Jump to content




Welcome to Unexplained Mysteries! Please sign in or create an account to start posting and to access a host of extra features.


Criminal Behaviour- Nature vs Nurture


  • This topic is locked This topic is locked
20 replies to this topic

#1    Lottie

Lottie

    The Nappy Ninja !!

  • Member
  • 7,516 posts
  • Joined:13 Oct 2003
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:London

  • "I like long walks, especially when they are taken by people who annoy me." - Noel Coward

Posted 16 April 2005 - 07:03 PM

Debate Suggestion by Roswell Man.

"My Gene's Did It !"- An excuse or a reality? Is criminal behaviour born or bred.

Looking for 2 participants. This will be a  formal debate, one introduction, 5 bodily posts and a conclusion.

Any questions feel free to PM Dis or myself.  thumbsup.gif

Edited by Lottie, 09 August 2005 - 07:24 PM.


#2    Kryso

Kryso

    Always watching...

  • Member
  • 3,943 posts
  • Joined:21 Sep 2003
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:England

  • Truth titillates the imagination far less than fiction.

Posted 29 April 2005 - 01:39 PM

I will argue that criminal behavior is bred. Not genetic!


#3    Disinterested

Disinterested

    Government Agent

  • Member
  • 3,740 posts
  • Joined:11 May 2004

Posted 05 May 2005 - 03:35 PM

I'll debate for a genetic predisposition towards criminal behaviour. wink2.gif


#4    Lottie

Lottie

    The Nappy Ninja !!

  • Member
  • 7,516 posts
  • Joined:13 Oct 2003
  • Gender:Female
  • Location:London

  • "I like long walks, especially when they are taken by people who annoy me." - Noel Coward

Posted 05 May 2005 - 05:15 PM

Fabulous! Okay this should be interesting  wink2.gif

Disinterested will be debating that criminal behaviour is Genetic
Kryso will be debating that criminal behaviour is Bred


The debate will consist of an introduction, 5 bodily posts showing countering of the opponent, good style, persuasive arguments and information relevant to the topic, and a conclusion. Remember to quote your sources, no flaming or offensive langauage.

Please try try to keep to the time limits of the rules which are 7 days per post. If for any reason this is not possible during the course of the debate please let me know.

Good luck & have fun!  thumbsup.gif


#5    Disinterested

Disinterested

    Government Agent

  • Member
  • 3,740 posts
  • Joined:11 May 2004

Posted 06 May 2005 - 08:01 PM

In this debate I will attempt to prove that there is in fact a genetic predisposition to violent or criminal behaviours.

Although I do not intend to prove that genetics are in fact an excuse for wrongful behaviours, my main focuses will be in terms of researching personality, human behaviour, learning processes, development and mental disorders and how much of a role heredity can play in these factors.

We will take a look at certain killers who have had seemingly perfect childhoods, but still managed achieve unusually high levels of agression; and different studies performed in regards to this exact issue.


(Short but sweet, I'm sure this will be a fun debate).


#6    Kryso

Kryso

    Always watching...

  • Member
  • 3,943 posts
  • Joined:21 Sep 2003
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:England

  • Truth titillates the imagination far less than fiction.

Posted 07 May 2005 - 10:58 AM

Thanks Disinterested…

I will debate the fact that when we are born we are an empty shell - nothing pre-programmed! I will try to show that there are no abnormal cerebral abnormalities that can be used as an excuse for criminal behavior. I will argue that we are who we are, and become this from being nurtured by our surroundings and parental guidance, and our interactions with other people and the media and interracial programs, (for example - computer games and movies!)

I will also use real life examples to prove this theory and uphold my side of the debate.

I will use examples of serial killers who have had traumatic backgrounds that have lead to their currant situation, and how the way they were treated as a child has mental and emotional consequences for when they become adults.

I will endeavor to prove these facts, and that technological countries – such as America – have a higher rate of serial killers than any other country!

Lastly, I look forward to having this debate with you Disinterested.

Back to you!



#7    Disinterested

Disinterested

    Government Agent

  • Member
  • 3,740 posts
  • Joined:11 May 2004

Posted 11 May 2005 - 03:32 PM

Body Post #1

Twin studies have been a valuable tool in personality and behaviour research. Many psychologists have examined twins who have never met and raised by different families. Typically, they will find many similar personalities.

The following link provides helpful information.
QUOTE
Though one’s personality is not determined strictly by genetics, there is
more evidence to support the idea that personality is inherited than there is to
support the idea personality is made based on the environment and based on one’s
experience.


The link does go on to explain that there have been many similarities in twins in this study, many of them that seem to be attributed mainly to genetics.

One of the first theories of human personality was the humoral theory. It came up with the following personality types:

Choleric : Individuals have excess levels of yellow bile; and were generally irritable.
Melancholic : Individuals have excess levels of  black bile; and were generally pessimistic.
Phlegmatic : Individuals have excess levels of phlegm; and generally laid-back.
Sanguine : Have excess levels of blood, and generally cheerful.

This theory has its obvious flaws – there couldn’t possibly be only four personality types. Especially not because of excess fluids in one’s body. However, it was the most plausible theory at the time, and the basis of it is still being researched today: that personality was affected by our biological make-up.

Take the example of Gary Hirte. This was a “perfect kid in a perfect town”. He had excellent grades and was a model student. There did not seem to be any environmental factors that would contribute to his violent behaviour.

Not all children who have grown up in less-than-favourable households or have negative childhood experiences grow up to be violent criminals. In fact, it seems that only a small percentage of them do. Genetics must play some part in determining what kind of adult they will grow up to be. If it were based solely on environmental factors, wouldn’t that mean that any one of us could be at risk of becoming aggressive and violent?



#8    Kryso

Kryso

    Always watching...

  • Member
  • 3,943 posts
  • Joined:21 Sep 2003
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:England

  • Truth titillates the imagination far less than fiction.

Posted 15 May 2005 - 12:55 PM

Post 1

I understand what you are saying, that twins who have been raised apart have the same personalities, even idiosyncrasies!
QUOTE
"One set of identical twins in the study met for the first time in their 60s. Their personalities echoed each other right down to idiosyncrasies such as reading magazines from back to front, wearing rubber bands on their wrists and getting a kick out of startling people by sneezing on elevators. Yet their upbringings could hardly have been more different: One man was raised as a Hitler Youth in Germany, the other as a Jew in Trinidad."

Source
But the genetics that’s makes each of us an individual has been simply split in two, creating two people who are identical in emotional and genetic makeup. Because these studies show it is only identical twins that do this mirroring of personalities. And even though they are brought up in different homes the similarities of the household’s environments are mainly the same.
QUOTE
Monozygotic (MZ, identical) twins’ share 100 percent of their genes, while dizogotic (DZ, fraternal) twins share only 50 percent of their genes (the same percentage as non-twin siblings). Therefore, to the extent that genes are influential, identical twins should be more alike than fraternal twins.

Source
Doctors and scientists admit that even thought they are looking into these subjects; no real headway is being done to identify certain genes that effect behavior!

QUOTE
Traditional research strategies in behavioral genetics include studies of twins and adoptees, techniques designed to sort biological from environmental influences. More recently, investigators have added the search for pieces of DNA associated with particular behaviors, an approach that has been most productive to date in identifying potential locations for genes associated with major mental illnesses such as schizophrenia and bipolar disorder. Yet even here there have been no major breakthroughs, no clearly identified genes that geneticists can tie to disease. The search for genes associated with characteristics such as sexual preference and basic personality traits has been even more frustrating.

Thus, more than any other aspect of genetics, discoveries in behavioral genetics should not be viewed as irrefutable until there has been substantial scientific corroboration.

Are behaviors inbred, written indelibly in our genes as immutable biological imperatives, or is the environment more important in shaping our thoughts and actions? Such questions cycle through society repeatedly, forming the public nexus of the "nature vs. nurture controversy," a strange locution to biologists, who recognize that behaviors exist only in the context of environmental influence.

Source
The debate for nature vs. nurture has been raging for years, and twin studies are the foremost in this research. But as it has been said above, no evidence has yet come forth to prove this speculation.

QUOTE
Take the example of Gary Hirte. This was a “perfect kid in a perfect town”. He had excellent grades and was a model student. There did not seem to be any environmental factors that would contribute to his violent behaviour.

Gary Hirte killed Glenn Kopitske in cold blood, but as you read through the story you pick up hints that he was already unstable…
QUOTE
Just in case Hirte needed more ordnance, however, he also carried an eight-inch buck knife, the same blade Eric had often seen him use as he casually sliced off calluses and the occasional wart from his hands.

Slicing of warts and calluses with an eight-inch blade is not normal behaviour!
QUOTE
The way the cops would later piece it together, Hirte had it all planned in advance, and even in the dark on that moonless July night in 2003, he could feel the perfect place to park his father's car.

This was no spur of the moment, “My genes made me do it,” he planned this killing down to the smallest detail.  
QUOTE
Hirte had gone to all that trouble, authorities would later say, to plan the perfect crime. Authorities say he picked out the perfect victim: a guy whom no one would really miss and who could not be linked to Hirte. He had even taken the weather into account. Yet, for reasons that only he could possibly understand, he had made the decision to bring a witness along on a dry run, a guy who, if the cops ever got wind of Hirte's involvement, could give them the evidence they'd need to put Hirte at the scene of the crime.

Hirte still needed to build himself up. That, said former FBI profiler Candace Delong, may very well have been why he spent time with Eric in the first place and why he chose a 14-year-old girlfriend. "More often than not, psychopaths... hang around younger women and younger males. Why? They are easier to impress and control," Delong said.

Does this sound like a person who just upped and killed a person, because his genes dictated he would be a violent person, even if he doesn’t want to be? It sounds like a person who has real psychological and emotional problems and he took this out on an unarmed innocent person.

So, what makes a person violent, become a killer? Nature or Nurtured?
QUOTE
Serial killers have tested out a number of excuses for their behavior. Henery Lee Lucas  blamed his upbringing; others like Jeffery Dahmer say that they were born with a "part" of them missing. Ted Bundy  claimed pornography made him do it. Herbert Mullin, Santa Cruz killer of thirteen, blamed the voices in his head that told him it was time to "sing the die song." The ruthless Carlm Panzram swore that prison turned him into a monster, while Booby Joe Long said a motorcycle accident made him hypersexual and eventually a serial lust killer. The most psychopathic, like, john Wayne Gacy turn the blame around and boast that the victims deserved to die.

Source

My post is very long, so in my next post I will look deeper into what makes a person become a killer!


#9    Disinterested

Disinterested

    Government Agent

  • Member
  • 3,740 posts
  • Joined:11 May 2004

Posted 19 May 2005 - 08:45 PM

Body Post #2

QUOTE(Kryso)
Gary Hirte killed Glenn Kopitske in cold blood, but as you read through the story you pick up hints that he was already unstable…


Of course he was already unstable. Whether you’re on the side of nature or nurture, there is no such thing as an individual who will ‘up and kill somebody’. These are individuals who’ve exhibited violent behavior (often beginning as young children) and had it escalate to murder.

Certain mental disorders are said have a genetic predisposition that is affected by external (environmental) factors. Though this is not to say that all individuals who may be predisposed will end up with the disorder, it simply states that for those who do, it can be attributed to genetics.

QUOTE
Gene variation increases risk of Schizophrenia (psychiatrymattters.md) - it was reported today that "Researchers have found evidence to suggest that the 3' genomic region of the D2 dopamine receptor (DRD2) gene may convey an increased risk of developing schizophrenia.


Source

There have also been findings that genetics play a stronger role in individuals who develop Bi-Polar Disorder than those who suffer from depression.

QUOTE
In population studies they found that there is a 10 percent risk that others in the nuclear family (father, mother, siblings) will have the disorder once one family member is diagnosed. Second degree relatives, such as grandparents, uncles, and aunts were found to have a four percent risk.


Source

It is important to remember that despite environmental factors, genetics do play a part in anyone’s behaviour. External stimuli can affect each individual differently and have a different effect. If we looked solely at environmental factors that contributed to a person’s violent and unpredictable behaviour, there would definitely be more cases of antisocial personality disorder or schizophrenia in the world.

Some of us have had terrible childhoods, and grow stronger because of it. Others become afraid, withdrawn and angry. With similar environments, why are they so different?



#10    Kryso

Kryso

    Always watching...

  • Member
  • 3,943 posts
  • Joined:21 Sep 2003
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:England

  • Truth titillates the imagination far less than fiction.

Posted 23 May 2005 - 07:00 PM

Post 2

QUOTE(Disinterested @ May 19 2005, 02:45 PM)
It is important to remember that despite environmental factors, genetics do play a part in anyone’s behaviour. External stimuli can affect each individual differently and have a different effect. If we looked solely at environmental factors that contributed to a person’s violent and unpredictable behaviour, there would definitely be more cases of antisocial personality disorder or schizophrenia in the world.

View Post



QUOTE
A recent study has demonstrated that 20 out of 31 confessed killers are diagnosed as mentally ill. Out of that 20, 64% have frontal lobe abnormalities. (1) A thorough study of the profiles of many serial killers shows that many of them had suffered sever head injuries (to the frontal lobe) when they were children. To discover why damage to the frontal lobe could be a cause of serial killing, one must look at the function of the frontal lobe of the brain.


This researcher found that it was damage, but by accidents, not genetics!

QUOTE
The frontal lobe is located in the most anterior part of the brain hemispheres. It is considered responsible for much of the behavior that makes possible stable and adequate social relations. Self-control, planning, judgment, the balance of individual versus social needs, and many other essential functions underlying effective social intercourse are mediated by the frontal structures of the brain. (3) Antonio and Anna Damasio, two noted Portuguese neurologists and researchers working in the University of Iowa, have been investigating in the last decade the neurological basis of psychopathy. They have shown that individuals who had undergone damage to the ventromedial frontal cortex (and who had normal personalities before the damage) developed abnormal social conduct, leading to negative personal consequences.

The idea that the frontal lobe is a stop button, or acts as a conscience that stops a 'normal' human from acting on their more violent tendencies, is not a new one.


But then they go on to say…

QUOTE
Brain damage cannot be the motivator for all serial killing. 46% of all confessed serial killers have no frontal or general brain damage. The majority admits that they were perfectly aware of what they were doing before, during, and after the crime. Some even confess that they know that what they were doing was wrong, and contemplated 'giving up' after the first time. The thrill derived from murder is a temporary fix. Like any other powerful narcotic, homicidal violence satisfies the senses for a time, but the effect soon fades.

(Link) Predestined Serial Killers Annabella Rutigliano

Either from accident or environment, serial killers (just one example I said I will use) have different ideas about why they became what they have.

QUOTE
For some of these killers, sexuality is equated with sin and death by overzealous parents who were anxious to keep their sons from becoming promiscuous. Their libidinous drive was channeled into other deviant behavior. "Lipstick Killer" William Heirens claimed that burglary was his primary form of sexual release. As a child, he had been warned that sexual contact was dirty and "caused disease." Joseph Kallinger, who was raised by sadistic Catholic parents who told him his penis had been operated on to keep it from growing (it was actually a hernia operation) was sexually excited by fires. For Ed Gein, who had been sternly taught that sex was sinful and degenerate, it almost seems natural that he would associate his own sexual curiosity with death, the fruit of sin itself.

Henry Lee Lucas, who was forced to dress like a girl as a child, declared, "I was death on women. I didn't feel they need to exist. I hated them, and I wanted to destroy every one I could find. I was doing a good job of it." Many believe that John Gacy was killing young men who symbolically represented his own hated homosexual self. Bobby Joe Long, who had an extra X (or female) chromosome, and grew breasts in puberty, brutally murdered prostitutes, and women who reminded him of his mother's promiscuity.

(Link) Crime Library

I have used serial killers as an example because they have higher profiles.  And a lot of study has been done into what makes them tick - to use an expression. Most talk about how they had been treated as a child, and how that reflected in how they treated their victims.

QUOTE
Violence on television affects children negatively, according to psychological research.
The three major effects of seeing violence on television are:
• Children may become less sensitive to the pain and suffering of others.
• Children may be more fearful of the world around them.
• Children may be more likely to behave in aggressive ways toward others
FACT: The average American child will have watched 100,000 acts of televised violence, including 8000 depictions of murder, by the time he or she finishes sixth grade (approximately 13 years old).

(Link) Children and television violence

QUOTE
Psychologist Douglas Gentile of the National Institute for Media and the Family has found that children learn well from repeated violent video-game play, but the lessons aren't good ones. Instead, children have more aggressive thoughts and then behaviors after the desensitization of digitized butchery. His latest research on students -- in grades 3 to 5, grades 8 and 9, and the early college years -- found that those who play multiple violent games are more aggressive than those who play a mix of different video games. He also found that those who play these games constantly, every day, even in small doses, are more aggressive than those who play in fewer, larger chunks of time.

(Link) The Dangers of Violent Video Games Raising Kids, Instead of Parents

Today more than ever children play games depicting violence, and this is obviously affecting them!

QUOTE
Imagine if the entertainment industry created a video game in which you could decapitate police officers, kill them with a sniper rifle, massacre them with a chainsaw, and set them on fire.

Think anyone would buy such a violent game?

They would, and they have. The game Grand Theft Auto has sold more than 35 million copies, with worldwide sales approaching $2 billion.

Two weeks ago, a multi-million dollar lawsuit was filed in Alabama against the makers and marketers of Grand Theft Auto, claiming that months of playing the game led a teenager to go on a rampage and kill three men, two of them police officers.

(Link) Can A Video Game Lead To Murder?

Parents sit back, ignoring the fact that their children are playing games with 18 certificates! And the above is a direct result of that. A child’s mind is sensitive, as stated above - when most serial killers state they became killers because of what happened in their childhood.

But let's change tracks slightly, what if what you are debating is true, and it is proven without a doubt , that it’s genetic! Would it end up like the Minority Report, people being placed in institutions, because their genes state they will be violent – killers. Will they be forced to have lobotomies? It sounds extreme, but they are doing extreme things. If it’s found without doubt that it is genetic, then what?

(Edited for spelling)

Edited by Kryso, 24 May 2005 - 02:25 PM.


#11    Disinterested

Disinterested

    Government Agent

  • Member
  • 3,740 posts
  • Joined:11 May 2004

Posted 30 May 2005 - 02:25 PM

Body Post #3

QUOTE
The first influential factor to be discussed that is important in the development of personality disorders, such as conduct disorder and antisocial disorder, is genetic and biological contributions and characteristics that make certain people more likely to develop this disorder than others.


Link

Another link that explains quite well how genetics can influence behaviour.

QUOTE(Kryso)
I have used serial killers as an example because they have higher profiles. And a lot of study has been done into what makes them tick - to use an expression. Most talk about how they had been treated as a child, and how that reflected in how they treated their victims.


I agree, it is quite obvious that the majority of these serial killers were victims themselves. Often subjected to physical and sexual abuse, having their childhoods robbed of them and growing up with out proper role models, or even love.

But if we do take a look at the individuals who have contributed to the horrendous childhoods of some of these killers -- could we not say that they were sick themselves? How often have you heard that people are born alcoholics, and remain so until their last day of life?

Who's to say that some of these children have not inherited their parents' illnesses?

QUOTE
Violence on television affects children negatively, according to psychological research.
The three major effects of seeing violence on television are:
• Children may become less sensitive to the pain and suffering of others.
• Children may be more fearful of the world around them.
• Children may be more likely to behave in aggressive ways toward others
FACT: The average American child will have watched 100,000 acts of televised violence, including 8000 depictions of murder, by the time he or she finishes sixth grade (approximately 13 years old).


I agree with your point here. Whether or not we are talking about genetic or environmental factors, a growing mind should not be subjected to such violence and gore.

However, I would like to point out that most children who have played or seen these programs, movies or video games do not exhibit violent behaviours or tendencies as they grow older.

On a personal note, I am completely against violent video games or shows for children under the age of 18. I believe that they are disturbing and in poor taste.

QUOTE(Kryso)
But let's change tracks slightly, what if what you are debating is true, and it is proven without a doubt , that it’s genetic! Would it end up like the Minority Report, people being placed in institutions, because their genes state they will be violent – killers. Will they be forced to have lobotomies? It sounds extreme, but they are doing extreme things. If it’s found without doubt that it is genetic, then what?


What I've been saying all along, is that I do not (and never will!) believe that violent behaviour could be solely placed on genetic factors. If this were the case, no one would ever be held responsible for their actions.

My main point has been a genetic predisposition, that certain individuals are more likely to develop violent tendencies because of their genes.

If, hypothetically, we contributed this 100% to genetics, then there are still many options available -- ranging from early therapy to developing medication to prevent outbursts before they happen.

It is quite difficult to say, especially when there is still such a large grey area between environment and genes.


#12    Kryso

Kryso

    Always watching...

  • Member
  • 3,943 posts
  • Joined:21 Sep 2003
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:England

  • Truth titillates the imagination far less than fiction.

Posted 02 June 2005 - 09:30 PM

Post 3

QUOTE
But if we do take a look at the individuals who have contributed to the horrendous childhoods of some of these killers -- could we not say that they were sick themselves? How often have you heard that people are born alcoholics, and remain so until their last day of life?


In the sense that these people contributed to the killers mental state, is without question. But I’ve never heard of the saying, Born an Alcoholic. Just like criminals I believe their surroundings and upbringing solely contribute to the individuals’ way of escaping from reality, by drinking.

QUOTE
However, I would like to point out that most children who have played or seen these programs, movies or video games do not exhibit violent behaviours or tendencies as they grow older.


True, simply playing a game, doesn’t affect everyone, in the sense that they are going to become killers. But after a simple game of martial arts on the computer, or watching fighting on the TV, children are instantly doing play-acting, kicking, punching, and having a little fight.
It’s similar to when parents smoke; you often see youngsters play-acting, by using a pen as a cigarette, and copying their parents – everything they see registers in their growing minds.

QUOTE
My main point has been a genetic predisposition, that certain individuals are more likely to develop violent tendencies because of their genes.


Can this simply be because there are more acceptable to their environment? Their brain more like a sponge? Certain individuals’ brain synapses are more vulnerable -more tender mentally?

QUOTE
In the first ever conducted international survey on children and media violence, a UNESCO study underlines television’s dominant role in the lives of young people around the world and its impact on the development of aggressive behaviour, paving the way for a stronger debate between politicians, producers, teachers and parents.

How do the world’s children spend most of their leisure time? The answer watching television may come as no great surprise, but the UNESCO Global Media Violence Study (see box), the largest ever intercultural project on this topic, sheds light on the striking similarities of television’s impact in vastly different cultural, economic and social contexts.

In the areas surveyed, from relatively peaceful environments like Canada or certain high-crime neighbourhoods in Brazil to war-zones in Angola or Tajikistan, the study confirmed the dominant role of television in the everyday lives of children around the globe: 93% of the students who attend school and live in electrified urban or rural areas have regular access to television and watch it for an average of three hours a day. This represents at least 50% more than the time spent on any other out of school activity, including homework, being with friends, or reading. The result justifies the assumption that television is the most powerful source of information and entertainment besides face-to-face interaction.

With the advent of mass media, including television and more recently, video and computer games, children and teenagers are exposed to increasingly higher doses of aggressive images. In many countries, there is an average of five to ten aggressive acts per hour of television. Violence among youth is also on the rise, making it plausible to correlate the two, even though we believe that the primary causes for aggressive behaviour in children are to be found in their family environment, and the social and economic conditions in which they are raised.

Media and Violence Study

But can these studies be accurate?

QUOTE
From 1996 to 1997, more than 5,000 12-year-old students from 23 countries (Angola, Argentina, Armenia, Brazil, Canada, Costa Rica, Croatia, Egypt, Fiji, Germany, India, Japan, Mauritius, the Netherlands, Peru, Philippines, Qatar, South Africa, Spain, Tajikistan, Togo, Trinidad and Tobago, Ukraine) answered a standardised 60-item questionnaire. Regional pre-tests assured that the children understood the questionnaire, which they filled in during classes. Out of school children or groups living in extremely remote areas could not be covered.

The study aimed to understand the role of the media in the lives of children; children’s fascination for media violence; the relationship between media violence and aggressive behaviour among children; the cultural and gender differences in the media impact on aggression; and how violent environments (war/crime) and the level of technological development influence the coping with aggressive media content.

Study Results!

This study shows that violence is having a massive impact on children and the way they themselves act and perceive everything around them.

Only this week in England two eleven year olds and one twelve year old have been questioned in the connection to the attempted murder of a five year old boy, who they tried to hang!

Could all three of these children have the gene that makes them violent? Or did they become influenced by the programs and films, and games they have played?
Source

It has the same kind of ring to it as the Jamie Bulger case, when the 2 year old was brutally murdered by two eleven year olds!
The Story of little Jamie Bulger

In my opinion society are breeding the next generation of murders and psychopaths.








#13    Disinterested

Disinterested

    Government Agent

  • Member
  • 3,740 posts
  • Joined:11 May 2004

Posted 06 June 2005 - 03:03 PM

Body Post #4

QUOTE
But I’ve never heard of the saying, Born an Alcoholic. Just like criminals I believe their surroundings and upbringing solely contribute to the individuals’ way of escaping from reality, by drinking.

On the contrary, there seem to be an increasing number of studies that point to alcoholism as being entirely physiological.  Link


QUOTE
But after a simple game of martial arts on the computer, or watching fighting on the TV, children are instantly doing play-acting, kicking, punching, and having a little fight. It’s similar to when parents smoke; you often see youngsters play-acting, by using a pen as a cigarette, and copying their parents – everything they see registers in their growing minds.

True, children do like to act out what they see. However, how often to boys play games of ‘cops and robbers’, where it’s the good guys against the bad? They play with toy guns, and until recently, no one was really bothered by it; not because the number of violent crimes have increased, but rather the disturbing nature of the crimes.


QUOTE
Can this simply be because there are more acceptable to their environment? Their brain more like a sponge? Certain individuals’ brain synapses are more vulnerable -more tender mentally?

Then what would make certain children more vulnerable than others?

Children are not born with a 'blank slate', they do posess the most basic motor functions (crying, suckling) when they are but a few minutes old.

Research has shown that our brains continue to grow and develop until we are in our early 20's. Until then, yes, their brains to act like a sponge, absorbing all surrounding stimuli. However, what varies is what aspects of their environment children absorb, and how their brain filters the information.


QUOTE
Only this week in England two eleven year olds and one twelve year old have been questioned in the connection to the attempted murder of a five year old boy, who they tried to hang!

Could all three of these children have the gene that makes them violent? Or did they become influenced by the programs and films, and games they have played?

It has the same kind of ring to it as the Jamie Bulger case, when the 2 year old was brutally murdered by two eleven year olds!

It's extremely difficult to say. Many psychologists and psychiatrists will not diagnose a child as being a sociopath, because they are naturally irrational and impulsive.

Children also have a fasination with death and mortality. It is not uncommon to find them drawing 'morbid' pictures, asking questions about death and the afterlife. Many of them don't understand the full extent of what it means to die -- they don't properly understand that they will never come back.

QUOTE
In my opinion society are breeding the next generation of murders and psychopaths.

Agreed. There aren't any preventative measures in place to deter violent behaviours before they begin.


#14    Kryso

Kryso

    Always watching...

  • Member
  • 3,943 posts
  • Joined:21 Sep 2003
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:England

  • Truth titillates the imagination far less than fiction.

Posted 10 June 2005 - 01:03 PM

Post 4

QUOTE
On the contrary, there seem to be an increasing number of studies that point to alcoholism as being entirely physiological.


It’s an interesting article. And like most things the theory is there, the evidence is building, but trying to locate the particular gene that causes the offending problem. But even they state, ‘may cause’!

QUOTE
There is a growing body of scientific evidence that alcoholism has a genetic component, but the actual gene that may cause it has yet to be identified.


Source

QUOTE
True, children do like to act out what they see. However, how often to boys play games of ‘cops and robbers’, where it’s the good guys against the bad? They play with toy guns, and until recently, no one was really bothered by it; not because the number of violent crimes have increased, but rather the disturbing nature of the crimes.


It’s interesting what cut-off lines parents’ use. Only yesterday I saw a mother tell her two children off for kicking each other, but it was okay to playact sword fights and shooting everyone with huge plastic guns! One even shouting: “Your dead, I just blew your brains out all over the garden.” And this from a 6 year old!
Some parents can’t see that this violent playacting is just as bad for their children as physical violence. Because children don’t see this as bad because their parents let them do it.
QUOTE
Children also have a fasination with death and mortality. It is not uncommon to find them drawing 'morbid' pictures, asking questions about death and the afterlife. Many of them don't understand the full extent of what it means to die -- they don't properly understand that they will never come back.


So true. Once again step in the parental lies. Parents come up with the strangest explanations as to where the dead loved ones have gone. I know it’s hard for a child to understand, but surely the truth is always the best answer. Some explanations leave the children confused and bewildered.

Here s a website with just a sample of crimes done by children.

Link

There is loads of information retaining to child crimes and violence.

Parents have a lot to answer to. There is no universal book on raising children, and I can’t really relate because I have none myself, but I was one once, lol. But children are lied too from such a young age. And this continues throughout their developing life as a child. And parents have such strange standards, maybe because it was okay when they were growing up? Physical violence seems to be bad, but watching it on TV, games and playacting violence doesn’t seem to make parents - in today’s societies - to batter an eyelid.

And one of my other points is sex is such a candid issue now, that children are being subjected to it at all stages of childhood. It’s in most stores, and placing it on the top shelf doesn’t make it invisible! And the standards on TV now have lowered so much: years ago it would be an 18 and not shown before the watershed. Now its everywhere and distorting children’s view of sex and violence. I say this because it is warping there perspective towards sex and violence, because it most cases its showing children that men are dominant over the females.

All-in-all, we have so much being forced at children everyday - TV, games, advertising (with violent references), music that sings of violence and pain, all this distorting young sensitive minds. Minds that soak it up like sponges. Minds that see all this, see how violence is packaged and sold, seeing it in such wide and varied areas that they become numb to it – it no longer seems wrong.

(Edited for spelling)


Edited by Kryso, 10 June 2005 - 01:32 PM.


#15    Disinterested

Disinterested

    Government Agent

  • Member
  • 3,740 posts
  • Joined:11 May 2004

Posted 17 June 2005 - 05:47 PM

Body Post #5

QUOTE(Kryso)
All-in-all, we have so much being forced at children everyday - TV, games, advertising (with violent references), music that sings of violence and pain, all this distorting young sensitive minds. Minds that soak it up like sponges. Minds that see all this, see how violence is packaged and sold, seeing it in such wide and varied areas that they become numb to it – it no longer seems wrong.

I agree that children are exposed to more violent media in today's society. However, that does not mean that it is breeding a generation of killers.

QUOTE(Kryso)
And one of my other points is sex is such a candid issue now, that children are being subjected to it at all stages of childhood. It’s in most stores, and placing it on the top shelf doesn’t make it invisible! And the standards on TV now have lowered so much: years ago it would be an 18 and not shown before the watershed. Now its everywhere and distorting children’s view of sex and violence. I say this because it is warping there perspective towards sex and violence, because it most cases its showing children that men are dominant over the females.

Of course sex is everywhere these days -- it seems to be a huge seller. Sexual innuendos are everywhere you turn, even in children's shows or movies! (As an example, I found the Scooby-Doo movie inappropriate for children).

However, this doesn't provoke violent behaviour. At the most, it can influence early sexual activity. But this alone isn't an environmental factor, considering arousal can begin before a child is even a year old. I would say that if sex on television is doing anything, it is giving teens and 'tweens' more incentive to explore their feelings without guilt.


Back to genetic predispositions, here is a link of a study conducted at the University of Wisconsin-Madison:
QUOTE
The job of picking up the unused keys is the work of an enzyme called monoamine oxidase A (MAO A). All brains produce some MAO A. In most people, the brain produces enough MAO A to break down excess amounts of the neurotransmitters serotonin, dopamine and norepinephrine. In 1993, Harm G. Brunner, head of the human genetics department at the St. Radbout University Medical Center in the Netherlands, announced he had found a genetic connection that could explain the abnormal amounts of serotonin often found in criminals. A study of a family of Dutch criminals revealed they suffered from a defect in the gene that determines MAO A production.

Link

As time goes on, more and more studies are seeing that there is likely a physiological reason for violent or criminal behaviour. The reasons vary, however, the end result is often the same.

The studies would suggest that some individuals are simply more prone to violent behaviour or mental disorders, that can be brought on by their surroundings. For example, a child with this predisposition could be set off by a negative upbringing (like flicking a switch) and a child without it can grow up to become a functional member of society.

Here is another link that explains various biological possibilities for psychopathic behaviour. It discusses the possibility of an extra chromosome, high testosterone levels and various kinds of brain damage as reason for criminal behaviour.

There is definitely no shortage of ideas on what makes a psychopath.





0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users