good religion for a christian, jew, catholic or even an atheist.

Because they are a Pagan or is there another reason? One thing about Pagans, they don't actually care what Path you follow as long as you play nice in the sand box and scoop your poop.

"The moment you declare a set of ideas to be immune from criticism, satire, derision, or contempt, freedom of thought becomes impossible." Salman Rushdie

#15    Ryu

Ryu

    Born to fail.

  • Member
  • 4,023 posts
  • Joined:17 Dec 2010
  • Gender:Not Selected
  • Location:Where you'll never find me

  • [i]All rivers find their own way to the ocean.[/i] -Unknown

Posted 13 July 2013 - 07:38 PM

View Postprophecycryptoresearcher, on 13 July 2013 - 09:42 AM, said:

I wouldn't trust a pagan to decide what makes a good religion for a christian, jew, catholic or even an atheist.

Why should a pagan be less trustworthy than anyone else, hmm?

Posted Image




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users