Jump to content




Welcome to Unexplained Mysteries! Please sign in or create an account to start posting and to access a host of extra features.


* * * - - 2 votes

Why are orbs attracted to water?


  • This topic is locked This topic is locked
178 replies to this topic

#151    ChrLzs

ChrLzs

    Just a contributor..

  • Member
  • 3,107 posts
  • Joined:21 Nov 2009
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Gold Coast (Qld, Australia)

  • I only floccinaucinihilipilificate
    when it IS worthless...

Posted 16 June 2014 - 09:13 PM

View PostBillpacer, on 16 June 2014 - 06:47 PM, said:

Dude, I can't even tell if you understand what I was arguing against. He was making the comparison between a photo and video.
...
But to compare a photo to a video is utterly pointless.
Why?  A video is simply a number of photos, each of which is rendered thru a lens, has aperture and shutter speed settings, is captured on a sensor (or film) with a particular ISO sensitivity setting.  Everything about each individual image is the same whether that image is part of a sequence, or a single frame.

About the only technical difference is that the original still image file has exif data attached which can help with analysis, and videos can (to a limited extent) be used for (angular) velocity analysis.

Declaring something as utterly useless seems to me to be what they call "Poisoning The Well" - and frankly it isn't what an imaging analyst will say, for the reasons above...  As I've said, there are three main principles operating here in reagrd to the hotographic or video records of 'orbs', and most blurry bright blobs in any images show some or all of those characteristics - which, to an analyst / scientist / investigator / thinker is another data point...

Of those three principles (OOF blur, motion blur, and illumination by camera-supplied light), which were displayed in the basketball example?  One might cynically suggest you picked it as it has little in common with the 'orbs' being discussed here.  So yes, that one is almost utterly useless :D - if I do a comparison video, it is very unlikely to include a stadium and large round ball, as some here might (correctly) observe that it seems a bit offtopic..

___
All my posts about Apollo are dedicated to the memory of MID - who knew, lived and was an integral part of, Apollo.

#152    Moeyoatey

Moeyoatey

    Alien Embryo

  • Member
  • Pip
  • 39 posts
  • Joined:18 Feb 2014
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Kentucky

  • A stinky concoction of wet paper and too much reading

Posted 17 June 2014 - 02:13 AM

View PostChrLzs, on 16 June 2014 - 05:28 AM, said:

Please be precise and define what is 'paranormal' in that video.

Let me first refer to a resident skeptic and see what they have to say on matter:

View Post_Only, on 15 June 2014 - 08:09 AM, said:

0:34 to 0:38

That is one magic flashlight, not limited to the appearance changing effect normal flashlights have when moving from different walls and surfaces, and able to give the size changing illusion that it is floating closer to the camera.

Now make up your mind: dust or flashlight? But pay attention to the video more carefully. 1 option doesn't work.

We have a skeptic noting of a magic flashlight, what is more paranormal than that. I've already noted several factors that have yet to be explained. I still want to see a speck of dust filmed in this manner or a bug with that same appearance.


#153    Moeyoatey

Moeyoatey

    Alien Embryo

  • Member
  • Pip
  • 39 posts
  • Joined:18 Feb 2014
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Kentucky

  • A stinky concoction of wet paper and too much reading

Posted 17 June 2014 - 02:20 AM

View PostChrLzs, on 16 June 2014 - 05:02 AM, said:

Like I said - why not prove that by doing your own little video and posting it.  Make it ontopic and relevant - and here's a hint - you could use fishing line and a tiny piece of crumpled up paper (coloured in if you want) suspended in front of the camera..  EASY!  So you go first - if not, stop demanding others do stuff YOU claim is easy.

How the heck are we supposed to duplicate the image precisely when we don't have the exact same camera, the exact same bug, the exact same settings...

(Funnily enough, I know the answers to that question, Moey - do you?)


Maybe you should think a little deeper before dismissing something as trivial or easy - I'll be waiting to see your video with interest - and you don't even have to emulate the OP one - just show an orb..  So my challenge to you is much easier than yours to me...

This doesn't even make sense. You want me to film something that I've been claiming is paranormal.


#154    Moeyoatey

Moeyoatey

    Alien Embryo

  • Member
  • Pip
  • 39 posts
  • Joined:18 Feb 2014
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Kentucky

  • A stinky concoction of wet paper and too much reading

Posted 17 June 2014 - 03:06 AM

View PostSlave2Fate, on 15 June 2014 - 02:41 AM, said:

Watch any video of bugs/dust close to the camera and highlighted by a light source and you'll see a striking resemblance to the objects in the OP's video. No reproduction necessary, there are many examples already on youtube. So far I haven't seen any positive evidence provided to indicate these orbs are anything other than dust/bugs, just denial based on....what is it based on again?
Yet another example, bugs close to the camera, clearly highlighted by a light source yet no resemblance to the OP's video.



#155    ChrLzs

ChrLzs

    Just a contributor..

  • Member
  • 3,107 posts
  • Joined:21 Nov 2009
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Gold Coast (Qld, Australia)

  • I only floccinaucinihilipilificate
    when it IS worthless...

Posted 17 June 2014 - 05:02 AM

View PostMoeyoatey, on 17 June 2014 - 02:13 AM, said:

Let me first refer to a resident skeptic....
If you want to argue semantics instead of focusing on the topic at hand, feel free.  But I'll be ignoring anything except that which is ontopic, and anything I've said that you (incorrectly) dispute.  If you have a beef with someone else, go talk to them and stop quoting me unless you have the cojones to actually DISCUSS what I have said.

Here's the three items that seem to describe the appearance of the bug (and I've enlarged some bits that are relevant to your (deliberately?) poorly chosen video example):

1. Objects close to a camera lens will be blurred from being out of focus - the closer they are, the larger and more blurred they appear.  The blurring effect (look up 'bokeh') may include patterns and artefacts that are related to the lens design and have nothing to do with real detail from the scene.

2. Objects that are moving near the camera lens may also be motion blurred, which gives a directional smearing effect, with the amount depending on the shutter speed.  Slow shutter speeds (as are selected by cameras in low light or in movie mode) will exaggerate that additional blurring.

3. Objects close to a camera with LED (or flash) lighting, will be illuminated by that light.  They will tend to take on more of the colour of the lighting and be brighter as they go closer to the lens - at some point they will become saturated or 'blown out' to bright white.

So, which of those do not apply to the OP video?  What in the OP video is not explained by those?  And when you oh-so-carefully chose your video, did you miss the bit about the blurring that occurs when something goes very close to the lens?  Did you also miss the bit about the lighting being on the camera, rather than being a flippin' great big fluorescent light that is not on the camera?   Yeah, easy to miss that... :rolleyes:

Quote

You want me to film something that I've been claiming is paranormal.
Is english not your native language?  Let me try in shorter words...

I may consider doing a comparative video, BUT there is no point if I am showing it to people who:

1 - have little or no knowledge of photography, bokeh, photogrammetry. To date you haven't addressed my 3 simple points above, so that would appear to put you in this category.

2 - will dispute comparative videos on ludicrous grounds, eg by showing a video of one particular bug shape in one particular lighting situation that is NOTHING like the original video, and then ignorantly complain it doesn't resemble the video...

Oh wait .. YOU just did that.   OF COURSE it doesn't look like the original as the lighting is completely different, the bugs are far away from the camera, and they are obviously of a completely different shape.  How could you have POSSIBLY selected a less relevant video?

Moeyoatey, I'm afraid you have just proven that you not only have a bias towards a particular result, you also have no clue about photography..  I am certainly not wasting my time on trying to convince you.

BTW, there's no absolutely no shame in having no clue about a topic - I have no clue about lots of topics (but photography isn't one of them).

The shame is when you pretend otherwise...

___
All my posts about Apollo are dedicated to the memory of MID - who knew, lived and was an integral part of, Apollo.

#156    sinewave

sinewave

    Majestic 12 Operative

  • Member
  • 6,101 posts
  • Joined:23 Aug 2009
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:The Midwest

  • Belief proves nothing. Show me the science.

Posted 17 June 2014 - 06:20 AM

View PostMoeyoatey, on 17 June 2014 - 02:20 AM, said:

This doesn't even make sense. You want me to film something that I've been claiming is paranormal.

And why are you claiming it is paranormal?


#157    Sunshine Hoosier

Sunshine Hoosier

    Alien Embryo

  • Member
  • Pip
  • 39 posts
  • Joined:21 Dec 2012
  • Gender:Female

Posted 17 June 2014 - 05:25 PM

View Post_Only, on 16 June 2014 - 02:42 AM, said:

You're misunderstanding what people are trying to explain to you.

The orb artifact appears only in low light and or visibility situations, of which your fruit fly video wasn't.

Chriszs description of the reflection of light creating the orb has nothing to do with needing a lot of light to see orbs. I don't think you really thought that anyway. You're just grasping for something here it seems, no offense.

The lighting is similar, both subjects are out of focus, and there is even a reflection behind the subject. For Chrisz's description you can't very well give added translations to fit what has been shown to be false.


#158    Thorvir Hrothgaard

Thorvir Hrothgaard

    Psychic Spy

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,512 posts
  • Joined:25 Jan 2014
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Noblesville

  • Viking and Pagan at heart. Drink Mead and Hold Your Heathen Hammer High!

Posted 17 June 2014 - 05:44 PM

View Postsinewave, on 17 June 2014 - 06:20 AM, said:

And why are you claiming it is paranormal?

Because it is easier than doing research and accepting the truth.

*SNIP*

Edited by Lilly, 17 June 2014 - 07:03 PM.
personal remark removed

Orbs and Chemtrails, Bigfoot and Global Warming,
It's these hoaxes and more
That give me my sour stomach each morning...

#159    Sunshine Hoosier

Sunshine Hoosier

    Alien Embryo

  • Member
  • Pip
  • 39 posts
  • Joined:21 Dec 2012
  • Gender:Female

Posted 17 June 2014 - 05:47 PM

View PostMoeyoatey, on 17 June 2014 - 03:06 AM, said:

Yet another example, bugs close to the camera, clearly highlighted by a light source yet no resemblance to the OP's video.

View PostSlave2Fate, on 15 June 2014 - 02:41 AM, said:

Watch any video of bugs/dust close to the camera and highlighted by a light source and you'll see a striking resemblance to the objects in the OP's video. No reproduction necessary, there are many examples already on youtube. So far I haven't seen any positive evidence provided to indicate these orbs are anything other than dust/bugs, just denial based on....what is it based on again?
Attached File  37.jpg   12.16K   0 downloads
Now looking looking at the two examples I see no strinking resemblance.
I'm quite interested to see if Slave2Fate will argue against his own quote or concede the entire bug idea.


#160    Sunshine Hoosier

Sunshine Hoosier

    Alien Embryo

  • Member
  • Pip
  • 39 posts
  • Joined:21 Dec 2012
  • Gender:Female

Posted 17 June 2014 - 06:21 PM

View PostHida Akechi, on 17 June 2014 - 05:44 PM, said:

Because it is easier than doing research and accepting the truth.

*SNIP*

We have certainly put up the bulk of the evidence which both sides have openly discussed. Unlike the other skeptics, you haven't added much to this discussion but negativity. *SNIP*

Edited by Lilly, 17 June 2014 - 07:05 PM.
edited quote/please use report button


#161    Lilly

Lilly

    Forum Divinity

  • 16,160 posts
  • Joined:16 Apr 2004
  • Gender:Female

  • "To thine own self be true" William Shakespeare

Posted 17 June 2014 - 07:07 PM

Please do not resort to personal comments. If you see posts that you feel are in violation of UM rules use the report function (don't get 'into it' with other members).

"Ignorance is ignorance. It is a state of mind, not an opinion." ~MID~

"All that live must die, passing through nature into eternity" ~Shakespeare~ Posted Image

#162    Redefining Success

Redefining Success

    Apparition

  • Member
  • PipPip
  • 342 posts
  • Joined:11 Jan 2012
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:North West UK

Posted 17 June 2014 - 08:46 PM

All this and its a vid which DOESNT belong to the OP.

If what I type offends you, don't see it as an attack, but as my opinion.

#163    Slave2Fate

Slave2Fate

    Bloodstained Hurricane

  • Member
  • 6,483 posts
  • Joined:22 May 2008
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Right behind you!

  • If you don't believe the sun will rise
    Stand alone and greet the coming night
    In the last remaining light -Audioslave

Posted 17 June 2014 - 08:55 PM

View PostSunshine Hoosier, on 17 June 2014 - 05:47 PM, said:

Attachment 37.jpg
Now looking looking at the two examples I see no strinking resemblance.
I'm quite interested to see if Slave2Fate will argue against his own quote or concede the entire bug idea.

Really? The 'orb' phenomena requires certain criteria which ChrLzs has thankfully covered. I was alluding to such videos that possess such criteria. Perhaps I should have been more clear however I was under the impression that it was implied.

Edited by Slave2Fate, 17 June 2014 - 09:43 PM.

"You want to discuss plausibility then you have to accept reality." -Mattshark

"Don't argue with an idiot. They'll drag you down to their level then beat you with experience." -Obviousman

You know... the plural of ``anecdote'' is not ``data''. Similarly, the plural of ``random fact'' is not ``mystical symbolism''. -sepulchrave


#164    ChrLzs

ChrLzs

    Just a contributor..

  • Member
  • 3,107 posts
  • Joined:21 Nov 2009
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Gold Coast (Qld, Australia)

  • I only floccinaucinihilipilificate
    when it IS worthless...

Posted 17 June 2014 - 09:03 PM

View PostSunshine Hoosier, on 17 June 2014 - 05:25 PM, said:

The lighting is similar, both subjects are out of focus, and there is even a reflection behind the subject. For Chrisz's description you can't very well give added translations to fit what has been shown to be false.
Oh, really?  It is ChrLsz by the way - attention to detail helps...

The ONLY light source that would be comparable would be one:
- coming from the camera at the same angle (in other words even if it is mounted above the lens to the right rather than left, it WILL make a difference)
- of the same size - in other words, if the light is a single small LED source, that will be quite different to say a standard xenon flash, or a fluorescent light, or ambient / diffuse light
- one of the same brightness (these lights may have different levels) and colour spectrum
- in a room with similar ambient lighting

IF I was motivated enough to create a comparative video, I'd need to gather all of that information JUST about the lighting conditions in order to emulate JUST that aspect.  And then there are the shutter speed settings, the aperture, th camera's white balance setting, the precise distance of the object from the lens, the zoom and focus settings (if adjustable), let alone the size, color and appearance of the bug / whatever.

ALL of those things can and of course WILL make a BIG difference to the appearance of anything near to the camera, mainly illuminated by a light on the camera, and out of focus.

At some point those who are pushing this might realise that:

1.  It would take a LOT of effort to get a video to anywhere near a useful close match..

2. That they don't have anywhere near the required expertise to know what they are looking at or trying to understand all the factors that are relevant.

THAT is why I challenged any of them to create a vaguely similar video - in doing so, they might finally start to learn..  but no, that won't happen...


The comments offered by those dismissing videos, or offering them for comparison and saying that they don't match and therefore this is unexplained or proven paranormal/spiritual, have given me enough info to realise that I will be completely wasting my time trying to overcome the bias and lack of understanding shown.

You want them to be spirit orbs.  Fine - knock yourselves out, and whatever you do, don't learn about photography, optics, photogrammetry, bokeh.   And when one of these orbs affects your life in a way that is measurable or evidenced, perhaps start a new thread.  I've had it with this one.

___
All my posts about Apollo are dedicated to the memory of MID - who knew, lived and was an integral part of, Apollo.

#165    Thorvir Hrothgaard

Thorvir Hrothgaard

    Psychic Spy

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,512 posts
  • Joined:25 Jan 2014
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Noblesville

  • Viking and Pagan at heart. Drink Mead and Hold Your Heathen Hammer High!

Posted 17 June 2014 - 11:48 PM

View PostSunshine Hoosier, on 17 June 2014 - 06:21 PM, said:

We have certainly put up the bulk of the evidence which both sides have openly discussed. Unlike the other skeptics, you haven't added much to this discussion but negativity. *SNIP*

I have to agree I'm seeing a lot of negativity here as well.  All coming from the close-minded individuals that don't accept scientific processes and proof, and won't do the research and just lazily claim it was "supernatural" or "paranormal".

Orbs and Chemtrails, Bigfoot and Global Warming,
It's these hoaxes and more
That give me my sour stomach each morning...




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users