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What if it was like this?!


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#1    EllJay

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 08:23 AM

What if the afterlife was like this, to some extent; how would you (for whom may it concern) as an die hard atheist -and perhaps with fevered hatred for religion- react?
Would you feel "cheated" of the oblivious `great big sleep` you thought you where headed for and would you still feel contempt for the creator/manager and ask for an eternal existence in an isolation room to pout? :)

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#2    spud the mackem

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 09:13 AM

We all go through the same gate at the end of this life,if you wake up after death its a bonus,if you dont you wont know about it,so why worry.No one has ever reported back so its either fantastic or Blank.

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#3    fullywired

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 12:22 PM

Nobody seems to know what the "afterlife" consists of ,.What do we do for eternity ?,the answers I have heard don't seem to me to be worth the effort required to achieve it ,I think the truth is no one as any idea if there even is an afterlife or a heaven ,it is probably just a "comfort" story that some cling to because they can't bear the thought of the  eternal darkness of the grave.It is not something I relish myself but that is . death and nothing we do will alter that

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#4    eight bits

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 01:16 PM

Quote

death and nothing we do will alter that
That is the median outcome on offer.

Spud is a little bit optimistic

Quote

its either fantastic or Blank
There is a rumor of a third possibility. If so, those folks won't be reporting back, either.

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#5    libstaK

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 01:51 PM

View Posteight bits, on 20 August 2013 - 01:16 PM, said:

That is the median outcome on offer.

Spud is a little bit optimistic


There is a rumor of a third possibility. If so, those folks won't be reporting back, either.
Latest whispering I heard was the third possibility was the cosmic version of a bogeyman tale.

Edited by libstaK, 20 August 2013 - 01:51 PM.

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#6    GreenmansGod

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 05:47 PM

I think if that is the afterlife I'll pass, I am well passed the need for mommy.  Ever notice how having a nice Mom is great when your little.  But when you live on your own for a while, then move back in or Mom moves in, not so nice.  I loved my Mom, I miss my Mom, but....

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#7    EllJay

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 06:05 PM

View Postspud the mackem, on 20 August 2013 - 09:13 AM, said:

We all go through the same gate at the end of this life,if you wake up after death its a bonus,if you dont you wont know about it,so why worry.No one has ever reported back so its either fantastic or Blank.

As some say about life; "no one comes out of it alive". But I don't think a possible (if anything) afterlife is something we could even imagine. NDE'rs claim that what they've seen and felt it was so unreal from the the senses we posses as a human. The "new" consciousness that could perceive the concept of non-linear time, the concept of eternity, the ability to move their being/consciousness to where ever they wanted just by thinking of it, in an instance fully perceive the knowledge about "everything" (the sense of knowing the purpose all things in existence and how it all is connected and constructed), also pretty fast lose the interest of their worldly life and those who still was alive because they "know" that regardless what happens to them everything will turn out alright and they be together in a "second". When they come back in their bodies after their NDE they sense that they for a while possessed all those new senses but they cant recollect any knowledge. A skeptical mind would say that that is pretty convenient thing to say if you want to spin a story. But if one believes in the survival of consciousness the physical brain might be the inhibitor to a fuller array of senses. Who knows.

Or it is, as you say, - nothing/blank- and if so nothing really matters, since you wont feel or be aware of nothing at all, since you ceased to exist totally.

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#8    White Crane Feather

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 06:22 PM

Some have reported back and some have been there. In fact there is sort of a standard model with what you will experience upon death.

1) a tunnel
2) light
4) a life review where you review everything in your life
5) a greeting of family members  or loving spirits
6) meeting with a higher being and a sense of incredible piece.

These standard things suggest a couple of things.

1) The things you do in life are important for some reason otherwise why the emphasis on a review.

2) something or Someone seems to go out of their/it's  way to make the transition comfortable.

3) there seems to be a boss or something directing it all.

of course there are occasionally hellish experiences, but usually these people are creating some sort of turmoil in their lives and the vision helps to straighten them out.

One thing is for certain. We know that a certain percentage of people that get pulled back from the brink of death experience these things ... Something like %12. This probably means that during the death process many more that do die experience it as well but simply can't report it.

So if you are a skeptic of the afterlife, and you turn out to be right, it's very possible that your last thought before winking out of existence will be "holy ****, they were right".  Personally I find that a bit amusing.

As to the old "it's all wishful thinking". This is simply asinine to give any kind credibility to. Quit obviously and documented many people have had powerful NDEs and OBE experiences. Even if the dying brain hypothesis is correct, it's just ignorant to  suggest that these people or the people that trust them are wishful thinking. It's perfectly reasonable to believe in an afterlife after you have witnessed such things or trust Someone who has.

As to the structure and continued existence in the after life. It's anybody's guess. I knew form of life perhaps, reincarnation after you are tired of being a spirit seems like the way to go, but who knows?

I have visited my father off and on for many years. As time goes by he really has seemed to drift in the way he behaves. At first he was very much like he was in life. He always wanted to play dominos like we did as I was growing up. But his death was fresh then and the visits were upsetting me and I was only 19. I told him he was dead and the visits were disturbing me so I wanted him to go away.  He did. He lifted his an nodded and I did not see him again, until I started to get control over my OBEs . Then he was having fun and happy. He slowly started to change though. He became more mature as a spirit. He got to the point where he acted like the rest of them. Hardly any words. Still warm but everything highly contextual and symbolic. One vision in particular I knew he was changed. He had moved on to another stage.

Anyway, if what I experience is real in any way, I think the afterlife is about continuing to evolve. I don't think the learning stops. Oh well we will see one way or the other.

"I wish neither to possess, Nor to be possessed. I no longer covet paradise, more important, I no longer fear hell. The medicine for my suffering I had within me from the very beginning, but I did not take it. My ailment came from within myself, But I did not observe it until this moment. Now I see that I will never find the light.  Unless, like the candle, I am my own fuel, Consuming myself. "
Bruce Lee-

#9    GreenmansGod

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 06:46 PM

If there is an after life why would the skeptic wink out.   Why wouldn't he just go on living?  If it is actually there, wouldn't everyone be there?

"The moment you declare a set of ideas to be immune from criticism, satire, derision, or contempt, freedom of thought becomes impossible." Salman Rushdie

#10    EllJay

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 06:57 PM

View PostGreenmansGod, on 20 August 2013 - 06:46 PM, said:

If there is an after life why would the skeptic wink out.   Why wouldn't he just go on living?  If it is actually there, wouldn't everyone be there?

View PostWhite Crane Feather, on 20 August 2013 - 06:22 PM, said:

Some have reported back and some have been there. In fact there is sort of a standard model with what you will experience upon death.

1) a tunnel
2) light
4) a life review where you review everything in your life
5) a greeting of family members  or loving spirits
6) meeting with a higher being and a sense of incredible piece.

These standard things suggest a couple of things.

1) The things you do in life are important for some reason otherwise why the emphasis on a review.

2) something or Someone seems to go out of their/it's  way to make the transition comfortable.

3) there seems to be a boss or something directing it all.

of course there are occasionally hellish experiences, but usually these people are creating some sort of turmoil in their lives and the vision helps to straighten them out.

One thing is for certain. We know that a certain percentage of people that get pulled back from the brink of death experience these things ... Something like %12. This probably means that during the death process many more that do die experience it as well but simply can't report it.

So if you are a skeptic of the afterlife, and you turn out to be right, it's very possible that your last thought before winking out of existence will be "holy ****, they were right".  Personally I find that a bit amusing.

As to the old "it's all wishful thinking". This is simply asinine to give any kind credibility to. Quit obviously and documented many people have had powerful NDEs and OBE experiences. Even if the dying brain hypothesis is correct, it's just ignorant to  suggest that these people or the people that trust them are wishful thinking. It's perfectly reasonable to believe in an afterlife after you have witnessed such things or trust Someone who has.

As to the structure and continued existence in the after life. It's anybody's guess. I knew form of life perhaps, reincarnation after you are tired of being a spirit seems like the way to go, but who knows?

I have visited my father off and on for many years. As time goes by he really has seemed to drift in the way he behaves. At first he was very much like he was in life. He always wanted to play dominos like we did as I was growing up. But his death was fresh then and the visits were upsetting me and I was only 19. I told him he was dead and the visits were disturbing me so I wanted him to go away.  He did. He lifted his an nodded and I did not see him again, until I started to get control over my OBEs . Then he was having fun and happy. He slowly started to change though. He became more mature as a spirit. He got to the point where he acted like the rest of them. Hardly any words. Still warm but everything highly contextual and symbolic. One vision in particular I knew he was changed. He had moved on to another stage.

Anyway, if what I experience is real in any way, I think the afterlife is about continuing to evolve. I don't think the learning stops. Oh well we will see one way or the other.

Fascinating experience. Some psychics who claim they have insight in the structure and "routine" of the afterlife say that many spirits who pass over have a very hard time accepting their new existence and react with anxiety, terror, disbelief, denial and disorientation. So they are in a sort of "therapy", with help to accept and grow stronger in their new situation, when they cross over. Imagine a hardcore materialist confronted with the realities of an afterlife, which they hated the concept of when alive, that would shake anyone up quite a bit.

"Opinions are like a**holes, everyone seems to have one" - Dirty Harry

"All those who believe in psychokinesis, raise my hand... "

"I have a black belt in Feng Shui, the subtle martial art. I go home to you and move a lamp and a chair... twelve years later you lay there on the floor with broken kneecaps and destitute."

#11    White Crane Feather

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 07:56 PM

View PostGreenmansGod, on 20 August 2013 - 06:46 PM, said:

If there is an after life why would the skeptic wink out.   Why wouldn't he just go on living?  If it is actually there, wouldn't everyone be there?
Indeed, if you look closely, I said ---if the skeptic turned out to be right--.

I of course do not think the skeptic will wink out of existence, I expect them to be quite surprised.

"I wish neither to possess, Nor to be possessed. I no longer covet paradise, more important, I no longer fear hell. The medicine for my suffering I had within me from the very beginning, but I did not take it. My ailment came from within myself, But I did not observe it until this moment. Now I see that I will never find the light.  Unless, like the candle, I am my own fuel, Consuming myself. "
Bruce Lee-

#12    RockShaman

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 08:23 PM

This reminds me of one night as I sat reading and sensed someone there. I looked up and my (deceased) Grandfather stood there, back against the wall, looking distressed and confused. In life, he had never been like that, always strong (narrow?) minded, a fundamentalist in religion and very rules oriented man. After a long moment of surprise, I asked him if he was alright.

After another long moment, he finally told me, "It is not what I expected."

LOL, I hadn't expected him to say that either, or for him to ever come by my house to say anything.  But, maybe it is a good thing that there may not be literal pearl gates and gold streets.

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#13    odas

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 09:05 PM

I did not have a worry before my birth. I excpect not to have any aftet my death.


#14    ShadowSot

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 09:22 PM

NDE have been pretty well examined and understood through science.

I'm not sure why you'd think a skeptic/atheist would feel cheated, I would love the opportunity to sit and shoot the breeze with Carl Sagan and Fred Rogers, or meet my grandfather again.
However, the evidence isn't there to pin my hopes on some sort of poorly described afterlife. Instead its best to live life the best you can, take advantage of as many opportunities as you can, and give as many others as you can all the opportunitues you can provide.

It was so much easier to blame it on Them. It was bleakly depressing to think that They were Us. If it was Them, then nothing was anyone's fault. If it was us, what did that make Me? After all, I'm one of Us. I must be. I've certainly never thought of myself as one of Them. No one ever thinks of themselves as one of Them. We're always one of Us. It's Them that do the bad things.
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#15    StarMountainKid

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Posted 21 August 2013 - 12:12 AM

Well, I don't think I would enjoy an afterlife that was similar to life. Do I really want to do all this again for an eternity? I don't think I do, once is enough for me.

As far as NDE's are concerned, these people were not dead. Only the really dead know what happens after death, if anything, and they never come back to tell the tale. I think this fact should be noted, as it's rather significant.

If there is an afterlife, in my view it would be something completely different than physical life as we know it. I mean, we'd be physically dead, so how could w still be walking around in our bodies, or playing tennis with our relatives? This is wishful thinking. Especially wishful, because who likes their relatives enough to want to hang out with them, even in heaven?

One last thought: why do we think an afterlife would be a nice place? This is another example of wishful thinking. Why would life after death be any better than life before death? If Something created life, I would think It would make the same stupid mistakes in creating an afterlife.

From my observations of life in the here and now, I have little trust in the quality of life in the there and then.

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