[Hotoke]

proof why this is impossible:

if alien visitors to Earth created humans, then evidence for this would have been found by now within our DNA. Since DNA sequencing is now cheap and easy, the conspiracy theory idea that our true DNA sequences have been suppressed would seem to be discounted, the idea being that since almost anyone can sequence our genes, if there was any extraterrestrial DNA to be found it would have been by now.

Additionally, humans and chimpanzees share up to 99% of their DNA and the remaining 1% is posited by to some to be of bacterial origin. Thus, present-day genetics fails to produce evidence that supports these theories and more readily supports the idea that humans evolved through a series of DNA mutations from a precursor ape-like species.

[Lumie]

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proof why this is impossible:

if alien visitors to Earth created humans, then evidence for this would have been found by now within our DNA. Since DNA sequencing is now cheap and easy, the conspiracy theory idea that our true DNA sequences have been suppressed would seem to be discounted, the idea being that since almost anyone can sequence our genes, if there was any extraterrestrial DNA to be found it would have been by now.

Additionally, humans and chimpanzees share up to 99% of their DNA and the remaining 1% is posited by to some to be of bacterial origin. Thus, present-day genetics fails to produce evidence that supports these theories and more readily supports the idea that humans evolved through a series of DNA mutations from a precursor ape-like species.

Proof you are wrong and proof you have no clue what you are talking about.

http://www.creationo...chapter4_9.html

Also, you do realize the missing link has still not been found right? And that Darwin's theory cannot be substantiated until this link is found. You psuedo-skeptics cling to theories that have been thoroughly disproven time and time again to the point where it's just silly to still believe in such theories even when the founding father of said theory himself said he might be wrong in light of evidence which is now being seen.

Also, almost everyone on Earth can be linked back to a single female, can you guess what her name is?

[Lumie]

Also, heres an article from a real scientist.

http://www.religionnewsblog.com/14936

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I’ve found God, says man who cracked the genome

[Ichiban Avtar]

i am convinced hotoke works for those who would like the truth to remain hidden and distorted.

[Hotoke]

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Proof you are wrong and proof you have no clue what you are talking about.

http://www.creationo...chapter4_9.html

you do realise the author of that site is a pseudo scientist. They justify they research to make it fit like it is correct

http://www2.truman.e...les/hyahya.html

the guy is insane
“Adnan Oktar strongly believes that he is the MAHDI (the Sunni and Shiite imitation of Messiah

He reportedly claims right to have sexual intercourse with every female member of his cult. He has even invented a name for those females: MOTOR (engine). Reportedly, his male followers are feeling lucky in letting him taste their girl friends first…

Look at the source you believe. This man does not know what he is talking about

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And that Darwin's theory cannot be substantiated until this link is found. You psuedo-skeptics cling to theories that have been thoroughly disproven time and time again to the point where it's just silly to still believe in such theories even when the founding father of said theory himself said he might be wrong in light of evidence which is now being seen

Evolution has left numerous records which reveal the history of different species. Fossils, together with the comparative anatomy of present-day plants and animals, constitute the morphological, or anatomical, record. By comparing the anatomies of both modern and extinct species, paleontologists can infer the lineages of those species. Important fossil evidence includes the connection of distinct classes of organisms by so-called "transitional" species, such as the Archaeopteryx, which provided early evidence for the link between dinosaurs and birds, and the recently-discovered Tiktaalik, which clarifies the development from fish to animals with four limbs

The development of molecular genetics, particularly DNA sequencing, has allowed biologists to study the record of evolution left in the DNA. The degree of similarity and difference in the DNA sequences of modern species allows geneticists to reconstruct their lineages. It is from DNA sequence comparisons that figures such as the 95% similarity between humans and chimpanzees come.

Other evidence used to demonstrate evolutionary lineages includes the geographical distribution of species. For instance, monotremes and most marsupials are found only in Australia, showing that their common ancestor with placental mammals lived before the submerging of the ancient land bridge between Australia and Asia.

Scientists correlate all of the above evidence, drawn from paleontology, anatomy, genetics, and geography; with other information about the history of the earth. For instance, paleoclimatology attests to periodic ice ages during which the world's climate was much cooler, and these are often found to match up with the spread of species which are better-equipped to deal with the cold, such as the woolly mammoth.


Morphological evidence

Fossil fish of the genus Knightia.Fossils are critical evidence for estimating when various lineages originated. Since fossilization of an organism is an uncommon occurrence, usually requiring hard parts (like teeth, bone or pollen), the fossil record is traditionally thought to provide only sparse and intermittent information about ancestral lineages. Fossilization of organisms without hard body parts is rare, but happens under unusual circumstances, such as rapid burial, low oxygen environments, or microbial action.

The fossil record provides several types of data important to the study of evolution. First, the fossil record contains the earliest known times of origination of life itself, as well as the earliest occurrences of individual lineages. For example, the first complex animals are known from the early Cambrian period, approximately 520 million years ago. Second, the records of individual species yield information regarding the patterns and rates of evolution, showing for example if species evolve into new species (speciation) gradually and incrementally, or in relatively brief intervals of geologic time. Thirdly, the fossil record is a document of large scale patterns and events in the history of life, many of which have influenced the evolutionary history of numerous lineages. For example, mass extinctions frequently resulted in the loss of entire groups of species, such as the non-avian dinosaurs, while leaving others relatively unscathed. Recently, many molecular biologists have used times of divergence of related lineages to calibrate the rate at which mutations accumulate, and at which the genomes of different lineages evolve.

Phylogenetics, the study of the ancestry of species, has revealed that structures with similar internal organization may perform divergent functions. Vertebrate limbs are a common example of such homologous structures. The appendages on bat wings, for example, are very structurally similar to human hands, and may constitute a vestigial structure. Other examples would include the presence of hip bones in whales and snakes. Such structures may exist with little or no purpose in a more current organism, yet have a clear purpose in an ancestral species of the same. Examples of vestigial structures in humans include wisdom teeth, the coccyx and the vermiform appendix.


Genetic sequence evidence
Comparison of the DNA sequences allows organisms to be grouped by sequence similarity, and the resulting phylogenetic trees are typically congruent with traditional taxonomy, and are often used to strengthen or correct taxonomic classifications. For example, neutral human DNA sequences are approximately 1.2% divergent (based on substitutions) from those of their nearest genetic relative, the chimpanzee, 1.6% from gorillas, and 6.6% from baboons.[10] Genetic sequence evidence thus allows inference and quantification of genetic relatedness between humans and other apes. Sequence comparison is considered a measure robust enough to be used to correct erroneous assumptions in the phylogenetic tree in instances where other evidence is scarce.

Further evidence for reconstructing ancestral lineages comes from junk DNA such as pseudogenes, i.e., 'dead' genes, which steadily accumulate mutations.

Since metabolic processes do not leave fossils, research into the evolution of the basic cellular processes is done largely by comparison of existing organisms. Many lineages diverged when new metabolic processes appeared, and it is theoretically possible to determine when certain metabolic processes appeared by comparing the traits of the descendants of a common ancestor.


Evidence from studies of complex iteration
"It has taken more than five decades, but the electronic computer is now powerful enough to simulate evolution" assisting bioinformatics in its attempt to solve biological problems. Computer science allows the iteration of self changing complex systems to be studied, allowing a mathematically exact understanding of the nature of the processes behind evolution and providing evidence for the hidden causes of known evolutionary events. The evolution of specific cellular mechanisms like spliceosomes that can turn the cell's genome into a vast workshop of billions of interchangeable parts can be studied for the first time in an exact way.

Christoph Adami et al., for example, make this point in Evolution of biological complexity:

To make a case for or against a trend in the evolution of complexity in biological evolution, complexity needs to be both rigorously defined and measurable. A recent information-theoretic (but intuitively evident) definition identifies genomic complexity with the amount of information a sequence stores about its environment. We investigate the evolution of genomic complexity in populations of digital organisms and monitor in detail the evolutionary transitions that increase complexity. We show that, because natural selection forces genomes to behave as a natural "Maxwell Demon," within a fixed environment, genomic complexity is forced to increase.

David J. Earl and Michael W. Deem also make this point in Evolvability is a selectable trait:

Not only has life evolved, but life has evolved to evolve. That is, correlations within protein structure have evolved, and mechanisms to manipulate these correlations have evolved in tandem. The rates at which the various events within the hierarchy of evolutionary moves occur are not random or arbitrary but are selected by Darwinian evolution. Sensibly, rapid or extreme environmental change leads to selection for greater evolvability. This selection is not forbidden by causality and is strongest on the largest-scale moves within the mutational hierarchy. Many observations within evolutionary biology, heretofore considered evolutionary happenstance or accidents, are explained by selection for evolvability. For example, the vertebrate immune system shows that the variable environment of antigens has provided selective pressure for the use of adaptable codons and low-fidelity polymerases during somatic hypermutation. A similar driving force for biased codon usage as a result of productively high mutation rates is observed in the hemagglutinin protein of influenza A.

"Computer simulations of the evolution of linear sequences have demonstrated the importance of recombination of blocks of sequence rather than point mutagenesis alone. Repeated cycles of point mutagenesis, recombination, and selection should allow in vitro molecular evolution of complex sequences, such as proteins." Evolutionary molecular engineering, also called "directed evolution" or "in vitro molecular evolution", involves the iterated cycle of mutation, multiplication with recombination, and selection of the fittest of individual molecules (proteins, DNA and RNA). The process of natural evolution can be reconstructed, showing possible paths from catalytic cycles based on proteins to ones based on RNA to ones based on DNA.

[Hotoke]

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Also, heres an article from a real scientist.

http://www.religionnewsblog.com/14936

oke i understand that one who is unfamiliar with biology will not know what evolution is all about

this is far from disproving me

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i am convinced hotoke works for those who would like the truth to remain hidden and distorted

arent you the guy who thinks aliens build pyramids even though we found the architect who build it and the tools to build it and the method?

[Hotoke]

If i can ask you all who believe the alien theory a question?


Where do you get most of your research from? I bet most of you just read internet sites about it. I advice you to do your own research about the history of civilisation. You will see the many mistakes the people who make these theories make

I read some stuff about sitchin and i have been told how he wrongly decipherd the sumerian tablets. And about his planet x which btw was suppose to hit in 2003 was scientifically impossbile.

[Ichiban Avtar]

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arent you the guy who thinks aliens build pyramids even though we found the architect who build it and the tools to build it and the method?

no, im the guy whos willing to admit that i dont know everything.
and that the writers of AD have f*ed everything up and distorted the truth so that we may not know who did what and why.

[Ichiban Avtar]

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arent you the guy who thinks aliens build pyramids even though we found the architect who build it and the tools to build it and the method?

no, im the guy whos willing to admit that i dont know everything.
and that the writers of AD have f*ed everything up and distorted the truth so that we may not know who did what and why.

[Lumie]

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If i can ask you all who believe the alien theory a question?


Where do you get most of your research from? I bet most of you just read internet sites about it. I advice you to do your own research about the history of civilisation. You will see the many mistakes the people who make these theories make

I read some stuff about sitchin and i have been told how he wrongly decipherd the sumerian tablets. And about his planet x which btw was suppose to hit in 2003 was scientifically impossbile.

Well to start, you have to realize people like me and Ichiban and many other "psuedo's" have all been brought to believe the same exact things you yourself cling to. We've all heard that side of the story and for one reason or another we realized it just doesn't add up and ultimately, you have to make the decision to perceive what the truth is no matter how unlikely or incredibly it sounds.

However, yes I do get much of my information from the internet but most of it is sourced from books and honestly it makes no difference where you get info from because people can just as easily write things off as truth in books as easily as they can online. It may be hard to believe and it may be hard to accept but there are infact people who are lying about history inorder to conceal the truth, especially those who are in power. It's like a drug company and the FDA, they employ their own scientists to "research" their products and to obfuscate as much information as possible so as to allow their bogus medicine pass FDA requirements(the FDA and Drug Companies work together btw, they're like best friends behind closed doors).

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I read some stuff about sitchin and i have been told how he wrongly decipherd the sumerian tablets.

Do you really need to be told he is wrong? Don't you think you should maybe do the research for yourself and not just take what one skeptic tells you? The truth is he thoroughly researched alot of what he says so in depth that it's mind boggling. He might be wrong about some things but to say he wrote all of those books on stuff he completely fabricated is rather naive. Just because something was debunked doesn't mean it can't be counter debunked, which many skeptic claims can be.

Just like the moon landings and 9/11 and the JFK assassination. There are several pieces of 100% irrefutable evidence that suggest the official versions of those events are complete lies. Not only that but the people behind the official versions have been caught in numerous lies. People have been murdered to cover up the truth.

Do some research on Gus Grissom, the first Apollo pilot, his family has done more research into his death then anyone in the whole world and their conclusion is he was murdered, and their findings should not be taken lightly. So not only is there irrefutable evidence, evidence of lies but theres also mysterious deaths surrounding many highly disputed events and ALWAYS deaths that mute those who are against the official versions.

Heres a good link you should honestly check out(and read it all, give it a chance).

http://www.erichufsc...rdogs_Main.html

Read the intro and especially read the "History is Warped". Let me know what you think.

[Ichiban Avtar]

very true.
what do you think disinformation and propoganda is?
tools used to irradicate truth and prpogate the lies..which is the truth they'd like you to accept.

[Lumie]

Exactly, because when you're misinformed and deceived and lead away from the truth, you're that much easier to control, which is what these people are ultimately after. Control.

Just like income tax. It's a completely bogus and unconstitutional tax yet everyone pays it even though they don't have to. If you know enough about laws and the constitution you can actually become exempt from having to pay this tax but how many people actually know this?

The truth is that by lying and deceiving the public they are trying to achieve something that is very analogous to fractional reserve banking. The idea behind fractional reserve banking is basically you can loan out money that you don't really have so as to make alot more interest then you normally could under the hope that no more then 10% of the banks money would be withdrawn on any single day(which almost never happens).

This is why during the great depression everyone ran to the banks but only the people who got their first got their money while everyone else was screwed. However, if everyone were to stand up to this kind of defected system in the first place, people wouldn't be subject to the ensuing insanity that is inevitably going to unfold just as it did during the great depression.

Likewise, if everyone were to stand up to propaganda and lies in the first place, the people in power would be helpless to stop it. So what their plan is, is they hope that their disinformation and brain washing reaches enough people so as to make those who speak out the minority because it's much easier to deal with a minority then a majority. What would they do if everyone at once stood up to the corruption? They couldn't do jack and they would lose all of their power over night. This has been the exact cause of every revolution in all of history. One day enough people start to realize the truth and revolt. The question is, which side do YOU want to be on?

This post has been edited by Lumie: 11 July 2006 - 04:14 AM

[Hotoke]

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The truth is he thoroughly researched alot of what he says so in depth that it's mind boggling. He might be wrong about some things but to say he wrote all of those books on stuff he completely fabricated is rather naive

It is a money making scheme

his 'planetary collision' theory superficially resembles a theory which is seriously entertained by modern astronomers —the giant impact theory of the Moon's formation about 4.5 billion years ago by a body impacting with the newly-formed Earth—, Sitchin's proposed series of rogue planetary collisions post-dating the early formation of the solar system finds little or no support within the scientific arena. As with Immanuel Velikovsky's earlier Worlds in Collision trilogy, Sitchin finds evidence of ancient human knowledge of rogue celestial motions in a variety of mythological accounts. In Velilovsky's case, these interplanetary collisions were supposed to have taken place within the span of human existence, whereas for Sitchin these occurred much earlier, but entered the mythological account passed down via the purported alien survivors of these encounters. In neither case are their respective interpretations of mythology held to be reliable by the great majority of scholars in the field.
Even you must realise the means of IMPOSSIBILITY


Sitchin's claim to fame is announcing that he alone correctly reads ancient Sumerian clay tablets. All other scholars have misread these tablets which, according to Sitchin, reveal that gods from another planet (Niburu, which orbits our Sun every 3,600 years) arrived on Earth some 450,000 years ago and created humans by genetic engineering of female apes. Niburu orbits beyond Pluto and is heated from within by radioactive decay, according to Sitchin. No other scientist has discovered that these descendents of gods blew themselves up with nuclear weapons some 4,000 years ago. Sitchin alone can look at a Sumerian tablet and see that it depicts a man being subjected to radiation. He alone knows how to correctly translate ancient terms allowing him to discover such things as that the ancients made rockets. Yet, he doesn't seem to know that the seasons are caused by the earth's tilt, not by its distance from the sun

Both Sitchin and Velikovsky write very knowledgeably of ancient myths and both are nearly scientifically illiterate. Like von Däniken and Velikovsky, Sitchin weaves a compelling and entertaining story out of facts, misrepresentations, fictions, speculations, misquotes, and mistranslations. Each begins with their beliefs about ancient visitors from other worlds and then proceeds to fit facts and fictions to their basic hypotheses. Each is a master at ignoring inconvenient facts, making mysteries where there were none before, and offering their alien hypotheses to solve the mysteries. Their works are very attractive to those who love a good mystery and are ignorant of the nature and limits of scientific knowledge.

Sitchin promotes himself as a Biblical scholar and master of ancient languages, but his real mastery was in making up his own translations of Biblical texts to support his readings of Sumerian and Akkadian writings

Most of Sitchin’s sources are obsolete. He has received nothing but ridicule from scientific archaeologists and scholars familiar with ancient languages. His most charming quality seems to be his vivid imagination and complete disregard for established facts and methods of inquiry, traits that are apparently very attractive to some people.

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However, yes I do get much of my information from the internet but most of it is sourced from books and honestly it makes no difference where you get info

Actuually it does, Ask an archeoligist specialised in the sumerian myths what it contains

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One day enough people start to realize the truth and revolt. The question is, which side do YOU want to be on?

your limited knowledge of history is what makes you blind

This post has been edited by Hotoke: 11 July 2006 - 06:56 AM

[Lumie]

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your limited knowledge of history is what makes you blind

Well considering the fact that most mainstream history pertaining to controversial topics is made up primarily of half truths and outright lies, I am quite sure you are wrong. On the contrary your skepticism and naivety and lack of spirituality is what makes you blind. You are brainwashed and I'm trying to tell you that you are and your way of proving to me that you're not is by reciting the information that has you brainwashed.

[Lion of Judah]

I'm Akkadian mixed race Scottish Irish Srilanken Chinese I say we are homo sapien sapien which seperates us from ape meaning we have a soul bigger mind and stronger upright body.
There are so many different tribes and races on Earth who evolved differently in Africa there were so many apes its hard to say which one we come from.There is a misconception about Adam he was created by God from blood & clay to be immortal and is like everyone olive skin brown eyes black hair.So this means we are 3 in one black white asian to maintain balance or we will all be deformed blind deaf dumb crippled.

This post has been edited by Lion of Judah: 11 July 2006 - 08:51 AM