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Noah's Ark


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#16    mr_halo

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Posted 02 September 2004 - 11:16 AM

i don't know if incest is a sin, but its pretty damn wrong  sad.gif

but yes if everything came from the original 2 animals there would be loads of defects amoung animals, and most of them would die out pretty quickly...plus if all humans originated from same 2 people then the same would go for us....

Edited by mr_halo, 02 September 2004 - 11:17 AM.

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#17    LoPar

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Posted 02 September 2004 - 12:08 PM

The flood wouldn't have destroyed all humans as I assume other people may have had their own boats.  

If the ark is ever found on some mountain we would have to assume the flood was world wide or a lot of people carried the ark up mountain.




#18    beowulf

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Posted 02 September 2004 - 12:19 PM

QUOTE
If the ark is ever found on some mountain we would have to assume the flood was world wide or a lot of people carried the ark up mountain.


I wouldn't hold my breath until it is found, after all the story was around for 2000 years before the Jews stole it and put it in their mythology.  I'm sure the Akkadians, Sumerians, and Ugarites all looked for it in their times and didn't find it either.  Someday people will learn to discern mythology from truth. whistling2.gif



#19    mr_halo

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Posted 02 September 2004 - 02:41 PM

i thought they'd already found noah's ark, it says about the discovery on the link i posted earlier in the topic....

this link.... http://www.arkdiscovery.com/noah's_ark.htm

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Edited by mr_halo, 02 September 2004 - 02:44 PM.

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#20    LoPar

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Posted 02 September 2004 - 04:52 PM

QUOTE(mr_halo @ Sep 2 2004, 11:41 AM)
i thought they'd already found noah's ark, it says about the discovery on the link i posted earlier in the topic....

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If this is the ark then the flooding was fairly extensive.  What height above sea level is the location of the 'Ark'?




#21    beowulf

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Posted 02 September 2004 - 05:49 PM

You had me going until it was disclosed that this was all discovered by Ron Wyatt in 1960.....This has been double disproved, Ron Wyatt has been shown to be charlatan (he discovered the wheels of Pharoes chariots in the Red Sea - wooden wheels would have lasted maybe 10 years against the torpedo worms of the Red Sea) and is discounted by even the most rabid Apologists.  The second thing is that in the 1960's the Soviets patrolled that area (even tho it was Turkish) and let no one in that area at all (there was a cold war going on and anyone going there had to have been a spy, as they saw it).  The pictures are a hoax and the last three expeditions (now that the Soviets are out of the picture) have not been able to find the structure shown in the photo.    Incidentally, there is no visitor's center or any of the other stuff mentioned, it is all a hoax, just as the rest of Wyatt's fantastic finds.  So the gist of the matter is that the Ark has not been found and won't, face it that is pure mythology, nothing more.   rolleyes.gif


#22    mr_halo

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Posted 02 September 2004 - 06:36 PM

oooooh a hoax, well i thought it was to good to be true, nearly made me believe in stories from the bible, grrrr religion  disgust.gif , i remember watching a program about it aswell, and they had american satelite photos of the thing.....

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#23    Velikovsky

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Posted 02 September 2004 - 06:46 PM

There is evidence for huge flooding on a worldwide level several times but never a world wide flood that literally covered everything. That's probably what inspired the original Sumerian story. There was a huge flood it did cover most of their land so once the story is told it becomes the entire world

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#24    Consummate Deist

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Posted 02 September 2004 - 06:58 PM

QUOTE
i remember watching a program about it aswell, and they had american satelite photos of the thing.....


You have to remember, Discover Channel, the History Channel, etc can't afford to make the Christians mad, they are about 50% of their viewers.  Naturally, they are gonna pussyfoot around things like this, the Exodus, and so on, even tho modern archaeology  can find no evidence of anything before the return from exile.   The photos are (according to a Christian geologist) nothing more than natural formations of basalt and that they are not uncommon (even shaped like that) worldwide.  Not my specialty, so I will take his (and the 10 other geologists that he referenced) word on the matter. wink2.gif

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#25    saltie

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Posted 21 September 2004 - 12:51 AM

Ok, lets follow some logic:

1. There are many, many stories of a flood from around the world. Many also describe and a man and a big boat.

2. These stories must come from somewhere

3. Chances are, there was a flood that devastated the world, and a man built a big boat and put animals on it.

Also, you could fit an animal as big as, say, a dinosaur, if you don't bring the biggest one out there. Bring a baby. And, if you happen to read the Bible, you don't bring german sheperds and poodles and labs and beagles. You bring two dogs-probably a type of wolf. And you also don't need to bring aquatic animals-fish, whales, dolphins, obviously. This brings the number of animals down greatly.



#26    aquatus1

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Posted 21 September 2004 - 02:40 AM

QUOTE
Ok, lets follow some logic:

1. There are many, many stories of a flood from around the world. Many also describe and a man and a big boat.

2. These stories must come from somewhere

3. Chances are, there was a flood that devastated the world, and a man built a big boat and put animals on it.


Let's try this logic:

1)  Floods are the single most common environmental disaster through-out history.

2)  The only cultures that describe the ark scenario are from the Mediterranean region.

3)  Societies around the world have differing stories, such as climbing mountains or building dams.

4)  Therefore, in seperate floods, a man built a boat, in another, they built a dam, and in another, they climbed a mountain.

I would seem more logical to conclude that an event that has occured and continues to occur through the world is responsible for these stories, rather than one single event that has never been shown to have occured, and indeed has left none of the physical signs it would inevitably leave if it had occured.


#27    bloodmoon

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Posted 21 September 2004 - 10:06 AM

QUOTE(saltie @ Sep 21 2004, 01:51 AM)
Also, you could fit an animal as big as, say, a dinosaur, if you don't bring the biggest one out there. Bring a baby. And, if you happen to read the Bible, you don't bring german sheperds and poodles and labs and beagles. You bring two dogs-probably a type of wolf. And you also don't need to bring aquatic animals-fish, whales, dolphins, obviously. This brings the number of animals down greatly.

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not so true, salt water fish would survive, not fresh water fish, which would be a big problem, meaning he would have to catch 2 of every fresh water fish,
its hard enough to catch enough to eat let alone a male and female of every species

or since it was rain, then it would have lowered the salinity of the oceans killing alot of sat water fish, but either way it dosnt look so likely

Edited by bloodmoon, 21 September 2004 - 10:09 AM.

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#28    Wiking

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Posted 21 September 2004 - 02:07 PM

Here is a link to a website that goes over the different opinions about where the Ark rests.  The search for the Ark is turns out to be a very interesting Indiana Jones type adventure.

http://www.noahsarksearch.com/index.htm

Pulling from my memory there is some decent evidence that something large is atop Mt.  Ararat.  Many witness accounts of seeing something and some good photographic and satellite images.  The last I heard Turkey has shut down all travel and exploration on Ararat due to the closeness of border with Iran  I also remember reading somewhere that rebels/militia use a large wooden structure atop Ararat as a hide-out.  

There are those of the opinion that the Ark is that boat shaped impression that is some distance from the Ararat.  (I saw the picture of this posted earlier on this thread)  There are some unusual metal readings when test were completed on that site.  An interesting looking formation there, but I don't believe that to be the resting place of the Ark.

And, some yet think that the Ark is in a whole different mountain range than that of where Ararat is located.  There is some debate as to the translation of the original wording.  Mt. Cudi a bit south of Ararat is the location some believe.

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#29    tupac amaru

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Posted 21 September 2004 - 05:16 PM

There is also the problem of where the water came from, Creationists have 3 main theories, none of which hold water - the Vapor Canopy (this one would raise the temperature of the world to about 2000 degrees Fareheit), the Tectonic Plate movements (fountains of the deep which would cause the plates to move at several feet per hour also raising the temperature of the world to over 2000 degrees fareheit) and the Combination (takes part of both of the previous and would raise the temperature to about 4000 degrees fahrehiet).  Of course then the good Christian says, "Well, God changed the natural laws to allow it to happen."  This takes the discussion out of science into "la la land" and ends the discussion.  Think of this, why would God go to all that trouble to get rid of the evil people, when all he had to do was tailor a germ to be a 100% fatal (to humans only) plague, release it to exterminate mankind and then tinker with the genes of Noah and his family to make them immune to the plague?  A god that had to rest after only 6 days of work would find that the easy way.  So why didn't he do it that way?  The answer is that the primitives writing the bible knew nothing about germs or genes, so they couldn't include them in their made-up story. rolleyes.gif

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#30    aquatus1

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Posted 21 September 2004 - 07:42 PM

Exactly.  The flood was used because that was the closest thing the ancients had to a world-ending cataclysm.  Nowadays, we use asteroids or giant comets when we want a good armageddon story (pun intended).





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