285 replies to this topic

[TheEssenceofExcellence]

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This account shows, man before any beasts.

NO!  Once again someone is Misinterpreting the Bible!  READ THE STUFF BEFORE THAT PLEASE!!!  I'm sorry, I don't want to come off as being angry or anything, i'm just frustrated that people read one paragraph and jump to a conclusion.  Zanadore you have to read the stuff right before the piece of text you quoted....

Look, God made the Earth to his liking.....then he created all the animals in the sea and the fowls to be in the air, and he created all the creeping things and cattle and so forth.....  Then he created man.  After he created man, he took a piece of land and made a Garden there (inside Eden), then he put the man in the garden.  Now at that point there aren't any animals in the garden.  When God saw that man was all alone in the garden he decided to put some animals in there so he wouldn't be lonely.  Once he decided to do that, he created all the beasts of the field (that were already in existence else where, he made more of them) and put them in the Garden with Adam.  Once God did that, he noticed that all the animals had mates but Adam did not, that's when he created Eve.

Here's a quick few quotes:

Genesis Chp. 1 Verse 1:  In the beginning God created the Heaven and the Earth.

(Light; separates light from darkness; day; night)

Genesis Chp. 1 Verse 6:  And God said let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters.

(dry land appears; land called Earth; waters called seas)

Genesis Chp. 1 Verse 11:  And God said, let the Earth bring forth grass and herb yielding seed, and the fruit tree yielding fruit after his kind, whose seed is in itself upon the earth: and it was so.

(stars; sun; moon)

Genesis Chp. 1 Verse 20:  And God said, Let the waters bring forth abundantly the moving creature that hath life, and fowl that may fly above the earth in open firmament of heaven.

Genesis Chp. 1 Verse 21:  And God created great whales, and every living creature that moveth, which the waters brought forth abundantly, after their kind, and every winged fowl after his kind: and God saw it was good.

(God blessed them saying be fruitful and multiply)

Genesis Chp. 1 Verse 24:  And God said, let the earth bring forth the living creature after his kind, cattle and creeping thing, and beast of the earth after his kind: and it was so.

Genesis Chp. 1 Verse 26:  And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

(so God created man; then God created the garden in Eden)

Genesis Chp. 2 Verse 8:  And God planted a garden eastward in Eden: and there he put man whom he had formed.

Genesis Chp. 2 Verse 15:  And the Lord God took the man, and put him into the garden of Eden to dress it and to keep it.

(don't eat of that one tree)

Genesis Chp. 2 Verse 19:  And out of the ground the Lord God formed every beast of the field, and every fowl of the air; and brought them unto Adam to see what he would call them: and whatsoever Adam called every living creature, that was the name thereof.

(Until then the animals existed but weren't named, and there wasn't any of them in the Garden; but afterwards more were made and brought into the garden so Adam would have company and could name them)

(Then God made Eve, ect.....)

So you see God created all the animals and beasts before he created man.

[zandore]

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I don't know when where you got the information that jesus would come back in our lifetime...that is imposssible...he said he would come back at the end of time....maybe as you said, the scripture you read were twisted by tongue...

Jesus was quoted saying that he would come back within a generation.....That means 2,000 years ago.

[frogfish]

how owuld generation be defined as 2000 years....its undefined...
Plus, its doesn't say that in the catholic, Lutheran, and Protestant Bibles

[draconic chronicler]

Frogfish, I'm sure Zandore didn't mean the generation lasted 2000 years, he meant the generation Jesus referred to was "over" 2000 years ago (actually 1900).
I believe the several references of Jesus coming back in the lifetime of his disciples are still to be found in most bibles, but simply overlooked, or confused with his brief time with them after the resseurection, though this wasn't what was meant in the scriptures.

When Jesus didn't come back then, everyone thought it would be in 1000 AD, and with him, great dragons to devour the wicked, as revelation implies.  The pope of that time was made a Saint for supposedly chaining the dragon(s), and thus staving off the end of the world.  Not that I don't think its a neat idea, but the Revelation dragons that will destroy one third of mankind, is also copied from zorastrian texts that say exactly the same thing, just like the bit about Satan wrapped in chains and cast into an abyss for 1000 years..... the only difference is that their bad dragon is named Ahriman instead. This was all written down hundreds of years before St. John copied them for his book.    Revelation is not a future prophecy, it is very clearly written that  those events were to happen by 100 AD at the latest, and of course they didn't.  But how could they, if it was all just a rip-off and compilation of the stories of all the popular pagan religons of the time?  You don't have to be stupid to believe in Jesus, just stupid to believe in false prophecies copied directly from pagan religions that should have never been included in the New Testament.  The Apocolypse of Baruch, is a lot more intelligent than the Apocolypse of st John (also known as Revelation.)  If you must have an apocolypse, go with that one instead. It used to be in many Bibles.

Edited by draconic chronicler, 19 October 2005 - 10:47 PM.

[fallingalien]

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then why havent any bones of humans been found in the same strata layer?

dinosaurs were differernt, and BIGGAR!! plus, carbon dating or whatever you call it isn't really a good way to see how old something is, because it has been WAY off many many times.

[frogfish]

"dinosaurs were differernt, and BIGGAR!! " That doesn't metter, use common sense.
"plus, carbon dating or whatever you call it isn't really a good way to see how old something is, because it has been WAY off many many times. What are you talking about? It is the most reliable way of dating...do some research before you state something.

[DemonWatcher]

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DW, It will be available soon both as a book or e-book, and available through Amazon on-line, or the mainstream bookstores.  I will announce it here when its available.  Some things are a bit to controversial for the publisher and have to be ironed out, as well as the title.  I will probably sell them myself, possibly a special version  containing the "forbidden chapters" if it comes to that.  There will be a related website with forum, etc related to the book and biblical dragons, historical sightings, etc, but NOT the modern, nonsensical dragon BS invented by fantasy writers over the past 30 years.

cool i will keep my eyes open, many thanx.

[zandore]

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I don't know when where you got the information that jesus would come back in our lifetime...that is imposssible...he said he would come back at the end of time....maybe as you said, the scripture you read were twisted by tongue...

Here Frog is a post of Mako's that will set you straight on that misconception you have.

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Here are the various reports of Jesus’ prophecies about the Second Coming:

Matthew
16:27 For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works.
16:28 Verily I say unto you, There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom.
24:30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.
24:31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.
24:32 Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When his branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is nigh:
24:33 So likewise ye, when ye shall see all these things, know that it is near, even at the doors.
24:34 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled.
26:62 And the high priest arose, and said unto him, Answerest thou nothing? what is it which these witness against thee?
26:63 But Jesus held his peace, And the high priest answered and said unto him, I adjure thee by the living God, that thou tell us whether thou be the Christ, the Son of God.
26:64 Jesus saith unto him, Thou hast said: nevertheless I say unto you, Hereafter shall ye see the Son of man sitting on the right hand of power, and coming in the clouds of heaven.
26:65 Then the high priest rent his clothes, saying, He hath spoken blasphemy; what further need have we of witnesses? behold, now ye have heard his blasphemy.

Mark
9:1 And he said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That there be some of them that stand here, which shall not taste of death, till they have seen the kingdom of God come with power.
13:24 But in those days, after that tribulation, the sun shall be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light,
13:25 And the stars of heaven shall fall, and the powers that are in heaven shall be shaken.
13:26 And then shall they see the Son of man coming in the clouds with great power and glory.
13:27 And then shall he send his angels, and shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from the uttermost part of the earth to the uttermost part of heaven.
13:28 Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When her branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is near:
13:29 So ye in like manner, when ye shall see these things come to pass, know that it is nigh, even at the doors.
13:30 Verily I say unto you, that this generation shall not pass, till all these things be done.
14:60 And the high priest stood up in the midst, and asked Jesus, saying, Answerest thou nothing? what is it which these witness against thee?
14:61 But he held his peace, and answered nothing. Again the high priest asked him, and said unto him, Art thou the Christ, the Son of the Blessed?
14:62 And Jesus said, I am: and ye shall see the Son of man sitting on the right hand of power, and coming in the clouds of heaven.
14:63 Then the high priest rent his clothes, and saith, What need we any further witnesses?
14:64 Ye have heard the blasphemy: what think ye? And they all condemned him to be guilty of death.

Luke
9:27 But I tell you of a truth, there be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the kingdom of God.
21:27 And then shall they see the Son of man coming in a cloud with power and great glory.
21:28 And when these things begin to come to pass, then look up, and lift up your heads; for your redemption draweth nigh.
21:29 And he spake to them a parable; Behold the fig tree, and all the trees;
21:30 When they now shoot forth, ye see and know of your own selves that summer is now nigh at hand.
21:31 So likewise ye, when ye see these things come to pass, know ye that the kingdom of God is nigh at hand.
21:32 Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass away, till all be fulfilled.

John
21:21 Peter seeing him saith to Jesus, Lord, and what shall this man do?
21:22 Jesus saith unto him, If I will that he tarry till I come, what is that to thee? follow thou me.

As you can see, nowhere is it implied that the generation being spoken of is any generation other that the one alive at that time.  In fact Mark 9:1 and Luke 9:27 are very specific about some of those standing there not dying ‘til the Kingdom of God comes (after the second coming).  Your Jesus make an untrue prophesy and is therefore a false prophet and was liable to be stoned to death.  

If you have anymore questions of a religious nature just search the religious threads on PM me.

[zandore]

NO! Once again someone is Misinterpreting the Bible! READ THE STUFF BEFORE THAT PLEASE!!! I'm sorry, I don't want to come off as being angry or anything, i'm just frustrated that people read one paragraph and jump to a conclusion. Zanadore you have to read the stuff right before the piece of text you quoted....

If you want to debate Bible contradictions this is the wrong section for that.

Genesis 2
5)And every plant of the field before it was in the earth, and every herb of the field before it grew: for the LORD God had not caused it to rain upon the earth, and there was not a man to till the ground.
6)But there went up a mist from the earth, and watered the whole face of the ground.
7)And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul

May I suggest you take and use your own advice:

.....you have to read the stuff right before the piece of text you quoted....

I did not jump to any conclusions. This is just one of many (as I said) contradictions that are in the Christian Bible.

Edited by zandore, 20 October 2005 - 01:48 PM.

[draconic chronicler]

Thanks Zandore,
I don't know how to cut or paste from other sections, but told them where they could find that info.

[TheEssenceofExcellence]

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If you want to debate Bible contradictions this is the wrong section for that.

Genesis 2
5)And every plant of the field before it was in the earth, and every herb of the field before it grew: for the LORD God had not caused it to rain upon the earth, and there was not a man to till the ground.
6)But there went up a mist from the earth, and watered the whole face of the ground.
7)And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul

May I suggest you take and use your own advice:

I did not jump to any conclusions. This is just one of many (as I said) contradictions that are in the Christian Bible.

Maybe if you didn't post it to begin with, I wouldn't debate it.  Technically I wasn't debating, I just showed you what it was really talking about.

It's not a contradiction, you just don't know what your reading as usual.

[draconic chronicler]

Essence, Frogfish, To get a littler closer to the original topic, have either of you looked up the original Hebrew that proves that the Seraphim servants of the bible are not mutant, swan-winged humans, but instead, are clearly meant to be a kind of winged reptilian creature with "fiery" attributes (like the "dragons" that appear in nearly every human culture)?

Though many may regard dragons, like a creator/God entity as a complete fantasy, this is relevent to the discussion in that it contradicts the notion that the "dragons" mentioned in the Bible AFTER the initial creation story are simply dinosaurs that survived extinction, for which there is absolutely no scientific evidence.  And both essence and frogfish, since you seem to be  Christians, and are familiar with dinosaurs and presumably the "scientific" dating of these creatures, what is your explanation of all the "dragons" mentioned in the Bible, after the Creation story, coexisting,( and sometimes eating) humans?  And remember, it is unlikely they are supposed to be "evil" devils and demons, because in Psalms (just one example), the dragons sing praises to God, and God rides upon their backs, their mightly wings creating the wind.  Not to mention several accounts of them residing in Heaven when not on missions of heavenly, fire and brimstone retribution.

And finally (going back off-topic), how can you still dispute the fact that "Revelations" was intended to happen in the same generation Jesus' apostles lived, as the overwhelming scriptual evidence provide by Mako and Zandore straight out of the Bible prove?  (But there is a theory in my book that God may indeed unleash the "fake apocolypse" invented by St. John, simply to punish the ignorant Christians of today for the sacrilege and blasphemy of believing in such a false scripture, so much of which was clearly copied from the theologies of pagan religions.

Edited by draconic chronicler, 21 October 2005 - 12:00 PM.

[Lord Umbarger]

All these people quoting from the bible. One question, not to be a wiseass but, how many of you read Hebrew? If you're quoting from anything other than the original sourse, (in the case of the New Testement),you are trusting the skills and honesty of dubious charachters from a time when the known world was ruled by the church. As we all know, when Christianity ruled the world it was called the Dark ages. Sorry, not trying to ruffle any feathers. Maybe my post should have been a Poll Question?
As for the "Old" Testement, I don't know what those guys  were seeing/hearing. I think that its's a great read, but, I don't try to understand too much of it. It'll run you crazy.
Bible, dinosaurs, what more could I aask for!

[zandore]

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Thanks Zandore,
I don't know how to cut or paste from other sections, but told them where they could find that info.

Have two windows open when you cut and paste/drag and drop or as I did with that post just click the quote button then go to the thread you want to quote it in and do what you want/need to do.

[Essan]

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dinosaurs were differernt, and BIGGAR!! plus, carbon dating or whatever you call it isn't really a good way to see how old something is, because it has been WAY off many many times.

Most dinosaurs, were smaller than humans.  This includes velociraptors which weren't much bigger than a turkey, despite what Spielberg would prefer you to believe.