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Bigfoots and tool usage.


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#31    HeathenRoyalty

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 07:27 PM

From what I've heard about BF, these things have the ability to cover large distances very quickly. And in some cases, I've heard they run at incredible speed. For something so big and fast, why would they need tools? If it is more animal, then say something like us, tools would be useless for the most part. Like every other animal, Chimps aside, they would probably eat everything uncooked and consume everything that can be consumed.


#32    QuiteContrary

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 09:31 PM

View PostStardrive, on 25 September 2013 - 04:47 PM, said:

Then to keep things on topic in regards to the OP, and in the spirit of good discussion, I'll address this part of your post. The OP had a small handaxe that missing overnight while he slept. Is it a fact that native americans used hand axes as a tool? And If said creature did exist would it recognize it as a familiar tool and take it? 3 possible explainations to the dissapearence of the handaxe are:

1) it was simply misplaced and ken forgot where he had put it. Thought he put it in the tree stump, but moved it and forgot where he moved it. In other words, lost track of it.

2) A human stumbled onto his camp while he was asleep and stole it.

3) (and most unlikley) An undiscovered primate stumbled onto his camp while he was asleep and stole it.


I agree with 1 & 2,  I place #3 at impossible, but for the sake of discussion I entertained ken's proposal. I gave my opinion on it. Which is, I find it unlikely  they are not more integrated with humans socially, or at least known, photographed, studied, and documented, IF they've been stealing our tools, foodstuffs, and etc....That is, they've found humans a necessary source of food and usable objects as other animals have. Even if they are pre-wired to avoid us,  due to some bad experience with us.

Lots of animals are afraid of humans and try to avoid us. Yet, they still come in to where we live and steal food. They are known, seen, verified, documented, photographed, studied and killed by humans.

Humans fear repercussions of the law and still steal and get caught repeatedly.

I do not agree with the unrealistic portrait of a zoologically sound bigfoot  I hear all the time. As some unnatural creature, operating above nature, above "mistakes", above desperation, above being ruled by its natural needs.

The tool stealing v. why then not more human contact thing is not the stand-alone oddity of this creature we have to find answers for. It is all we ever do when it comes to bf, look for answers to all this creature's unexplainable unnatural supernatural behavior.

Edited by QuiteContrary, 25 September 2013 - 09:36 PM.

Keep your eyes wide open and don't run!

P.S. Just to be clear, because sometimes I am not. I do not believe...
in the existence of a large previously unknown undiscovered hairy biped roaming North America.
But I like to hear the accounts, read the books, watch the shows, discuss and argue about the phenomenon.

#33    Stardrive

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 10:23 PM

View PostQuiteContrary, on 25 September 2013 - 09:31 PM, said:

I place #3 at impossible
Fair enough. Thanks for the discussion.

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#34    keninsc

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Posted 26 September 2013 - 01:42 AM

Guys, please understand, I'm sort of second guessing now many years after the fact. Fact is Bigfoot stole my ax, is simply a way out in left field possibility that I'm willing to entertain now. Mainly due to discussions here and with others and having seen some things on a couple other websites.

As I recall, I was rather tired that evening. I'd hiked some twenty or so miles along the Tennessee/Alabama border. Pretty rugged terrain and very few heavily travels trails.......at least trails travels by humans. I recall there was a check in station where I parked my truck and I showed the attendant the approximate route I was planning on going. The lady looked at me and said, "Are you serious? You're going into that area alone?" I said yeah, what of it. I thought it was odd at the time because she didn't want to say anything other that the token, it's rough, little traveled and not an easy hike. I do recall she asked if I'd be armed and I said I'd have my pistol with me. She gave sort of a half shrug, half cringe and said, "You should be ok then."

Later after I came home from the hike I was talking to some of the guys at work and one of the guys was a huge Spelunking enthusiast asked if I had my topomap and I told I had it at home, he asked me to bring it in the next day and show where I'd gone. So next day I bring it in and show him, then asked where I parked and I was surprised because You could clearly see the parking area on the map. He looked at me and said, "Jenny let you go in there alone?"

Supposedly the locals claimed some bad stuff happened in that area, nothing specific, just the usual "hillbilly" lore or haunts and people going missing, but nothing of any sort of Bigfoot like creature.

For all I know it fell down and is still laying on the ground there and I just didn't find it.


#35    keninsc

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Posted 26 September 2013 - 04:04 AM

The ax could simply have been misplaced, and sadly the knives could have been stolen by thieving humans, however.....what about the bag of guts? Why would any known wild creature simply make off with guts, bag and all? Then there's the missing rope, ripped off my back pack and other more valuable things left behind?


#36    DieChecker

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Posted 26 September 2013 - 04:13 AM

There are homeless living in the woods, and sometimes criminals??

I know that as a kid and teenager, I stole a LOT of stuff out in the woods. If you'd left your stuff out where I could get at it, when I was 14, it would have been GONE. A lot of the better stuff I buried and still I sometimes will remember where those treasures are at and go dig them up now and then. But that was stuff within a couple miles of Home.

But... from what I know of hikers, they are not predisposed to steal from each other, and if you're out camping 20 miles from anywhere, I don't see who else might be out there to steal stuff? Even the homeless and criminals stay close to civilization.

Edited by DieChecker, 26 September 2013 - 04:14 AM.

Here at Intel we make processors on 12 inch wafers. And, the individual processors on the wafers are called die. And, I am employed to check these die. That is why I am the DieChecker.

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#37    keninsc

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Posted 26 September 2013 - 07:00 AM

There's really no possibility I can't rule out.

The main thing I'm starting to do is think in somewhat different terms where this creature is concerned. Don't get me wrong, I'm not ready to jump onto the band wagon and embrace all thimgs as being Bigfoot activity. But it's got me thinking.


#38    Earl.Of.Trumps

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Posted 26 September 2013 - 07:58 PM

View Postkeninsc, on 26 September 2013 - 04:04 AM, said:

The ax could simply have been misplaced, and sadly the knives could have been stolen by thieving humans, however.....what about the bag of guts? Why would any known wild creature simply make off with guts, bag and all? Then there's the missing rope, ripped off my back pack and other more valuable things left behind?

Ken, your story is very very interesting. spooky, but nice.

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#39    Earl.Of.Trumps

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Posted 26 September 2013 - 07:59 PM

View PostDieChecker, on 26 September 2013 - 04:13 AM, said:

There are homeless living in the woods, and sometimes criminals??

I know that as a kid and teenager, I stole a LOT of stuff out in the woods. If you'd left your stuff out where I could get at it, when I was 14, it would have been GONE. A lot of the better stuff I buried and still I sometimes will remember where those treasures are at and go dig them up now and then. But that was stuff within a couple miles of Home.

But... from what I know of hikers, they are not predisposed to steal from each other, and if you're out camping 20 miles from anywhere, I don't see who else might be out there to steal stuff? Even the homeless and criminals stay close to civilization.


DieChecker, I see your point, *but*.... (there's always that 'but') a bag of guts...????? YIKES!

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#40    keninsc

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Posted 26 September 2013 - 10:52 PM

Yeah, I use to be an avid hunter and of course if you shot it, you have to clean it and prepare it for the table. Unlike a lot of guys who drive around with a dead deer to show it off, most real hunters know that in the first few minutes following the kill what you do is important. Field dressing........the removal of the internal organs........is important.

However, often time when hunting in a group many will opt to bring their back to a central location in order to get help in the butchering process. That central location is often the hunting camp, last thing you want is a bunch of rotting gut pile around for a number of reasons, so we would use trash bags and then haul them away or bury them.

In the case I mentioned we didn't get it all done.


#41    keninsc

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Posted 27 September 2013 - 01:38 AM

View PostQuiteContrary, on 25 September 2013 - 09:31 PM, said:

I do not agree with the unrealistic portrait of a zoologically sound bigfoot  I hear all the time. As some unnatural creature, operating above nature, above "mistakes", above desperation, above being ruled by its natural needs.

The tool stealing v. why then not more human contact thing is not the stand-alone oddity of this creature we have to find answers for. It is all we ever do when it comes to bf, look for answers to all this creature's unexplainable unnatural supernatural behavior.

As it happens, I do agree with you QC. The whole thing is wrought with catch-22's, contradictions and some things that make no sense at all. However, I'm forced to consider it as a possibility at this point in my life. If it had been a single event rather than three then I would have blown it off as well. Now consider that I have had two friends who told me they saw the bugger. I've been talking to people both here and elsewhere who are card carrying believers who've pointed things out to me. Things, I might add, that I have seen myself and never made a connection to a Bigfoot. Now I find myself wondering and I'm inviting all who read this to ask questions, offer comments, even speculate with me if they'd like.

One thing I learned early on in engineering is no one has all the answers and the best way to try and cover yourself is to "brain storm" it. The more brains you have the better.

:yes:


#42    DieChecker

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Posted 27 September 2013 - 03:34 AM

View PostEarl.Of.Trumps, on 26 September 2013 - 07:59 PM, said:

DieChecker, I see your point, *but*.... (there's always that 'but') a bag of guts...????? YIKES!
Kids..... You can't predict what might happen.

When I was a kid, I walked up on a site where a deer had been butchered and there was guts and stuff there, and I walked off with the set of 4 hooves that the hunter had cut off for some reason. Is cutting off the hooves (hoofs?) normal practice?

Here at Intel we make processors on 12 inch wafers. And, the individual processors on the wafers are called die. And, I am employed to check these die. That is why I am the DieChecker.

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Qualifications? This is cryptozoology, dammit! All that is required is the spirit of adventure. - Night Walker

#43    keninsc

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Posted 27 September 2013 - 03:59 AM

Most modern hunters usually have no use for the hooves unless they plan to make them part of a mounted display. I recall finding a relatively fresh carcass once with only the head and front legs missing. Obviously taken by a trophy hunter.

Personally I never cared for leaving perfectly good meat out to rot, but that happens.


#44    QuiteContrary

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Posted 27 September 2013 - 04:50 AM

View Postkeninsc, on 27 September 2013 - 01:38 AM, said:

As it happens, I do agree with you QC. The whole thing is wrought with catch-22's, contradictions and some things that make no sense at all. However, I'm forced to consider it as a possibility at this point in my life. If it had been a single event rather than three then I would have blown it off as well. Now consider that I have had two friends who told me they saw the bugger. I've been talking to people both here and elsewhere who are card carrying believers who've pointed things out to me. Things, I might add, that I have seen myself and never made a connection to a Bigfoot. Now I find myself wondering and I'm inviting all who read this to ask questions, offer comments, even speculate with me if they'd like.

One thing I learned early on in engineering is no one has all the answers and the best way to try and cover yourself is to "brain storm" it. The more brains you have the better.

:yes:

I agree. It is what all threads are, an OP that everyone thinks about and comments on... for, against, undecided and all manner in between.

I think of all the lost stuff I've found in the woods. My H's findings too, while hunting for so many years. It's hard not to spend a few hours in the woods and not find something humans have left behind, unfortunately. Although it is usually useless or trash.  

I'd guess humans pick up stuff they find and take it home, if they want it, more often then they leave it behind.
I always taught my kids not to take things just because they've found it and it appears someone else has lost it. Maybe the person will return looking for it.
But it seems like the woods are fair game. There is not a lost and found, although sometimes you can turn stuff into rangers or the landowners.

Keep your eyes wide open and don't run!

P.S. Just to be clear, because sometimes I am not. I do not believe...
in the existence of a large previously unknown undiscovered hairy biped roaming North America.
But I like to hear the accounts, read the books, watch the shows, discuss and argue about the phenomenon.

#45    keninsc

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Posted 27 September 2013 - 05:11 AM

True Dat!

Personally, I've learn more from discussions with people I disagree with rather than the opposite. That's not to say that flame wars are a good thing at all because that's just internet drama run amuck.

Also, as you point out, people simply loose things or just carelessly forget them. I once found a really nice knife stuck in a tree. It had been there a very long time and was rusted pretty badly. I'd guessed someone planted it there then forgot to resheath it and time had taken it's toll on it. Nothing really odd about it orveven mysterious, but being a lover of large fixed bladed knives myself it seem a terrible shame. I left it where it was undisturbed.







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