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How Do We Save Ufology?


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#1    mister

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Posted 27 July 2014 - 11:28 PM

Ufology is falling off and I blame it on the new generation. Stanton Friedman and the others like him weren't perfect but they brought new things to the table; actively looking for new witnesses, FOIA requests, background checks and etc. You can disagree with their conclusions but they put lots of dots out there that we can connect ourselves.

Who's doing all that today? With tons of witnesses, hotspots, and cases happening every day there's a whole data mine out there just waiting to be dug up. But this new generation just rather keep rehashing the old stuff. It's becoming a dead end science.

Then again why do real investigative work when there's a community of ppl out there that will keep buying the same old book as long as it has a new cover?

Anyway, that's my rant. The purpose of this thread is to get others to share their opinion on how do we put the -ology back in Ufology. It's not meant to be a debate over whether or not the phenomenon is real. So what is it missing? Are new "ufologists" too lazy?

Edited by mister, 27 July 2014 - 11:31 PM.


#2    GreenmansGod

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Posted 27 July 2014 - 11:55 PM

It comes and goes in cycles.   If someone could actually come up with an actual ship it would help the cause.  One thing cameras are getting better and it is easier to spot the cow patties in the sky.  It is easier to figure out what things are and they become identified flying objects, like a drone.

Edited by GreenmansGod, 27 July 2014 - 11:55 PM.

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#3    aquatus1

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Posted 28 July 2014 - 12:03 AM

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UFO-ology isn't going to get the respect i desires as a credible topic of research until it actually begins acting like a credible research topic.  That means that the whole "Here's the evidence, put the dots together yourself" needs to end.  Researchers don't tell others to come to their own conclusions; they gather their evidence and beat the heck out of it until they have eliminated all the possibilities out of it and present the one with the strongest probability as the most likely explanation.  As it is, there is entirely too much bias on the desired result.


#4    JVG

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Posted 28 July 2014 - 12:11 AM

There is nothing really there to put a handle on. Most are explained away and still people want to believe that we are visited by a superior race. If that is true than show us the money!!!!


#5    Swede

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Posted 28 July 2014 - 12:15 AM

View Postmister, on 27 July 2014 - 11:28 PM, said:

Ufology is falling off and I blame it on the new generation. Stanton Friedman and the others like him weren't perfect but they brought new things to the table; actively looking for new witnesses, FOIA requests, background checks and etc. You can disagree with their conclusions but they put lots of dots out there that we can connect ourselves.

Who's doing all that today? With tons of witnesses, hotspots, and cases happening every day there's a whole data mine out there just waiting to be dug up. But this new generation just rather keep rehashing the old stuff. It's becoming a dead end science.

Then again why do real investigative work when there's a community of ppl out there that will keep buying the same old book as long as it has a new cover?

Anyway, that's my rant. The purpose of this thread is to get others to share their opinion on how do we put the -ology back in Ufology. It's not meant to be a debate over whether or not the phenomenon is real. So what is it missing? Are new "ufologists" too lazy?

The "concept" has never, even by the broadest definition of the term, ever been a "science". The usurpation of the suffix "-ology" is, in itself, an insult to credible research.

.


#6    aquatus1

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Posted 28 July 2014 - 12:30 AM

We know it is not a science by how UFO-ology (defined more as a subject of interest than one of academic study) isn't actually offering an explanation for a phenomena; it is still struggling to actually show a phenomena exists.  No one questions the existence of gravity; the phenomena is uncontested.  There are different theories for how gravity works, but the phenomena itself is uncontested.  The same with evolution.  The phenomena of evolution is uncontested in the academic arena.  There are numerous scientific theories that describe the various aspects of evolution, but evolution as a phenomena is uncontested.

UFO-ology simply hasn't reached the level where it has even shown that a phenomena exists to explain.


#7    Kurzweil

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Posted 28 July 2014 - 01:22 AM

Save ufology? Got news. If one is ever publicly recovered and proven to be alien then that would be the last nail in the coffin for ufology. I'm all for getting rid of, omg what's that I'll take a horseshiit video of it, stuff. Problem is without those we have nothing to make fun of..wait or is that just me?


#8    ufoscan

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Posted 28 July 2014 - 02:43 AM

View Postmister, on 27 July 2014 - 11:28 PM, said:

Ufology is falling off and I blame it on the new generation.

The problem with Ufology is that there are two streams of it.  On the one hand, there is the "Ufology" created by the media - the ones that publish magazines and articles on the subject based on what they think it is but mostly to get an audience.  Then combined with that, think of the steady stream of hoaxers who enjoy fooling people with fake pictures and clips and made-up stories...

Then there is the actual phenomenon itself being witnessed by quite a number of people who mostly either don't report it at all to anyone or will mention it to a local UFO group but no more.

I don't think that has ever been otherwise - and I have been at this thing for over fifty years.

Nowadays, we have the internet and that is simply a new form of media where again so many hoaxers want attention.  And, unfortunately, this is basically where most people form their opinion on the subject.

View Postmister, on 27 July 2014 - 11:28 PM, said:

Stanton Friedman and the others like him weren't perfect but they brought new things to the table; actively looking for new witnesses, FOIA requests, background checks and etc. You can disagree with their conclusions but they put lots of dots out there that we can connect ourselves.

Who's doing all that today? With tons of witnesses, hotspots, and cases happening every day there's a whole data mine out there just waiting to be dug up.

Like in the past, there are local UFO groups actively doing this but they don't necessarily report their findings to the media.


#9    Hammerclaw

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Posted 28 July 2014 - 03:00 AM

In the era High Definition imagery, fuzzy lights and blurry blobs with a rousing but unsubstantiated narrative, just don't get it anymore. UFO reports read like modern folktales. For people like me who have been waiting for real evidence for decades, our credulity wears thin. Anecdotal reports are the worst kind of evidence.

There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy. - Hamlet (1.5.167-8),

#10    Hammerclaw

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Posted 28 July 2014 - 03:02 AM

View Postaquatus1, on 28 July 2014 - 12:03 AM, said:

UFO-ology isn't going to get the respect i desires as a credible topic of research until it actually begins acting like a credible research topic.  That means that the whole "Here's the evidence, put the dots together yourself" needs to end.  Researchers don't tell others to come to their own conclusions; they gather their evidence and beat the heck out of it until they have eliminated all the possibilities out of it and present the one with the strongest probability as the most likely explanation.  As it is, there is entirely too much bias on the desired result.
Exactly. If you want to learn how to do a proper investigation, read The Condon Report.

There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy. - Hamlet (1.5.167-8),

#11    ufoscan

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Posted 28 July 2014 - 03:05 AM

View PostJohn Wesley Boyd, on 28 July 2014 - 03:00 AM, said:

In the era High Definition imagery, fuzzy lights and blurry blobs with a rousing but unsubstantiated narrative, just don't get it anymore.

Don't you know about the aliens' "blurr screen" ??? :alien:

View PostJohn Wesley Boyd, on 28 July 2014 - 03:00 AM, said:

UFO reports read like modern folktales. For people like me who have been waiting for real evidence for decades, our credulity wears thin. Anecdotal reports are the worst kind of evidence.

You really need to experience it for yourself or maybe have someone close to you that has an incredible experience and then you find it harder to dismiss someone you known is quite sane.


#12    Hammerclaw

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Posted 28 July 2014 - 03:20 AM

View Postufoscan, on 28 July 2014 - 03:05 AM, said:

Don't you know about the aliens' "blurr screen" ??? :alien:



You really need to experience it for yourself or maybe have someone close to you that has an incredible experience and then you find it harder to dismiss someone you known is quite sane.
Not Necessarily. Even ordinarily mentally stable individuals can experience episodes of cognitive disconnect.

There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy. - Hamlet (1.5.167-8),

#13    mister

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Posted 28 July 2014 - 03:26 AM

@aquatus1 I'm not sure what you mean on your last post because ufo sightings as a phenomena is uncontested. We know this phenomena exists. People really are seeing things up there.

@Swede Not everything that falls under the umbrella term "ufology" is science but there are those that engage in the "study of" the phenomenon and what they do is indeed a science. Like the statisticians that study the numbers.


#14    mister

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Posted 28 July 2014 - 04:04 AM

View Postufoscan, on 28 July 2014 - 02:43 AM, said:



The problem with Ufology is that there are two streams of it.  On the one hand, there is the "Ufology" created by the media - the ones that publish magazines and articles on the subject based on what they think it is but mostly to get an audience.  Then combined with that, think of the steady stream of hoaxers who enjoy fooling people with fake pictures and clips and made-up stories...

Then there is the actual phenomenon itself being witnessed by quite a number of people who mostly either don't report it at all to anyone or will mention it to a local UFO group but no more.

I don't think that has ever been otherwise - and I have been at this thing for over fifty years.

Nowadays, we have the internet and that is simply a new form of media where again so many hoaxers want attention.  And, unfortunately, this is basically where most people form their opinion on the subject.

Pretty much.


Quote

Like in the past, there are local UFO groups actively doing this but they don't necessarily report their findings to the media.

There are some here and there I just think there aren't enough. For the ones that exist I think they need to put their findings out there somehow. And do it in a way that they distinguish themselves from hoaxers.


#15    mister

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Posted 28 July 2014 - 04:15 AM

View PostJohn Wesley Boyd, on 28 July 2014 - 03:00 AM, said:

Anecdotal reports are the worst kind of evidence.
When you read these reports on paper coming from people you don't know I can see why it's so easy to dismiss them. That's why I strongly recommend folks to get out there and have face to face conversations with some of these folks yourself. Go to a local event or something and you will see.






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