Jump to content




Welcome to Unexplained Mysteries! Please sign in or create an account to start posting and to access a host of extra features.


Iran-diplomacy or war?


  • This topic is locked This topic is locked
10 replies to this topic

#1    AztecInca

AztecInca

    Martian

  • Member
  • 9,013 posts
  • Joined:13 Apr 2004
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Australia

  • All it takes for evil to triumph, is for good people to do nothing.

Posted 07 May 2006 - 11:38 AM

Debate Topic: Will the current crisis with Iran and its uranium enrichment program be solved through diplomatic efforts or through military action?

We are looking for two participants. One to debate that this issue can only be solved by diplomatic efforts and another to debate that this issue will only be resolved through military action.

This will be a 1v1 formal debate.
An Introduction, 5 bodily posts and a conclusion from each participant. No Flaming, bad manners or profantities will be tolerated.

Please be aware that:

There is a point deduction for debaters who fail to make a post within the 7 day time frame. The deductions will be 2 points for every day the participant fails to post after the 7 days.

This is to ensure that debates continue in a timely fashion. If for any reason you cannot post within the 7 days, please ensure that you let myself or Tiddlyjen know to avoid having the points taken off your debate.

If, however the participant does not then attempt to make a post for up to 2 weeks after the 7 day rule has started an immediate disqualification will occur.

Aztec.

Edited by AztecInca, 25 June 2006 - 06:55 AM.


#2    robbieb

robbieb

    Astral Projection

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 687 posts
  • Joined:12 Apr 2006

Posted 07 May 2006 - 04:05 PM

ill go for pro military action if you would like


#3    WarriorVisions

WarriorVisions

    Ectoplasmic Residue

  • Member
  • Pip
  • 140 posts
  • Joined:23 May 2006
  • Location:Indiana

  • It is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring. -Carl Sagan

Posted 23 May 2006 - 04:57 PM

I am interested in taking the diplomacy side.


#4    AztecInca

AztecInca

    Martian

  • Member
  • 9,013 posts
  • Joined:13 Apr 2004
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Australia

  • All it takes for evil to triumph, is for good people to do nothing.

Posted 24 May 2006 - 09:50 AM

Death Star III you are already invloved in a significant amount of debates currently and allowing you to compete in yet another would be unfair to yourself and others.

robbieb will be debating that this crisis canonly be resolved through military action while WarriorVisions will be debating that this crisis can only be solved through diplomatic efforts.

The debate guidlines are outlined in the first post of this thread. If you have any questions or problems please contact either myself of tiddlyjen via a pm.

Good Luck! thumbsup.gif

Edited by AztecInca, 24 May 2006 - 09:51 AM.


#5    WarriorVisions

WarriorVisions

    Ectoplasmic Residue

  • Member
  • Pip
  • 140 posts
  • Joined:23 May 2006
  • Location:Indiana

  • It is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring. -Carl Sagan

Posted 24 May 2006 - 12:10 PM

Introduction

Imagine, if you will, a roomful of century-old dynamite.  At the time the explosive was manufactured, dynamite still required inordinately careful handling and environmental controls.  As our dynamite has aged, the nitro-glycerin has sweated to the surface of the stick, making the entire volatile to even walk into, much less begin picking up crates and moving them.

As a smoker, I tend to light up when I am agitated, nervous, or stressed.  Being in such a room, especially if I am forced to be there from outside pressures, would be just the kind of stressful situation which would make me want to have a smoke.

Yet, prudence would immediately deem this not only inappropriate but downright foolish.

In much the same way, America has stepped into a room full to the ceiling of old dynamite, carelessly stored and improperly handled for years.  There have been fires in the room only contained at the last minute or which are still being fought in an effort to keep the whole room from exploding.

America also has a habit of "smoking" when it feels stress.  While the origins of the habit are clear in the militaristic beginnings of the country, it nonetheless remains a habit which could greatly affect American presence in this room of explosives known as the Middle East.

In the coming posts, I will argue American presence in the Middle East remains a necessary burden but that intelligent cautions and handling of the elements involved are essential to not only our future survival as a country but the world as a whole is dependant upon us to diffuse tensions and contain fires we have already been a part of starting.  Specifically, Iran's nuclear ambitions and the American response could tip the balance between uncontrollable chaos spilling out from the region and at least a modicum of stability achieved among the various interested factions.

America must decide whether the use of military force or diplomatic negotiation is the best manner in which to handle a stick of aged dynamite laying so close to other crates of the same.


#6    robbieb

robbieb

    Astral Projection

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 687 posts
  • Joined:12 Apr 2006

Posted 25 May 2006 - 02:04 AM

Introduction


Did you ever go into a store with a 4 year old and you are walking. Suddenly he turns his head and grabs a toy. He is not allowed to have the toy because he is being punished and you tell him he can not have it and he needs to put it back but he says “NO” and again you ask him to please put it down and again he says “NOOOOOO!” and suddenly the whole store is looking at you as this 4 year old is throwing a fit in the middle of the store over a toy he cannot have. So you do the only logical thing, you take it form him.

Iran is a bad 4 year old it has a toy a very dangerous one and we: America, France, England, and all others who promote safety for the world, have to take it form them.

We have asked nicely and they threw a temper tantrum and told us they will not talk about it anymore.

In my following posts I will explain to you how using military force will be the only way to deal with this rebellious country. As any parent, sibling, or anyone who deals with children will tell you will understand the clear path that has to be taken. America has the strongest military and I believe that only by utilizing its superiority now before Iran has full capability to launch a nuke at a country will be the proper course of action. Just like taking the toy away before a temper tantrum erupts and everyone starts looking at us to do something.



#7    WarriorVisions

WarriorVisions

    Ectoplasmic Residue

  • Member
  • Pip
  • 140 posts
  • Joined:23 May 2006
  • Location:Indiana

  • It is far better to grasp the Universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring. -Carl Sagan

Posted 25 May 2006 - 12:56 PM

Post #1

In my introduction, I compared the current Middle East to a room full of aged dynamite.  There is perhaps no other place on the planet where ancient tensions still run so deeply.  Sitting at the cradle of humanity, this area of the world has produced the three biggest religions, been the scene of nearly constant war between adherents of those religions, and also has the largest deposits of oil.

The religion and the oil are the only factors in why America would even have any interest in the region.  Were it not for our support of Israel and our ever-increasing demand for oil, it would be absurd to be so intimately tied up in an portion of the world which is openly hostile to nearly all other countries.

Yet, America is not the only country bogged down there for these reasons.  Most other nations also have an interest in the religious and energy aspects of what Iran and its neighbors represent.

Thus, threats made by the Iranian president combined with the country's stated desires for nuclear weapons make this a world problem instead of just an American one.  American influence can and will determine the course the world takes, but our credibility is already badly damaged by the last time we intervened in the area.

As we learned in the Iraqi debacle, the various factions working toward their own goals makes military intervention not only problematic in a logistic sense, but heightens the tensions rather than alleviating them.

In searching for answer to Iran's saber-rattling, we must look to history to see what has worked before and what hasn't.  Military intervention might address and American arrogance of being the world's protector, but it hasn't actually solved any problems so far and, in fact, created new ones to be addressed.

Conversely, diplomatic maneuvers, world sanctions, and a unified world response has definitely been shown to work in two very notable examples: Iraq and Libya.

Prior to our current invasion of Iraq, the country was economically in peril.  Crippling sanctions had neutralized and de-fanged Iraqi military capability and Saddam Hussein was unable to acquire the WMD he was known to have sought.  So too with Libya, sanctions and behind-the-scenes negotiations resulted in a public declaration of abandonment in seeking nuclear weapons.


#8    AztecInca

AztecInca

    Martian

  • Member
  • 9,013 posts
  • Joined:13 Apr 2004
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Australia

  • All it takes for evil to triumph, is for good people to do nothing.

Posted 05 June 2006 - 11:24 AM

robbieb the 7-day time limit for you to post has well and trully passed. If you are unable to post please let either myself or tiddlyjen know via a pm. If this is not done point deductions will occur and eventually disqualification will result.

Edit: I have spoken with robbieb and he will be posting as soon as possible. thumbsup.gif

Edited by AztecInca, 07 June 2006 - 06:19 AM.


#9    robbieb

robbieb

    Astral Projection

  • Member
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 687 posts
  • Joined:12 Apr 2006

Posted 08 June 2006 - 02:23 AM

Ah yes Iran. Iran is a country based on lies and hatred. Everyday they have chants in the street American flags are burned and “death to America” is chanted. Lovely as it is these are all signs of a country that will not negotiate peacefully.

Have you ever tried talking to someone who dislikes you and ask them for a favor and have them say, “yea no problem.” Ha if only life were that easy, but it is not and we must look at it that way.

The more time we give Iran in dealing with this the more time Iran has to further develop there weapon, and then what? When they finally have a nuclear war head will they say no more and what will we do then? For Iran has stated numerous times that they hate Israel just as much as they hate us.

For Iran to threaten a most loyal and strong ally as Israel is without a doubt an atrocity itself.

As a Martial artist there are 8 codes along with a creed that are set for me to live by as a black belt:

A person's heart is the same as heaven and earth.

The blood circulating is similar to the moon and sun.

A manner of drinking and spitting is either hard or soft.

A person's unbalance is the same as a weight.

The body should be able to change directions at any time.

The time to strike is when opportunity presents itself.

The eyes must see in all directions.

The ear must listen in all directions.


And a Creed to live by as well:

I come to you with only karate, empty hands.
I have no weapons, but should I be forced
to defend myself, my honor, or my principals,
Should it be a matter of life or death, of right or wrong,

Then here are my weapons,
My empty hands.

From these teaching I know that the proper time to strike is hen it presents itself and to strike when honor, life, and goodness are at stake.
We are kidding ourselves if we think Iran is willing to negotiate peacefully. Iran is simply biding there time with these talks and then saying no talks and then they will talk but not to America. Simple games they are playing and America needs to say no more games put the toys away you are done.



#10    AztecInca

AztecInca

    Martian

  • Member
  • 9,013 posts
  • Joined:13 Apr 2004
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Australia

  • All it takes for evil to triumph, is for good people to do nothing.

Posted 15 June 2006 - 02:31 AM

WarriorVisions the 7 day time-limit for you to post is about to pass. Please pm either myself or tiddlyjen if you are having any problems posting or you require an extension. If you do not do so, point deductions will result.


#11    AztecInca

AztecInca

    Martian

  • Member
  • 9,013 posts
  • Joined:13 Apr 2004
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Australia

  • All it takes for evil to triumph, is for good people to do nothing.

Posted 25 June 2006 - 06:54 AM

WarriorVisions you have failed to post within the two-week time limit and are disqualified. This debate is now closed.





0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users