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Who came up with "Quarantine Hypothesis"?


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#1    ambelamba

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Posted 09 September 2013 - 11:08 PM

Didn't it come with Fermi Paradox?

I've heard about this for a few times but I really haven't found any in-depth and saner explanations for this idea. But you know what? Something tells me that whoever coined this idea kinda stumbled upon the truth by accident.

The problem is that many of the speculations related to the quarantine hypothesis are, at best, loopy as hell.


#2    synchronomy

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Posted 10 September 2013 - 02:15 AM

View Postambelamba, on 09 September 2013 - 11:08 PM, said:

Didn't it come with Fermi Paradox?

I've heard about this for a few times but I really haven't found any in-depth and saner explanations for this idea. But you know what? Something tells me that whoever coined this idea kinda stumbled upon the truth by accident.

The problem is that many of the speculations related to the quarantine hypothesis are, at best, loopy as hell.
It may have come in with FP.  However numerous authors such as Greer, Hoagland, Nidle et al have claimed it is specifically because we intend (have already) weaponized space.  The quarantine is to keep nutbars such as us out of the cosmos until we have the maturity to stop with our self-detructive tribal warfare tendencies...so is the claim.
My personal view is that IF highly advanced ET's are here, then they would in all likelihood maintain a "prime directive" of not interfering.  Much of the foundations of our religious and political beliefs could (likely would) be shattered by the sudden appearance of interfering humanoids whether well-intentioned or not.  Additionally they would likely be here for science and discovery and the best way to conduct research is with a non-interference policy.  All this of course somewhat minimizes the likelihood that abductions, cattle mutilations, and crop circles have anything to do with ET's.
Hopefully we are eased into acceptance by our discovered of bacteria or at least fossils of them on Mars or another nearby neighbor...there are a lot of human's simply couldn't handle the truth.

Edited by synchronomy, 10 September 2013 - 02:19 AM.

At the heart of science is an essential balance between two seemingly contradictory attitudes--an openness to new ideas, no matter how bizarre or counterintuitive they may be, and the most ruthless skeptical scrutiny of all ideas, old and new.
This is how deep truths are winnowed from deep nonsense. -- Carl Sagan

#3    Frank Merton

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Posted 10 September 2013 - 02:36 AM

As I understand it, the quarantine hypothesis speculates that there is a galactic super-civilization that "protects" budding societies like ours by quarantining them, so they can develop normally.

This implies a rather cold intellectual bunch, since such a society could intervene here and end a lot of suffering.  It's not unlike the question of why God permits suffering, often used as a moral argument against the existence of God.  Various rationalizations are presented against this point, much as theists produce various leaky rationalizations when defending God.


#4    Frank Merton

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Posted 10 September 2013 - 02:38 AM

As a way of keeping nut cases like us out of space, it doesn't seem to be working.  Of course we haven't gotten too far yet.  I find this sort of approach rather hard to avoid ridiculing.


#5    ambelamba

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Posted 10 September 2013 - 03:12 AM

View Postsynchronomy, on 10 September 2013 - 02:15 AM, said:

It may have come in with FP.  However numerous authors such as Greer, Hoagland, Nidle et al have claimed it is specifically because we intend (have already) weaponized space.  The quarantine is to keep nutbars such as us out of the cosmos until we have the maturity to stop with our self-detructive tribal warfare tendencies...so is the claim.
My personal view is that IF highly advanced ET's are here, then they would in all likelihood maintain a "prime directive" of not interfering.  Much of the foundations of our religious and political beliefs could (likely would) be shattered by the sudden appearance of interfering humanoids whether well-intentioned or not.  Additionally they would likely be here for science and discovery and the best way to conduct research is with a non-interference policy.  All this of course somewhat minimizes the likelihood that abductions, cattle mutilations, and crop circles have anything to do with ET's.
Hopefully we are eased into acceptance by our discovered of bacteria or at least fossils of them on Mars or another nearby neighbor...there are a lot of human's simply couldn't handle the truth.

It really doesn't work always.

Two examples are like this: Meerkats and Yanomamo people in Amazon. There's no way the researchers could conduct 'non-interfering' observations. In case of meerkats they ended up hanging out with the zoologists all the time and in case of Yanomamo people one researcher ended up having a child with the native.

You shouldn't have mentioned Greer because anyone with an ounce of self respect will avoid him like a plague. He is a reason why UFOlogists are laughed at.

And we can't rule out the possibility that there is at least one group of aliens who are itching to have a full-scale contact with us. Some folks out there might be resentful of how the world is going and they might be fanatical enough to 'enlighten' the savage monkeys, meaning US. Probably their delegate to the Galactic Council would flip the finger at the High Council and say "Up yours! We are going in!" then their government will assemble their fleet to head straight to our dark and savage planet. Many of their young men and women will sign up to...who knows? They gotta pay for their higher educations.


#6    ambelamba

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Posted 10 September 2013 - 03:22 AM

Actually, when I was taking a screenwriting class last year I tackled with this issue.

A vastly powerful alien race, originated from Ice Age Earth, disobeys the quarantine order of the Galactic Council to invade Earth. Although they have common ancestors with us, their path of evolution and genetic manipulations made them whole lot more egalitarian and hive-minded. And very level-minded. The alien protagonist, whose father was once the regent of the young emperor and the one instigated the invasion, is a part of the elite squadron led by the emperor's younger brother. Without the approval of the council and the imperial senate, they could only bring a few hundred vessels with vastly undermanned crew.

Their first target is the Middle East. The aliens want to cut the oil supply so that they can make the world governments surrender. The protagonist and his squadron drop down to Tehran, causing mayhem.

During the operation the protagonist, affectionately called "Dukeling", kills the supreme ayatollah and his grandchilden, who were unarmed and begging for mercy. US government somehow obtains the footage of killing and uses it as the propaganda against the aliens.


#7    synchronomy

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Posted 10 September 2013 - 05:28 AM

View Postambelamba, on 10 September 2013 - 03:12 AM, said:

It really doesn't work always.

Two examples are like this: Meerkats and Yanomamo people in Amazon. There's no way the researchers could conduct 'non-interfering' observations. In case of meerkats they ended up hanging out with the zoologists all the time and in case of Yanomamo people one researcher ended up having a child with the native.

You shouldn't have mentioned Greer because anyone with an ounce of self respect will avoid him like a plague. He is a reason why UFOlogists are laughed at.

And we can't rule out the possibility that there is at least one group of aliens who are itching to have a full-scale contact with us. Some folks out there might be resentful of how the world is going and they might be fanatical enough to 'enlighten' the savage monkeys, meaning US. Probably their delegate to the Galactic Council would flip the finger at the High Council and say "Up yours! We are going in!" then their government will assemble their fleet to head straight to our dark and savage planet. Many of their young men and women will sign up to...who knows? They gotta pay for their higher educations.
I didn't intend to paint Greer in a positive light.  He is a charaltan as is Hoagland and Nidle.  Many others are cut from the same cloth. They stand out in my mind as the one's who push their theory that we are quarantined due to our violent nature.
Perhaps, also, our planet may be quarantined due to the diseases we carry.  Perhaps viruses and pathogens are not a common occurance in the Universe.  Just speculation.
Also, we as humans, do not practice proper science frequently, as we often find it necessary to destroy a civilisation in order to study it.  This is true whether it be a primitive Amazon tribe or an ant hill...we will rip it apart in order to write a book about it.
I suppose some of this mentality may be related to our inability to live together on the same planet.

At the heart of science is an essential balance between two seemingly contradictory attitudes--an openness to new ideas, no matter how bizarre or counterintuitive they may be, and the most ruthless skeptical scrutiny of all ideas, old and new.
This is how deep truths are winnowed from deep nonsense. -- Carl Sagan

#8    Frank Merton

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Posted 10 September 2013 - 06:12 AM

There may be a natural isolation of any planet with life on it -- it may be that different forms of life using different basic molecules are just naturally poisons to each other.


#9    bison

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Posted 10 September 2013 - 07:22 PM

A galactic embargo of this planet, and a leaky one at that, covers the fact of no overt, general contact with extraterrestrials, and the possibility of their fleeting and ambiguous appearance. It just might be considered wise among extraterrestrials to begin preparing us for contact with the rest of the galaxy now, well before our ability to travel to the stars forces the issue.
     If such contact is to occur, it could seem best to bring this about in a gradual manner, so as to avoid the damage that could be done by sudden, shocking contact. The way in which the world has gradually become so 'extraterrestrial-minded', especially in the last six or seven decades, seems congruent with such a program of gradual preparation.


#10    mcrom901

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 02:11 AM

quarantine? i think you meant the zoo hypothesis?


#11    qxcontinuum

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 03:56 AM

I don't think there is such thing as peaceful alien nation. Even in God's perfected society there was war between angels.
We are simply following an evolution that is the way of the universe. The strongest one always wins devouring the smallest. There is no peace in cosmos , it will never be. Galaxies are eating galaxies, and bigger planets are absorbing the smallest ones, etc.
So if there is an alien civilization up there and we are not conquered yet it is likely because they are not more evolved than us.



#12    bison

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 03:15 PM

The probability that we are the most advanced form of intelligent life in the galaxy seems remote. It has been calculated that the average age of habitable planets in our galaxy is around two billion years older than our own. Plenty of time for life to have evolved to heights we care barely, or not at all, conceive of.


#13    zoser

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 03:23 PM

View PostFrank Merton, on 10 September 2013 - 02:38 AM, said:

As a way of keeping nut cases like us out of space, it doesn't seem to be working.  Of course we haven't gotten too far yet.  I find this sort of approach rather hard to avoid ridiculing.

Well you said it in your 3rd sentence.  We haven't got too far yet and neither are we about to in the future.

Sending probes out to the local planets is for now all we can possible hope to achieve with our crude technology.

Unless of course someone gives a helping hand:

:alien:

Posted Image


#14    bison

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 07:28 PM

An interesting article on the Zoo hypothesis, which is treated as equivalent to a galactic quarantine--                
http://en.wikipedia..../Zoo_hypothesis


#15    Frank Merton

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Posted 12 September 2013 - 07:35 PM

I think the evidence is pretty strong that "they" don't exist anywhere near (oh, life exists but not some galactic civilization).  The posts here arguing otherwise are just speculation, generally rather silly speculation.  The actual evidence is that the universe is sterile, and it is just probability arguments based on huge uncertainties that people use to argue otherwise.  That is unpersuasive to an objective person.

And wars in heaven?  Give me strength.





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