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Native American Powers


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#1    BrideofDracula

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Posted 15 October 2003 - 10:38 PM

I'm knew to this board so don't mind me if I am posting in the wrong board.

I remember stories that have been around for ages. Stories of people who are really powerful and that can change form. There are a few very poular stories about people getting into trouble and then shapeshifting into a rock or a tree so they would not be noticed.
The stories always say that is was someone whom was very powerful.

What do you think about This?

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#2    gonzowalker

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Posted 15 October 2003 - 10:49 PM

All of the Indians I know call them Tricksters. They are mostly evil spirits(if I remember correctly) and hide their guts in tree stumps or under logs and rocks. If you find and destroy the guts, you get rid of the spirit.

Just what I was told. I'm not about to call a full-blood Choctaw a liar to his face.
I'll see if I can find any more info on it.


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#3    Nintendork

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Posted 15 October 2003 - 10:51 PM

welcome to the forum original.gif


well, i think that was a very interesting topic. alot of the indian tribes had beleived in a chosen one in their tribe. they would beleived that that chosen one would have powers like communicating with animals,spirits, ect.  

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#4    BrideofDracula

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Posted 15 October 2003 - 11:01 PM

Well I'll just clarify my story a bit. I should have just told the story that I heard when I was originaly posting.

My cousin whom is like 30 years older than me. Told me that when the first settlers came around this area, there was a tribe that was settled not too far from a fort that they had built. Anyway one of the Native's went to go and check things out. He had gotten spotted, and not wanting to give the Location of the Camp he turned himself into a Buffalo skeleton. The riders passed over him not even glancing at the Buffalo skeleton. He was never deemed evil or anything, just that he had a very powerful spirit and a very talented gift.

That is one thing that I find so facinating about this and I dug deep to find out if there were anymore stories, and I hit the Jackpot when i asked my Brother if he had heard anything like that. He said that he heard as late as 1970 something. there was a guy that was able to shapeshift.  

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#5    Paulo

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Posted 19 October 2003 - 06:24 AM

Hey,

                                    I do believe this... because in our country, the Philippines, we also have some local tribes, located in theVisayan isalnd, who can shapeshift into animals, and Blood-sucking vampire.

                                    Although in our country this so called "Aswang" pronounced as "Ass Wang" are folklore legends, yet this are True. Because they are not your commonly belief vampires.

                                      This Aswang are daywalkers, who appear to be Human, but changes it's original form at night. Hunting for food.

                                       However, these American shapeshifters, Native American indian are not bloodsucking vampires.

                                        Kindly correct me if I am wrong. My Shaman teacher was taught by a Hopi Indian.


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#6    Benjo Koolzooie

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Posted 19 October 2003 - 08:10 AM

Welcome BrideofDracula. original.gif  thumbsup.gif  

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#7    doink

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Posted 09 November 2003 - 12:12 PM

The thing about Native American beliefs and legends is that you can't lump them all into one opinion. Different tribes have different beliefs, customs, and legends. Though many people are learning different things from each other the tradidtional beleifs are still very important. Yes, many tricksters are shapeshifters, and many tricksters can individually be evil, or naughty, or obnoxious, or good. Many by being selfish or naughty bring about something good in the creation stories. It's not necesarily a lesson that being bad will bring good things, it just explains why things are the way they are today. But many shapeshifters are good, and many good people can change shape. It is said at one time there was very little difference between animals and humans.

For example, The story of White Buffalo Calf Woman. The Sioux people at one time were starving and dying. Two men were sent out to find food. They saw a female white buffalo, and it approached them and before their eyes changed into a woman. She taught the Sioux people to hunt her people, the Buffalo, and to use everything from the body, waste nothing or risk starving again. She taught them to pray with the pipe and tobacco (no, marijuana was not used). She taught them the sundance. She taught them how to live.

There are those today who can shapeshift and use their abilities for good, there are others who use it for bad.


#8    dennam

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Posted 06 August 2009 - 06:42 AM

View Postgonzowalker, on Oct 15 2003, 11:49 PM, said:

All of the Indians I know call them Tricksters. They are mostly evil spirits(if I remember correctly) and hide their guts in tree stumps or under logs and rocks. If you find and destroy the guts, you get rid of the spirit.

Just what I was told. I'm not about to call a full-blood Choctaw a liar to his face.
I'll see if I can find any more info on it.


I dont know if this is related, but my uncle swears he has seen enemy soldiers appear and disappear before his eyes in the jungles of Vietnam. He said they they appeared to be a small animal and became a man and charged him. He also said that they appear out of nowhere. As a scout/sniper, I know how hard it is to conceal yourself in any situation, but I have seen things I cant explain as well.  I am very much inclined to think that this is a form of mind controlled illusion.  I dont think it has anything to do with "evil" and more about the power of suggestion and will.


#9    TheSearcher

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Posted 06 August 2009 - 09:42 AM

View Postdennam, on Aug 6 2009, 08:42 AM, said:

I dont know if this is related, but my uncle swears he has seen enemy soldiers appear and disappear before his eyes in the jungles of Vietnam. He said they they appeared to be a small animal and became a man and charged him. He also said that they appear out of nowhere. As a scout/sniper, I know how hard it is to conceal yourself in any situation, but I have seen things I cant explain as well.  I am very much inclined to think that this is a form of mind controlled illusion.  I dont think it has anything to do with "evil" and more about the power of suggestion and will.

I've heard the same story from Ghurka's that I served with, when I was in the Belgian Armed forces. We were on a Nato exercise with British troops. One of them said that they also had such "tricksters" in his home region and that once he had seen one. Most of the others agreed to this, when he told the story. When I asked him if it might have been somthing that projected an illusion,he was adament that this was not the case, because it was not a sorcerer he had seen.

I'm not silly enough to call a full fledged Ghurka a liar, cause I don't want to end up on the business end of his khukuri knife. Besides, these are some of the most amazing warriors I've come across, so I tend to be inclined to believe he has seen something extraordinary.

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#10    Pal101

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Posted 06 August 2009 - 03:43 PM

Well for one, the only people who ever encounter shape shifters are people who believe in them. What dos that tell you?

A credible person should be 50% openmided and 50% Skeptical. One cannot exist without the other without looking like an idiot.

#11    667-Neighbor of the Beast

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Posted 06 August 2009 - 05:21 PM

View PostPal101, on Aug 6 2009, 11:43 AM, said:

Well for one, the only people who ever encounter shape shifters are people who believe in them. What dos that tell you?

Well, of course they are.  If you saw someone change into an animal in front of your eyes, you would be a believer, wouldn't you??

Anyway, I am Native American myself, and have heard most of these stories growing up.  Few Native Americans actually believe the stories.  They are more like the stories in the Bible, not to be taken literally, but rather to carry a moral lesson.  It is a scientific, and physical impossibility for a human to change into anything other than what they were born as.  Shapeshifters, tricksters, aswan, and all other mythological creatures were born out of stories that were created by a more primitive people who didn't know rational explanations for the world around them.  They created stories, such as these, to explain what was unknown to them at the time.  However, in our modern world, where what was once a mystery to them, is now common knowledge in children, the perpetuation of stories such as these as fact is simply ludicrous.

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#12    Cadaver

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Posted 07 August 2009 - 12:43 AM

We shouldnt dicredit possibilities just because the existence of science. There remains things that can't be explained, and shouldn't be,  but that doesn't mean they don't exist. There's a whole other side to the world rather than science.

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#13    667-Neighbor of the Beast

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Posted 07 August 2009 - 02:36 AM

View PostCadaver, on Aug 6 2009, 08:43 PM, said:

We shouldnt dicredit possibilities just because the existence of science. There remains things that can't be explained, and shouldn't be,  but that doesn't mean they don't exist. There's a whole other side to the world rather than science.

Agreed, but there is a limit to possibilities.  A human transforming themselves into other objects is a physical impossibility.  Even the things that exist outside of science still have to obey the rules of the universe, i.e. physics and biology.  Just because some things remain unexplained does not make them outside of the rules that everything else in the universe obeys, just simply outside of our understanding of how they use them.

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#14    Gravitorbox

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Posted 07 August 2009 - 06:23 AM

View Post667-Neighbor of the Beast, on Aug 6 2009, 10:36 PM, said:

A human transforming themselves into other objects is a physical impossibility.
This is all that needs to be said.

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#15    Enigmatic Ghost

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Posted 07 August 2009 - 06:30 AM

View PostKacen, on Aug 7 2009, 07:23 AM, said:

This is all that needs to be said.




I believe it is very possible, however it is within the Eyes and perception of the Viewer, the eye witness, as I believe the Human perception of the viewer does at times alter, waver, as far as if other independent person or animal can effect/trick/altar the viewers visual perception, I do not know. :lol:

Edited by Enigmatic Ghost, 07 August 2009 - 06:34 AM.





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