The Metal Spheres of South Africa

[DJ_Quinn]

Unexplained grooved sphere from South Africa: a representation of Saturn's moon Iapetus?

"Over the past several decades, South African miners have found hundreds of metallic spheres, at least one of which has three parallel grooves running around its equator. The spheres are of two types--'one of solid bluish metal with white flecks, and another which is a hollow ball filled with a white spongy center' (Jimison 1982). Roelf Marx, curator of the museum of Klerksdorp, South Africa, where some of the spheres are housed, said: 'The spheres are a complete mystery. They look man-made, yet at the time in Earth's history when they came to rest in this rock no intelligent life existed. They're nothing like I have ever seen before' (Jimison 1982)."

Even more interesting is the discovery that Iapetus' conspicuous equatorial bulge, seen up close, appears to be composed of three distinct "layers" -- remarkably like the grooved rings encircling the enigmatic spheres described above. As the ever-controversial Richard Hoagland notes regarding Saturn's unlikely moon: "It is a well-known cliché that 'Nature doesn't usually create straight lines.' If that is true, then it certainly doesn't create three of them (close-up-below) -- all running parallel, not only to each other, but to the literal equator of the planet."

Given their strange similarity to Iapetus, could the South African spheres be manufactured representations of Saturn's moon (assuming a non-natural origin for the unexplained bulge)?

Recently, the prospect of alien intelligences choosing to communicate via physical "messages in a bottle" has gained notoriety, as tangible artifacts wafted into space are immune to the signal degradation that invariably afflicts electromagnetic transmissions. Extraterrestrials might choose to communicate long-distance (and over vast spans of time) by "broadcasting" large numbers of tangible artifacts. Ideally, such artifacts could communicate a message, however simple -- perhaps even referencing their place of origin. Additionally, dating such ET artifacts might help scientists determine when they were crafted; ultimately, they might serve as calling cards for any species advanced and fortunate enough to find them and recognize their potential significance.

If the grooved spheres are indeed ET artifacts, buried for millennia, what might they be trying to say? If they're representations of Iapetus, it's conceivable Iapetus is a message or beacon of some kind. Inexplicably oblate and adorned with a shallow ring, Iapetus might be a massive, simplified depiction of Saturn itself . . . in which case there might be something wholly unexpected waiting for us if and when we muster the foresight to go there.

Edited May 23, 2005 by DJ_Quinn

[marduk]

Unexplained grooved sphere from South Africa: a representation of Saturn's moon Iapetus?

"Over the past several decades, South African miners have found hundreds of metallic spheres, at least one of which has three parallel grooves running around its equator. The spheres are of two types--'one of solid bluish metal with white flecks, and another which is a hollow ball filled with a white spongy center' (Jimison 1982). Roelf Marx, curator of the museum of Klerksdorp, South Africa, where some of the spheres are housed, said: 'The spheres are a complete mystery. They look man-made, yet at the time in Earth's history when they came to rest in this rock no intelligent life existed. They're nothing like I have ever seen before' (Jimison 1982)."

Even more interesting is the discovery that Iapetus' conspicuous equatorial bulge, seen up close, appears to be composed of three distinct "layers" -- remarkably like the grooved rings encircling the enigmatic spheres described above. As the ever-controversial Richard Hoagland notes regarding Saturn's unlikely moon: "It is a well-known cliché that 'Nature doesn't usually create straight lines.' If that is true, then it certainly doesn't create three of them (close-up-below) -- all running parallel, not only to each other, but to the literal equator of the planet."

Given their strange similarity to Iapetus, could the South African spheres be manufactured representations of Saturn's moon (assuming a non-natural origin for the unexplained bulge)?

Recently, the prospect of alien intelligences choosing to communicate via physical "messages in a bottle" has gained notoriety, as tangible artifacts wafted into space are immune to the signal degradation that invariably afflicts electromagnetic transmissions. Extraterrestrials might choose to communicate long-distance (and over vast spans of time) by "broadcasting" large numbers of tangible artifacts. Ideally, such artifacts could communicate a message, however simple -- perhaps even referencing their place of origin. Additionally, dating such ET artifacts might help scientists determine when they were crafted; ultimately, they might serve as calling cards for any species advanced and fortunate enough to find them and recognize their potential significance.

If the grooved spheres are indeed ET artifacts, buried for millennia, what might they be trying to say? If they're representations of Iapetus, it's conceivable Iapetus is a message or beacon of some kind. Inexplicably oblate and adorned with a shallow ring, Iapetus might be a massive, simplified depiction of Saturn itself . . . in which case there might be something wholly unexpected waiting for us if and when we muster the foresight to go there.

635749[/snapback]

I think the aliens that buried these did so because being an advanced technological society they knew thar Cricket is the most boring game on earth

[Mr Ed]

It sounds weird, but you think to yourself, if you are going to leave calling cards you would not leave them in one place with a smallish radius on a global scale, and then leave no explanation for them...

[TraJikMaJik]

Unexplained grooved sphere from South Africa: a representation of Saturn's moon Iapetus?

"Over the past several decades, South African miners have found hundreds of metallic spheres, at least one of which has three parallel grooves running around its equator. The spheres are of two types--'one of solid bluish metal with white flecks, and another which is a hollow ball filled with a white spongy center' (Jimison 1982). Roelf Marx, curator of the museum of Klerksdorp, South Africa, where some of the spheres are housed, said: 'The spheres are a complete mystery. They look man-made, yet at the time in Earth's history when they came to rest in this rock no intelligent life existed. They're nothing like I have ever seen before' (Jimison 1982)."

Even more interesting is the discovery that Iapetus' conspicuous equatorial bulge, seen up close, appears to be composed of three distinct "layers" -- remarkably like the grooved rings encircling the enigmatic spheres described above. As the ever-controversial Richard Hoagland notes regarding Saturn's unlikely moon: "It is a well-known cliché that 'Nature doesn't usually create straight lines.' If that is true, then it certainly doesn't create three of them (close-up-below) -- all running parallel, not only to each other, but to the literal equator of the planet."

Given their strange similarity to Iapetus, could the South African spheres be manufactured representations of Saturn's moon (assuming a non-natural origin for the unexplained bulge)?

Recently, the prospect of alien intelligences choosing to communicate via physical "messages in a bottle" has gained notoriety, as tangible artifacts wafted into space are immune to the signal degradation that invariably afflicts electromagnetic transmissions. Extraterrestrials might choose to communicate long-distance (and over vast spans of time) by "broadcasting" large numbers of tangible artifacts. Ideally, such artifacts could communicate a message, however simple -- perhaps even referencing their place of origin. Additionally, dating such ET artifacts might help scientists determine when they were crafted; ultimately, they might serve as calling cards for any species advanced and fortunate enough to find them and recognize their potential significance.

If the grooved spheres are indeed ET artifacts, buried for millennia, what might they be trying to say? If they're representations of Iapetus, it's conceivable Iapetus is a message or beacon of some kind. Inexplicably oblate and adorned with a shallow ring, Iapetus might be a massive, simplified depiction of Saturn itself . . . in which case there might be something wholly unexpected waiting for us if and when we muster the foresight to go there.

635749[/snapback]

I think the aliens that buried these did so because being an advanced technological society they knew thar Cricket is the most boring game on earth

635767[/snapback]

And good morning to your Marduk.. lol.. I knew that I wouldnt have to look far, for that stupid comment =). Wernt you at 1750ish posts yesterday? Now your at 1900?? Good lord, must have found some exciting info.. lol

Edited May 23, 2005 by TraJikMaJik

[Mr Ed]

Yeah thank Roswell Man. He provided us with some fascinating infomation about the Bayeux tapestry. It is captivating.

[ForRizzle]

Looks like a grooved musket ball or minie ball.. Probably hidden by mother nature through storms and found in old sediments.

[marduk]

Unexplained grooved sphere from South Africa: a representation of Saturn's moon Iapetus?

"Over the past several decades, South African miners have found hundreds of metallic spheres, at least one of which has three parallel grooves running around its equator. The spheres are of two types--'one of solid bluish metal with white flecks, and another which is a hollow ball filled with a white spongy center' (Jimison 1982). Roelf Marx, curator of the museum of Klerksdorp, South Africa, where some of the spheres are housed, said: 'The spheres are a complete mystery. They look man-made, yet at the time in Earth's history when they came to rest in this rock no intelligent life existed. They're nothing like I have ever seen before' (Jimison 1982)."

Even more interesting is the discovery that Iapetus' conspicuous equatorial bulge, seen up close, appears to be composed of three distinct "layers" -- remarkably like the grooved rings encircling the enigmatic spheres described above. As the ever-controversial Richard Hoagland notes regarding Saturn's unlikely moon: "It is a well-known cliché that 'Nature doesn't usually create straight lines.' If that is true, then it certainly doesn't create three of them (close-up-below) -- all running parallel, not only to each other, but to the literal equator of the planet."

Given their strange similarity to Iapetus, could the South African spheres be manufactured representations of Saturn's moon (assuming a non-natural origin for the unexplained bulge)?

Recently, the prospect of alien intelligences choosing to communicate via physical "messages in a bottle" has gained notoriety, as tangible artifacts wafted into space are immune to the signal degradation that invariably afflicts electromagnetic transmissions. Extraterrestrials might choose to communicate long-distance (and over vast spans of time) by "broadcasting" large numbers of tangible artifacts. Ideally, such artifacts could communicate a message, however simple -- perhaps even referencing their place of origin. Additionally, dating such ET artifacts might help scientists determine when they were crafted; ultimately, they might serve as calling cards for any species advanced and fortunate enough to find them and recognize their potential significance.

If the grooved spheres are indeed ET artifacts, buried for millennia, what might they be trying to say? If they're representations of Iapetus, it's conceivable Iapetus is a message or beacon of some kind. Inexplicably oblate and adorned with a shallow ring, Iapetus might be a massive, simplified depiction of Saturn itself . . . in which case there might be something wholly unexpected waiting for us if and when we muster the foresight to go there.

635749[/snapback]

I think the aliens that buried these did so because being an advanced technological society they knew thar Cricket is the most boring game on earth

635767[/snapback]

And good morning to your Marduk.. lol.. I knew that I wouldnt have to look far, for that stupid comment =). Wernt you at 1750ish posts yesterday? Now your at 1900?? Good lord, must have found some exciting info.. lol

635896[/snapback]

2nd time i heard your monotone in three days

both times in the form of a personal attack

i can't figure out yet if you want to date me or you're just immature

time will tell eh

[Mr Ed]

I am guessing he wants to date you. That's an educated guess.

[ForRizzle]

How about sticking to the topic instead of insulting each other

[Mr Ed]

The topic is...too controversial for me.

[marduk]

How about sticking to the topic instead of insulting each other

635912[/snapback]

what else could it be

It's still more likely than it being a moon of the planet saturn

[marduk]

How about sticking to the topic instead of insulting each other

635912[/snapback]

Oh ok Rizzle

Jimison (1982) is a unreliable source of data for discussing the origins of the South African spheres described as used by Forbidden Archeology. Thus, his claims that there are two types of spheres, including one of solid blue metal with white flecks, are suspect and cannot be considered as valid evidence. As documented by Brunvand (1993) in the Scientists Discover Hell storyline published in the Weekly World News, a fictional news article in it might founded be on truth, but the truth is so changed as to be almost unrecognizable and useless as a source of data.

The remainder of the quote from Forbidden Archeology quotes a letter that provides some documentation. However, the letter contains a few factual errors as demonstrated by published information research concerning the pyrophyllite deposits of the Syferfontein Formation that outcrop near Ottosdal, Western Transvaal.

Forbidden Archeology states:

We wrote to Roelf Marx for further information about the spheres. He replied in a letter dated September 12, 1984: "There is nothing scientific published about the globes, but the facts are: They are found in pyrophyllite, which is mined near the little town of Ottosdal in the Western Transvaal. This pyrophyllite (Al2Si4O10(OH)2) is a quite soft secondary mineral with a count of only 3 on the Mohs' scale and was formed by sedimentation about 2.8 billion years ago.

The letter of Mr. Marx is correct in stating that pyrophyllite is mined near Ottosdal. It is mined for stone facing, tombstones, lubricant, absorbent, fillers, and the manufacture of electrical porcelains, enamels, and many other things (Coetzee 1976, Jager 1976).

The pyrophyllite occurs as thin beds within a very thick sequence of felsic volcanics. This sequence of volcanics consist of over three kilometers of massive quartz-feldspar porphyry with only local occurrences of brecciated textures, amygdaloidal or spherical textures, and flow banding. Their massive character is the clear result of metamorphism having altered the volcanic rocks (Crow and Condie 1987, Jackson 1992).

However, the claim that sedimentation formed the pryrophyllite is incorrect and significantly misrepresents the facts. Although either clays or volcanic ash accumulated 2.8 billion years ago along with numerous lava flows to create the Syferfontein Formation, metamorphism later altered the sediments to form pyrophyllite from either clays or volcanic ashes. The pyrophyllite is a mineral created by metamorphism at moderate temperature and burial depths of over several kilometers. Such metamorphism has significantly altered the original clays or volcanic ashes into greenschist grade metamorphics. As a result, the original sedimentary and igneous structures of these rocks have been, except locally, totally obliterated. Any primary concretions within both the sediments and volcanic rocks would also have been obliterated at this degree of metamorphism (Chopin and Schreyer 1983, Jackson 1992).

Jackson (1992, p. 175) states:

Volcanoclastic units now converted to massive pyrophyllite (wonderstone) are a significant component of the Syferfontein Fm. in the Ottosdal area (Fig. 2). These rocks are generally massive and very fine-grained, but are locally thin-bedded and have shallow-amplitude ripple-marks on bedding planes and surfaces (see Nel et al. 1937, plate IIIA). Net et al. believed that volcanic ash deposited subaqueously in quiet water conditions became devitrified and altered to clay (bentonite) which was then metamorphosed to pyrophyllite to form these deposits.

These age of these strata has been determined by van Niekerk and Burger (1969) at around 2.8 billion years.

Forbidden Archeology further claimed that the spheres have a fibrous structure with an inside shell around it that is so hard that it cannot be scratched by steel.

By corresponding by e-mail with rockhounds who have collected these spheres and geologists at the University of the Witwatersrand, Wits, South Africa and at the pyrophyllite mine in Ottosdal, West Transvaal it was determined that the mystery spheres consist of pyrite and goethite. These spheres consist of goethite within the near-surface, weathered pyrophyllite and consist of pyrite in the unweathered pyrophyllite. The pyrite spheres are metamorphic nodules that formed during the alteration of either clay or volcanic ash to pyrophyllite by metamorphism. The goethite spheres are pyrite nodules altered by weathering near the ground surface. These spheres are identical to the ones shown in The Mysterious Origins of Man, but they are much softer than claimed in Forbidden Archeology. Furthermore, there is a lack of any evidence for the existence of the solid blue metal spheres described in the World Weekly News. However, a tabloid newspaper infamous for its fictionalized news is unlikely to have presented such information correctly.

Nel et al. (1937,p. 19) briefly document the presence of pyrite nodules when they state:

Pyrite nodules or concretions have been found in quarried stone, hitherto (sic) their occurrence has been so scattered as to be no appreciable harm.

The harm that Nels et al. (1937) refers is harm caused to the economics of mining this deposit by increasing the amount of waste produced during mining by the presence of the nodules.

In a previous post, I had hypothesized that the spheres were metamorphic nodules composed of some manganese oxide. The hypothesis that they are metamorphic nodules has been verified. In part because it was based upon incorrect information given by Forbidden Archeology, the hypothesis that they consist of some manganese oxide has proved to be incorrect.

Forbidden Archeology further states:

In his letter to us, Marx said that A. Bisschoff, a professor of geology at the University of Potchefstroom, told him that the spheres were "limonite concretions." Limonite is a kind of iron ore. A concretion is a compact, rounded rock mass formed by localized cementation around a nucleus.

As defined by Jackson and Bates (1987), limonite is a field term for group of brown, amorphous, naturally occurring, hydrous, ferric oxides whose identities are unknown. Limonite can be composed of variable proportions of goethite, hematite, and various other iron hydroxides. By this definition, Dr. Bisschoff correctly identified the composition of one of two groups of nodules present in the Ottosdal pyrophyllite deposits. It is likely he was shown only the goethite and, thus, did not know that pyrite nodules were also present. However, the spheres are nodules, not concretions, because they are of metamorphic, not sedimentary origin. The presence of goethite nodules in the weathered pyrophyllite is consistent with the presence of pyrite nodules in the unweathered pyrophyllite because goethite is a common weathering product of pyrite as noted by Jackson and Bates (1987).

Forbidden Archeology objects to the identification of the spheres as limonite for two reasons. It claims that limonite concretions usually occur in groups that are stuck together like soap bubbles. Forbidden Archeology argues that the spheres which normally appear isolated and perfectly round, thus, cannot be limonite. Finally, this book argues that the spheres are too hard to be limonite.

The first objection is based upon false information. Contrary to the claims of this book, limonite can occur as isolated, rounded spheres. Furthermore, in case of these goethite nodules, their spherical shape is inherited from the pyrite nodules which have been converted to goethite as a result of weathering. Thus, the objection to some of the nodules being limonite, composed of goethite, on the basis of shape and isolated occurrence is a false objection that lacks any basis in fact.

The last objection that some of the nodules are not limonite on the basis of hardness is also a false objection. Given the other errors of fact in the letter of Mr. Marx, this might be just another error. Also, the goethite nodules can have other harder iron hydroxide minerals associated with them that can account for this observation. Technically speaking, they together would still be defined by Jackson and Bates (1987) as limonite. The identification of limonite by Dr. Bisschoff is substantiated by other knowledgeable rockhounds and geologists who have independently noted the presence of goethite nodules within the weathered pyrophyllite.

Forbidden Archeology notes:

Neither do they normally appear with parallel grooves encircling them.

Some of the goethite nodules do exhibit a parallel groove around them. However, not all of the nodules like the spheres shown on the The Mysterious Origins of Man have the grooves. Whether some of the pyrite nodules exhibit these grooves in not yet known.

Forbidden Archeology continues:

For the purposes of this study, it is the sphere with three parallel grooves around its equator that most concerns us.

It is interesting to note that there is one three-grooved sphere out of hundreds.

Even if it is conceded that the sphere itself is a limonite concretion, one still must account for the three parallel grooves.

There is no chain-of-evidence that clearly proves that this sphere with the three grooves had them when found in place. If artificial, the grooves could have been carved innocently just as folkart and later mistakenly thought to have been present when it was found. Since the spheres are metamorphic nodules from the pyrophyllite, then they could not have been carved before the sediment was buried and metamorphosed, because the nodule would not have existed at the time that the sediments were deposited. Thus, If these grooves are artificial, than they were created after the nodule was extracted from the pyrophyllite and they are considerably younger than the age assigned to them.

Of course, the three-grooved sphere could be a sphere of a different origin than the metamorphic nodules found in the pyrophyllite. However, if this sphere is composed of a different material then the nodules present in the pyrophyllite, then there is no evidence linking this sphere to the nodules found within the pyrophyllite. Also, had the sphere been buried in the sediment about 2.8 billion years age, their subsequent metamorphism would have severely defaced the grooves exhibited by the sphere and have deformed the sphere itself. Thus, if the sphere is composed of something other than pyrite or goethite, there is no evidence connecting it to the pyrophyllite deposits. In that case, it would be impossible to assign any sort of age, significance, or origin to it without additional study of the three-grooved sphere itself.

Neither The Mysterious Origins of Man nor Forbidden Archeology present any evidence that the grooves are artificial. The Mysterious Origins of Man quotes only anonymous lab technicians as their evidence. Without some idea of their expertise and affiliation, it is impossible to judge the expertise, impartiality, and validity of their judgments. Forbidden Archeology presents no documented evidence at all that these grooves are artificial.

Forbidden Archeology concludes:

In the absence of a satisfactory natural explanation, the evidence is somewhat mysterious, leaving open the possibility that the South African grooved sphere--found in a mineral deposit 2.8 billion years old--was made by an intelligent being.

However, there is a complete lack of any evidence that either the nodules/spheres are artificial or that the grooves were cut prior to burial. As far as can be determined at this time, the spheres consist of pyrite nodules of metamorphic origin and goethite nodules formed by the weathering of the pyrite. Since the nodules are metamorphic in origin and, thus, formed by metamorphism while the enclosing strata were buried under kilometers of rock, the grooves, if artificial, had to have been cut after they had collected from the pyrophyllite during quarrying operations. As a result, the grooves are far less than 2.8 billions old. The nodules are clearly of natural origin and less than 2.8 billion years old.

There are natural processes that can account for single, possibly multiple, grooves. However, until actual specimens can be acquired for study, it is rather pointless to speculate on such a matter.

The study of these nodules is ongoing. At this time, I am trying to obtain via surface (snail) mail actual specimens of these and copies of private reports containing data about them. This unfortunately, will likely take some time, possibly months.

http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/mom/spheres.html

and this is just what talk origins says about them

serious geological sources regard this as a joke.

See i could have shot this down on my first post but that might have upset DJ Quinn who did after all take such a long time to copy all this out of forbidden archaeology in the first place

[Amalgamut]

I think the aliens that buried these did so because being an advanced technological society they knew thar Cricket is the most boring game on earth

 

635767[/snapback]

hahhhah

[Mr Ed]

Thanks for the lengthy quoted piece marduk.

[ForRizzle]

Timeline for the spheres.

Edited May 23, 2005 by ForRizzle

[nativechick1989]

WOW

Talk about an interesting read!

[ForRizzle]

OMG its the deathstar!

[Amalgamut]

Hmmm....maybe its just a petrified orange?

[marduk]

Oh come on now

"It is a well-known cliché that 'Nature doesn't usually create straight lines.'

it might be well known but its false. nature creates straight lines all the time

so you have a fallacy being used as evidence that something else is true

Besides which. These lines are curved and they were only found on one ball, maybe you were wondering why there wasn't a picture of twenty grooved spheres.

They are handed in by miners in south africa a country famed for its love of cricket

Now whats the chances that one of the miners carved those grooves on the one sphere for a laugh. "hey look guys a petrified cricket ball"

It wasn't a suspicious similarity pointing towards a moon of saturn

IT WAS A HOAX

geddit

[Mr Ed]

You have probably upset many people marduk, misleading them and so forth...

[marduk]

You have probably upset many people marduk, misleading them and so forth...

636232[/snapback]

No change there then

allegedly

[TraJikMaJik]

Ahhh marduk.. Well I wouldnt flatter yourself with me wanting to date you lol. Just tired of logging on every day and looking at a down to earth thread, and seeing some busted ass attempt at being funny..

But Really, wernt you at 1750 posts yesterday, and now your at 1900?? Just find that a little, umm "pathetic?" Considering proably 2 of them on the subject of what is being discussed.. oh, lemee end it off with the famous cause we know that makes ur replies so much more funny.. wtf lol.

[Amalgamut]

[LordBailey]

Pardon if this is offensive, but I'll try and make a point here.

Arguing on the internet is like running in the Special Olympics, even if you win, you still lose...

[Amalgamut]

Pardon if this is offensive, but I'll try and make a point here.

Arguing on the internet is like running in the Special Olympics, even if you win, you still lose...

636680[/snapback]

Arguing on the internet is like competing in the Special Olympics, even if you win, you're still retarded.