Vatican administration "sick" says Pope

[+Link of Hyrule]

Pope Francis says Vatican administration is sick with power and greed

Vatican City: The Vatican's top administrators would have been expecting an exchange of pleasantries at their annual Christmas meeting with Pope Francis on Monday.

Instead, Francis chose the occasion to issue a stinging critique, telling the priests, bishops and cardinals who run the Curia, the central administration of the Roman Catholic Church, that careerism, scheming and greed had infected them with "spiritual Alzheimer's".

Source for further reading

Edited December 23, 2014 by Paranoid Android

[Sir Wearer of Hats]

Well that's him done for then (c.f. John Paul 1)

[Likely Guy]

I'm not religious (at all) but there's something about this guy that I like.

Edit: Just a few days ago he helped broker the US/Cuba impass and now he's 'upsetting apple carts' within his own administration.

Way to go, Pope Frank!

Edited December 23, 2014 by Likely Guy

[quiXilver]

This one really surprised me.

So surprising, all I can really think is that it would be better for his health if he took up smoking than continued to strike the hornet's nest this way...

Who woulda thunk it... the Catholic political process is keen enough to have put a very people friendly face on their figurehead.

I find his energy to be remarkably authentic for one in a place of such power. He strikes me as having held onto his small town, priestly demeanor of genuinely wanting to help people in the presence of one of the planet's oldest and most efficient power machines.

[Aus Der Box Skeptisch]

[Likely Guy]

A couple weeks ago he fired the head of the Swiss guard for his authoritarian and dictatorial rule. Apparently a member of the guard was assigned to stand alert outside his bedroom all night and in the morning, the pope found him there, gave him a chair and ordered the guy a cappucino.

I love this guy!

[back to earth]

Maybe he will reveal the last secret of Fatima ?

" In an interview conducted in November 1984, Cardinal Ratzinger (of the Holy Office) confirmed that, with the Pope’s permission, he had read the Secret and that it concerns, in his words, "... the dangers threatening the Faith and the life of a Christian ... "

http://www.fatima.or...acts/secret.asp

or even the apostasy of the Pope

http://en.wikipedia....n_of_the_Church

Edited December 23, 2014 by back to earth

[LostSouls7]

I think all relgions are about greed..

i mean even Satanism asks for a monthly fee

well most organized groups and relgions..

so it;s doesn't matter if it's a mormon or a Santanist asking for

membership fees.. when they are after your money

what's the difference ?

[Sir Smoke aLot]

I think all relgions are about greed..

i mean even Satanism asks for a monthly fee

well most organized groups and relgions..

so it;s doesn't matter if it's a mormon or a Santanist asking for

membership fees.. when they are after your money

what's the difference ?

More important the position, more income it makes for a person - more influence, power. Its like that in every religion while it should be totally opposite. Those at higher ranks should have no material possesions at all Talking about morality and being one with God...

A man who was Reis ( Muslim spiritual leader of country ) in my country did try to go for presidents position at time of last elections, that was a shame. Today its golden rule, people preach, speak about morality, peace, all those greatest values... But they act in a way which completely destroys every word they said. My respect to those who are better then that, Pope Francis is one of them.

[quiXilver]

This one really surprised me.

So surprising, all I can really think is that it would be better for his health if he took up smoking than continued to strike the hornet's nest this way...

Who woulda thunk it... the Catholic political process is keen enough to have put a very people friendly face on their figurehead.

I find his energy to be remarkably authentic for one in a place of such power. He strikes me as having held onto his small town, priestly demeanor of genuinely wanting to help people in the presence of one of the planet's oldest and most efficient power machines.

and then I get a chance to reflect a bit

and remember their history

and I don't believe anything is a slip up, accident, or a mistake when it comes to any media announcements and the Vatican.

they've taken such hits due to the non-stop molestation scandals, these are scripted sound bytes, to improve the brand name.

[toast]

Greed.

I watched a TV documentation a few weeks ago about the real estate property of the RCC here in Germany. A Professor (I dont rembember of what,

somehing in the fields of finance) tried to investigate how much real estate the RCC do own here. The Vatikan refused to provide any data, so the HQ

of the RCC here as well. Also the public authorities were not able to provide such data. But the smart Prof. was aware of the fact the Nazis did such

inquiry in 1939 and this data was still available. Based on the figures of 1939 the RCC owned in 1939 estate property with a todays value of, its incredibly,

220.000.000.000EUR, that are 238 BillionUSD. And it must be assumed, based on the fact that the RCC pocket church tax (5,5Billion EUR in 2013),

that the real estate property of the RCC in Germany is much, much more today than in 1939.

The whole RCC/Vatikan story has nothing to do with religion. Its business, simply just that. And with very big success since 2000 years meanwhile.

You can forget Apple, Microsoft, BP and colleagues, its all peanuts.

Edited December 23, 2014 by toast

[quiXilver]

edit to add:

Edited December 23, 2014 by quiXilver

[libstaK]

Greed.

I watched a TV documentation a few weeks ago about the real estate property of the RCC here in Germany. A Professor (I dont rembember of what,

somehing in the fields of finance) tried to investigate how much real estate the RCC do own here. The Vatikan refused to provide any data, so the HQ

of the RCC here as well. Also the public authorities were not able to provide such data. But the smart Prof. was aware of the fact the Nazis did such

inquiry in 1939 and this data was still available. Based on the figures of 1939 the RCC owned in 1939 estate property with a todays value of, its incredibly,

220.000.000.000EUR, that are 238 BillionUSD. And it must be assumed, based on the fact that the RCC pocket church tax (5,5Billion EUR in 2013),

that the real estate property of the RCC in Germany is much, much more today than in 1939.

The whole RCC/Vatikan story has nothing to do with religion. Its business, simply just that. And with very big success since 2000 years meanwhile.

You can forget Apple, Microsoft, BP and colleagues, its all peanuts.

Just to add some reality checks here. The catholic church runs Churches, Hospitals, Elderly Care Homes, Schools, Orphanages, Monasteries and homes for Nuns, particularly caring for the elderly of the cloth, hospice care, homeless shelters, drug rehabilitation clinics etc. These are not "riches" of the church, these are services and facilities to service and care for the congregations of the church and the public at large. It is hardly surprising that the value of these properties across a population of hundreds of millions of catholics who donate to support the continuation of the services and facilities is going to be huge, because it takes thousands of properties to care for hundreds of millions of catholics and the public at large who use and need the services.

Add to that the fact that many of the churches of Europe are many hundreds of years old and historical buildings held in trust by the church for the people. These historical buildings require government legislated levels of care in some countries and morally required care in every aspect to preserve the heritage and history of the cultures they belong to -and these preservation costs are a huge expense to the church/s.

Edited December 23, 2014 by libstaK

[quiXilver]

Just to add some reality checks here. The catholic church runs Churches, Hospitals, Elderly Care Homes, Schools, Orphanages, Monasteries and homes for Nuns, particularly caring for the elderly of the cloth, hospice care, homeless shelters, drug rehabilitation clinics etc. These are not "riches" of the church, these are services and facilities to service and care for the congregations of the church and the public at large. It is hardly surprising that the value of these properties across a population of hundreds of millions of catholics who donate to support the continuation of the services and facilities is going to be huge, because it takes thousands of properties to care for hundreds of millions of catholics and the public at large who use and need the services.

Add to that the fact that many of the churches of Europe are many hundreds of years old and historical buildings held in trust by the church for the people. These historical buildings require government legislated levels of care in some countries and morally required care in every aspect to preserve the heritage and history of the cultures they belong to -and these preservation costs are a huge expense to the church/s.

edit to add:

[+DieChecker]

I was reading about this the other day, and it seems the Pope really ripped into his Vatican staff. He's going to have those ol' boys on their toes this coming year.

Maybe he will clean house and get more people who think more like him installed.

[+Link of Hyrule]

Just to add some reality checks here. The catholic church runs Churches, Hospitals, Elderly Care Homes, Schools, Orphanages, Monasteries and homes for Nuns, particularly caring for the elderly of the cloth, hospice care, homeless shelters, drug rehabilitation clinics etc. These are not "riches" of the church, these are services and facilities to service and care for the congregations of the church and the public at large. It is hardly surprising that the value of these properties across a population of hundreds of millions of catholics who donate to support the continuation of the services and facilities is going to be huge, because it takes thousands of properties to care for hundreds of millions of catholics and the public at large who use and need the services.

Add to that the fact that many of the churches of Europe are many hundreds of years old and historical buildings held in trust by the church for the people. These historical buildings require government legislated levels of care in some countries and morally required care in every aspect to preserve the heritage and history of the cultures they belong to -and these preservation costs are a huge expense to the church/s.

The voice of reason. Even the Atheists Foundation of Australia asks a yearly membership (plus any donations care to be offered, not to mention their merchandise section if you want "God is not real" printed on your coffee mug or T-shirt).

What humanitarian work are they doing with the funds they receive, and why don't atheists complain about them?

[back to earth]

Just to add some reality checks here. The catholic church runs Churches, Hospitals, Elderly Care Homes, Schools, Orphanages, Monasteries and homes for Nuns, particularly caring for the elderly of the cloth, hospice care, homeless shelters, drug rehabilitation clinics etc. These are not "riches" of the church, these are services and facilities to service and care for the congregations of the church and the public at large. It is hardly surprising that the value of these properties across a population of hundreds of millions of catholics who donate to support the continuation of the services and facilities is going to be huge, because it takes thousands of properties to care for hundreds of millions of catholics and the public at large who use and need the services.

Add to that the fact that many of the churches of Europe are many hundreds of years old and historical buildings held in trust by the church for the people. These historical buildings require government legislated levels of care in some countries and morally required care in every aspect to preserve the heritage and history of the cultures they belong to -and these preservation costs are a huge expense to the church/s.

True ... but the Pope's 'sin' , like the last one that disappeared quiet quickly was to want to seize wealth and power from the Vatican admin that seemed frivolous (like he refused to ride around in the big ornate chair) and help the actual poor in need more than they were being helped.

[Likely Guy]

True ... but the Pope's 'sin' , like the last one that disappeared quiet quickly was to want to seize wealth and power from the Vatican admin that seemed frivolous (like he refused to ride around in the big ornate chair) and help the actual poor in need more than they were being helped.

Sorry Back2Earth, you mentioned the Pope's 'sin'. After that, you lost me.

Is it this Pope, or the last Pope or just any Pope?

Edit: On second read, I think that you mean 'the last Pope'.

Edited December 24, 2014 by Likely Guy

[Likely Guy]

As I said, I'm not religious, but this man, Pope Francis is a special individual. He's 'special', in that that he's average.

[back to earth]

Sorry Back2Earth, you mentioned the Pope's 'sin'. After that, you lost me.

Is it this Pope, or the last Pope or just any Pope?

Edit: On second read, I think that you mean 'the last Pope'.

I meant the Pope Watsisname ... the one that lasted 33 days ... he made the same complaints as this one and blamed vatican bureaucracy and entrenched power brokers in the system, like this Pope appears to be doing.

The 'sin' is a sin from the criminal perspective ... he did wrong by their system he lasted 33 days and had a 'sudden heart problem'.

I can look it all up if you like ...I have history of the vatican and all the Popes, what they did and what happened to them, (what a read ! ) .

It might be a 'sin' for the Pope to just leave and commit apostasy out of despair as well (the 3rd secret Fatima prediction )

I think one came close before ... it might have been when the contracts for the buying of French exocet missiles for the Falklands War by Argentina were made public (as the 'Bank of the Holy Spirit' brokered the deal and their bank account numbers were revealed to be on the contracts.

"Hey ! It was just a business deal ."

You know .... that sort of thing ... thats probably what is p***ing him off ... and the abuse cover-ups ... and all the other stuff he is finding out about the longer he is there .

Edited December 24, 2014 by back to earth

[Frank Merton]

The present bureaucrats were put in place largely by the Polish Pope who was more interested in maintaining strict dogma and moral doctrine even when it hurt people than in being a place of love. I hope changes will happen.