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Fear of responding to life


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#1    markdohle

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Posted 22 May 2014 - 08:09 PM

Fear of responding to life


The soul is like a flower opening up before the sun…our sins are based on the fear of fully responding to life in a manner that allows our hearts to expand in love.  Sin is a headlong escape from truth and our own inner need for grace.   We seek to flee pain, but only run deeper into its embrace.  


#2    JJ50

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Posted 23 May 2014 - 11:25 AM

'Sin' is a silly little word, imo. Things which some consider a 'sin', like homosexuality for instance, no reasonable person would describe it as wrong!

“The wise recognise their failings and laugh at their idiosyncrasies” RJG



#3    markdohle

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Posted 23 May 2014 - 11:47 AM

View PostJJ50, on 23 May 2014 - 11:25 AM, said:

'Sin' is a silly little word, imo. Things which some consider a 'sin', like homosexuality for instance, no reasonable person would describe it as wrong!

Yes I understand, yet it still has meaning for many and not always based on neurotic guilt but the reality of the fact that we do have freedom, that it can grow, and also that we can fail.

Peace
Mark


#4    JJ50

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Posted 23 May 2014 - 12:36 PM

View Postmarkdohle, on 23 May 2014 - 11:47 AM, said:

Yes I understand, yet it still has meaning for many and not always based on neurotic guilt but the reality of the fact that we do have freedom, that it can grow, and also that we can fail.

Peace
Mark

I am not sure what you mean by that?

“The wise recognise their failings and laugh at their idiosyncrasies” RJG



#5    markdohle

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Posted 23 May 2014 - 03:02 PM

View PostJJ50, on 23 May 2014 - 12:36 PM, said:

I am not sure what you mean by that?

We sin when we know what we are doing is wrong, when we go against what our conscience tells us is wrong.  Our choices create us, our sins wound us. When we realize that we are free and responsible then we can change, turn away from a way of life that is self destructive towards ourselves and others.  Sin makes us less human, less loving, more narcissistic.  We close ourselves off from others and from life itself when we refuse to do what is best for ourselves and others.

True guilt can lead to change, also failure need not keep us down, there is always hope for a new beginning.  

Peace
Mark

Edited by markdohle, 23 May 2014 - 03:03 PM.


#6    JJ50

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Posted 23 May 2014 - 03:11 PM

We all do things we shouldn't from time to time, and if we are decent we should make amends to any human we have harmed. If the deity exists how does it live with itself if the deeds attributable to it had any basis in fact?

“The wise recognise their failings and laugh at their idiosyncrasies” RJG



#7    markdohle

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Posted 23 May 2014 - 07:43 PM

View PostJJ50, on 23 May 2014 - 03:11 PM, said:

We all do things we shouldn't from time to time, and if we are decent we should make amends to any human we have harmed. If the deity exists how does it live with itself if the deeds attributable to it had any basis in fact?

I was talking about sin being opposed to reality, to the fact that God exist, we are called to relationship,  the more we try to escape into sin, the more we suffer.  Addictions of all kinds, our not loving others, reducing them to objects rebounds back on us.   We are called to love others as ourselves, to love God, to see Christ is others, all others.  So to fail in that is sin.  To admit to sin, is to admit to freedom, the freedom to 'convert', to turn around, to ask for mercy and a new beginning.  This leads to hope and trust.  

What do you mean my 'deity"(?), I always find language can break down when talking about this kind of thing.....thanks for asking, keep asking if I am not clear.

Peace
Mark


#8    JJ50

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Posted 24 May 2014 - 09:56 AM

View Postmarkdohle, on 23 May 2014 - 07:43 PM, said:

I was talking about sin being opposed to reality, to the fact that God exist, we are called to relationship,  the more we try to escape into sin, the more we suffer.  Addictions of all kinds, our not loving others, reducing them to objects rebounds back on us.   We are called to love others as ourselves, to love God, to see Christ is others, all others.  So to fail in that is sin.  To admit to sin, is to admit to freedom, the freedom to 'convert', to turn around, to ask for mercy and a new beginning.  This leads to hope and trust.  

What do you mean my 'deity"(?), I always find language can break down when talking about this kind of thing.....thanks for asking, keep asking if I am not clear.

Peace
Mark

By deity I mean the god character in the Bible.

“The wise recognise their failings and laugh at their idiosyncrasies” RJG



#9    markdohle

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Posted 24 May 2014 - 11:58 AM

View PostJJ50, on 24 May 2014 - 09:56 AM, said:

By deity I mean the god character in the Bible.

I believe that revelation from God is possible, I also understand the bible is not a word by word revelation of God, it is man's growing in understanding and also in his ability to receive.  For the early Jews, their God was formless, different, yet still a war god.  He was carried into battle, (the ark) so it was one god against another.  That is why the Jews were so often tempted to created and idol.  The golden calf for instance.  The early Jews were no different from their neighbors.  However over time, human sacrifice disappeared.  The law while it can be rough, also has parts that show compassion and mercy for the alien, the slave and the downtrodden.  It was against cruelty to animals etc.  It was a mixed bag.  The Spirit I believe continues to work within human history to help us grow in understand just what the revelation of Jesus means and is......we are still very young I believe, primitive and more like instinct bound animals than actually being truly and deeply human.  Jesus was the apex of revelation in the bible I believe.....though again we still do not understand it, still learning, groping and failing.  God is always revealing Himself to us, our capacity to listen differs from era to ear, people to people and individual to individual.  If you read the Prophets, they are speaking in the name of the Lord, who is deeply concerned over issues of justice, proper treatment of people and yes animals.  I agree the Old Testament is not always easy to read, but there is more than the stereotype that people like to throw out........though I am used to it and it does not concern me over much.


#10    JJ50

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Posted 24 May 2014 - 01:04 PM

The Biblical characters aren't exactly a good advertisement for their version of god, many of them are highly unpleasant, just as some of the high profile god botherers are today. The TV evangelists are the scum of the earth, in my opinion preying, off the gullible!

“The wise recognise their failings and laugh at their idiosyncrasies” RJG



#11    Beany

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Posted 24 May 2014 - 03:46 PM

Forum guidelines: 'Spirituality, Religion and Beliefs' board guidelines Please always respect the beliefs of other members - the bashing of specific religions, countries, races or belief systems is strictly disallowed. Several of the topics in this section cover some sensitive areas and it is important to respect the views of others; this means no flaming, no flamebaiting, no trolling and no personal attacks. We must also ask that members do not use the forums to promote or 'preach' their personal spiritual beliefs to others.

The Spirituality, Religion and Beliefs board is primarily aimed at discussing general topics pertaining to religion and spirituality, for skeptic vs believer style discussion and debate on the nature of spirituality themed topics please visit the Spirituality vs Skepticism board.


#12    markdohle

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Posted 24 May 2014 - 10:26 PM

View PostJJ50, on 24 May 2014 - 01:04 PM, said:

The Biblical characters aren't exactly a good advertisement for their version of god, many of them are highly unpleasant, just as some of the high profile god botherers are today. The TV evangelists are the scum of the earth, in my opinion preying, off the gullible!

They are human, just like you and me.  God uses whomever he will.  to understand how we are inwardly at war with ourselves allows for the freedom of not being surprised at the weaknesses or failures of others, I have have my own.

Peace
mark


#13    Philangeli

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Posted 24 May 2014 - 10:34 PM

View Postmarkdohle, on 22 May 2014 - 08:09 PM, said:


Fear of responding to life


The soul is like a flower opening up before the sun…our sins are based on the fear of fully responding to life in a manner that allows our hearts to expand in love.  Sin is a headlong escape from truth and our own inner need for grace.   We seek to flee pain, but only run deeper into its embrace.  

That is very well said.

Yes, sin is turning one's back from love and truth and turning to the ego/self for comfort/power/pleasure, which never lasts, and only ends in bitterness.

Philangeli


“When thoughts arise, then do all things arise. When thoughts vanish, then do all things vanish.” Huang Po

#14    Mr Walker

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Posted 24 May 2014 - 11:46 PM

View PostJJ50, on 23 May 2014 - 11:25 AM, said:

'Sin' is a silly little word, imo. Things which some consider a 'sin', like homosexuality for instance, no reasonable person would describe it as wrong!
Sin comes from knowing good consequences of thoughts and deeds from bad consequences of thoughts and deeds. When we knowingly chose something which will have a negative, harmful or destructive consequence on ourselves or others, we sin.   It is the knowledge and feedback psychologically, that we are doing something wrong, harmful, hurtful, or destructive, which creates the sin and causes the sin to alter our minds and our bodies via psychological processes. Thus the act of homosexuality might be a sin if it does or causes harm, but the act of infidelity in a marriage definitely is, on many levels of morality, from breaking the terms of a promise/contract, to an act of emotional and physical betrayal.

You are a child of the universe, no less than the trees and the stars; you have a right to be here. And whether or not it is clear to you, no doubt the universe is unfolding as it should.

Therefore be at peace with God, whatever you conceive Him to be, and whatever your labors and aspirations, in the noisy confusion of life keep peace with your soul.

With all its sham, drudgery and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world..

Be cheerful.

Strive to be happy.

#15    Whisperer

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Posted 25 May 2014 - 12:02 AM

I thought 'Sin' means 'To Stumble' or there a bouts, so just pick yourself up again, surely....

I be Ra...The river of life, the ebb and flow of summer tides...
Make not an image of me, nor offer unto me the limitations of form...
For I be Soul....and I will not be limited...




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