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If Jesus was so smart


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#46    GodsMessenger

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Posted 25 June 2005 - 12:10 AM

Addendum

And personally I see the spirit of Christ in all cultures, Hindu's, Buddhists, Moral Atheists, Christians, Jews, I hear it in the Golden Rule which most if not all of the above agree with in principle\spirit.


#47    EmpressV

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Posted 25 June 2005 - 11:55 AM

QUOTE(GodsMessenger @ Jun 24 2005, 08:10 PM)
Addendum

And personally I see the spirit of Christ in all cultures, Hindu's, Buddhists, Moral Atheists, Christians, Jews, I hear it in the Golden Rule which most if not all of the above agree with in principle\spirit.

View Post


What do you mean by "moral athiests)?

WHO'S THE KNUCKLEHEAD THAT GOT ME SIDETRACKED?


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GODS ONLY EXIST IN THE MINDS OF THOSE THAT BELIEVE IN THEM

#48    GodsMessenger

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Posted 25 June 2005 - 01:51 PM

QUOTE(curiousity @ Jun 25 2005, 06:55 AM)
QUOTE(GodsMessenger @ Jun 24 2005, 08:10 PM)
Addendum

And personally I see the spirit of Christ in all cultures, Hindu's, Buddhists, Moral Atheists, Christians, Jews, I hear it in the Golden Rule which most if not all of the above agree with in principle\spirit.

View Post


What do you mean by "moral athiests)?

View Post


Well the other belief systems infer some kind of moral belief because they are connected to God or with buddhists they have some kind of teacher like Budhha.

Atheists do not have that inferred greater good to answer to, so I mention the moral part for atheists who do believe in the golden rule concept.

Because you have asked I will also say that those other groups have their "immoral" members that would coincide with immoral atheists as opposed to moral atheists.


#49    GodsMessenger

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Posted 25 June 2005 - 01:52 PM

Again I would like to take a moment to thank you for asking me to clarify what I have said instead of making some kind of accusatory statement based on what I have said.


#50    LucidElement

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Posted 26 June 2005 - 06:36 AM

good question, but if he was the Son of God, isnt he created.. all knowing?

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#51    EmpressV

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Posted 28 June 2005 - 12:25 PM

QUOTE(GodsMessenger @ Jun 25 2005, 09:51 AM)
QUOTE(curiousity @ Jun 25 2005, 06:55 AM)
QUOTE(GodsMessenger @ Jun 24 2005, 08:10 PM)
Addendum

And personally I see the spirit of Christ in all cultures, Hindu's, Buddhists, Moral Atheists, Christians, Jews, I hear it in the Golden Rule which most if not all of the above agree with in principle\spirit.

View Post


What do you mean by "moral athiests)?

View Post


Well the other belief systems infer some kind of moral belief because they are connected to God or with buddhists they have some kind of teacher like Budhha.

Atheists do not have that inferred greater good to answer to, so I mention the moral part for atheists who do believe in the golden rule concept.

Because you have asked I will also say that those other groups have their "immoral" members that would coincide with immoral atheists as opposed to moral atheists.

View Post


Moral & immoral, isn't that a self serving use of words. You say "the other belief systems" infer some kind of moral belief but christians use this inferrance as well to discribe anyone who doesn't follow the rules they set down. I know many athiests and nonbelievers who don't live by your set of rules and they are some of the best people on earth. We know the difference between whats right and wrong. We are active in our communities and are good to our fellow man. We follow the laws of the land not necessarily the so called "golden rule". As far as nonbelievers not having a greater good to answer too. Yes we do, we have ourselves to answer too.

WHO'S THE KNUCKLEHEAD THAT GOT ME SIDETRACKED?


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

GODS ONLY EXIST IN THE MINDS OF THOSE THAT BELIEVE IN THEM

#52    GodsMessenger

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Posted 28 June 2005 - 09:07 PM

QUOTE(LucidElement @ Jun 26 2005, 01:36 AM)
good question, but if he was the Son of God, isnt he created.. all knowing?

View Post



John says Jesus was "in the beginning" and was with God and was God as "The Word". But as a man, Jesus had to learn the same way we all do. His parents and his society and his life experiences and the personal revelation the the Spirit of God to Him. Just like all men. Jesus was not God , He was a man. But he had the Spirit of God in him. Like a dove I believe it said. And we also can ask that same spirit to be within us.


#53    GodsMessenger

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Posted 28 June 2005 - 09:18 PM

QUOTE(curiousity @ Jun 28 2005, 07:25 AM)
QUOTE(GodsMessenger @ Jun 25 2005, 09:51 AM)
QUOTE(curiousity @ Jun 25 2005, 06:55 AM)
QUOTE(GodsMessenger @ Jun 24 2005, 08:10 PM)
Addendum

And personally I see the spirit of Christ in all cultures, Hindu's, Buddhists, Moral Atheists, Christians, Jews, I hear it in the Golden Rule which most if not all of the above agree with in principle\spirit.

View Post


What do you mean by "moral athiests)?

View Post


Well the other belief systems infer some kind of moral belief because they are connected to God or with buddhists they have some kind of teacher like Budhha.

Atheists do not have that inferred greater good to answer to, so I mention the moral part for atheists who do believe in the golden rule concept.

Because you have asked I will also say that those other groups have their "immoral" members that would coincide with immoral atheists as opposed to moral atheists.

View Post


Moral & immoral, isn't that a self serving use of words. You say "the other belief systems" infer some kind of moral belief but christians use this inferrance as well to discribe anyone who doesn't follow the rules they set down. I know many athiests and nonbelievers who don't live by your set of rules and they are some of the best people on earth. We know the difference between whats right and wrong. We are active in our communities and are good to our fellow man. We follow the laws of the land not necessarily the so called "golden rule". As far as nonbelievers not having a greater good to answer too. Yes we do, we have ourselves to answer too.

View Post



Christian rules = 2.
Love goodness and righteousness
Love Others

How can your atheists friends be so wonderful if they do not believe in those two rules.
You yourself say your friends "know the difference between whats right and wrong." and " We are active in our communities and are good to our fellow man. We follow the laws of the land not necessarily the so called "golden rule". As far as nonbelievers not having a greater good to answer too."

What I was saying is the other groups have a "religion" that codifies this morality. A "god or buddha's" expectations of morailty to live up to.

Atheists don't have the guts to make such a code of ethics that represents what they believe in. SO you cannot say to an atheist , "You are a hypcrite for not obeying your Gods commands to do what is right and good".
Instead many athiests when challanged will reply "There is no such thing as good and evil, right and wrong, or other spiritual values like love, honesty, etc."

It gives atheists a blank check to do evil without having to answer to some greater power for it.

But the do have to answer to the same greater power of good that we all do.\

Not all atheist will admit as you have that they have a "greater good"/God,  to answer to.

God is the Spirit of Truth and Righteousness. And you are basically saying to me that atheists also answer to that God.




#54    EmpressV

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Posted 07 July 2005 - 01:35 PM

QUOTE(GodsMessenger @ Jun 28 2005, 05:18 PM)
QUOTE(curiousity @ Jun 28 2005, 07:25 AM)
QUOTE(GodsMessenger @ Jun 25 2005, 09:51 AM)
QUOTE(curiousity @ Jun 25 2005, 06:55 AM)
QUOTE(GodsMessenger @ Jun 24 2005, 08:10 PM)
Addendum

And personally I see the spirit of Christ in all cultures, Hindu's, Buddhists, Moral Atheists, Christians, Jews, I hear it in the Golden Rule which most if not all of the above agree with in principle\spirit.

View Post


What do you mean by "moral athiests)?

View Post


Well the other belief systems infer some kind of moral belief because they are connected to God or with buddhists they have some kind of teacher like Budhha.

Atheists do not have that inferred greater good to answer to, so I mention the moral part for atheists who do believe in the golden rule concept.

Because you have asked I will also say that those other groups have their "immoral" members that would coincide with immoral atheists as opposed to moral atheists.

View Post


Moral & immoral, isn't that a self serving use of words. You say "the other belief systems" infer some kind of moral belief but christians use this inferrance as well to discribe anyone who doesn't follow the rules they set down. I know many athiests and nonbelievers who don't live by your set of rules and they are some of the best people on earth. We know the difference between whats right and wrong. We are active in our communities and are good to our fellow man. We follow the laws of the land not necessarily the so called "golden rule". As far as nonbelievers not having a greater good to answer too. Yes we do, we have ourselves to answer too.

View Post



Christian rules = 2.
Love goodness and righteousness
Love Others

How can your atheists friends be so wonderful if they do not believe in those two rules.
You yourself say your friends "know the difference between whats right and wrong." and " We are active in our communities and are good to our fellow man. We follow the laws of the land not necessarily the so called "golden rule". As far as nonbelievers not having a greater good to answer too."

What I was saying is the other groups have a "religion" that codifies this morality. A "god or buddha's" expectations of morailty to live up to.

Atheists don't have the guts to make such a code of ethics that represents what they believe in. SO you cannot say to an atheist , "You are a hypcrite for not obeying your Gods commands to do what is right and good".
Instead many athiests when challanged will reply "There is no such thing as good and evil, right and wrong, or other spiritual values like love, honesty, etc."

It gives atheists a blank check to do evil without having to answer to some greater power for it.

But the do have to answer to the same greater power of good that we all do.\

Not all atheist will admit as you have that they have a "greater good"/God,  to answer to.

God is the Spirit of Truth and Righteousness. And you are basically saying to me that atheists also answer to that God.

View Post


I'm sorry I've been out of town for awhile. I'm glad I was after reading this crap. You really don't have a clue, do you? Atheist, agnostics and non believers are wonderful people and don't have the hangups that believers do. Obviously you have a bad impression of those who don't share your ideology. I don't know of too many nonbelievers who go out and do evil deeds, but there are more than a few people who say they worship your diety and use their beliefs as a get away free card. Do a little penance and your heaven bound. What a joke! People in prison use this every day in order to get an early release. Yes we do believe in good & evil, right & wrong, love & honesty. These values are not just for the god worshippers, although that is apparently what you think. The greater good is not tied to god, as you would like me to believe. I have a wonderful life filled with love for my fellow man (even christians) and I & many others know the difference between right and wrong. My suggestion to you is to get to know some nonbelievers on a personal level and not a spiritual one (if you can). You may be pleasantly surprised by the similarities you have and your attitude toward us may be less judgemental.

WHO'S THE KNUCKLEHEAD THAT GOT ME SIDETRACKED?


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

GODS ONLY EXIST IN THE MINDS OF THOSE THAT BELIEVE IN THEM

#55    EmpressV

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Posted 07 July 2005 - 03:02 PM

Messenger,
we need to get back to the subject at hand and close this one. Deal?

WHO'S THE KNUCKLEHEAD THAT GOT ME SIDETRACKED?


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GODS ONLY EXIST IN THE MINDS OF THOSE THAT BELIEVE IN THEM

#56    GodsMessenger

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Posted 07 July 2005 - 06:21 PM

[quote=curiousity,Jul 7 2005, 08:35 AM]
[quote=GodsMessenger,Jun 28 2005, 05:18 PM][quote=curiousity,Jun 28 2005, 07:25 AM][
[right]View Post[/right]
[/quote]
I'm sorry I've been out of town for awhile. I'm glad I was after reading this crap. You really don't have a clue, do you? Atheist, agnostics and non believers are wonderful people and don't have the hangups that believers do. Obviously you have a bad impression of those who don't share your ideology. I don't know of too many nonbelievers who go out and do evil deeds, but there are more than a few people who say they worship your diety and use their beliefs as a get away free card. Do a little penance and your heaven bound. What a joke! People in prison use this every day in order to get an early release. Yes we do believe in good & evil, right & wrong, love & honesty. These values are not just for the god worshippers, although that is apparently what you think. The greater good is not tied to god, as you would like me to believe. I have a wonderful life filled with love for my fellow man (even christians) and I & many others know the difference between right and wrong. My suggestion to you is to get to know some nonbelievers on a personal level and not a spiritual one (if you can). You may be pleasantly surprised by the similarities you have and your attitude toward us may be less judgemental.
[right]View Post[/right]
[/quote]

Oh you start off sounding real mature... NOT ... you call my message "crap" and say "I don't have a clue".  Then you beco0me the por calling the kettle black with your biggoted comments about believers as a whole.

Go back and read my messages and this time at least "try" to understand what I am saying.

Now to get back on track. I was saying there are GOOD atheists who claim a moral code and obey that moral code. There are BAD atheists who claim a moral but do not live by that moral code.
There are GOOD believers who claim a moral code (their God) and obey that moral code. There are BAD believers who claim a moral code but do not live by that code.

Good atheists = Good believers
Bad atheists = Bad believers.

I know atheists and jews and hindus and muslims and christians.

Their are good in each and there are bad in each.

Please read the teachings of Jesus. Does Jesus say anything at all that you cannot understand? Yes granted there may be confusion in terms of translation and interpretation, but when looked on as a whole and interpretted from that vantage, Jesus teaches "Love truth and righteousness" and "Love others". Pretty simple stuff until you have to justify not doing those things. Come up with a reason for not loving truth righteousness and others.

Jesus didn't teach anything "new" or "complicated" meaning of life.

He taught the golden rule. He taught what anyone who really wants to know the truth will know from common sense and empathy. Something too many people seem to feel the need to avoid in their rush to get what they want.


#57    sanchera1978

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Posted 07 July 2005 - 06:33 PM

i think your right on the money GM.  What he really taught was the golden rule.. To love thy nieghbor as theyself.   I think too many people regard jesus as their saviour simply becuase they believe in him. He was sent here to teach us the way (Love and Compassion)  since humanity somehow forgot how to live in peace and harmony.


#58    EmpressV

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Posted 08 July 2005 - 01:22 AM

messenger, The getting back to the subject at hand means getting back to the original post. Not your one track mind!
Oh by the way maybe you should go back over the posts yourself messenger. I'm sorry you think I'm against believers as a whole. That is not my intent.
You have refered to me many times as bigoted, not only do I take offense to that but you, yourself have made several bigoted statements in this thread. You need to look up the word BIGOT because you obviously don't know what it really means.

If you want to discuss where on earth jesus got his education and his where abouts during his teen years and early manhood, then we can talk but I'm not going to indulge you on this other topic any longer, it's boring me. sleepy.gif

WHO'S THE KNUCKLEHEAD THAT GOT ME SIDETRACKED?


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GODS ONLY EXIST IN THE MINDS OF THOSE THAT BELIEVE IN THEM

#59    Amalgamut

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Posted 08 July 2005 - 01:40 AM

QUOTE(LucidElement @ Jun 26 2005, 12:36 AM)
good question, but if he was the Son of God, isnt he created.. all knowing?

View Post


Yep, you're right.



Why tiptoe quietly through life just to arrive safely at death?

#60    Nirwana

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Posted 08 July 2005 - 02:00 AM

I also think he was all knowing, he didn't showed any math skills or anything like that cause it wasn't needed in his mission here but he would probably know anything we could ask him or do you think the son of God would be made a dumbass.. off course not imo.





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