[Disinterested]

Debate topic by kikuchiyo.

Many people see plastic surgery as an improvement to our bodies, where we can fix any imperfections that we may see to make ourselves feel more comfortable with our image. Others may argue that plastic surgery is nothing but a degradation to the human body, and we should accept the bodies that we were born with.

Looking for two people for a formal, 1 vs 1 debate. One person will debate in favour of plastic surgery, and the other will debate against it.

Any questions, feel free to send me a PM.

This post has been edited by Lottie: 08 March 2005 - 01:54 PM

[Kryso]

I will debate FOR plastic Surgery!

This post has been edited by Kryso: 08 March 2005 - 01:31 PM

[Lottie]

Fabulous! Kryso will be debating FOR plastic surgery.

Now looking for one more person to oppose him.

[snuffypuffer]

I'll oppose.

[Disinterested]

Great!!!

Kryso will debate for plastic surgery;
SnuffyPuffer will debate against plastic surgery.

Any questions, please feel free to send Lottie or myself a PM.

[Kryso]

I am for Plastic Surgery and Cosmetic Alterations.

No matter whom you are or how great you look, every single person - even if they refuse to admit it to friends or themselves – are not happy with one aspect of their body. Be it a nose to long or sloped, a non-existent chin or saggy eyes, to much fat around the waist or thighs, breast to small or in some cases to large; every person has a area of their body, that if they could, they would change!

The beauty of plastic surgery is now everyone has the opportunity to change that aspect of themselves. Granted sometimes a lot of money is involved. But in some cases the person in question can get help medically with the cost when it is effecting them physically or emotionally.

An example from the BBC News
Health / Plastic surgery benefits 'underestimated'
Prof Fitzpatrick told BBC News Online...

"For many patients receiving cosmetic surgery the benefits, in terms of health and quality of life, were very substantial and from that we concluded that one should not think of this as a purely cosmetic procedure," he said.

Link
Benefits of Plastic Surgery

The physical result of plastic surgery produces a healthier look and the ramifications are immense, as this healthy look will often permeate to the patient's entire lifestyle. People who have surgeries like liposuction and breast reduction usually feel more comfortable in their clothes, that their new bodies allow them to participate in physical activities that they wouldn't have considered before surgery. Plastic surgery can open new doors to people who have previously lived their lives sheltered. They find themselves participating in activities they never would have in the past such as swimming or aerobics, due to their renewed confidence.

Taken from MyBodyPart.com.
Link
And also not forgetting plastic surgery that can be performed when someone is disfigured through cancer! Women with breast cancer at one time had no alternative but to use a type of mold that they inserted down their empty bra. Now with today’s surgery they can have a breast built from their existing skin and bodily fats.

Reconstruction of a breast that has been removed due to cancer or other disease is one of the most rewarding surgical procedures available today. New medical techniques and devices have made it possible for surgeons to create a breast that can come close in form and appearance to matching a natural breast. Frequently, reconstruction is possible immediately following breast removal (mastectomy), so the patient wakes up with a breast mound already in place, having been spared the experience of seeing herself with no breast at all.

American Society of Plastic Surgeons Plastic Surgery Educational Foundation
Link
And not forgetting people who are disfigured due to accidents and health that can – and do - benefit from plastic surgery.
The Scope of Plastic Surgery

Approximately 30% is acute surgery referred from accident and emergency departments. Around 50% of patients are referred directly from their general practitioners for management of a whole range of conditions. Variable amounts of reconstructive surgery are carried out in collaboration with other surgical disciplines, for example orthopaedic, ENT and maxillofacial surgeons. This accounts for approximately 20% of the work done in plastic surgery units.

Link
There has been an increasing appreciation among the public of the scope and ability of plastic surgeons to satisfy reconstructive demands. This has been accompanied by an increased potential to realise these demands by new developments in techniques.

Plastic surgery covers a very large field and can be considered under the following clinical areas (This is not an exhaustive list):

Congenital  [Congenital - are those that are present from birth]
# breast and chest wall defects
# cleft lip and palate and other facial deformities
# craniofacial defects
# limb defects
# skin defects
# urogenital defects (including hypospadias)
Trauma
and burns  [Trauma, conditions caused by accidents, and can either be BLUNT (car/motorcycle crash injuries), or PENETRATING (stabbings, gunshots), or BURNS]
# Burns
# Face
# Hand
# Lower limb
# Scars + tattoos
Neoplasms
[Neoplasms: means conditions that are "new growths", and are either:
BENIGN - i.e. not "cancerous" or;
# MALIGNANT - i.e. "cancerous"] Breast
# Head + neck
# Skin -benign
# Skin -malignant
# Soft tissue
# Other areas  Pressure sores
# Reconstruction of large defects
# Venous ulcers
# Degenerative hand conditions

[snuffypuffer]

I'm against plastic surgery for anything but serious defects.

Poor body image
It is true that most people have a flaw or two that they tend to worry about. But many times, small defects actually add to a person's allure. For instance, can you imagine Cindy Crawford without the mole? For the most part, a little pudge here or a mark there is nothing to worry about, and most people actually like to see a small blemish here or there. It makes a person seem much more real and approachable.

The problem here is that the mass media today has given us an unrealistic expectation of what a human body is supposed to look like, especially young, impressionable people.

being surrounded by images of unnatural bodies in the media that have been through digital alteration and special lighting, some cosmetic surgeons are being extra cautious of performing procedures on young patients that have formed unhealthy bodily images.

source

For instances such as this, fostering a positive environment, where people are accepted for who they are as individuals rather than their outward appearance, is a much better way to mold healthy, productive members of society. Plastic surgery is a "quick fix" to modify a person to fit an unrealistic ideal, and as such is an unhealthy way to approach self improvement.

I hope that was appropriately short, sweet and to the point.

[Kryso]

Plastic surgery is a "quick fix" to modify a person to fit an unrealistic ideal, and as such is an unhealthy way to approach self improvement.

True, plastic surgery is used for self improvement. But has not an intelligent species such as humans the right to make personally decisions on how they look? If a single person has had 5 or even 20 plastic surgical operations, is it not the given right of that individual to decide how far to go?
Is it not the same as body piercing? Some may not agree with a person with an eyebrow and top-part of the ear being pierced (such as I have), but is it not the individuals right to how far they go? Or even tattooing?
An adult with all their thinking faculties should have the right and power to do anything they wish to their own body if it doesn’t affect or harm another.

My point is, if it’s not hurting anyone else, why can not an adult decide what to do with their own body!

[snuffypuffer]

But has not an intelligent species such as humans the right to make personally decisions on how they look?

Yes, they do. But a person who goes through multiple surgeries, spending hundreds of thousands of dollars, very often has much deeper issues than just being uncomfortable with the way they look. These people want to become a completely different person, and they believe that by changing their appearance, they can also change those parts of their personalities that they find lacking.

Is it not the same as body piercing? Some may not agree with a person with an eyebrow and top-part of the ear being pierced (such as I have), but is it not the individuals right to how far they go? Or even tattooing?

I don't think it's exactly the same as body art. As the proud owner of a tattoo, I understand the point you're trying to make, though. But I think that, rather than changing our features, we're only accentuating what we already have.

An adult with all their thinking faculties should have the right and power to do anything they wish to their own body if it doesn’t affect or harm another.

Within reason, yes, an adult should be able to decide how they wish to look. But when that need to be more desireable to others becomes harmful to the person, where, in the case of Michael Jackson, parts of their body literally fall off due to being extremely weakened as a result of multiple operations, then a line needs to be drawn.

When a person feels the need to drastically change their appearance, and there is the potential for harm, not necessarily to others but to one's self, is it not right to step in and say something about it?

[Kryso]

When a person feels the need to drastically change their appearance, and there is the potential for harm, not necessarily to others but to one's self, is it not right to step in and say something about it?

I understand what you are saying… But every individual has the right to do what they wish to their own body (so long as if doesn’t harm another). What would become of us if the one thing we all have, Free Will is taken away? That’s the one thing that no matter how poor or rich, old or young, Free Will is what make us who we are!

Compare these images. Why can’t a person decide if they have the right to change their own bodies?




Of course you have breast enlargements and reductions, ect… Stomach tucks and hair transplants. And all because a person has to pay to have this done, does it make it wrong?

If a small operation boosts a person’s self-confidence is that bad? On the program Extreme Makeover, you see people’s life’s change for the better because it gives them the confidence they need to live a fuller life.

DONALD J. CAPUANO, M.D. Plastic Surgeon.

Plastic surgery specializes in both reconstructive and cosmetic or aesthetic surgery. Reconstructive surgery helps one to fix or bring to normalcy something that is irregular on the body, such as a ripped earlobe, or a scar. Cosmetic surgery helps to improve one's image, or as it is often called, aesthetic surgery, it gives one's body a sense of beauty. Plastic surgery has many uses today. Ultimately, plastic surgery benefits both young and old psychologically, physically and emotionally.

Source

[snuffypuffer]

Back again!

But every individual has the right to do what they wish to their own body (so long as if doesn’t harm another).

I agree with you completely on this point. However, if you'll excuse the cliché, god made us the way we are for a reason. The beauty of being human is not always found in one's physical appearance.

Compare these images. Why can’t a person decide if they have the right to change their own bodies?

My simple opinion, the woman on the bottom, is an attractive woman. I think she may even look better before the nose job. Think of Cindy Crawford's mole. Without it, she's just another gorgeous model, with it, she's one of the most recognizeable women in the world. Sometimes an imperfection actually accentuates one's beauty, rather than draws attention away from it.

If a small operation boosts a person’s self-confidence is that bad? On the program Extreme Makeover, you see people’s life’s change for the better because it gives them the confidence they need to live a fuller life.

I have a serious problem with this show. The message it sends is that no matter how bad your problems are, if you change the way you look outwardly, your life will get better. Confidence, real, true, confidence, does not come from a doctor's scalpel, but in having faith in your worth as a human being, regardless of how you look to other people. These people, regardless of what they say for the cameras, are simply putting wallpaper over the parts of themselves that they don't like so much. A shiny new smile will never take the place of some deep introspection and changing one's life through being disciplined and choosing to live healthy.

A person has a right to do whatever they want to themselves, but simply changing the wrapping paper does nothing to change the fact that the gift inside is just another pair of gym socks.

Back to you, Kryso.

[Kryso]

Mostly all this comes down to self confidence. The outer wrapping is part and parcel of who we are, and it effects us in our everyday life. If an individual has emotional problems, due to having a large nose, or a fat overhanging stomach that they simply can’t get rid off, by all means plastic surgery is a means to an end. And if it is simply the outer look of the person that has held them back for years, then surgery is a feasible, affordable means to change that persons life, and insecurities.

However, if you'll excuse the cliché, god made us the way we are for a reason. The beauty of being human is not always found in one's physical appearance.

As the saying goes, “beauty is in the eye of the beholder,” this is very true. And as you say, God made us the way we are, but not everyone is religious, even though I know it’s just a saying. God also gave us the ability to grow, change, even if that is by different means.

A shiny new smile will never take the place of some deep introspection and changing one's life through being disciplined and choosing to live healthy.

This is also true, but some people have defected teeth, oversized or rotting away. If they can bring back a smile, and confidence, I don’t see how that can be wrong?
Life is too short, and if a person can change a part of them, because they want to, then I see no harm, as I said, so long as they don’t harm others.

[snuffypuffer]

Mostly all this comes down to self confidence.

Exactly. It's a sad state of affairs when your self worth is so tied up in how you look that other, more important qualities are overlooked. A person's outward appearance only holds them back if they want to enter a profession such as modeling or acting, where a person's appearance is considered important. And even in acting, talent many times overcomes what a performer might lack physically. Just look at Philip Seymour Hoffman, John C. Reilly, Ron Perlman, or John Goodman. None of these guys is what you'd call a matinee idol. Yet in spite of that, they've all managed to become very successful, respected figures in their chosen field. Self confidence, no matter what you look like, might just be the most important factor in determining your own self worth.

If an individual has emotional problems, due to having a large nose, or a fat overhanging stomach that they simply can’t get rid off, by all means plastic surgery is a means to an end.

If a person's emotional problems simply stem from having a small flaw in their outward appearance, then these are very small problems indeed. In fact, if this is the extent of your problems, then by all means have the nose job. Unfortunately, emotional distress rarely, if ever is simply due to being uncomfortable with the way one looks. The promise that a surgical procedure will miraculously cure all your problems is a misleading one. Self worth comes from within. A person's self confidence very rarely simply arises from their appearance.

Life is too short, and if a person can change a part of them, because they want to, then I see no harm, as I said, so long as they don’t harm others.

I agree with this to a point. One of the great things about being human is that we can change. We can decide for ourselves what we want to take out of this life. How we live and the quality of that life is up to us, to a certain extent. But what kind of life is it when the quality of life is determined by the shell it's contained in? Going out and seeing the world, learning a new skill, changing careers, even just starting up a new hobby are all much more spiritually satisfying, not to mention less costly, ways to improve your outlook on life.

The point here is, the quality of your life depends on the worth you give it. This is not something that can be done simply by changing your appearance. It has to come from inside, and requires changing fundamental things, like the way you experience and interact with the world around you. Plastic surgery is a quick fix to a superficial problem, and will never make a bad person better.

[Kryso]

The point here is, the quality of your life depends on the worth you give it. This is not something that can be done simply by changing your appearance. It has to come from inside, and requires changing fundamental things, like the way you experience and interact with the world around you.

But sometimes confidence is a large part of how we feel and the way we interact with other people; and looks have a large part to play in that socializing event we call life.
This is simply the way we are brought up, and how school molds us, along with TV and magazines.
And what’s wrong with someone thinking that changing their body would alter their prospective on life? We only live once, and if we can alter our body with different means, then I don’t see that as wrong. A person who keeps trying to diet, but the weight will not shift, regardless of exorcise. If an operation to remove that fat will work, then I say go for it.

Every single person who reads this look at yourself in a mirror, take a long hard look, and even if you will not admit it to another, there is bound to be one aspect of yourself you would like to change; (I have never met someone who hasn’t)? Be it your nose, eyes, breast, thighs, butt or stomach, or one of another hundred different things. And if you had it in your power to change that thing, would you not do it? Personally, I would have to say yes!

[snuffypuffer]

This is simply the way we are brought up, and how school molds us, along with TV and magazines.

If this were true, then all our problems would be solved in less than thirty minutes, everything will kill you, and Cosmo's advice would actually have some merit. Being comfortable in your own skin is about much more than simply how you look. It's the combination of everything you are that makes you a unique, beautiful individual member of the human race.

Every single person who reads this look at yourself in a mirror, take a long hard look, and even if you will not admit it to another, there is bound to be one aspect of yourself you would like to change; (I have never met someone who hasn’t)?

This is true to a point. But one's physical features are the only things in this life that they will ever truly own. I'd like to lose some weight, and sometimes I wish I were better looking. But my face is exactly that, my face. My eyes, nose, lips, chin, all these go together to make my face different from every other face on the planet. It's just one component of what sets me apart from everyone else. Sure, sometimes I wish I'd been blessed in the looks department, but I wouldn't change anything about it. It's the only face I'm ever gonna have, and I'd much rather keep my mug than try to look like someone else.

The obsession in some people to become someone else is one of the real dangers of plastic surgery. Take the case of Cindy Jackson, for instance. cindyjackson.com This woman has had nearly thirty surgeries to look like her idol, a Barbie doll. Is this merely to give her self confidence a boost? More likely, this poor woman, who was very attractive to begin with, has no real sense of herself. A lack of identity, for one reason or another, has led to the desire to become something which is idealized in her mind. There is also a woman in England who's undergone several operations to look like Queen Nefertiti. At what point do we quit looking at this as a quick fix for a person's lagging self-esteem, and do we begin to deal with the often deeper personal issues that lead a person's desire to become a completely different individual?