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A $50 Billion Bill for Putin

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#1    questionmark

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    Cinicus Magnus

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Posted 28 July 2014 - 03:46 PM

Bloomberg View said:

A court in the Hague has done more to hurt Russia's economy than all the Ukraine-related sanctions put together. The Permanent Court of Arbitration ruled that Russia must pay $50.02 billion to the shareholders of the oil company Yukos, which was dismantled by President Vladimir Putin's government beginning in 2004. The ruling is a reminder that Putin was no different a decade ago from the man who recently seized Crimea from Ukraine and continues to foment separatist unrest in that nation.

There is a measure of poetic justice in the decision. Although published today, it was handed down in the Netherlands the day after Malaysia Airlines Flight MH17 was downed, apparently by pro-Russian rebels in eastern Ukraine. The Netherlands had more victims on the flight than any other country.

Although the ruling has nothing to do with Putin's new geopolitical assertiveness, it punishes the Russian leader for a similarly aggressive approach to domestic policy during his first and second terms in power, from 2000 to 2008. In effect, the court, which was established to resolve international disputes, told Putin that, in the modern world, you can't seize property without compensating the owners.

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Edited by questionmark, 28 July 2014 - 03:52 PM.

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#2    George Ford

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Posted 28 July 2014 - 03:56 PM

Well that sucks, he'll just put the price of natural gas up even higher so it will be some European countries that will end up paying the $50billion anyway.

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#3    questionmark

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Posted 28 July 2014 - 04:00 PM

View PostGeorge Ford, on 28 July 2014 - 03:56 PM, said:

Well that sucks, he'll just put the price of natural gas up even higher so it will be some European countries that will end up paying the $50billion anyway.

The Europeans are about to start the next step of sanctions, which will p!ssoff Putin even further and probably end in putting gas on the list. Algeria will be the winner (as Libya is messing it up with in-fighting)

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#4    stevewinn

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Posted 28 July 2014 - 04:09 PM

View Postquestionmark, on 28 July 2014 - 04:00 PM, said:

The Europeans are about to start the next step of sanctions, which will p!ssoff Putin even further and probably end in putting gas on the list. Algeria will be the winner (as Libya is messing it up with in-fighting)

on a link i posted from the BBC Parliament channel - government committee on EU-Russia. said the UK and Germany are in negotiations with Russia on securing the flow of oil/Gas through the pipeline through Ukraine. where Germany receives 37% of her Gas. so as you can see Ukraine is going to pot and behind the scenes everyone is making sure their okay. securing their own interest's meanwhile acting all tough in front of the TV NEWS cameras. talking about tougher sanctions yet are all sitting in a room together most probably sharing a drink or two securing the flow of oil and gas.  :gun:

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#5    questionmark

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Posted 28 July 2014 - 04:16 PM

View Poststevewinn, on 28 July 2014 - 04:09 PM, said:

on a link i posted from the BBC Parliament channel - government committee on EU-Russia. said the UK and Germany are in negotiations with Russia on securing the flow of oil/Gas through the pipeline through Ukraine. where Germany receives 37% of her Gas. so as you can see Ukraine is going to pot and behind the scenes everyone is making sure their okay. securing their own interest's meanwhile acting all tough in front of the TV NEWS cameras. talking about tougher sanctions yet are all sitting in a room together most probably sharing a drink or two securing the flow of oil and gas.  :gun:

Wait until they decide to embargo military equipment to Russia what will flow....

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#6    Helen of Annoy

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Posted 28 July 2014 - 06:07 PM

View Poststevewinn, on 28 July 2014 - 04:09 PM, said:

on a link i posted from the BBC Parliament channel - government committee on EU-Russia. said the UK and Germany are in negotiations with Russia on securing the flow of oil/Gas through the pipeline through Ukraine. where Germany receives 37% of her Gas. so as you can see Ukraine is going to pot and behind the scenes everyone is making sure their okay. securing their own interest's meanwhile acting all tough in front of the TV NEWS cameras. talking about tougher sanctions yet are all sitting in a room together most probably sharing a drink or two securing the flow of oil and gas.  :gun:
Now you only have to make Schäuble believe in that.

http://www.reuters.c...N0FW0CU20140727

Quote

"Economic interests are not the top priority. The top priority is ensuring stability and peace,"Finance Minister Wolfgang Schaeuble was quoted by the newspaper as saying.
If German ministers were to warn against sanctions because of the potential damage to the German economy, then Chancellor Angela Merkel would have the wrong ministers, he said.

"An erosion of peace and stability would, by the way, be the biggest danger to economic developments," he said.


And what Lavrov said? That they're not worried with sanctions because they'll make Russia more independent.
Independent from profit, I presume. Well, that's great, I always admired spiritual people. They have a lot of atonements to make, anyway.

http://in.reuters.co...N0FX0JJ20140728

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#7    stevewinn

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Posted 28 July 2014 - 07:20 PM

The Russian economy will suffer not because of the sanctions but due to the lack of foreign investment and that'll do more damage in the long term than the very limited sanctions the EU will agree upon. at the end of the day Ukraine isn't important enough for different countries to set aside their own national interest when the impact is disproportionate for instance Germany with 37% of her Gas coming from Russia and the shutting down of her Nuclear plants makes it more than a little problematic. than say the UK, whose also go a vested interest when it comes to gas. so lets be honest here, if we thought Ukraine was important NATO would deploy its troops and mechanised divisions in great numbers in Poland, Lithuania, Latvia & Estonia. If Russia pushed across the border into Estonia the only thing to slow them down would be the great forests. but would still be in Russia hands within hours. a response from NATO to deploy on the ground would take three months. at the moment Russia is laughing at us. they'll absorb currently what the west is throwing at them. Russia as always seen european goods as a threat to Russian goods and services and would like nothing more than to limit imports and reinforcing their own domestic markets. Russia has only just joined the WTO back in August 2012. which says a lot about their trade outlook.

The fact remains we pushed Russia a little to much. you only have to listen to Putin's Speech on 18th March. were he says about NATO breaking promises not to expand towards Russian borders and their not willing to put up with it any longer. look at Kaliningrad which is completely surrounded by NATO members/EU members. It was Kaliningrad and the Russian threat of basing nuclear weapons there which stopped George Bush and later Obama from going ahead with the US missile defence system being deployed in Poland. when you take into account the promises the west made to Russia which we have broken - we took advantage of a weaker Russia. and like Putin said you put to much pressure on the spring, at some point that Spring will recoil.

Speech
https://www.youtube....h?v=YtM5rk4tods

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#8    Helen of Annoy

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Posted 28 July 2014 - 09:00 PM

View Poststevewinn, on 28 July 2014 - 07:20 PM, said:

The Russian economy will suffer not because of the sanctions but due to the lack of foreign investment and that'll do more damage in the long term than the very limited sanctions the EU will agree upon. at the end of the day Ukraine isn't important enough for different countries to set aside their own national interest when the impact is disproportionate for instance Germany with 37% of her Gas coming from Russia and the shutting down of her Nuclear plants makes it more than a little problematic. than say the UK, whose also go a vested interest when it comes to gas. so lets be honest here, if we thought Ukraine was important NATO would deploy its troops and mechanised divisions in great numbers in Poland, Lithuania, Latvia & Estonia. If Russia pushed across the border into Estonia the only thing to slow them down would be the great forests. but would still be in Russia hands within hours. a response from NATO to deploy on the ground would take three months. at the moment Russia is laughing at us. they'll absorb currently what the west is throwing at them. Russia as always seen european goods as a threat to Russian goods and services and would like nothing more than to limit imports and reinforcing their own domestic markets. Russia has only just joined the WTO back in August 2012. which says a lot about their trade outlook.

The fact remains we pushed Russia a little to much. you only have to listen to Putin's Speech on 18th March. were he says about NATO breaking promises not to expand towards Russian borders and their not willing to put up with it any longer. look at Kaliningrad which is completely surrounded by NATO members/EU members. It was Kaliningrad and the Russian threat of basing nuclear weapons there which stopped George Bush and later Obama from going ahead with the US missile defence system being deployed in Poland. when you take into account the promises the west made to Russia which we have broken - we took advantage of a weaker Russia. and like Putin said you put to much pressure on the spring, at some point that Spring will recoil.

Speech
https://www.youtube....h?v=YtM5rk4tods
They’ll suffer from sanctions that include the lack of investment.
Vested interests are very, very well known, especially in the countries that were temporarily traded out of Europe because of them. I don’t think that mistake will be repeated, especially not with a country of Ukrainian size.
It’s a long pipeline that must be made to China. Judging by the speed of building promised bridge to Crimea, we can expect this mess to be resolved before any of mentioned construction wonders of new empire are finished.
Russia, of course, could live on its own. But that’s not why this crap is happening. It’s happening because Russia wanted to expand, not withdraw. Getting thrown out of various conferences was not what they intended to achieve, they wanted to achieve... extort, actually... the leading status.

Calm and rational approach of the West was understood as appeasement in Russia and it only encouraged their egotripping. Maybe now things will clear up a little. They don’t have to clear up completely, just to the point of not invading foreign countries, undermining their sovereignty or shooting random civilian planes off the sky.

The reason why NATO is not moving is precisely because sane people are leaving huge space for rational resolution of crisis made solely by soviet way of thinking.
Missiles in Poland... well, don’t poke Poland and what do you care for their missiles. Oh, but the missiles get in the way of protecting the Russian Minority... what minority? Don’t worry, not only they can roll minority into an area, they can also make it a majority with their soviet mathematics. It could end up so deadly but still it’s hilarious.

Anyway, I understand you’re allergic to EU, but expecting Putin to destroy it for you is a little over the top.

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