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Something to ponder on conspiracies


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#1    ambelamba

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Posted 02 May 2014 - 12:15 AM

I was listening to Kevin and Bean show on my way to my casting agency for a status update. (yea, I became a SAG member without planning on it. Weird...) And they had a sketch segment about a mock interview with Rush Lumbaugh. \

Well, the Rush character (played by some comedian) claimed that Magic Johnson conspired to get Sterling butt-kicked and his plan worked. According to him, the black entertainers have...uh...The Black Caucus and they have their own conspiracies to take over whatever they want. LA Clippers is the next target. According to the Rush character...

The black people have huge caucuses.

Enormous caucuses.

*Giggle*

But something dawned on me. The mock conspiracy presented on the radio show sounded convincing to conspiracy theorists! But here's one major problem with that.

Secret conspiracies tend to fail more often because they tend to attract more human errors and bureaucratic mishaps. Realistically, it's insanely difficult to pull off any minor or major conspiracy plans. When I realized this, I could chill out a bit more. The world doesn't work like a mind chess.

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#2    toyomotor

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Posted 28 June 2014 - 12:21 PM

Quote

Secret conspiracies tend to fail more often because they tend to attract more human errors and bureaucratic mishaps. Realistically, it's insanely difficult to pull off any minor or major conspiracy plans. When I realized this, I could chill out a bit more. The world doesn't work like a mind chess.

You hold that thought if it makes you happy.

The best and major conspiracies succeed because they are secret. We don't even know that they happened.

And if did know, I certainly wouldn't tell anyone because I sort of like being alive.

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#3    Frank Merton

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Posted 28 June 2014 - 12:50 PM

I think the OP is right; I know for damn certain if I were a government official or head of some big company or whatever I would never try to hide bad information.  That just serves to make it look much worse when it does come out, and it will.

When it comes to something really significant, such as an assassination or something, if it is legal by the laws of your country, then do it openly and issue a press release ("We just killed a jeep full of terrorists in Yemen.")  Don't even think about it if your law says no.


#4    Babe Ruth

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Posted 28 June 2014 - 01:55 PM

View PostFrank Merton, on 28 June 2014 - 12:50 PM, said:

I think the OP is right; I know for damn certain if I were a government official or head of some big company or whatever I would never try to hide bad information.  That just serves to make it look much worse when it does come out, and it will.

When it comes to something really significant, such as an assassination or something, if it is legal by the laws of your country, then do it openly and issue a press release ("We just killed a jeep full of terrorists in Yemen.")  Don't even think about it if your law says no.

In your life have you worked for a government?  If so, for how many years and in what capacity?

It sounds like you are suggesting that governments and "big companies" do not spin?


#5    Earl.Of.Trumps

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Posted 28 June 2014 - 04:03 PM

A fact of reality is this... if people can get away with a crime, one that makes them very wealthy or takes out a dreaded political leader, they will do it. And they certainly will not dispatch the info to CNN/BBC.

Human nature, in other words. Of course, conspiracies exist. Not all the 'reported' conspiracies are real, but some are.

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#6    bendigger0

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Posted 28 June 2014 - 05:22 PM

View Postambelamba, on 02 May 2014 - 12:15 AM, said:

I was listening to Kevin and Bean show on my way to my casting agency for a status update. (yea, I became a SAG member without planning on it. Weird...) And they had a sketch segment about a mock interview with Rush Lumbaugh. \

Well, the Rush character (played by some comedian) claimed that Magic Johnson conspired to get Sterling butt-kicked and his plan worked. According to him, the black entertainers have...uh...The Black Caucus and they have their own conspiracies to take over whatever they want. LA Clippers is the next target. According to the Rush character...

The black people have huge caucuses.

Enormous caucuses.

*Giggle*

But something dawned on me. The mock conspiracy presented on the radio show sounded convincing to conspiracy theorists! But here's one major problem with that.

Secret conspiracies tend to fail more often because they tend to attract more human errors and bureaucratic mishaps. Realistically, it's insanely difficult to pull off any minor or major conspiracy plans. When I realized this, I could chill out a bit more. The world doesn't work like a mind chess.
You don't know much about the Federal Reserve Bank do you?  The World Bank, or the International Monetary Fund?


#7    bendigger0

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Posted 28 June 2014 - 05:31 PM

View PostFrank Merton, on 28 June 2014 - 12:50 PM, said:

I think the OP is right; I know for damn certain if I were a government official or head of some big company or whatever I would never try to hide bad information.  That just serves to make it look much worse when it does come out, and it will.

When it comes to something really significant, such as an assassination or something, if it is legal by the laws of your country, then do it openly and issue a press release ("We just killed a jeep full of terrorists in Yemen.")  Don't even think about it if your law says no.
In a company like ENRON for example, the conspiracy was one of silence.  Results (financial return) are all that matters.  People at the top AND the traders knew something wrong was happening, but they didn't discuss it (officially).  Among thinking people an understanding can be reached without an overt communication.  Like "actions speak louder than words" or "a picture is worth a thousand words".  Within Government, say CIA, results are also what is desired.  The methods and means of obtaining those desired results aren't always discussed.  Like... if you tell an assassin that you have problem with a certain individual, what do think will happen?


#8    spartan max2

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Posted 28 June 2014 - 05:39 PM

Yeah I agree with the world dosent work like chess.

Iv always pictures life more like a poker game. You never know what cards coming next and you normally can't see people's hands.

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#9    Slate

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Posted 02 July 2014 - 04:18 PM

View Postambelamba, on 02 May 2014 - 12:15 AM, said:

Realistically, it's insanely difficult to pull off any minor or major conspiracy plans.

"Conspiracy" in this context is an element of criminal or civil law.

All crimes that are plotted between two or more people are considered conspiracies, and "conspiracy" is added as an offense in a criminal case in addition to the actual crime committed.

All you have to do is look at how many plotted crimes are successfully committed without being solved and you will realize that there are many, many, many successful conspiracies committed every day.

All organized crime involves conspiracy. Prostitution rings and drug rings are conspiracies.

Corporate and political conspiracies often go unnoticed because often the criminal act involved isn't as obvious; you usually have to follow the money to figure out what the crime is, and it's often a civil matter rather than criminal, and my involve collusion rather than conspiracy.

If two or more people plot to commit a crime, and only one of them actually carries out the criminal act, they are all guilty of the same crime.

Confessions by members of a conspiracy does not affect their liability for the crimes committed, but may reduce their sentence after conviction.

Edited by Slate, 02 July 2014 - 04:27 PM.

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#10    Rafterman

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Posted 03 July 2014 - 02:11 PM

View Posttoyomotor, on 28 June 2014 - 12:21 PM, said:

You hold that thought if it makes you happy.

The best and major conspiracies succeed because they are secret. We don't even know that they happened.

And if did know, I certainly wouldn't tell anyone because I sort of like being alive.

That's a pretty convenient position don't you think.

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#11    Frank Merton

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Posted 03 July 2014 - 02:27 PM

I worked for one of the largest US Corporations for 15 years and I was never told to keep silent or spin anything and in fact we had to go to seminars where the consequences of such behavior for other companies was held up as examples.  My experience is that this is the norm, the others are the exception.





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