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The Cold War continues


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#1    redhen

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Posted 19 August 2013 - 10:16 PM

Politicians in the People's Republic of China have received a memo warning that  "Power could escape their grip, they are being told, unless the party eradicates seven subversive currents coursing through Chinese society."

What do these seven deadly sins consist of?

"The first was “Western constitutional democracy”; others included promoting “universal values” of human rights, Western-inspired notions of media independence and civil society, ardently pro-market “neo-liberalism,” and “nihilist” criticisms of the party’s traumatic past."


#2    and then

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Posted 19 August 2013 - 10:58 PM

View Postredhen, on 19 August 2013 - 10:16 PM, said:

Politicians in the People's Republic of China have received a memo warning that  "Power could escape their grip, they are being told, unless the party eradicates seven subversive currents coursing through Chinese society."

What do these seven deadly sins consist of?

"The first was “Western constitutional democracy”; others included promoting “universal values” of human rights, Western-inspired notions of media independence and civil society, ardently pro-market “neo-liberalism,” and “nihilist” criticisms of the party’s traumatic past."
Kind of like being a "little pregnant"... capitalism - even in small doses will be their undoing.  That's a GOOD thing, I think.

  Imagination is the power in the turn of a phrase.

#3    spartan max2

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 12:17 AM

Give people a taste of freedom and they will want more

" I imagine that the intellegent people are the ones so intellegent that they dont even need or want to look "intellegent" anymore".
Criss Jami

#4    Frank Merton

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 01:46 AM

What one memo writer says is hardly a statement of Chinese policy.  There are many old party cadres still alive and many who fear for their pensions (as happened in Russia) if the party falls.

The biggest threat to the party is probably entirely internal, as there are many other party members who want to go in a more westerly direction, although one-party state system is seen as the best arrangement, it can be made more democratic.

The country, like all large countries, has hegemonic tendencies toward its smaller neighbors, without really being aware of it, but it is not set on world conquest the way Stalinist Russia was.


#5    Sir Wearer of Hats

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 02:38 AM

Anyone else finding it scarily easy to imagine replacing some of the words in the OP with "America", "Islamofascists" "anti-governmental agitators" and "free men"?


#6    redhen

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 04:18 AM

View PostSir Wearer of Hats, on 20 August 2013 - 02:38 AM, said:

Anyone else finding it scarily easy to imagine replacing some of the words in the OP with "America", "Islamofascists" "anti-governmental agitators" and "free men"?

No, not really. I don't see any scary or threatening words in "constitutional democracy”,  “universal values” of human rights, media independence, civil society,  pro-market “neo-liberalism,"

OK, that last one is kinda scary. Any ideology that is "pro-market" at the expense of all other values is dangerous.


#7    Kaa-Tzik

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Posted 31 August 2013 - 02:29 PM

View Postredhen, on 20 August 2013 - 04:18 AM, said:

No, not really. I don't see any scary or threatening words in "constitutional democracy”,  “universal values” of human rights, media independence, civil society,  pro-market “neo-liberalism,"

OK, that last one is kinda scary. Any ideology that is "pro-market" at the expense of all other values is dangerous.
I see the point you make, though there is another way of looking at this. "Constitutional democracy" is not democracy as any Greek would understand it, they would see it as an elected oligarchy, or even elected dictatorship. And "universal values" are simply that we all wish to live our lives without being harmed or harming others, though it is often used to mean one particular world view, and that those not subscribing to that world view are beyond the pale, barely human even. "Media independance" leads to what has happened in Britain, were the media think they are gods and can do as they like. And as for "civil society", well, I hear Cameron spouting words like this out, but I do not even know what he means other than that we are all "nice" to each other, as if we all want to be at each others throats. To me these are all throw away buzz words for the moment, something to make us all think politicians know what they are doing, as apposed to the opposite. It's all words without meaning, or any meaning you want.

Edited by Kaa-Tzik, 31 August 2013 - 02:50 PM.


#8    redhen

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Posted 01 September 2013 - 05:04 AM

View PostKaa-Tzik, on 31 August 2013 - 02:29 PM, said:

To me these are all throw away buzz words for the moment, something to make us all think politicians know what they are doing, as apposed to the opposite. It's all words without meaning, or any meaning you want.

Yes, they are political buzzwords here in the West. We have some politicians who merely pay lip-service to these ideals.But at least they are something we strive for, in China they are denounced and banished.


#9    Frank Merton

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Posted 01 September 2013 - 05:11 AM

All societies have values, both affirmative (take care of the old and the handicapped, provide justice, educate the children, optimize health care and living standards, etc.) and the negative (no slavery, no corruption, no massacres, and no gassing civilians.

In the West a great deal is made of freedom of the press (mostly so they can make a lot of money distorting things) and freedom of religion (not much different).


#10    spartan max2

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Posted 01 September 2013 - 02:44 PM

View PostFrank Merton, on 01 September 2013 - 05:11 AM, said:

All societies have values, both affirmative (take care of the old and the handicapped, provide justice, educate the children, optimize health care and living standards, etc.) and the negative (no slavery, no corruption, no massacres, and no gassing civilians.

In the West a great deal is made of freedom of the press (mostly so they can make a lot of money distorting things) and freedom of religion (not much different).

yes because it would be so much better to have one state ran media source. So that the government can tell us what to believe :innocent:


We just need to de-monopolize our media. 6 companies control 90 percent of all the media sources.

Edited by spartan max2, 01 September 2013 - 02:45 PM.

" I imagine that the intellegent people are the ones so intellegent that they dont even need or want to look "intellegent" anymore".
Criss Jami




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