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#1    ambelamba

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Posted 31 March 2014 - 05:31 AM

Trust me, I hate that song. :D I prefer Lift Me Up or House of the Rising Sun (cover by FFDP).

Anyway, I came to realize that the boundary between theism and non-theism can be really blurry, depending on the definition of God. In fact, many of spiritual principles that contradict each other can have same kind of problem. Is that bad? I don't think so.

Rather than seeing religion and faith as the center of our lives, we should see them as instruments, no more no less. This is how we can convince ourselves that the concept of religion itself is not that harmful to mankind.

They came with a Bible and their religion. stole our land, crushed our spirit, and now they tell us we should be thankful to the Lord for being saved.

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#2    davros of skaro

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Posted 31 March 2014 - 07:20 AM

View Postambelamba, on 31 March 2014 - 05:31 AM, said:

Trust me, I hate that song. :D I prefer Lift Me Up or House of the Rising Sun (cover by FFDP).

Anyway, I came to realize that the boundary between theism and non-theism can be really blurry, depending on the definition of God. In fact, many of spiritual principles that contradict each other can have same kind of problem. Is that bad? I don't think so.

Rather than seeing religion and faith as the center of our lives, we should see them as instruments, no more no less. This is how we can convince ourselves that the concept of religion itself is not that harmful to mankind.

The Abrahamic God does not allow what you suggest.

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Leviticus 14 2 Peter 1:16
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https://m.youtube.co...h?v=79Lmmy2jfeo <-- "The Mythical Jesus"
http://www.unexplain...howtopic=272571 <--Science of belief

#3    GreenmansGod

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Posted 31 March 2014 - 03:44 PM

View Postambelamba, on 31 March 2014 - 05:31 AM, said:

Trust me, I hate that song. :D I prefer Lift Me Up or House of the Rising Sun (cover by FFDP).

Anyway, I came to realize that the boundary between theism and non-theism can be really blurry, depending on the definition of God. In fact, many of spiritual principles that contradict each other can have same kind of problem. Is that bad? I don't think so.

Rather than seeing religion and faith as the center of our lives, we should see them as instruments, no more no less. This is how we can convince ourselves that the concept of religion itself is not that harmful to mankind.

:tu: I agree.  They are a tool for guidance and interaction, but beyond that it becomes a tool with which to use and exploit others.

"The moment you declare a set of ideas to be immune from criticism, satire, derision, or contempt, freedom of thought becomes impossible." Salman Rushdie

#4    J. K.

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Posted 31 March 2014 - 04:16 PM

View PostGreenmansGod, on 31 March 2014 - 03:44 PM, said:

:tu: I agree.  They are a tool for guidance and interaction, but beyond that it becomes a tool with which to use and exploit others.

To paraphrase another hotbed issue: "Religion doesn't control people; people control people."

I think the control issue only exists because of the people who want to be in control of everything, and that desire crosses all boundaries.  True religion should focus only on a person's personal relationship with his higher power.

One's reality is another's nightmare.

#5    GreenmansGod

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Posted 31 March 2014 - 06:18 PM

People invented religion, without people there is no religion.  People without religion are still people.

Edited by GreenmansGod, 31 March 2014 - 06:18 PM.

"The moment you declare a set of ideas to be immune from criticism, satire, derision, or contempt, freedom of thought becomes impossible." Salman Rushdie

#6    davros of skaro

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Posted 01 April 2014 - 10:53 AM

View PostJ. K., on 31 March 2014 - 04:16 PM, said:

To paraphrase another hotbed issue: "Religion doesn't control people; people control people."

I think the control issue only exists because of the people who want to be in control of everything, and that desire crosses all boundaries.  True religion should focus only on a person's personal relationship with his higher power.

NonReligious people miss out on pearls of wisdom and do not understand.

1 Peter 2:18-20

18 Slaves, in reverent fear of God submit yourselves to your masters, not only to those who are good and considerate, but also to those who are harsh. 19 For it is commendable if someone bears up under the pain of unjust suffering because they are conscious of God. 20 But how is it to your credit if you receive a beating for doing wrong and endure it? But if you suffer for doing good and you endure it, this is commendable before God.

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Leviticus 14 2 Peter 1:16
http://m.youtube.com...h?v=MzrIHdN9O7M <-- "Ten Lies About Jesus"
https://m.youtube.co...h?v=79Lmmy2jfeo <-- "The Mythical Jesus"
http://www.unexplain...howtopic=272571 <--Science of belief

#7    GreenmansGod

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Posted 01 April 2014 - 02:41 PM

Davros, that is the kind of Scripture a thiest will spend 10 pages of typing trying to explain why is means something other than what is written.  Should be interesting.

"The moment you declare a set of ideas to be immune from criticism, satire, derision, or contempt, freedom of thought becomes impossible." Salman Rushdie

#8    davros of skaro

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Posted 01 April 2014 - 02:49 PM

View PostGreenmansGod, on 01 April 2014 - 02:41 PM, said:

Davros, that is the kind of Scripture a thiest will spend 10 pages of typing trying to explain why is means something other than what is written.  Should be interesting.

PA recently offered the apologist spin on it.

Slavery was needed otherwise the inquisition, crusades, and rejection of scientific inquiry would not be possible in the dark ages (not like that, but you understand.)

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Leviticus 14 2 Peter 1:16
http://m.youtube.com...h?v=MzrIHdN9O7M <-- "Ten Lies About Jesus"
https://m.youtube.co...h?v=79Lmmy2jfeo <-- "The Mythical Jesus"
http://www.unexplain...howtopic=272571 <--Science of belief

#9    Paranoid Android

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Posted 01 April 2014 - 10:38 PM

View Postdavros of skaro, on 01 April 2014 - 02:49 PM, said:



PA recently offered the apologist spin on it.

Slavery was needed otherwise the inquisition, crusades, and rejection of scientific inquiry would not be possible in the dark ages (not like that, but you understand.)
That's not even close to what I said, but such misquotes are par for the course, it seems. At least it is so with you.

Edited by Paranoid Android, 01 April 2014 - 10:46 PM.

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#10    Paranoid Android

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Posted 01 April 2014 - 10:45 PM

View PostGreenmansGod, on 01 April 2014 - 02:41 PM, said:

Davros, that is the kind of Scripture a thiest will spend 10 pages of typing trying to explain why is means something other than what is written.  Should be interesting.
Actually, it means exactly what it says - submit to the earthly authorities, including slaves to submit to their masters. If you're going to be punished, then at least make sure you're innocent so that you have no reason to be punished and the evil is entirely on their shoulders and not yours.

That really was the quickest 10 pages I've ever written :yes: :tu:

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#11    davros of skaro

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Posted 02 April 2014 - 01:36 AM

View PostParanoid Android, on 01 April 2014 - 10:38 PM, said:

That's not even close to what I said, but such misquotes are par for the course, it seems. At least it is so with you.

" (not like that, but you understand.)"

GmG understands.

I do not feel like fishing for your qoutes, but slavery was needed in the Bible including in the Roman Empire in order to establish the Christian Church in the context of the times.

If I had to make excuses for a deity that in reality I am more moral than said deity, would make me snap out of it.

Posted Image
Leviticus 14 2 Peter 1:16
http://m.youtube.com...h?v=MzrIHdN9O7M <-- "Ten Lies About Jesus"
https://m.youtube.co...h?v=79Lmmy2jfeo <-- "The Mythical Jesus"
http://www.unexplain...howtopic=272571 <--Science of belief

#12    Paranoid Android

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Posted 02 April 2014 - 12:13 PM

View Postdavros of skaro, on 02 April 2014 - 01:36 AM, said:



" (not like that, but you understand.)"

GmG understands.

I do not feel like fishing for your qoutes, but slavery was needed in the Bible including in the Roman Empire in order to establish the Christian Church in the context of the times.

If I had to make excuses for a deity that in reality I am more moral than said deity, would make me snap out of it.
Completely different. But if you choose to say otherwise, I can't stop you. Good morning,

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#13    libstaK

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Posted 02 April 2014 - 12:24 PM

View PostParanoid Android, on 01 April 2014 - 10:45 PM, said:

Actually, it means exactly what it says - submit to the earthly authorities, including slaves to submit to their masters. If you're going to be punished, then at least make sure you're innocent so that you have no reason to be punished and the evil is entirely on their shoulders and not yours.

That really was the quickest 10 pages I've ever written :yes: :tu:
Or even less pages "two wrongs do not make a right".  Meeting evil with evil is not going to end evil.

"I warn you, whoever you are, oh you who wish to probe the arcanes of nature, if you do not find within yourself that which you seek, neither shall you find it outside.
If you ignore the excellencies of your own house, how do you intend to find other excellencies?
In you is hidden the treasure of treasures, Oh man, know thyself and you shall know the Universe and the Gods."

Inscription - Temple of Delphi

#14    davros of skaro

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Posted 02 April 2014 - 12:54 PM

View PostParanoid Android, on 02 April 2014 - 12:13 PM, said:

Completely different. But if you choose to say otherwise, I can't stop you. Good morning,

I do not believe in slavery in any context, but your supposed omnipotent God does.Don't blink.

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Leviticus 14 2 Peter 1:16
http://m.youtube.com...h?v=MzrIHdN9O7M <-- "Ten Lies About Jesus"
https://m.youtube.co...h?v=79Lmmy2jfeo <-- "The Mythical Jesus"
http://www.unexplain...howtopic=272571 <--Science of belief

#15    Paranoid Android

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Posted 02 April 2014 - 12:57 PM

View Postdavros of skaro, on 02 April 2014 - 12:54 PM, said:



I do not believe in slavery in any context, but your supposed omnipotent God does.Don't blink.
None of which bears on the answer I gave in an unrelated context about 1st century Roman society. You've chosen to misquote my view to support yours. Kudos to you, on that, and as such..... Good morning....

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My blog is now taking a new direction.  Dedicated to my father who was a great inspiration in my life, I wish to honour his memory (RIP, dad) by sharing with the world what he had always kept to himself.  More details, http://www.unexplain...showentry=27811




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