I have been mulling this over, and I am wondering if anyone here has any thoughts.

If a homosexual is attracted to another homosexual BUT that other homosexual acts, dresses, and in any other way resembles a person of the opposite sex, is the one who is attracted really gay? In other words, if a man is attracted to a man who acts, talks, dresses, or in any other way acts like a woman, is that man gay? Could he be attracted to women in reality but something prevents him from acting on his hetero feelings? The same question for lesb@#$s who like "butch" females. Can a person who is really gay be attracted to opposite sex traits and not the opposite sex?

I'll be back to talk.

this is a news section...its not gay rights day is it?...

Even though gay people have a strangely hightened sense of fashion, I don't think they go for partners for their clothes.

In every relationship there is a dominant figure - the person who wears the trousers - I guess it's just instinct. So a butch woman, would be attracted to feminine women and vica versa.

But what it really comes down to, is two hot women who're lesbiens.

i think they would technically be gay. i have known friends who unknowingly found members of the opposite sex attractive until the person turns arround from the bar and it is a man with long hair or something.

Yes. However, your question seems to indicate that you might not have a good grasp of human sexuality. Human sexuality is not a black and white issue. Masters and Johnson (and I think Kinsey too) showed that the overwhelming majority of human beings fall someplace on a sliding scale of sexual attraction. In other words, very few people are 100% gay or 100% straight.

Now, of course most fall more to one side and choose not to act on the part of them that slides over to the other side, and the scale of sexual attraction changes durring one's lifetime. it's the human desire to quantify and qualify everythign that causes us to need a label of "gay" or "straight."

the fact is that very few people are NOT bisexual, varying in scale person to person, while the vast majority of most lean to one side or the other and stay on that side.

So your observation that sometimes gay men are attracted to other gay men in drag, or effiminate gay men, seems to support this hypothesis.

Yeah your "Friend"...

LOL. really was friend. i would say if it was me, having no shame. i tend to learn from others mistakes though chokmah

Actually, I have a good deal of experience and knowledge on human sexuality (I am working on my MA in psych), but I am not convinced that one body of research is the end all of discussion.
My question here isn't whether we all have gay and stright tendencies,which by the way, I don't agree that we do, I am putting forth the question of whether attraction equals gay or straight, and if attraction heterosexually is defined in terms of actual gender, or gender qualities. Are there degrees of gay, or is there room for a person to be incapable of having a hetero relationship, although in reality they are more drawn to those qualities. The way I am reading your reply is that you think a woman can be just as attracted to a "butch" lesian as she is to a natural male. I disagree with this based not just on research I have read, but on personal experience as well... I am definitely more attracted to men than women regardless of how manly a woman looks.

it takes all kinds. I know women who love butch women. I myself don't care for them, I don't like lipstick lesbians either. I like an ordinary woman. and actually that is the bulk of lesbians. ( it's actually the bulk of all women)

we have a saying about a couple of cities near where I live. The women all look like butch lesbians but if you were to call them that they'd kick your ass - straight , married , jeans , flannel tough looking women. motorcycle chicks riding on the backs of hogs. One city we call Taylortucky.

lets get honest. Gay people are as diverse as straight people. Most straight women look like lesbians to me if you go by what they are wearing and acting.
Most cross dressers are straight men.

but stereotypes abound ( and of course there are some truth to them) .

those women who like butch women - it isn't that they want a man but for some it's the eroticism of blended gender. Many straight women tend to find themselves attracted to butch women yet that doesn't make them lesbian.

gender roles are fluid. if you find you love that sensitive part of your husband/boyfriend , does that make him gay ? if your male and your girlfriend liked working on cars or likes to fish does that make her a lesbian ? no.

your question -



the answer is about as much as a straight person can be attracted to same sex traits and not the same sex.



ps - you also have to bear in mind that there are no role models for gay kids growing up other that straight ones or flamboyant ones media portrays .It is changing as society changes. It's changed alot since I was a kid.

most gays and lesbians are ordinary folk.

lol . Most relationships aren't butch and femme. but pretty equal. sometimes one is in control and sometimes another. just like in straight relationships.

as for two hot women who are lesbians ? you need to stop watching straight porn . It isn't real life. women in bed with high heels ? lol that's an accident waiting to happen.

My bosses boss at work is a cross dresser (at work too) as far as I know, he's a straight man, but I wouldn't swear to that (I don't mind the dresses, but I'd love to give him some fashion tips, he needs to stay away from the empire waisted dresses eeeww, a nice A-line skirt and blouse would be a better look for him lol). The only other cross dresser I know is also straight and married with 3 kids.

The one that always tripped me up was I knew a trandgendered man who was on hormone therapy, dressed as a woman, took a woman's name, and for all intents and purpose s/he was a female, he was just waiting until he could have the twig and berries taken care of (her/his words, not mine). Oddly, even as a female, he was still attracted to women. He is for lack of a better way to put it: A man, who's a woman now, who is a lesbian. I never quite figured it out, it was all too complex for my pea brain.

Personally? I'm attracted to tall, thin, graceful, effeminate men (long hair works too) but I can say without doubt, that I am not a lesbian... I'm just not.

I like your replies a lot, Lt., but this just isn't true any more. You have to look hard to find them, but they are there.
Off the top of my head, I can think of Captain Jack from Doctor Who, Laura Innes' character from ER, and some of the characters from the UK and US version of Queer as Folk. They're all
non-stereotypical gay characters.

--Jaylemurph

Let me first say this much so far. To identify sexuality in the genres. There are gay men. There are bi-sexual men ( men who favor one woman and one man in sexuality). There are gay/lesbian women. There are bi-sexual women ( women who favor one man and one woman in sexuality). There is 'Butch' which is the more agressive type. There is 'Dike' which is the more passive type. Now nobody get upset, this is certainly human behavior. In order to really answer this persons question, you need to identify with who is who, and how do they behave. It's behavioral science in sexuality.

Secondly there are transvestites, and trans-sexuals. There are a select amount of people that seem like they 'resemble' women who are truly male in reality. There are those that are opposite of that.

To answer the question. In an environment, a society, a city or town, where it is acceptable for these people to exist in a free society, whether on two ends of the bi-sexual scale or not, is acceptable under certain terms.

You can behave gay, and be bi-sexual. You can also behave gay and be trans-sexual, and transvestite as well. You may ( I'm not talking in legal terms here, I'm talking behavioral science) behave as though you are gay, but you may be attracted to bi-sexual people. As well as anyone who is homosexual.

You may behave gay, and hide that you are bi-sexual if you choose to reveal it to your potential "partner".......or potential "significant other".

It would be in common courtesy that you do, rather than to create problems for your future 'significant other'. Otherwise what kind of problem woul'd there be? I can't say. I woul'd rather I didn't. There are many enlightening ways to sexuality that can be represented in human and behavioral science, as well as sexuality in it's own right as a science itself.

Myself being someone who has experience bisexuality with women before, and with lesbians exclusively, I have learned a thing or two. What I do know is, that you behave a certain way towards another potential significant other, in a "significant way" for wich YOU choose for yourself. IF that person recognizes it, then so be it. IF that person doesn't recognize your behavioral act upon them, there may be a problem with you and how you express your feelings towards that particular person.

I am a straight man, who has been single for 11 years.

Thank You~

Art --

You seem to be a little confused. You do mean "gender" and not "genre", right?
Furthermore, they /only/ way to "act gay" or to "behave gay" is to engage in same-sex sexual intercourse. You might mean "to act effeminate." I shouldn't have to say it, but not all gay men are effeminate...

--Jaylemurph

I'm attracted to men with feminine traits more than I am to females themselves, but I'm not interested in overly masculine men. I just call myself bi, though that might not be the right word. @_@;

exactly jaylemurph - I've know very effeminate men who are very very straight . as well as very butch women who are straight.

as for role models - I don't know many 10 and under year olds that watch ER. And I'm talking about everyday life role models. Tv is rarely like real life. Sure things have gotten better. There are now gay teen helplines and peer groups with gay teens the same age. At one place near here the group holds a yearly Prom . all under 18. but for most kids they don't have the same resources available. Look at the role models straight people have. Even parents rarely approach *spam filter* and life with their kids . they automatically assume they are straight. Even I got the straight sex talk. I got it at 12. I knew I was a lesbian , but didn't come out till I was 15. Most parents wouldn't know how to deal with it or know themselves and a good number wouldn't want too.

Jack McFarland and Queer as Folk aren't great role models. Good tv ratings , but not great for life advice.



this just made me laugh. I've known many butch women who are passive and femmes who are aggressive. and it's Dyke not Dike and some are passive some are not.

here is a link to terminology - I don't think those lesbians you knew knew much.

http://www.gaycityusa.com/Dictionary.htm




are you sure those women were lesbians? Exclusive lesbians tend not to sleep with men for sex. ( unless they want to have a baby the old fashioned way). I would call the women you slept with bi. or confused.( whatever the case may be.)

see even on these boards there is discrimination.


I can write straight sex and no filter, but put the words gay and sex togeather ? = *spam filter*. tada ! it permeates everyday life everywhere.

I take your point about ER, Lt., and your other ones.

--Jaylemurph

[But there are a lot of ten-year-olds who watch Doctor Who. At least in the UK.]

What is happening can be referred to as the GAP, Inc.

Gender, Attraction, and Personality, Incorporated. None of them are interdependent, and all are interchangeable. They can be arranged any which way, and this is an element of the "struggle" for imagined humans:

Effeminate man attracted to tomboy woman - this often leads to inner conflict for both, as many combinations do, because men are often expected to excel in sports, for example, while women are supposed to wear dresses and make-up.

Masculine man attracted to feminine woman - Concept of male dominance causes many women to lose sight of their own growth for the sake of worshiping the man

Below are combinations where the conflicts are all too familiar (Because we, the collective imagination, impose such thinking upon us for our own benefit):

Effeminate man attracted to masculine man
Bi-sexual, masculine woman attracted to effeminate, lesbian woman
etc. etc.

The simple truth is that physically intimate relationships of any kind are there to help us break free from them and realize that we are one. No practice of sexuality is better than another. No one is guilty of anything, either, except for learning, growing, and reaching further toward love of self. How bad is that?

The simple truth is that physically intimate relationships of any kind are there to help us break free from them and realize that we are one. No practice of sexuality is better than another. No one is guilty of anything, either, except for learning, growing, and reaching further toward love of self. How bad is that?

Actually this simplifies what I said. Thanks~

I agree ! good answer !

At first, I was just going to disagree and say that sexuality was just about getting off, but then I realized that would /totally/ be a gay thing to say...

--Jaylemurph

Well actually I didn't say it (forgot to quote him on it), but (ThankPunt) had probably the best ways to put it so far. So yeah great answers dude.

Well if the guy is attracted to another guy for looking like a women but isnt than yes he would be,And yes the same goes for the other thing you were talking about BUT only if it took place in england or south america.