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Evolution of UFO


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#1    qxcontinuum

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Posted 13 September 2013 - 03:30 AM

As ufo enthusiast but not an expert, i wish to consider myself still a believer. Still numerous stories, books and pictures i read througout the years, made me realize something interesting, that i would like to share;
Ufo's have changed their look and finishing every 10 year. I would say coincidentaly  in the same time with  our industrial tehnology change. The first pictured sightings from 50's were depincting some rough shaped chunky ufo's looking more like a hat or a church bell , abrasive endings, visible lights, barely aerodynamic, while the most modern one are thin, smooth, perfect shaped, missing central dome glass, more aerodynamic, etc...
Have someone noticed it ?
That leads me to the conclusion that numerous sightings were not alien in origins, likely objects made with the human technology back then.
Hum what do we think about this ?


#2    krypter3

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Posted 13 September 2013 - 06:41 AM

Well UFO stands for Unidentified flying Object, says nothing about aliens.


#3    Valdemar the Great

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Posted 13 September 2013 - 07:27 AM

View Postqxcontinuum, on 13 September 2013 - 03:30 AM, said:


That leads me to the conclusion that numerous sightings were not alien in origins, likely objects made with the human technology back then.
Hum what do we think about this ?
i think that'd be very unlikely, since there are no manmade aircraft that look at all like the traditional Saucer, and there's never been any proof that any of these futuristic triangle-shaped things that people always say "Well, the're obviously Secret Aircraft" have ever actually existed, let alone being flown as much as must be the case from the number of reports.

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#4    itsnotoutthere

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Posted 13 September 2013 - 08:02 AM

The only reference that enthusiasts have regarding what alien craft may or may not look like is the popular culture that surrounds them during their life time.
It is no surprise that descriptions of alien craft by so called witnesses follow the same trends as the latest ideas from The X-Files or the latest speilberg blockbuster.
In the 40s 50s & 60s 'witnesses' described saucer shaped craft (see 'The Day The Earth Stood Still)
In the 70s & 80s 'witnesses' described fast moving balls of light & small aliens with large eyes (see Close Encounters)
In the 90s 'witnesses' described triangular space ships (see The X-Files)

Edited by itsnotoutthere, 13 September 2013 - 08:13 AM.

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#5    quillius

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Posted 13 September 2013 - 10:02 AM

View Postitsnotoutthere, on 13 September 2013 - 08:02 AM, said:

The only reference that enthusiasts have regarding what alien craft may or may not look like is the popular culture that surrounds them during their life time.
It is no surprise that descriptions of alien craft by so called witnesses follow the same trends as the latest ideas from The X-Files or the latest speilberg blockbuster.
In the 40s 50s & 60s 'witnesses' described saucer shaped craft (see 'The Day The Earth Stood Still)
In the 70s & 80s 'witnesses' described fast moving balls of light & small aliens with large eyes (see Close Encounters)
In the 90s 'witnesses' described triangular space ships (see The X-Files)

the day the earth stood still was 1951, so the 40's suggestion is cannot be based on the film as you say. Coupled with the fact that in 1947 alone there were over 850 reports that included saucer shaped craft, balls of light etc.
As an overall trend you may be loosely correct however this would only work if we considered all sightings as real, if not then I would say all the BS/hoaxes/lies etc may follow that trend but 'real' UFO events do not.

Edited by quillius, 13 September 2013 - 10:03 AM.


#6    itsnotoutthere

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Posted 13 September 2013 - 10:27 AM

View Postquillius, on 13 September 2013 - 10:02 AM, said:

the day the earth stood still was 1951, so the 40's suggestion is cannot be based on the film as you say. Coupled with the fact that in 1947 alone there were over 850 reports that included saucer shaped craft, balls of light etc.
As an overall trend you may be loosely correct however this would only work if we considered all sightings as real, if not then I would say all the BS/hoaxes/lies etc may follow that trend but 'real' UFO events do not.

i used that reference as an example rather than being specific. Think you'll find plenty of sci-fi films featuring saucer shapes from the 40s. but not many showing Close Encounter type ships. All these designs coupled with witness 'sightings' are design specific to that era, my point being that these people that report these things use popular sci-fi imagery as their jumping off point.

Edited by itsnotoutthere, 13 September 2013 - 10:35 AM.

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#7    seeder

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Posted 13 September 2013 - 11:25 AM

View Postitsnotoutthere, on 13 September 2013 - 10:27 AM, said:

i used that reference as an example rather than being specific. Think you'll find plenty of sci-fi films featuring saucer shapes from the 40s. but not many showing Close Encounter type ships. All these designs coupled with witness 'sightings' are design specific to that era, my point being that these people that report these things use popular sci-fi imagery as their jumping off point.

exactly, older ufo/ET stories have ET ships with levers and dials in them, (like the old flash Gordon series to name but one). ha, dials and levers. In just 40-50 years we have craft with computers to fly them, lcd touch panels and all kinds of high tech.

But them old 'super advanced aliens', have dials and levers. Oh and antennae on their heads :lol:

Yeh peoples imaginations and concocted stories are based on whats around them at the time in culture

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#8    quillius

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Posted 13 September 2013 - 12:00 PM

yes I agree but only to the extent that the argument can be used for hoaxes/lies/dellusions etc and not for real 'ufo' sightings. Do real UFO events follow the same pattern? I dont think they do. In actual fact this maybe also indicates a logical way in which to fathom out hoaxes etc ...i.e reports/events that conradict the 'trend' suggested...(although this does leave us open to missing a real event if it matches the trend)


#9    Jacques Terreur

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Posted 13 September 2013 - 12:07 PM

nice thread! :) what you guys is absolutely right, there has been a change in UFO Appearance in sightings that went along with both cultural and technical advances over the years.
Well, neither do i believe that all UFO sightings are hoaxes, nor will i try to deny that at least 90% of the stories you get served here and everywhere are dubious (to phrase it without the B and the S).

GIVEN there is really something to this phenomenon, it led me to think that whatever causes those sightings could be able to adapt to the capacity of the human consciousness. Or gets misinterpreted. People tend to express what they see in the words they have. If a guy in medieval times could see an F-16 fighter plane, i'm pretty sure he would describe it as "metallic bird", because he has no clue about aviation.
So people in "our" time, from the 40s to 2013, would likely act the same way when confronted with something above their understanding, only with a bigger knowledge about technology and classic sci-fi.

OR the whole UFO thing is not so much a real-world-tangible, but a psychological phenomenon. I think it was Carl Gustav Jung who saw UFOs as a kind of foreshadowing of the evolution of the human mind. Not sure, gotta check it up. I don't know who's familiar with his concept of "collective consciousness", but he said that it doesn't apply to past events only, but also on future events.
Anyway, take only the high number of people all over the world that claim to be abducted by "aliens". This kind of stuff is more or less pop culture nowadays. But i can't believe that since the first person came up with that story, all the others are merely reproductions of people wanting their 15 minutes of fame/shame on local tv. SOMETHING happens to some of these people, but
this is not necessarily of extraterrestrial origin.


edit to add that i just saw this is my 600th post. cheers! :D

Edited by Jacques Terreur, 13 September 2013 - 12:09 PM.

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#10    quillius

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Posted 13 September 2013 - 12:18 PM

View PostJacques Terreur, on 13 September 2013 - 12:07 PM, said:

nice thread! :) what you guys is absolutely right, there has been a change in UFO Appearance in sightings that went along with both cultural and technical advances over the years.
Well, neither do i believe that all UFO sightings are hoaxes, nor will i try to deny that at least 90% of the stories you get served here and everywhere are dubious (to phrase it without the B and the S).

GIVEN there is really something to this phenomenon, it led me to think that whatever causes those sightings could be able to adapt to the capacity of the human consciousness. Or gets misinterpreted. People tend to express what they see in the words they have. If a guy in medieval times could see an F-16 fighter plane, i'm pretty sure he would describe it as "metallic bird", because he has no clue about aviation.
So people in "our" time, from the 40s to 2013, would likely act the same way when confronted with something above their understanding, only with a bigger knowledge about technology and classic sci-fi.

OR the whole UFO thing is not so much a real-world-tangible, but a psychological phenomenon. I think it was Carl Gustav Jung who saw UFOs as a kind of foreshadowing of the evolution of the human mind. Not sure, gotta check it up. I don't know who's familiar with his concept of "collective consciousness", but he said that it doesn't apply to past events only, but also on future events.
Anyway, take only the high number of people all over the world that claim to be abducted by "aliens". This kind of stuff is more or less pop culture nowadays. But i can't believe that since the first person came up with that story, all the others are merely reproductions of people wanting their 15 minutes of fame/shame on local tv. SOMETHING happens to some of these people, but
this is not necessarily of extraterrestrial origin.


edit to add that i just saw this is my 600th post. cheers! :D

Hey JT, some very good points there especially the bolded. :tu:

in addition the comment regarding abductions reminded me of my favourite abduction case (probably the only one that I cant find a hole in whatsoever) the Pascagoula abduction. Their descriptions of both the craft and the 'beings' cannot be linked to pop culture as suggested, therefore strengthening my position that any potential real experiences contradict any trend.

:tu:


#11    seeder

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Posted 13 September 2013 - 12:24 PM

View PostJacques Terreur, on 13 September 2013 - 12:07 PM, said:

nice thread! :) what you guys is absolutely right, there has been a change in UFO Appearance in sightings that went along with both cultural and technical advances over the years.
Well, neither do i believe that all UFO sightings are hoaxes, nor will i try to deny that at least 90% of the stories you get served here and everywhere are dubious (to phrase it without the B and the S).

GIVEN there is really something to this phenomenon, it led me to think that whatever causes those sightings could be able to adapt to the capacity of the human consciousness. Or gets misinterpreted. People tend to express what they see in the words they have. If a guy in medieval times could see an F-16 fighter plane, i'm pretty sure he would describe it as "metallic bird", because he has no clue about aviation.
So people in "our" time, from the 40s to 2013, would likely act the same way when confronted with something above their understanding, only with a bigger knowledge about technology and classic sci-fi.

OR the whole UFO thing is not so much a real-world-tangible, but a psychological phenomenon. I think it was Carl Gustav Jung who saw UFOs as a kind of foreshadowing of the evolution of the human mind. Not sure, gotta check it up. I don't know who's familiar with his concept of "collective consciousness", but he said that it doesn't apply to past events only, but also on future events.
Anyway, take only the high number of people all over the world that claim to be abducted by "aliens". This kind of stuff is more or less pop culture nowadays. But i can't believe that since the first person came up with that story, all the others are merely reproductions of people wanting their 15 minutes of fame/shame on local tv. SOMETHING happens to some of these people, but
this is not necessarily of extraterrestrial origin.


edit to add that i just saw this is my 600th post. cheers! :D


Congrats on the 600th! But again when we look thru history we see tales of abduction have been around for ages. When I was a lad in the 70's. my mother had a big black book, telephone book sized in fact, and it was called something like Myths and Folklore. That book used to give me the willies with its stories and woodcut print pictures of witches and goblins and general spooky things.

Trolls in the woods would take little boys and girls away if they hadnt been baptised,  fairies and goblins too sometimes, there would be ghostly headless horsemen in the night, banshees wailing and screaming, and all manner of things like that. But never was ufo's and aliens mentioned. People put their fears on strange twisted little men that lived in forests and such like.

Nowadays those stories have faded away, but the same 'scenarios' seem now to come with tales of UFOS and little grey men. Go back 200 hundred years and the topics of many conversation were the myths and folklore,  nowadays, its ufos and alien abductions. Whats changed in that respect? Except for our interest and knowledge of space?


.

Edited by seeder, 13 September 2013 - 12:32 PM.

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#12    itsnotoutthere

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Posted 13 September 2013 - 12:38 PM

View Postquillius, on 13 September 2013 - 12:00 PM, said:

yes I agree but only to the extent that the argument can be used for hoaxes/lies/dellusions etc and not for real 'ufo' sightings. Do real UFO events follow the same pattern? I dont think they do. In actual fact this maybe also indicates a logical way in which to fathom out hoaxes etc ...i.e reports/events that conradict the 'trend' suggested...(although this does leave us open to missing a real event if it matches the trend)

Define 'real ufo sighting'

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#13    quillius

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Posted 13 September 2013 - 12:39 PM

View Postitsnotoutthere, on 13 September 2013 - 12:38 PM, said:

Define 'real ufo sighting'

one that isnt a hoax or lie.


#14    Jacques Terreur

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Posted 13 September 2013 - 12:40 PM

View Postquillius, on 13 September 2013 - 12:18 PM, said:

Hey JT, some very good points there especially the bolded. :tu:

in addition the comment regarding abductions reminded me of my favourite abduction case (probably the only one that I cant find a hole in whatsoever) the Pascagoula abduction. Their descriptions of both the craft and the 'beings' cannot be linked to pop culture as suggested, therefore strengthening my position that any potential real experiences contradict any trend.

:tu:

thx, quillius! :) you were referring to the two guys in the fisherboat, being abducted by THIS:
Posted Image

right? I'm into UFOs for at least 20years, it's more of a pasttime than serious studying, but i've read a LOT of stuff where people
claim all kinds of things luring them into their ships. I'm sure you know, too. But do i understand you correctly, you think that the stories that go further away from the kind of mainstream "grey aliens took me to their ship and probed me" are more likely to be true events?

I rather see them as the "statistical odds", like left and right of a bell curve. If you take out the obvious blowhards with a craving for recognition, who make up or hoax UFO or abduction events, you are still left with those people who would swear they saw SOMETHING. For them it is real, be it greys or the friendly carrot men up there. What i want to say is: If you take the "genuine" cases, where no hoax could be proven, for me it's not so much the question WHICH events are more likely to be true, but what is behind it. And the most logical thing for me at the moment is that it is a psychological/medical phenomenon. I can't really explain this, it's merely a hunch.

I like to take long beach walks in the sunset with my wife until
the LSD wears off and i realize that i am dragging a stolen Mannequin over a LIDL parking lot.

#15    Jacques Terreur

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Posted 13 September 2013 - 12:49 PM

View Postseeder, on 13 September 2013 - 12:24 PM, said:


Nowadays those stories have faded away, but the same 'scenarios' seem now to come with tales of UFOS and little grey men. Go back 200 hundred years and the topics of many conversation were the myths and folklore,  nowadays, its ufos and alien abductions. Whats changed in that respect? Except for our interest and knowledge of space?


.

excatly, seeder. Those stories have always been and will keep on, i'm sure. Lots of the old stories were also to scare the kids of going away too far from home, but if you look around a bit, you will indeed find reports that are strikingly similar to modern UFO/abduction scenarios, only including goblins or fairies. What i wonder is merely if those events really happen(ed) or if people
only THINK they do. (as i said above: i only refer to the stuff that wasn't ruled out as blatant fake)

I like to take long beach walks in the sunset with my wife until
the LSD wears off and i realize that i am dragging a stolen Mannequin over a LIDL parking lot.




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