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What Will Bibi Do Now?

israel iran attack

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34 replies to this topic

#16    Frank Merton

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Posted 11 September 2013 - 04:03 PM

View PostPhaeton80, on 11 September 2013 - 03:56 PM, said:

Although your well- versed, explanatory and extremely coherant comment is very inticing.. (?!)

I would, in all modesty, beg to differ.
You may be right, but in general Israel is better off with neighbors as stable and prosperous as possible, not those constantly setting themselves backward. Stable regimes and prosperous people don't risk it all in symbolic terrorist stuff.


#17    and then

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Posted 11 September 2013 - 04:09 PM

View PostFrank Merton, on 11 September 2013 - 04:03 PM, said:

You may be right, but in general Israel is better off with neighbors as stable and prosperous as possible, not those constantly setting themselves backward. Stable regimes and prosperous people don't risk it all in symbolic terrorist stuff.
I agree about the issue of stability but when it comes at the price of oppression of the true nature of a group of people then I think it can only be provided in a transient way.  These folks are taught from earliest childhood to hate the Jew as a sacred duty to their god.  There is no "forward" with a mindset like this - never will be.

  We've cast the world, we've set the stage,
  for what could be, the darkest age...
“This is like playing poker with a guy who cheated you twice before. You know who does that, a moron.

#18    and then

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Posted 11 September 2013 - 04:13 PM

View PostColonel Rhuairidh, on 11 September 2013 - 03:29 PM, said:

Don't mess with (uncle Sam has now retired, so now it's israel)?
The difference is found in the WILL to do what is necessary.  America is not Barack Obama.  He will eventually be gone but now it will require sending messages, so to speak, to regain any respect.  You seem unwilling to admit that realpolitik includes brute force.  Disagree with the target all you like but you must admit that in a real world force is the only thing that gains respect.

  We've cast the world, we've set the stage,
  for what could be, the darkest age...
“This is like playing poker with a guy who cheated you twice before. You know who does that, a moron.

#19    Phaeton80

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Posted 11 September 2013 - 04:13 PM

View Postand then, on 11 September 2013 - 04:09 PM, said:

I agree about the issue of stability but when it comes at the price of oppression of the true nature of a group of people then I think it can only be provided in a transient way.  These folks are taught from earliest childhood to hate the Jew as a sacred duty to their god.  There is no "forward" with a mindset like this - never will be.

Simply not true. And you should be ashamed to state such a thing. This is such a simplification of reality, it isnt even funny anymore.


#20    Frank Merton

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Posted 11 September 2013 - 04:25 PM

View PostPhaeton80, on 11 September 2013 - 04:13 PM, said:

Simply not true. And you should be ashamed to state such a thing. This is such a simplification of reality, it isnt even funny anymore.
I think it is a little naive to say that Muslims are not anti-Semitic, if that is what you mean, and where would they pick up such garbage if it weren't in childhood?

It is very true that Islamic society is more diverse than we are sometimes led to believe, but there is no doubt that hate forms a large part of the motivation of large numbers of them.  Hate is a useful political tool.


#21    Valdemar the Great

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Posted 11 September 2013 - 04:26 PM

View Postand then, on 11 September 2013 - 04:13 PM, said:

The difference is found in the WILL to do what is necessary.  America is not Barack Obama.  He will eventually be gone but now it will require sending messages, so to speak, to regain any respect.  You seem unwilling to admit that realpolitik includes brute force.  Disagree with the target all you like but you must admit that in a real world force is the only thing that gains respect.
if it needs brute force, then it's already failed. Successful realpolitik is much more subtle. That may not mean that non-brute force realpolitik may be very nice, but that's any effective method of politics won't be nice for someone. There's a big difference between having the Big Stick to hand and automatically reaching for the Big Stick as a first resort, which is what America tends to have done ever since the 1960s at least.

Life is a hideous business, and from the background behind what we know of it peer daemoniacal hints of truth which make it sometimes a thousandfold more hideous.

H. P. Lovecraft.


:cat:


#22    Frank Merton

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Posted 11 September 2013 - 04:35 PM

Things continue as Obama is doing an the big stick will become a twig.


#23    Phaeton80

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Posted 11 September 2013 - 04:44 PM

View PostFrank Merton, on 11 September 2013 - 04:25 PM, said:

I think it is a little naive to say that Muslims are not anti-Semitic, if that is what you mean, and where would they pick up such garbage if it weren't in childhood?

It is very true that Islamic society is more diverse than we are sometimes led to believe, but there is no doubt that hate forms a large part of the motivation of large numbers of them.  Hate is a useful political tool.

First of all, the term 'Muslims' is a religious one, and that religion encompasses all sorts of ethnic denominations. To suppose 'a Muslim' is per definition 'an Arab' or ME inhabitant, is grossly inapt.

Secondly, a lot of the people you judge as 'anti Semitic', are 'Semites' themselves. Direct decendants of Shem [Arphaxad].

Third, there has been and is indeed an anti Israeli sentiment within the ME nations, in reaction to the behaviour of the Israeli state. But to imply 'these people' [Syrians] as a whole are braught up to hate Jews [for being Jews]
to please their G*d is just plain nonsensical, deceitful poppycock.

Fourth, opposing the political zionist entity known as the state of Israel does in no shape or form constitute 'anti- semitism'.


#24    Frank Merton

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Posted 11 September 2013 - 04:46 PM

"Semite" as you use it is a language family; in the term "anti-Semitic" it means hate of Jews.  You are conflating words for your own use.


#25    Phaeton80

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Posted 11 September 2013 - 04:51 PM

If thats your reaction to my post I think were done here, Frank.


#26    Frank Merton

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Posted 11 September 2013 - 04:55 PM

View PostPhaeton80, on 11 September 2013 - 04:51 PM, said:

If thats your reaction to my post I think were done here, Frank.
As far as I can tell you never posted anything really worth responding to.  I had thought you would elaborate but I guess you can't.


#27    Phaeton80

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Posted 11 September 2013 - 05:08 PM

Yeah..

Thanks for the giggle Frank, have a nice one.

Always a pleasure.


#28    Frank Merton

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Posted 11 September 2013 - 05:14 PM

View PostPhaeton80, on 11 September 2013 - 05:08 PM, said:

Yeah..

Thanks for the giggle Frank, have a nice one.

Always a pleasure.
That is pure hypocrisy on your part.  It achieves nothing except convince me you are underhanded.


#29    and then

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Posted 11 September 2013 - 07:23 PM

View PostPhaeton80, on 11 September 2013 - 04:13 PM, said:

Simply not true. And you should be ashamed to state such a thing. This is such a simplification of reality, it isnt even funny anymore.
The fact that you deny it doesn't invalidate it P.  I would suggest to your attention PMW -Palestinian Media Watch but those of your mindset will not hear any source but your own.  Arafat and Abbas routinely said/say one thing in the west and another in front of the home crowds.  They depend on no one calling them on it and it has worked because we have a slavish, willing media in the west.  Books for kindergartners through secondary education spread the VILEST of libels against Jews.  It such a commonly known fact that I'm amazed you'd deny it.  Rave on if you wish, but do so in the knowledge that no honest person will listen without looking for the facts.
http://www.palwatch.org/  Rejection without investigation is the worst form of hypocrisy.

  We've cast the world, we've set the stage,
  for what could be, the darkest age...
“This is like playing poker with a guy who cheated you twice before. You know who does that, a moron.

#30    Phaeton80

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Posted 11 September 2013 - 07:59 PM

View Postand then, on 11 September 2013 - 07:23 PM, said:

The fact that you deny it doesn't invalidate it P.  I would suggest to your attention PMW -Palestinian Media Watch but those of your mindset will not hear any source but your own.  Arafat and Abbas routinely said/say one thing in the west and another in front of the home crowds.  They depend on no one calling them on it and it has worked because we have a slavish, willing media in the west.  Books for kindergartners through secondary education spread the VILEST of libels against Jews.  It such a commonly known fact that I'm amazed you'd deny it.  Rave on if you wish, but do so in the knowledge that no honest person will listen without looking for the facts.
http://www.palwatch.org/  Rejection without investigation is the worst form of hypocrisy.

Well sir, when you put it that way, who am I to argue? All Syrians / Muslims must indeed be religiously motivated to rout out Jews where ever they find them. Your very astute and sharply objective analysis is enlightening as it is humbling.

On a somewhat more serious ending note; to point your finger at the Palestinian People for acting against a military opressor in this context is a perfect example of your bias.
http://www.economist...inian-textbooks

Oh and I think its "Condemnation without investigation is the height of ignorance". Which is rather, erm, ironic.. coming out of your mouth (sort of).

Edited by Phaeton80, 11 September 2013 - 08:00 PM.






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