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Ice-age ivory


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#1    GreenmansGod

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Posted 11 December 2004 - 06:17 AM

Friday December 10, 05:31 PM


Ice-age ivory flute found in German cave

BERLIN (Reuters) - A 35,000-year-old flute made from a woolly mammoth's ivory tusk has been unearthed in a German cave by archaeologists, says the University of Tuebingen.

The flute, one of the oldest musical instruments discovered, was pieced together from 31 fragments found in a cave in the Swabian mountains in southwestern Germany, the university said on Friday.

The mountains have yielded rich pickings in recent years, including ivory figurines, ornaments and other musical instruments. Archaeologists believe humans camped in the area in winter and spring.

Mammoths, now extinct, were large elephant-like creatures with hairy coats and long, upcurved tusks. They lived during the Pleistocene period from 2 million to 11,000 years ago.

The university said it planned to put the instrument on display in a museum in Stuttgart.

http://uk.news.yahoo.com/041210/325/f8bso.html

I wish I could have found some pictures of this.  I thought it was pretty cool.

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#2    Asterix

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Posted 11 December 2004 - 08:39 AM

Very interesting story. If 35.000 years ago humans had already "discovered" music and  had invented musical instruments, then the intelligent humans have appeared on this earth long before we believe.

On the latter, there is the discovery of a human skeleton at Halkidiki's Petralona cave, in Greece, which dates back to 700,000 B.C. Several bone tools were also found within the cave as well as traces of the most ancient fire ever lit by human hands in the entire planet (1,000,000 B.C.).

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Scull of the 700.000 yr old human skeleton



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#3    Mad Manfred

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Posted 11 December 2004 - 09:02 AM

Very cool discovery.

I had no idea humanity, at such an early stage, had developed musical instruments.

35,000 makes it even more interesting as humans as we know them have been around for only 37,000.


#4    FreyKade

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Posted 11 December 2004 - 11:24 AM

if humans can make an instrument like the flute after only being around for 2000 years, i wonder how old humans were when the first tools were made

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#5    witch~hunter

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Posted 12 December 2004 - 01:24 AM

Geez, it took humans 2000 years to figure out something as simple as a flute? It's no wonder humans are so far behind the rest of the universe.



#6    Burgundy Johnson

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Posted 12 December 2004 - 04:39 AM

hmm...


looks like the ancient/advanced civilization theory just got proven!

atlantis here we come


#7    Me_Again

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Posted 12 December 2004 - 04:49 AM

*wonders if this effects the theory of evolution  w00t.gif

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#8    Asterix

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Posted 12 December 2004 - 09:28 AM

QUOTE(witch~hunter @ Dec 12 2004, 03:24 AM)
Geez, it took humans 2000 years to figure out something as simple as a flute? It's no wonder humans are so far behind the rest of the universe.

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And may I ask with what do you make the comparison when you say "rest of the universe"

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#9    FreyKade

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Posted 12 December 2004 - 12:53 PM

its still amazing to think that something that was invented by man 35 000 years ago, is still around today and will probably be around for alot longer. but i suppose knives have been around for ages even if they were just sharpened bones or flakes of flint

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#10    Mad Manfred

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Posted 12 December 2004 - 01:19 PM

Knives and weapons are one thing...this is a flute. Music. Which means advanced civilization for a time when most where still roaming tribes.


#11    Art Vandelay

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Posted 12 December 2004 - 01:50 PM

Indeed, music indicates a very advanced form of thinking.  It's not the same thing as making 'sharp objects' to skin an animal, that is merely survival.  Music is completely different.......

Edited by Art Vandelay, 12 December 2004 - 01:50 PM.

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#12    FreyKade

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Posted 12 December 2004 - 01:53 PM

agreed...but i wonder when the first drum was invented...that seems to be the obvious choice for 1st ever musical instrument. i take it this means that humans have been intelligently creative far longer than we had previously thought

"isn't that intresting Dave, i mean every step you take down that chain, takes you one step further from your imagination"

i said
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"Wanna buy some pegs Dave?"
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#13    Asterix

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Posted 12 December 2004 - 07:13 PM

Perhaps even more impressive than the discovery of a flute in 35.000 BC is to discover that people had developed the ability to write as early as in 15.000 BC.
Recent story on that

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#14    FreyKade

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Posted 12 December 2004 - 07:25 PM

that is quite interesting aswel nbut the thought that early humans 35 000 years ago playing music is abig difference to the image of living only in caves and painting on walls

"isn't that intresting Dave, i mean every step you take down that chain, takes you one step further from your imagination"

i said
"you're right! youre a bit of a hippy, but you're right"
- Dave Gorman

"Wanna buy some pegs Dave?"
"I got some pegs belonging to you"
- Papa Lazarou

#15    witch~hunter

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Posted 12 December 2004 - 09:17 PM

Okay, let's say the mammoth tusk is 35,000 years old. My question is, when did it become a flute? If I tear down a 200 year old barn and use the wood to make furniture, can I call it antique furniture? Mammoth tusk are still found to this day. Regardless, I doubt it had anything to do with the advent of music, it was more than likely a toy, something to keep Jr. from wandering off and being eaten by wolves.

On the point of music, let's try a little exercise. Listen to your favorite song, think about how it makes you feel, what is the song about? Tell me and I'll say you're wrong. That song was written, produced, and recorded to make money! That is all it's really about. The only thing the song was meant to convey, is your money into some CEO's pocket. Funny that humans get so passionate over sound waves.







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