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Dems Turn to Minimum Wage as 2014 Strategy

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#1    DieChecker

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Posted 30 December 2013 - 03:17 AM

http://www.nytimes.c...ategy.html?_r=0

Quote

In the capital, Mr. Obama and congressional Democrats are supporting legislation that would raise the federal minimum wage to $10.10 an hour by 2015. Mr. Obama is planning a series of speeches across the country focused on improving wages for workers, aides said, many of them timed to coincide with key minimum-wage votes in Congress. Income inequality is also likely to play a prominent role in his State of the Union address next month.

Though I am a fiscal conservative, I don't see this as Armagedden. A jump from $7.25 to $10+ an hour seems pretty steep, but I don't see this putting anyone out of business. I do see prices adjusting though.

I also tend to agree that it potentially would reduce government assistance handed out to those living in poverty.

But then that begs the question... Won't the government then just re-set what line constitutes poverty?

Even if the Democrats are successful to get $10+ an hour minimum wage, I predict this will NOT help them much in the 2014 elections. Obamacare is just such a monsterous chaotic mess that it will not be possible to distract or white-wash it away. Nothing short of a war, or other global event, such as (well handled) multiple hurricanes, or multiple (well handled) terror attacks, will reduce Obamacare's smack down on the Democrat credibility before the end of 2014.

Edited by DieChecker, 30 December 2013 - 03:20 AM.

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#2    and then

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Posted 30 December 2013 - 03:43 AM

View PostDieChecker, on 30 December 2013 - 03:17 AM, said:

http://www.nytimes.c...ategy.html?_r=0


Though I am a fiscal conservative, I don't see this as Armagedden. A jump from $7.25 to $10+ an hour seems pretty steep, but I don't see this putting anyone out of business. I do see prices adjusting though.

I also tend to agree that it potentially would reduce government assistance handed out to those living in poverty.

But then that begs the question... Won't the government then just re-set what line constitutes poverty?

Even if the Democrats are successful to get $10+ an hour minimum wage, I predict this will NOT help them much in the 2014 elections. Obamacare is just such a monsterous chaotic mess that it will not be possible to distract or white-wash it away. Nothing short of a war, or other global event, such as (well handled) multiple hurricanes, or multiple (well handled) terror attacks, will reduce Obamacare's smack down on the Democrat credibility before the end of 2014.
He and his party SHOULD be held accountable for this dreadfully destructive power grab.  But he has walked smooth away from so much in the past 5 years it will not surprise me if he skips out on this one also.  If the right gets control of the house and senate they should begin relentlessly passing well considered legislative fixes to minimize the damage of the ACA.  He will, of course, veto most of them but it may be that they can structure some of it such that he signs off so as to get SOMETHING done in the last 3 years of his presidency.  The alternate route is for him to continue in his role as Caesar and rule by executive orders.  Maybe they will have enough courage and integrity to defund every one of his actions - they CAN actually do this I think.  At some point he may step so far over the line that it could be possible to impeach, try and convict and end this nightmare.

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#3    Purifier

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Posted 30 December 2013 - 05:08 AM

Well the first step is to reduce the usual welfare, unemployment, food stamps, etc. Both Repubs and Dems are starting to do that now. The second step is to compensate by raising the minimum wage. Both Repubs and Dems will start doing that soon and I'll bet you ten to one it want stop at $10.10 an hour; even when Obama is out of office. The next joker, Repub or Dem will probably raise it some more.

It looks like it's heading that way to me, based on past political history with politicians and the economy.


Edit: typo

Edited by Purifier, 30 December 2013 - 05:08 AM.

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#4    DieChecker

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Posted 30 December 2013 - 05:55 AM

I agree, because it is a political promise that is guaranteed to gain votes.

Here at Intel we make processors on 12 inch wafers. And, the individual processors on the wafers are called die. And, I am employed to check these die. That is why I am the DieChecker.

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Qualifications? This is cryptozoology, dammit! All that is required is the spirit of adventure. - Night Walker

#5    Yamato

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Posted 30 December 2013 - 08:19 AM

Democrats will get what they want, eventually.  Both parties always do.

By forcing the economy to perform so many unnatural but politically correct stunts, our bureaucrats are ruining it and the chance for greatness in the future.   Leftists, please stop coddling America's largest corporations using the force control of govt.



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#6    Peter B

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Posted 30 December 2013 - 01:09 PM

I'm intrigued why people here are so opposed to the idea of increasing the minimum wage. Why should it cause economic problems (as claimed by some in the article linked in the OP)? Don't you think that millions of people earning an extra $3 an hour is going to pump a lot of money into the economy? These people are currently paid so little it's not as though they're going to put the extra money in the bank - they're going to spend it! And on top of that, higher wages presumably means more income tax for the government to help it balance its books.


#7    Gromdor

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Posted 30 December 2013 - 01:44 PM

Inflation and the poverty level increases regardless of the minimum wage level.  We already have 47% of Americans not paying income tax because they basically don't make enough to tax.  We subsidize the costs of labor for the retail and fast food industries with government benefits.  Perhaps a minimum wage increase is not the answer, but these are three trends that are going to increase every year with the status quo.


#8    DieChecker

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Posted 30 December 2013 - 08:50 PM

View PostPeter B, on 30 December 2013 - 01:09 PM, said:

I'm intrigued why people here are so opposed to the idea of increasing the minimum wage. Why should it cause economic problems (as claimed by some in the article linked in the OP)? Don't you think that millions of people earning an extra $3 an hour is going to pump a lot of money into the economy? These people are currently paid so little it's not as though they're going to put the extra money in the bank - they're going to spend it! And on top of that, higher wages presumably means more income tax for the government to help it balance its books.

View PostGromdor, on 30 December 2013 - 01:44 PM, said:

Inflation and the poverty level increases regardless of the minimum wage level.  We already have 47% of Americans not paying income tax because they basically don't make enough to tax.  We subsidize the costs of labor for the retail and fast food industries with government benefits.  Perhaps a minimum wage increase is not the answer, but these are three trends that are going to increase every year with the status quo.

Gromdor has the right idea of it.


Perhaps the people getting raised up to a new minimum wage would be 10% better off for a year, but then Cost of Living will catch up, and then these people will be in the same boat they are now. Sure, they will be earning more, but they'll be paying out more too. They will not have extra money in the bank. They will be living paycheck to paycheck again. And there is nothing wrong with raising the minimum wage, it is a time tested true method of temporary help to those in, and near, poverty. It just simply is not permenant. Not even close. A year would be a generous time lag on the affects of such a payraise.

All a higher minimum wage really is going to do is draw everyone else down a little to try to make things more "Fair". What is the term being used these days.... reduce the "economic inequality".

Here at Intel we make processors on 12 inch wafers. And, the individual processors on the wafers are called die. And, I am employed to check these die. That is why I am the DieChecker.

At times one remains faithful to a cause only because its opponents do not cease to be insipid. - Friedrich Nietzsche

Qualifications? This is cryptozoology, dammit! All that is required is the spirit of adventure. - Night Walker

#9    Yamato

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Posted 30 December 2013 - 09:19 PM

View PostPeter B, on 30 December 2013 - 01:09 PM, said:

I'm intrigued why people here are so opposed to the idea of increasing the minimum wage. Why should it cause economic problems (as claimed by some in the article linked in the OP)? Don't you think that millions of people earning an extra $3 an hour is going to pump a lot of money into the economy? These people are currently paid so little it's not as though they're going to put the extra money in the bank - they're going to spend it! And on top of that, higher wages presumably means more income tax for the government to help it balance its books.
Into Wal-Mart and the Chinese economy, and the consumer staples sector.  Probably a lot more prescription drugs too, as if anyone needs to spend more on that garbage.

A lot of money into our economy?   Where does this money come from?  You're implying that it comes out of thin air.  What a convenient expectation/mindset 30+ years of Federal Reserve monetary abuse can create, I suppose.   No, the money comes from employers, who have costs, including labor costs.  It's taking money out of the economy before putting it back in.  Who does that help?  The tax collector.

And where's the maximum wage?   If you actually believe that government can value our work fairly, and calculate for the rest of us what "enough" is, why be opposed to lowering a maximum wage?   If I take all the liberal arguments and assume them at the same time, there's no reason why you wouldn't support a maximum wage.

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#10    Kowalski

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Posted 30 December 2013 - 10:56 PM

View PostYamato, on 30 December 2013 - 09:19 PM, said:

A lot of money into our economy?   Where does this money come from?  You're implying that it comes out of thin air.  What a convenient expectation/mindset 30+ years of Federal Reserve monetary abuse can create, I suppose.   No, the money comes from employers, who have costs, including labor costs.  It's taking money out of the economy before putting it back in.  Who does that help?  The tax collector.


Exactly! The problem isn't how much the minimum wage is, this is just a band aid solution. The problem is the federal reserve.

This is the best presentation I've ever seen on how the federal reserve works:

The Biggest Scam In The History Of Mankind - Hidden Secrets of Money Ep 4 - Mike Maloney


Link: http://m.youtube.com...h?v=iFDe5kUUyT0


#11    Purifier

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Posted 30 December 2013 - 11:18 PM

View PostDieChecker, on 30 December 2013 - 05:55 AM, said:

I agree, because it is a political promise that is guaranteed to gain votes.

Yep! That's the Bonus!




View PostDieChecker, on 30 December 2013 - 08:50 PM, said:

Gromdor has the right idea of it.


Perhaps the people getting raised up to a new minimum wage would be 10% better off for a year, but then Cost of Living will catch up, and then these people will be in the same boat they are now. Sure, they will be earning more, but they'll be paying out more too. They will not have extra money in the bank. They will be living paycheck to paycheck again. And there is nothing wrong with raising the minimum wage, it is a time tested true method of temporary help to those in, and near, poverty. It just simply is not permenant. Not even close. A year would be a generous time lag on the affects of such a payraise.

All a higher minimum wage really is going to do is draw everyone else down a little to try to make things more "Fair". What is the term being used these days.... reduce the "economic inequality".


Right on! And 10 years from now, more or less we'll have another economic decline. Then we'll be right back where we were, like in 2005 (I think that's when it started to decline). Anyway...SOS. It's like a frigin' economic merry-go-around.

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#12    Thanato

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Posted 01 January 2014 - 07:32 PM

Are people really against raising minimum wage? Didn't effect us here when they raised it slowely but steadily from 7
$7ish to $10.25 or what ever I is now.

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#13    DieChecker

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Posted 02 January 2014 - 01:38 AM

Did you say you lived in Oregon Thanato? It is $8.95 an hour here. And going up to $9.15 as of today.

Here at Intel we make processors on 12 inch wafers. And, the individual processors on the wafers are called die. And, I am employed to check these die. That is why I am the DieChecker.

At times one remains faithful to a cause only because its opponents do not cease to be insipid. - Friedrich Nietzsche

Qualifications? This is cryptozoology, dammit! All that is required is the spirit of adventure. - Night Walker

#14    coolguy

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Posted 02 January 2014 - 06:18 AM

Great way to avoid talk about his failed Obama care lol.
When I started working when I was a kid minimum wage was 3.35 an hour

Edited by coolguy, 02 January 2014 - 06:19 AM.


#15    Yamato

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Posted 02 January 2014 - 07:10 AM

Dangling the dumb carrot in front of the democrat voters again.    Lord knows, it'll work again.   Then the real cost of living will continue to increase a lot faster than our bureaucrats are able to admit, and certainly a lot faster than their flat minimum wage, and they'll dangle the carrot again years from now, years too late.   It'll take 100 years for the voters to learn how bad they're getting skrooed at this point.   When it's damn near necessary to raise the minimum wage, the political energy gets amped enough to push it through the halls of puppets.

"The power to declare war, including the power of judging the causes of war, is fully and exclusively vested in the Legislature.  The Executive has no right, in any case, to decide the question" ~ James Madison
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"To deny people their human rights is to challenge their very humanity.   To impose on them a wretched life of hunger and deprivation is to dehumanize them." ~ Nelson Mandela
"I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians.  Your Christians are so unlike your Christ." ~ Mahatma Gandhi




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