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Beget, Begat, Begot - Help needed please


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#1    GIZZIE

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Posted 25 February 2002 - 11:58 PM

My next post concerns something written in the Old Testament in the Bible.  It is has nothing to do with religion or even belief; It just happens to be something I spotted a long time ago, questioned, and to date have never had a satisfactory reply (even from the most devout). It is a niggling little mystery that I would like solved or at the very least, opinons on.  Because of it, I renounced a religion.

Before I make this post however, I need some help from superior knowledge:

When was the Old Testament written? Approx will do
Confirm at least 2 BC and BB (before Bible) developed races and if poss, their religions/beliefs.
Was it written in Hebrew originally?

I think this will give me the info necessary to post the question.

Many thanks in advance and I hope the eventual post will be an interesting one for all

Swallows are the dolphins of the sky

#2    Homer

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Posted 26 February 2002 - 03:03 AM

GIZZIE,
The Old Testament consists of many different books, written by many different people, over periods of hundreds of years.

Nobody knows with absolute certainly when it started, but it is widely believed that Moses wrote the the first book, Genesis, approximately 1400 BC.

I think, but don't quote me on this, that it was first written in Hebrew, however, the word genesis actually originated from Greece.

At the time Genesis was written, the Egyptians and Americans Israelites were advanced nations, speaking Egyptian and Hebrew respectively. The Egyptian religion was a strange mixture of pantheism and animal worship, while the Israelites worshipped the God who ordered the creation of the Old Testament in question.

I hope this helps a little

אַ֭תָּה אֱלֹהֵ֣י יִשְׁעִ֑י

#3    Mr-X

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Posted 26 February 2002 - 07:59 AM

According to Jewish and christian tradition the Old Testament was written by Moses. However the books themselves do not say Moses was the author. Some scholars actually suggest that the law began as oral literature and was written down following the reign of King David- that is after 1000 B.C.

Many people have studied the Old Testament and have noted differences in vocabulary, style, the names for God, and the idea of God. Scholars actually believe that several persons or groups wrote the law. They suggest that four versions actually existed. These versions are written over a period of of at least 500 years and were combined by a number of editors.

The Authors of the writings are unknown. However scholars believe that there books of the prophets. They partly reflect the way the prophets words were remembered and honoured long after their death.

The words of later generations are mixed with those of the prophets, either as an explanation or as actual changes in what the prophets said. However several books are said to have been written by such ancient leaders as daniel and Solomon.

Now, just for some extra knowledge did you know that the reason the New Testament was written in the Hellenic language was because the Greek language was so diverse in those days, (like English) it was the only way in which they could preach JC's words.


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Oh, you should never doubt what no one is sure about.
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#4    dalia

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Posted 26 February 2002 - 06:42 PM

Gizzie,

I don't have anything that wasn't covered in the above posts. However, I'm looking forward to your 'question' post.  

Dalia  :sk

Purrr-fectly happy

#5    GIZZIE

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Posted 26 February 2002 - 07:16 PM

Many thanks for the information so speedily sent:
O.K. 4 last questions and I hope to post a little later (I hope nobody will be disappointed)

Am I correct in saying that the Book of Genesis is believed/accepted to have been dictated by God to Moses? Moses was the author in any case.
Am I correct in that Adam and Eve were the first and only 2 human beings created by God, and living in Paradise, according to the Book of Genesis?
Am I correct in saying that God said He was/is a jealous God in reference to worship of other Gods?
Lastly continuing the above, is there a reference in the Bible to God being the God of all Gods?

I think thats it!

PS. Odin the Supreme I read your post, looked the subject up in a dictionary and couldn't find it!! Whilst I would love to help you, I'm afraid I remain ignorant!! I therefore bow to your Supremacy.

Swallows are the dolphins of the sky

#6    Homer

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Posted 26 February 2002 - 08:03 PM

GIZZIE,

It is widely believed that God instructed Moses to write the book, and that Moses is the author.

According to the King James Version of the Holy Bible, which is the only one I'm familiar with, God made other people besides Adam and Eve.

Yes God stated He was jealous God

There are referances about God being the God of all gods

אַ֭תָּה אֱלֹהֵ֣י יִשְׁעִ֑י

#7    Sheff_Pud

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Posted 26 February 2002 - 10:38 PM

:sk GOSH can't wait for the next chapter (and verse) in this saga.
My breath is bated... :o

Surgeons must be very carefulWhen they take the knife!Underneath their fine incisionsStirs the Culprit -- Life!                            (Emily Dickinson)

#8    PurpleStuart

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Posted 26 February 2002 - 11:26 PM

Sheff  - they never did write the sequel "Bible the later years"  ;D :P

never take me too seriously

#9    GIZZIE

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Posted 27 February 2002 - 12:12 AM

It would be nice to have a Happy Ending though wouldn't it?

Am still working on the research however but.........as a little 'whistle whetter"...............................If God is a jealous God, then He can't be perfect can He?  If He is a jealous God, then He admits to the existence of other Gods.  He is referred to as the God of Gods and if He is the God of Gods, then surely He shouldn't be jealous.....?

Something thrown in for free - I read the other night an 'article' ,which must have taken the author one helluva time to write, in which Prince Charles is down as the Anti Christ.  The relevant passages from the Book of Revelations are all there plus, the author's interpretation.  If nothing else it's a fascinating read!!

Swallows are the dolphins of the sky

#10    Sheff_Pud

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Posted 27 February 2002 - 12:54 AM

:sf I always thought there was something strange, but unnervingly attractive, about our Charlie.  :sg
I get the point though Gizzie- the Big Book is full of contradictions e.g. Jesus says "suffer the little children...etc." while Proverbs tells us to beat the living daylights out of them for the slightest thing.  ???

Surgeons must be very carefulWhen they take the knife!Underneath their fine incisionsStirs the Culprit -- Life!                            (Emily Dickinson)

#11    PurpleStuart

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Posted 27 February 2002 - 01:32 AM

Well as i see it the old and new testaments are completely different animals written at different times for different purposes. Before i go on i will say that what i'm about to say is my opinion and i in no way mean to demean any other's religious belief.

The old testament was written over a great many years by different authors (as said above) and it in the main portrays god as vengeful putting the "fear of god" into people. This god destroyed angels for singing one note out of tune etc. This was not a god that appealed to the romans and so the New testament (written like an early PR campaign) was written for their ears. A lot of it was borrowed from earlier gods which the Romans already worshipped (Mithras), but it's purpose was purely to convert the romans.

never take me too seriously

#12    Homer

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Posted 27 February 2002 - 01:48 AM

GIZZIE,
There can be some very interesting and objective questions that can come from the Bible. Can this post you're thinking about be stated in a way as to not have someone feel they should defend their belief?

There was a thread last year click here that got a little out of hand. You might want to skim through it before posting something related to the Bible.

[glow=blue,2,300]Homer :sj

אַ֭תָּה אֱלֹהֵ֣י יִשְׁעִ֑י

#13    GIZZIE

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Posted 27 February 2002 - 01:42 PM

Homer

Oh Boy, I see what you mean; it certainly did turn nasty didn't it?
I don't think what I am going to post will offend or challenge anyone's beliefs; Incidentally with regard to defending one's faith - I will NEVER defend my faith. Why? - it is mine, personal, belongs to me and therefore can NEVER be taken away from me. Only I can alter it. Like God, it cannot be touched or seen, but I know it's there.
If anyone is offended by the eventual post then it is their choice, if they disagree, that's fine.  But let's get it straight and understood from the start I am neither questioning the validitity of the Bible nor am I pushing my faith onto anyone .  I am going to ask a question or 3 and hopefully, receive some interesting and thoughtful replies which will help me in trying to understand what I consider to be an unexplained mystery - That's all!

Swallows are the dolphins of the sky

#14    Loonboy

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Posted 27 February 2002 - 09:17 PM

[blue]In my opinion the Old Testament was indeed written by a number of different authors over a prolonged period of time. I believe that the New Testament was indeed about a person who actually lived and breathed in Nazareth/Jerusalem/Bethlehem etc.

I do however believe that both works have been tampered with, excised and generally rewritten in part to serve one purpose or another, which is why there are contradictions and oddities.

The main question for modern cultures really is to ask themselves: which of this information am I going to believe as truth and which of this information am I going to believe as less than truth? I don't think that anyone can doubt that most of the guidance and examples of behaviour have and will continue to influence society in a generally good way, but belief/disbelief is always a personal choice.

Are you going to throw the baby out with the bathwater?
[/blue]


Do what you want and be what you feel. Because after all, those who mind don't matter, and those who matter don't 'mind.

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The soul would have no rainbow if the eyes had no tears. Minquass


#15    Homer

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Posted 27 February 2002 - 09:30 PM

I don't believe there are contradictions in the King James Version. I feel that what one considers to be a contradiction is really a misunderstanding of scripture. Again, this is just what I believe.

אַ֭תָּה אֱלֹהֵ֣י יִשְׁעִ֑י




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