What is your personal view on forgiveness? Do you believe that there is no forgiveness? If so, how do you deal with your mistakes?

There are a variety of beliefs on here. In Christianity, we believe that by accepting Jesus as our Lord and Savior we are forgiven of our sins.

Are you speaking religiously? Or just regular forgiveness of someone who may have done you wrong? Either way, it takes a strong person to ask for forgiveness. How often are we truly sorry for the sins we commit.

WWF and it's just that easy? Idon't think so. It's easier to forgive someone else than it is to forgive ourselves. It's usually over the stupidest things too. I don't want to nor is it my intent to criticize your beliefs but, you seem to be caught up in the dogma of your beliefs. I have friends who have that kind of relationship with thier god. It's all cookie cutter evangelical talk. It's like they can't see anything other than what they've been conditioned with. But not a whole lot of them know anything about the true history of their religion and they are surprised when I know more than they do. The only things they know are jesus was born on Dec 25 and he died at easter time and believe it because that's what they've been taught.
All I can tell you is, you seem very sweet and I hate to say this but either you will free yourself up a little here or you will get eaten alive. I've seen it happen and it's not pretty.

There is no morality in a religion that forgives people who ask for it.

Go ahead... Accept child rapists, murderers, child porn photographers, people who talk at the theater and other horrific human beings... Doesn't mean anybody is going to agree with the religion that those people are alright now because they didn't do anything good but they only worship... That's what it comes down to... Seems god doesn't care about anything else other then being worshipped in christianity. Do whatever you'd like... No matter how terrible it is... Your god will forgive you if you worship him... So go wild!

The Banality of Evil...

Really? I'm not familiar with this Jesus fellow. Please tell me more.



Hey now, its not fair to murderers to group them with people who talk in cinemas. They are especially heinous.

LOL Curiousity, you are a sweetheart. You bring up a good point though.

Most Christians believe that forgiveness holds the secrets to being blessed....

So you don't think anybody can seek to be forgiven for their sins?

Yes we can be forgiven for our sins.. I meant forgiving others.... that's where our blessings are held. That's my belief anyway.

That's just awful that anybody can be forgiven no matter what they have done...

Even in personal forgiveness... If you simply just forgive everyone, you become a bad judge of character and quality for everybody else. Forgiveness for the most grievous of problems against ourselves to simply be forgiven is bad nature and isn't a survivial trait.

Btw, I was talking about religious forgiveness here, as it's topic starter was talking about christianity.

The OP didn't make it clear on what kind of forgiveness he was talking about.. unless, he come back later and said- O' well, I missed it. And I AM talking about forgiveness in Christianity.

You think it's healthier to hold grudges? & to call forgiveness bad nature, or against survival? seems very contradictory. My daddy died of heart attack in his late 40's and he held some grudges now, he didn't forgive NO ONE, NEVER!!

It's wonderful that anyone can be forgiven, Kratos... Geez. The key is the person can' t just SAY it, they have to really want it.. So, it's not as easy as you may think. Or, in your case, as easy as you like to think it is.

Well there's mention of dying for all sins...

Who said anything about holding grudges? Just because you don't forgive someone doesn't mean there is a grudge there. There are plenty of people in my past who I will never forgive and only a small handful of them have a grudge still on them from me.

No, it's really not... Accepting and rewarding child molesters, murderers, rapists and other horrible people is not right nor it is moral. Jesus/god must be some ultra bleeding heart liberal.

Ok, even as you say they have to mean it when they say it... Big deal... All those horrible people who mean it are still getting a free pass. That's just twisted and sick.

No, Kratos when you can't let go of something, and hold that (pain, etc) in your thought and mind of that person, that's a grudge. I hold them too, and it's bad. The hardest thing for me to do is forgive someone... So, I know very well, it's holding a grudge on someone when you can't seem to forgive them. It does have its way of taking it's toll on you too. We are not machines.

I resent any act of a child molester, rapists, murderer, etc, but it's not accepting or rewarding them.. it's a gift to be forgiven, as it is to forgive.
There's no way in hell I could forgive a repetitive sexual offender, but maybe there are one or two that make the mistakes somehow, or someway and truly seek forgiveness-- If there are any out there. Only through their actions do they prove themselves worthy, not by their words..

You contradict yourself... You say God is bad because of all the badness- not understanding, being to harsh and wrath and horrifying death etc,., then you say God is bad because he gives free passes to heaven and must be a bleeding heart lib...... which is it?

It's not the type of grudge that causes my phsyical pain like stress or ulcers. You were comparing my "grudges" to the same ones that killed your father.



You may not... but the christian god will. That's just terrible.



He's still bad either way you look at it. If he's murdering babies or letting a man who raped a baby into heaven... Both actions are immoral and quite disgusting to me.

Maybe so.

Naw, Of course, it's my opinion, but I think some things done are the point of no return, raping babies & children are one of them..The main reason I think this is because to do certain acts (such as these) calls for someone who isn't cut to admit their wrongs-while change, and ask forgiveness.. imo, again.
The difference here is I believe God's justice is perfect. I wouldn't think that with a perfect justice anyone would make it to heaven, if they didn't darn well deserve it.. so, nothing is a free pass.

My view on this original post is this:

If we were not human, we would do now wrong, however, we are human, therefore we do.

If I do something that is not right, I hope against hope that it is forgiven. If someone does something to me, depending what it is (and between me and the whole of the readers on the UM Board) hopefully it isn't something regarding life and death!

We are human, we all make mistakes and anyone that says they do not make a mistake are liars .

No-one is perfect and therefore we shouldn't expect anyone TO be perfect.

They say God is Love, unfortunately a lot of the time people spout on about quotes from the Bible.

Love others as you would love yourself.

Do harm to no-one.

Treat others as you would be treated yourself.

What is so difficult?

Maybe more difficult that it sounds eh

forgiveness is done more for the 'victim' than for a perpetrators benefit in the long run. I've just ordered the film Forgiving Dr. Mengele . you can preview it in Netflix. it is a great example of how forgiveness helps oneself heal.

One sister has come to forgive in order to let go and be happy . remember forgiveness doesn't mean forgetting nor acting like something has never happened , it also doesn't make it all better instantly . Something her twin sister doesn't understand yet is still so angry she admits her life has no joy. Even her children say her heart in incapable of happiness. It's because she can't let go and forgiveness is a way of doing so.

Forgiveness is an extremely healthy move to do for oneself.

I would hope that as someone who makes mistakes that people are healthy enough to forgive , but it isn't something I need as much as they need.

there is only one way to deal with mistakes ,take responsibility and not to repeat them. doing the same thing over and over again is insanity.

I've have seen that Lt.. It's very inspirational.. moving.

we can forgive each other but I don't think in a sense there is anything to be forgiven about or by in terms of God. since all serves his plan.


If this is true , then all our actions come from God. all of them. good , bad and indifferent.

Isaiah 45:7 (King James Version):
I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things

Isaiah 45:7 affirms that God creates darkness and disaster. It is not a creation of mankind, nor of fallen beings or Satan. The Hebrew word here that is translated as "disaster" could also mean "wickedness", "hurt", "affliction" or "adversity". God creates these things directly. Any argument that asserts that evil is a result of Human free will must first get over the fact that the Christian Bible states that God creates evil and disaster itself. Not only does this God create darkness and disaster, but it actively "does" them too. It doesn't merely create them as possibilities for other people, it actively chooses to do them itself.

The Book of Lamentations confirms that free will cannot stop evil, when evil comes from God, nor can man stop goodness, when goodness comes from God:

Who is he that can speak, and it happens, when the Lord command it not?37
Out of the mouth of the Most High proceedeth not both evil and good?38
Lamentations 3:37-38

I have it in my lineup. One I just saw that I really liked was Iris.

The Magdalene Sisters was great ! So was Chorus and the Hotel Rwanda. great films.

I'm truly grateful for God's forgiveness. I don't know where I would be without it after having made so many mistakes in my life. I've also learned the importance of forgiving others as God has forgiven me. I think sometimes the hardest thing to do is forgive oneself even after God has forgiven us.

Forgiviness is like respect..it has to be earned


Im normally a forgiving person but sometimes its not that easy to forgive

Anyone that says they forgive ALL 100% of the time regardless are talking cobblers

It is supposed that the harshest judges of us personally are ourselves. How often is it found that a person will suffer for years and years simply because they have found it nigh on impossible to forgive themselves for something they have done, whether to someone else or to themselves.

We bind ourselves in chains at times and it is not always easy to find the key to unlock those chains.

WWF you obviously found something that is profound to you, it is a miracle in itself and don't let anyone tell you any different

When i ask for forgivness i do so because i,ve learned from the wrong i,ve done and desire and strive never to do that wrong or cause that pain ever again! And when i forgive someone who,s asked my forgiveness it frees me from anger and all the negetive emotions that destroy my own health and happiness. when i forgive someone that hasn,t asked for forgiveness it does the same,it frees me from all that anger,resentment that makes me sick and destroys my happiness! But forgivness doesn,t mean that people don,t have to be held accountable for their actions,and they still need to earn back the trust they destroyed! As for forgiving rapists and murderers and pedophiles? Yes but we must take steps to protect ourselves from them,just because they asked for and/or have been forgiven doesn,t mean there going to be wonderful people who are never going to re offend,and some might ask for forgiveness without really meaning it.I see forgiving others as a gift i give myself!

I agree to that.

thats a easy way of running from your problems

I've had my fair share of mistakes in this life. Yet, I'm still standing without no god or religion to use as a crutch.

You're forgiveness is only in your mind. Just like all other religions with forgiveness have same exact stories just like your's as their gratefulness that their god(s) and/or goddess(es) have granted them forgiveness.

There was an Eagles song the said "Sometime we live our lives in chains and never knowing we have the key."

If I mess up it is up to me so seek forgiveness from who I have offended. I will usually forgive people who hurt me, unless they keep doing it, then I will walk away and just forget about them. I even have a spell for it.

Being a Pagan I don't have to seek forgiveness from my Gods. I am just a child to them. They understand children make mistakes. No one had to die for a sin I didn't commit or even my own sins. I and only I am responsible for the sins I do in this life. I will be given a chance to make amends in the next life.

I strongly believe in true forgiveness. The kind that does not come from your mouth but cleanses your heart and those of others. Grudges only hurt others and ourselves. Forgivness comes from the simple idea that we do not want to be hurt in anyway and should feel and think the same when others are being hurt by our actions or words.

I personally am very "once bitten twice shy". But that does not mean I am cold hearted to a person the betrayed or hurt me before. It just means I am more cautious around that person until that trust is renewed. I have never not forgiven someone. And I have never forsaken someone for a past action.

I think that if more looked at forgivness as a step process to bettering ourselves and not just a selfish plea to get out of trouble or make amends. We as a whole would flourish. But there are allways those hypocritical and selfish people who expect or demand forgivness but do not return any. There is too much of this in this world I think to even really take forgiveness seriously (like I have seen a few post describing this.)

In my opinion the world revolves around respect. And through respect everything is possible and acomplished. Be it earning jobs or money or even friends and more importantly trust and forgiveness.

Forgiveness, both giving and receiving, is/should be one of the easiest things in the world to do.

As usual it is that old ego/self/I which complicates matters. Why do we have so much trouble forgiving others? Because they have hurt/offended our sense of self. And yet, if that sense is big enough it won't be diminished by others' actions, nor by our forgiveness (don't forget that we are asked to forgive the Sins/actions of others. We are already supposed to love them as people like ourselves.) There should be nothing to forgive about a person if we love them like ourselves.

Why do we have so much trouble accepting forgiveness of our own sins? Perhaps beause we know how hard it is for us to forgive, and therefore struggle with the idea that others can let go and forgive us our sins against them. Or perhaps because we do not love ourselves enough and fail to understand that we are innately good people, but sin has crept in to our lives and, almost inevitably, we will fall prey to it in some form or other. As my mother would say when I did her wrong " I disapprove of your deeds, but I love you as a person and as my son"

Once you accept this division within your self and within other humans, it become a lot easier to forgive people their harmful actions, and to accept forgiveness for your own.

True forgiveness involves wiping the slate clean and starting as if the sin had never been committed. This is the nature of forgiveness which Jesus offers for humanity's sins; both individually and collectively. Our sins are washed away in the blood of the lamb.

There are things I know people have done to people I love, and for this I will never forgive them. Am I wrong in this attitude? Not in my opinion, I'm simply not exhibiting this divine 'omni-forgiveness' that the Christian bible speaks of. That quality I'm not sure exists.

A question I'd ask, WWF. Does your acceptance of Christs' forgiveness truly allow you to forgive yourself, or others. Or is it simply a way of shifting the guilt of the things you are ashamed of off onto your deity (or maybe burying the guilt)?

I will forgive someone for something if they are truly sorry, understand their mistake, and vow to not do it again. I will also forgive out of pity...like if somebody is too dumb to understand what they did was wrong or if the wrong thing they did
was absolutely necessary(like somebody steals my money to feed their starving kid or something).

Overall though I generally forgive but do not forget.

Forgiveness is really a gift we give to ourselves and not the other person. We got better things to do then to hold grudges.

I believe that in dealing with my mistakes, I try to take responsiblity for them. No ifs, ands, or buts. It's hard, but askings for and recieving forgiveness is two different things for me. Plus, if you ask god for forgiveness, what about those you made those mistakes with? You did point out in a question on how to deal with mistakes, right? That means with others here in the mortal world. I would like to know, if you expect others to 'forgive you', even if some do not believe in God like you, or believe at all. Like it or not, from my experience, if they do not forgive you, (from what ever you do to make those mistakes), you still have to take responsiblity for your mistakes with them, if they do not forgive you. And they have that choice, you cannot talk them out of it.

My view is, saying your sorry and asking for forgiveness from God, I do not understand. It's almost like a get out of jail card you're recieving. If the mistake has been done, and the damage is still done, that damage is still there. There is still the damage to be responsiblity for. I always wondered if Jesus was trying to point out to us, with his actions, that we are forgiving, once we realize we need to take responsiblity for our actions. I often reflect that he took responsiblity for other's mistakes, it's nothing for others take responsiblity for their own. Then I think forgiveness is there, because someone up there sees your growth and maturity. My take on this. My very strong take on this.

WalkingWith Fire. Good one! I will answer your question based on the title of this thread and your first 3 sentences.

What are my personal views on forgiveness? I am a firm believer in forgiving others in my life. Sometimes it is hader to forgive myself than to forgive others. I believe in second chances and communication. I also believe no one is perfect and to err is human.

Do you believe that there is no forgiveness? Absolutely not. There truly is forgiveness.

If so, how do you deal with your mistakes? I'm not saying how I personally deal with my mistakes is the correct way for everyone; but here is what I do. I acknowledge the fact I've made a mistake. I communicate with the person to make ammends. I hope, if I've wronged someone that they forgive me and I apologize. I pray to God for His forgiveness as well. I learn from my mistakes and move forward; keeping in mind not to do whatever wrong it was again.

I will forgive a person for hurting me, but only so many times. My ex would say and do hurtful things and then say "sorry" thinking everything was OK. I tell my daughter not to say sorry unless she will not do whatever wrong she did again. IF a person keeps doing things to me, I will wash my hands of them, they obviously have no caring about hurting me, so they will lose me from their life. Sure forgiveness is a great thing, but so is the responsibility to own up to your own shortfallings and stop hurting the ones you supposedly love. Everyone makes mistakes and everyone gets crabby sometimes ut that doesn't excuse a callus attitude towards family and friends.

Listen. We MUST forgive, no matter what. We cant carry that in our hearts. Its not healthy. Its strange but I've recently dealt with this subject. My parents have a habit of stealing and using me. I found myself feeling somewhat guilty for not just "letting it go." Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me. Do I forgive them? Of course. You must speak it from the mouth to them personally, I feel, to really feel you've forgiven someone. My problem was that, if I allowed them back into my life directly, I would be taken advantage of again. I think that tends to be a problem with Christians. You must find a balance of forgiveness and self-preservation. I'm sorry, but if my family's welfare and my ability to pay my bills is in danger, yes I'll forgive you, but dont expect to walk through my front door.

Very well said... Jody

Is that forgiving, though? Soem people don't equate that with fogivinb. I agree with you on that aspect, but there are some people who will see that as you are not forgiving them.

i understand what youre saying. but, forgiveness is meant for YOUR wellbeing. ideally, people will realize that even though ive done them wrong, they forgive. hopefully, they question their ways. but i dont think that god intends us to be fools and set ourselves up for damage.

I guess I understand, but htere are a couple of people I can't fully forgive, they have caused me a lot of problems. Maybe If they weren't relatives I would be able to forgive them and just forgive them. I have cut them out of my life, but it just may take time to totally forgive them.

oh we both agree. it just seems harder when your related, doesnt it? it just makes it seem so worse. but, wouldnt you agree that you have learned a lesson from these transgressions? at least, what not to do? havent you experienced the other side, and are therefore less willing to persecute others?

in fact, those who intend to hurt you have given you a gift. forgive and learn brother.

forgiveness has nothing to do with what you do for another its something you do for yourself it needs not be exceppted to be viable and healing, and a time will come in most lives when they grow to an awareness that they remember there is nothing to forgive.....

psssttt....sister LOL

sorry. anyway, i hope you understand what im saying.

I do. It is just a little harder to overcome some things and to forgive them. I have forgiven some aspects, but there are still some parts of what happened to me that I can't forgive, like I said, sometimes forgiving takes time.

i suppose thats true. but the key is this: dont let the tyranny of evil men change you.

Unfortunately that is easier said than done. But, I am working on it, and that is what is important. You never stop learning about yourself and your strengths. And sometimes you will surprise yourself. Now, I just need to let it all go, I know, but ..........

im not saying it will make the pain go away. yes, time will do that. but it will NEVER go away as long as you hold resentment in your heart.

forgiveness is the first step, not the last.

People need to earn forgiviness

really, forgiveness has nothing to do with the transgressors. its about the victim.

but yes, if they want to be a part of your life again, then they got some work to do!