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America position on the syrian situation


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#1    the-Unexpected-Soul

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Posted 24 September 2013 - 12:09 PM

so America is okay if the conflict continue on as long as the dying is not by chemical weapons, and can this be a green light for Assad to continue what he is doing as the problem was only that people have died of chemicals not explosions ?

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#2    RavenHawk

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Posted 24 September 2013 - 05:06 PM

Iím not necessarily ďOKĒ with it, and it doesnít matter if it is death by WMD or conventional means.  It is still a slow burning fuse that can ignite the whole thing beyond the region.  But this is the mess created by the Democrats/Progressives/Socialists in this country.  If we had remained in Iraq in strength, this would not be happening now.  Because the Socialists were so jealous in capturing the Whitehouse, they became blind to the issues of the region among other things elsewhere.  They just donít understand the dynamics.  As much as I think we should/need to do something, weíve already made our bed and need to stand down.  We should prepare for the next opportunity to go in but that could be another 100 years before that happens.  Although, a strike at Israel by Iran is becoming more of a reality and this would be our excuse Ė or should be.  

I would suggest we go before that strike, but we need to get our house in order and remove all vestiges of Socialism and ineptness first.  We need to establish our will from a position of strength.  This cannot happen if we are Socialist.  Socialism robs individual achievement en masse.  The difference being that in a united Republic, a nation of individuals stands strong but under Socialism, the military becomes an implement of control for a means to an end.  And the individual members of the military matter not.  They become *only* cannon fodder.  Just perfect for a narcissistic POTUS.

Iím sorry to say, but I think your nation is fnucked and itís because we are fnucked.  Having a choice between Assad on one side and al Qaeda on the other highlights the problem that American influence could have fixed if we had planned to stay in Iraq for several generations.  The Left touted that Bush going into Iraq to fight al Qaeda would just recruit more members, but the fact is is that we were merely stirring up the nest.  Bush didnít create more; he just drew them out into the open.  What will bloat the ranks of terrorists will be not putting boots on the ground.  But this nation no longer has the will, we have been dumbed-down by the Obama Administration.

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#3    Yamato

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Posted 24 September 2013 - 08:55 PM

View Postthe-Unexpected-Soul, on 24 September 2013 - 12:09 PM, said:

so America is okay if the conflict continue on as long as the dying is not by chemical weapons, and can this be a green light for Assad to continue what he is doing as the problem was only that people have died of chemicals not explosions ?
Nobody is okay that the conflict continues.  Missiles would have escalated the conflict not the reverse.   Assad still has a yellow light and he's still running it.

We should consider people dead by explosion as well as chemical; they are both equivalent imo.

"The power to declare war, including the power of judging the causes of war, is fully and exclusively vested in the Legislature.  The Executive has no right, in any case, to decide the question" ~ James Madison
"Peace cannot be achieved by force, only by understanding."  ~ Albert Einstein
"To deny people their human rights is to challenge their very humanity.   To impose on them a wretched life of hunger and deprivation is to dehumanize them." ~ Nelson Mandela
"I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians.  Your Christians are so unlike your Christ." ~ Mahatma Gandhi

#4    lightly

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 01:17 AM

View Postthe-Unexpected-Soul, on 24 September 2013 - 12:09 PM, said:

so America is okay if the conflict continue on as long as the dying is not by chemical weapons, and can this be a green light for Assad to continue what he is doing as the problem was only that people have died of chemicals not explosions ?

   Good Question .     ... I also find the U.S. government's stance confusing .    'the "U.S."    .. says it doesn't want to foment regime change ... BUT,  gives help to some who's Only goal is  Regime Change.      

  I think the  "Red Line"   position,  (and Planned Attack)  , was met with such immediate and overwhelming domestic and international NON support  .. that it just dried up.  For now.

Important:  The above may contain errors, inaccuracies, omissions, and other limitations.

#5    Yamato

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 01:27 AM

View PostRavenHawk, on 24 September 2013 - 05:06 PM, said:

I'm not necessarily "OK" with it, and it doesn't matter if it is death by WMD or conventional means.  It is still a slow burning fuse that can ignite the whole thing beyond the region.  But this is the mess created by the Democrats/Progressives/Socialists in this country.  If we had remained in Iraq in strength, this would not be happening now.  Because the Socialists were so jealous in capturing the Whitehouse, they became blind to the issues of the region among other things elsewhere.  They just don't understand the dynamics.  As much as I think we should/need to do something, we've already made our bed and need to stand down.  We should prepare for the next opportunity to go in but that could be another 100 years before that happens.  Although, a strike at Israel by Iran is becoming more of a reality and this would be our excuse – or should be.  

I would suggest we go before that strike, but we need to get our house in order and remove all vestiges of Socialism and ineptness first.  We need to establish our will from a position of strength.  This cannot happen if we are Socialist.  Socialism robs individual achievement en masse.  The difference being that in a united Republic, a nation of individuals stands strong but under Socialism, the military becomes an implement of control for a means to an end.  And the individual members of the military matter not.  They become *only* cannon fodder.  Just perfect for a narcissistic POTUS.

I'm sorry to say, but I think your nation is fnucked and it's because we are fnucked.  Having a choice between Assad on one side and al Qaeda on the other highlights the problem that American influence could have fixed if we had planned to stay in Iraq for several generations.  The Left touted that Bush going into Iraq to fight al Qaeda would just recruit more members, but the fact is is that we were merely stirring up the nest.  Bush didn't create more; he just drew them out into the open.  What will bloat the ranks of terrorists will be not putting boots on the ground.  But this nation no longer has the will, we have been dumbed-down by the Obama Administration.
The right needs to let go of its entitlement complex to other peoples' business, other peoples' property, other peoples' territory and other peoples' freedom.   Jamming the gubmint down other peoples throats is what's fundamentally wrong with socialism.   Nobody complains about the bread line when it's a charity.  And being on "the right" is no excuse for such Statism.

"The power to declare war, including the power of judging the causes of war, is fully and exclusively vested in the Legislature.  The Executive has no right, in any case, to decide the question" ~ James Madison
"Peace cannot be achieved by force, only by understanding."  ~ Albert Einstein
"To deny people their human rights is to challenge their very humanity.   To impose on them a wretched life of hunger and deprivation is to dehumanize them." ~ Nelson Mandela
"I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians.  Your Christians are so unlike your Christ." ~ Mahatma Gandhi

#6    Black Red Devil

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 02:45 AM

View PostRavenHawk, on 24 September 2013 - 05:06 PM, said:

I'm not necessarily "OK" with it, and it doesn't matter if it is death by WMD or conventional means.  It is still a slow burning fuse that can ignite the whole thing beyond the region.  But this is the mess created by the Democrats/Progressives/Socialists in this country.  If we had remained in Iraq in strength, this would not be happening now.  Because the Socialists were so jealous in capturing the Whitehouse, they became blind to the issues of the region among other things elsewhere.  They just don't understand the dynamics.  As much as I think we should/need to do something, we've already made our bed and need to stand down.  We should prepare for the next opportunity to go in but that could be another 100 years before that happens.  Although, a strike at Israel by Iran is becoming more of a reality and this would be our excuse – or should be.  

I would suggest we go before that strike, but we need to get our house in order and remove all vestiges of Socialism and ineptness first.  We need to establish our will from a position of strength.  This cannot happen if we are Socialist.  Socialism robs individual achievement en masse.  The difference being that in a united Republic, a nation of individuals stands strong but under Socialism, the military becomes an implement of control for a means to an end.  And the individual members of the military matter not.  They become *only* cannon fodder.  Just perfect for a narcissistic POTUS.

I'm sorry to say, but I think your nation is fnucked and it's because we are fnucked.  Having a choice between Assad on one side and al Qaeda on the other highlights the problem that American influence could have fixed if we had planned to stay in Iraq for several generations.  The Left touted that Bush going into Iraq to fight al Qaeda would just recruit more members, but the fact is is that we were merely stirring up the nest.  Bush didn't create more; he just drew them out into the open.  What will bloat the ranks of terrorists will be not putting boots on the ground.  But this nation no longer has the will, we have been dumbed-down by the Obama Administration.

I don't agree with much of anything you said in this post but the enlarged bit really got me puzzled.  Please explain how a nation pledging individualism is considered a united entity?

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#7    Frank Merton

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 02:49 AM

A wise politician will abandon policy when it gets in the way of results.  This does not mean the politician is weak; indeed it implies the opposite.


#8    Black Red Devil

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 02:55 AM

View PostFrank Merton, on 25 September 2013 - 02:49 AM, said:

A wise politician will abandon policy when it gets in the way of results.  This does not mean the politician is weak; indeed it implies the opposite.

No not weak, what it does is send the message to his/her constituents that he is totally confused.

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#9    Frank Merton

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Posted 25 September 2013 - 03:01 AM

View PostBlack Red Devil, on 25 September 2013 - 02:55 AM, said:

No not weak, what it does is send the message to his/her constituents that he is totally confused.
I don't think so.  The signal it sends is that this is someone one can do business with.


#10    Knight Of Shadows

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Posted 26 September 2013 - 08:51 AM

unfortunatly soul this seems the way with the world
but hey lighten up .. when did we ever depended on the west or usa ?
if we did we would be daydreaming of freedom by now instead fighting for it

there is abloutely no one will help and we should come in term with that
we're alone only Allah is with us and He all we need

by the name of Allah the Gracious the Merciful
Say, "I seek refuge in the Lord of daybreak From the evil of that which He created
And from the evil of darkness when it settles And from the evil of the blowers in knots
And from the evil of an envier when he envies"
truthful was Allah The Most High And Great





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