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SWAT put a hole in a 2 year old.


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#1    supervike

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Posted 25 June 2014 - 01:20 AM

http://www.salon.com...2_year_old_son/


It's hard to argue that the police state isn't already here, when you hear things like this...

Is the War on Drugs really worth these sorts of tactics?


#2    The Id3al Experience

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Posted 25 June 2014 - 01:26 AM

We are seeing this to much lately. I myself have not had the best experience with officers when needing help, Protect and Service is there slogan, I now understand that slogan, Protect the governements rights, and service thereselves.

Watch this space

#3    Agent0range

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Posted 25 June 2014 - 01:44 AM

http://www.cnn.com/2...raid/index.html

This **** allowed drugs to be manufactured and sold out of her house with her child in it and is going to cry about non-lethal munitions being used?  **** her.  She should be locked up and her child taken away forever.


#4    aquatus1

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Posted 25 June 2014 - 01:47 AM

Damn shame.

I'm talking about the baby, though, not politics.


#5    libstaK

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Posted 25 June 2014 - 01:56 AM

Apparently the family have no insurance and have set up a website to collect donations for the babies treatment?  Is that actually necessary?  Surely having being the victim of the SWAT raid would cover the baby straight up?  What kind of country/system makes the parents pay for treatment for an injury incurred by it's law enforcement?

*Disclaimer*  I am not suggesting or commenting on whether SWAT did the right or wrong thing here, it could have been a terrible accident and the raid was done with the belief there were no children in the house, I am just commenting on the need for the family to now pay for the injuries sustained to the child - because if, as I believe, the police dept and by extension the state are accountable for those injuries it seems the family might be making a money grab without cause?

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#6    OverSword

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Posted 25 June 2014 - 01:58 AM

View PostAgent0range, on 25 June 2014 - 01:44 AM, said:

http://www.cnn.com/2...raid/index.html

This **** allowed drugs to be manufactured and sold out of her house with her child in it and is going to cry about non-lethal munitions being used?  **** her.  She should be locked up and her child taken away forever.
The problem with your link, AgentO, is that there were no armed guards outside.  There were no drugs in the house.  The information came from a drug addicted informant who must have lied, and the man they were looking for doesn't live there and was not in the house.  

I think the problem is that these type of 'no knock raids' are violent and getting to be more common.  Sometimes this may be a good tactic but it's easy to find hundreds of instances where they do these raids based on shoddy intel (like this story) and tragedies occur like this or many examples of them shooting the family dog etc....  And for what?  An 8ball of meth?  These violent tactics can easily end in tragedy and we're lucky this baby is alive, and had there been the armed guards it could easily have been a dead officer as easily as a gang banger?  Is it worth it?  I don't think so.


#7    aquatus1

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Posted 25 June 2014 - 01:59 AM

View PostAgent0range, on 25 June 2014 - 01:44 AM, said:

This **** allowed drugs to be manufactured and sold out of her house with her child in it and is going to cry about non-lethal munitions being used?  **** her.  She should be locked up and her child taken away forever.

To my understanding, it wasn't her house, but rather her brother's house, and she was sleeping there with her family because her house had recently burned down.  How recently she had moved in is unclear, but apparently she knew drugs were being sold out of the house, and tried to keep her family clear of it.  Apparently, the drugs were being sold out the back, because her entire family was camped out in the living room and the baby's crib was, inexplicably yet universally reported, to have been right up against the front door, blocking it (then again, if everything was done out the back, that would make sense).  The police came in loaded because the guy they were looking for had 9 arrests for armed felonies.

I can't imagine what the policeman must feel like after being responsible for tossing a grenade through the cracked door that resulted in a baby being injured so severely.  Procedures or not, that is the sort of thing that haunts a guy.  Personally, I would have slapped the hell out of whoever made the idiotic choice to place a baby's crib against the front door of a drug house.  That's right up there with hiding weapon's in their cribs.


#8    OverSword

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Posted 25 June 2014 - 02:00 AM

View PostlibstaK, on 25 June 2014 - 01:56 AM, said:

Apparently the family have no insurance and have set up a website to collect donations for the babies treatment?  Is that actually necessary?  Surely having being the victim of the SWAT raid would cover the baby straight up?  What kind of country/system makes the parents pay for treatment for an injury incurred by it's law enforcement?

*Disclaimer*  I am not suggesting or commenting on whether SWAT did the right or wrong thing here, it could have been a terrible accident and the raid was done with the belief there were no children in the house, I am just commenting on the need for the family to now pay for the injuries sustained to the child - because if, as I believe, the police dept and by extension the state are accountable for those injuries it seems the family might be making a money grab without cause?
True, once the pay-off comes from this police error they will be able to treat the baby and buy a new place to live.  That could be years from now though.


#9    The Id3al Experience

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Posted 25 June 2014 - 02:00 AM

View PostAgent0range, on 25 June 2014 - 01:44 AM, said:

http://www.cnn.com/2...raid/index.html

This **** allowed drugs to be manufactured and sold out of her house with her child in it and is going to cry about non-lethal munitions being used?  **** her.  She should be locked up and her child taken away forever.

Well thats a completely difference story to the OP.

Edited by The Id3al Experience, 25 June 2014 - 02:02 AM.

Watch this space

#10    OverSword

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Posted 25 June 2014 - 02:01 AM

View Postaquatus1, on 25 June 2014 - 01:59 AM, said:

I can't imagine what the policeman must feel like after being responsible for tossing a grenade through the cracked door that resulted in a baby being injured so severely.  

That was one of my first thoughts when I heard about this weeks ago.  Tragic.


#11    supervike

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Posted 25 June 2014 - 02:07 AM

View PostAgent0range, on 25 June 2014 - 01:44 AM, said:

http://www.cnn.com/2...raid/index.html

This **** allowed drugs to be manufactured and sold out of her house with her child in it and is going to cry about non-lethal munitions being used?  **** her.  She should be locked up and her child taken away forever.

The baby and it's mother were guests in this house, according to both the Salon report and the CNN report.

The 'non-lethal' munitions burned a hole in this kids chest, and according to the mother, may have brain damage.

Flash bangs and M-16's maybe great for rousing terrorists, but I don't think they should be part of a 'peace keepers' arsenal.


#12    aquatus1

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Posted 25 June 2014 - 02:11 AM

View PostlibstaK, on 25 June 2014 - 01:56 AM, said:

Apparently the family have no insurance and have set up a website to collect donations for the babies treatment?  Is that actually necessary?  Surely having being the victim of the SWAT raid would cover the baby straight up?  What kind of country/system makes the parents pay for treatment for an injury incurred by it's law enforcement?

They haven't set up a webpage, at least not directly.  You'll find a bunch of webpages for groups like the Libertarians who want donations to fight against the cause du jour, in this case No-Knock warrants, but the only website for the baby that I have found was started by Holly Benton Wickersham, who claims to be a friend of the family.  The page has been flagged for fraud on Grabpage, but that doesn't mean it is actually fake.


#13    libstaK

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Posted 25 June 2014 - 02:13 AM

View Postaquatus1, on 25 June 2014 - 02:11 AM, said:

They haven't set up a webpage, at least not directly.  You'll find a bunch of webpages for groups like the Libertarians who want donations to fight against the cause du jour, in this case No-Knock warrants, but the only website for the baby that I have found was started by Holly Benton Wickersham, who claims to be a friend of the family.  The page has been flagged for fraud on Grabpage, but that doesn't mean it is actually fake.
Thanks Aquatus for checking that out - bad CNN for making the claim without checking it out.

"I warn you, whoever you are, oh you who wish to probe the arcanes of nature, if you do not find within yourself that which you seek, neither shall you find it outside.
If you ignore the excellencies of your own house, how do you intend to find other excellencies?
In you is hidden the treasure of treasures, Oh man, know thyself and you shall know the Universe and the Gods."

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#14    OverSword

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Posted 25 June 2014 - 02:15 AM

There are childrens hospitals here that will give a family top quality care for their child free of charge to qualified families, of which I'm sure these people would be.  Aren't these around the country?


#15    aquatus1

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Posted 25 June 2014 - 02:19 AM

View PostOverSword, on 25 June 2014 - 01:58 AM, said:

The problem with your link, AgentO, is that there were no armed guards outside.  There were no drugs in the house.  The information came from a drug addicted informant who must have lied, and the man they were looking for doesn't live there and was not in the house.  

The guards are alleged, true, but that doesn't automatically mean they weren't there when they were reported to be (which wasn't during the raid).  I'm finding conflicting reports on whether there were drugs in the house or not, but there does seem to be agreement on a drug transaction having taken place which did result in the warrant being issued.  As for the man himself, he seems to have been rotating around in houses, which considering his background and continued criminal life, was at least a tactically intelligent decision.  I won't go so far as to say he didn't live in the house.





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