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Obama Total Disregard Congress or Consitution


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#76    spacecowboy342

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Posted 30 December 2013 - 02:58 AM

View PostYamato, on 30 December 2013 - 02:54 AM, said:

Not every budget increases military spending, every war does.
http://www.washingto...g-sequester.jpg
Or every republican presidency. We are spending more now than during the cold war. This is madness


#77    Yamato

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Posted 30 December 2013 - 02:59 AM

View PostHarte, on 30 December 2013 - 12:25 AM, said:

Welcome to forcing Americans to pay 1500 dollars for a 30 inch flatscreen.

IOW, welcome to losing the next election.

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You'd have to demonstrate that his idea is represented by the party establishment, and it's not.  You'd also have to show a difference between one platform and the other, but there isn't one.   You'd also have to explain how people are so sensitive to TV prices when they're not for energy, health care, education, and military.   All of these sectors are severely inflationary and wasteful.  One party obediently props up its assigned spending sprees, the other props up theirs.

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#78    Yamato

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Posted 30 December 2013 - 03:05 AM

View Postspacecowboy342, on 30 December 2013 - 02:58 AM, said:

Or every republican presidency.
No, that chart shows that's not true either.  Eisenhower lowered spending after Truman raised it.  Nixon lowered spending after Johnson raised it.   There's no salvation from military spending drawn on party lines at all.

We are spending mad money on military, and Obama's spending cuts are disapproved of by the conservative establishment.   Take Mitt Romney in 2012, he wasn't suggesting any spending cuts in the final days of the election, he was complaining about Obama's spending cuts.

"The power to declare war, including the power of judging the causes of war, is fully and exclusively vested in the Legislature.  The Executive has no right, in any case, to decide the question" ~ James Madison
"Peace cannot be achieved by force, only by understanding."  ~ Albert Einstein
"To deny people their human rights is to challenge their very humanity.   To impose on them a wretched life of hunger and deprivation is to dehumanize them." ~ Nelson Mandela
"I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians.  Your Christians are so unlike your Christ." ~ Mahatma Gandhi

#79    Gamrat

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Posted 30 December 2013 - 02:10 PM

WOW! Thanks for the BS post on a total BS topic! You hypocrites make me laugh! Ok... please site actual examples of when the constitution was p***ed on... and don't give me more BS... When you look at facts rather than opinion the world makes much more sense.


#80    Babe Ruth

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Posted 30 December 2013 - 02:45 PM

View PostNeognosis, on 29 December 2013 - 11:47 PM, said:

Military spending does prop up a lot of companies and pay a lot of salaries.

If you are going to allow manufacturing to leave this country and do nothing about it, the economy needs SOMETHING to be made or processed here, other wise there will be no jobs.

You have no idea how many livelihoods are effected by defense spending, for better or worse. Spend it there or spend it on more unemployment.... unless you fix the manufacturing problem

True, dat!

But the question soon becomes something like : do we really need to spend more money on the military than the next 5 or 10 countries in the world do, combined?

At what point does military spending become unnecessary and wasteful?


#81    Neognosis

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Posted 30 December 2013 - 04:37 PM

It is already unnecessary and wasteful.

But no congressman wants to be the one who let a thousand people in his district lose their jobs because the contract on some outdated tank that we don't use or need was canceled by congress, and there's a company there that makes a sprocket or gear for it. So, it's more complicated in our american process than just to do things that make sense.


#82    Babe Ruth

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Posted 30 December 2013 - 08:42 PM

To be sure, SOME military spending is crucial.  I'm all for a strong military, but one that operates STRICTLY within the rule of law as defined by the US Constitution.

For most of my life, this country and its government has been involved in some kind of illegitimate and undeclared war or the other.  That's what Ike was warning against, and that is what we have today.


#83    Sir Wearer of Hats

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Posted 30 December 2013 - 11:15 PM

View Postspacecowboy342, on 30 December 2013 - 02:58 AM, said:

Or every republican presidency. We are spending more now than during the cold war. This is madness
Umm.... isn't Obama a Democrat?

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#84    spacecowboy342

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 02:13 AM

View PostSir Wearer of Hats, on 30 December 2013 - 11:15 PM, said:

Umm.... isn't Obama a Democrat?
Yeah, but this is a special case. No other president had to deal with such an obstructionist do-nothing congress that has refused to even pass a budget in what? 4 years or so? Which makes the OP kind of ironic. What has congress actually done for Obama to disregard? They actually had to change the rules in the senate just to get votes on appointees. The republicans' only mission seems to be makes sure nothing gets done. At this they are succeeding


#85    Yamato

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 04:30 AM

The market loves getting nothing done then, if that's what it is.   And based on the size of the debt and deficits, it's a whole lotta nothing, too.

"The power to declare war, including the power of judging the causes of war, is fully and exclusively vested in the Legislature.  The Executive has no right, in any case, to decide the question" ~ James Madison
"Peace cannot be achieved by force, only by understanding."  ~ Albert Einstein
"To deny people their human rights is to challenge their very humanity.   To impose on them a wretched life of hunger and deprivation is to dehumanize them." ~ Nelson Mandela
"I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians.  Your Christians are so unlike your Christ." ~ Mahatma Gandhi

#86    Neognosis

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 02:19 PM

Quote

The republicans' only mission seems to be makes sure nothing gets done. At this they are succeeding

Right.

So, which is more an offense... Obama's "disregard" for congress, or congress' disregard for the american people?


#87    ninjadude

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 08:02 PM

View PostHarte, on 29 December 2013 - 11:03 PM, said:

No legislation in the past granted as much discretion to the Secretary (namely) and the President (by proxy) that could have been addressed in the bill itself.

554 Billion yearly to the DOD and the sec of Defense?

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#88    Babe Ruth

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Posted 31 December 2013 - 08:33 PM

View Postspacecowboy342, on 31 December 2013 - 02:13 AM, said:

Yeah, but this is a special case. No other president had to deal with such an obstructionist do-nothing congress that has refused to even pass a budget in what? 4 years or so? Which makes the OP kind of ironic. What has congress actually done for Obama to disregard? They actually had to change the rules in the senate just to get votes on appointees. The republicans' only mission seems to be makes sure nothing gets done. At this they are succeeding

Note that the OP specifies "congress or constitution". :tu:


#89    Harte

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Posted 01 January 2014 - 12:53 AM

View Postspacecowboy342, on 31 December 2013 - 02:13 AM, said:

Yeah, but this is a special case. No other president had to deal with such an obstructionist do-nothing congress that has refused to even pass a budget in what? 4 years or so?
Oh, well then, a "special case" for Obama, then!

Please.  Your argument about a budget shoots your own idea down.

The Republicans can't pass a budget in the Senate.  They're the minority.

The House has passed a budget every year.  The Senate never even took up the process in those years you're talking about.

Harte

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#90    spacecowboy342

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Posted 01 January 2014 - 01:06 AM

View PostHarte, on 01 January 2014 - 12:53 AM, said:

Oh, well then, a "special case" for Obama, then!

Please.  Your argument about a budget shoots your own idea down.

The Republicans can't pass a budget in the Senate.  They're the minority.

The House has passed a budget every year.  The Senate never even took up the process in those years you're talking about.

Harte
Maybe the gerrymandered house should take a lesson by this and pass something that can be agreed to by both sides. This is the political process, not continually insisting on getting your own way in hopes of wearing down the opposition. The senate can't take up the process. By the constitution all money bills originate in the house. The conservatives need to get a grip and realize they aren't running the show any more and stop trying to hijack the government from the house





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