What do people have against a God that joined the ranks of men and redeemed us from our own selfish hearts? Haven't you noticed a slight offense toward Christ unlike any offense to any god? What did Jesus do that was so appalling?

P.S., I meant to make the title say, TARGET for the world's frustrations, but it ended up being TARGE. My apology.

"Jesus Christ" is but a character in a story to me.
I don't have any frustration towards fictional characters, though I suppose some people are a little more sensitive. Why else would this thread exist?

*waiting and watching*

I personally do not have a problem with Jesus. I think he was generally a good guy who preached good things(pacifism, kindness, charity, etc).

The difficulty comes with Jesus' divinity. Was Jesus the son of God? Did he actually preform all those miracles? Did he actually even exist in the way he did in the bible?

Jesus goes hand in hand with God. God's morality, ethics, judgement, and existence are all questionable. Since people have a problem with God that frustration is automatically passed onto Jesus(since it is said they are one in the same)

There is more 'offense' to the christian religion because it is the dominate one and tends to throw their beliefs in peoples faces.

As far as I am aware of Jesus didn't directly hurt anybody or want to. Although some of his beliefs differed from mine that doesn't mean I don't like him. My problem lies more with the father then the son.

Thread title fixed

I have no problem with Jesus at all. But I doubt he is my saviour for many reasons.

"Jesus is just all right with me,Jesus is just all right ,oh yeah" -Doobie Bros. Love that song !

It's big daddy -as described in the bible -I have a problem with. They are like night and day in their character.

Jesus is not a target Blue.............the only real targets are those that throw attitude towards non believers


NOT JESUS <--never seen jesus as a target


To me he is just a character in a book......

This may have been true (I am not sure what has been written in every thread) but recently I was stricken when COI started to say things like Jesus deserved to be crucified and that He was a liar and deciever. Check out the "Jesus is He the Messiah" thread to see this in person. I'd say that if COI's writing has anything in common with anyone else's on this forum, then indeed Jesus has been a target.

Just because COI makes jesus out to be a target...and COI claims harsh things like what you have just stated...is COI worth responding to?? IMO - NO...cuz he is just ONE person

No one else targets Jesus.......I have never used Jesus as a target...because I dont see the point in using Jesus as a target if i don't believe he existed..

Jesus the teacher is a fine example of a wise and mature being. Teaching tolerance, and love. In the 1960's he would have be a guru.
I have no problem with the lessons he taught & the examples he demonstrated.

Its some of his followers I have issue with.

And the organizations that have distorted and misued his teachings.

Blue...i just want to add - Even though I am NOT a christian..and even though way back in the past, you and I never really seen eye to eye........you are a prime example on what a real christian is....all of your posts I may not agree with..BUT..you still make excellent posts Blue

PS - I dont see Jesus as a target lol


*fast exit*

Jesus's own religion spreads hatred, bigotry, discrimination and other items along those lines. Crazy to actually think that those little items are going to be ignored because christians front only, mostly, the "good" stuff as the religion evolves and changes to try and keep alive despite it's failings around the world in a drop in believers.

If anything it's because people prefer truth over lies. Jesus contradicted the one true God's words so many times its not funny. Worse off he had the nerve to say he was God.

What's funnier? There are Chrstians that don't believe that Jesus was God, there are Jew's who believe he was the Messiah. What a tangled web huh?

You probably should take it down a notch kiddo, you're not doing yourself or your new found faith any justice or peace.

*wipes eyes* wtf?? did COI just say what I thought he said??OMG...if a non christian wrote the same thing...they would be pulled over the coals for it...goodness me!!!!!!!!!

Geee and he calls himself a follower of the way.............question is which way?? or what way?? lol

ummm thats defo a classic if ever I read one....a christian slamming Jesus............OMG whats next??


I dont believe in Jesus...but blimeyI wont slam him lol


Danmmmmmm just when I thought I'd seen it all...I see this LOL...crazy stuff....

Umm...BM, you should really check out the Is Jesus the Messiah thread on the Spirituality Boards. COI is no longer a Christian. Jesus, he may not have existed. If he did, than he deserved the crucifixion he received for the lies against HaShem that he spread.

WAIT...umm you are no longer a christian???

Umm why didnt I get the memo


COI...how come??

Who has planted ideas into your head??? good grief

I sure hope this is a descission you made on your OWN...I HOPE no one has planted anything in your head

anyhoo..how come??

I think you need to take it down a notch COI... you're doing your new found religion a huge injustice.

You get a little bit of a pass here because you're a kid. Study for a few years, then come back and talk to us about this new faith of yours. You haven't studied enough. You converted or something last weekend.

MissWels, he is the same arrogant little man he was when he was a 'christian'.

No matter what he professes to be at the moment, the only consistancy in him is his overwhelming need to be right, and to be as offensive as he can get away with.

I wouldn't be at all surprised if he got banned. Again. But then, banning in itself is a badge of honor for him. It validates his own "correctness", because he thinks that he is such a threat; that his arguements are so unmatched, that he must be banned.

I agree with JMPD..he is still the same arrogant lil guy when he claimed to be christian

we never got at his faith ever..we only got at his attitude

just like you are doing..his attitude isnt right judging from how you have responded to him..heck we non christians have been telling him the same thing as you have for ages....

isnt it weird when one arrogant christian can get in non christian faces..then the sec they turn coat..they are annoying christians

Not trying to be funny..but that is whats happened here

It was a choice of my own. I realized that I never truly served Christ and I found inconclusive evidence in the Bible that proves that Christ was not the Messiah.

Ok then....but seriously your attitude towards others has remained the same

My attitude would stay the same, I am the same person. I have simply come to terms with the fact that I don't believe in Jesus.

You change your mind brave and often...it seems like a trend of yours

But dont go attacking christians for their right to follow Jesus <--remember you were once one of them...so therefore you should UNDERSTAND were they come from

I dont believe in Jesus..but gee i wouldnt SLAM HIM
I dont see the point in slamming a character from a book i dont believe existed

I don't change my mind often at all. So I change my name to match my mood every once in a while. My mind and beliefs stay the same. I hardly ever change my mind on things. I simply came to terms with the fact that I didn't believe in Jesus at all. See before, I said I believed in him, but didn't inside, now I have merely come to admittance that I don't believe in him. Yes, it has its drawbacks, but for HaShem I refuse to lie any longer by claiming to be a Christian. Yes, I know what it's like to be under the Christian label, and I'm not attacking Christians. Since I have rejected Christ I have not at all attacked any Christians. I have only defamed and challenged the name of their God. I have proved that he was not the Messiah. Which only leaves the other options that he didn't exist, or died and stayed that way.

How on eath have you actually proved he was NOT the messiah?? were is the actual fact proof??

if its from a bible, thats not real proof btw

The Bible is real proof to the Christian. I mean, I don't need to prove it to you, you already don't believe in him. But using the Bible itself I can prove Jesus is not the Messiah. As is, Jesus is a contradiction to the OT.


Below are things Jesus did not do which the Messiah is prophesied to do.

But thats not actual real scientific proof COI...

just a belief

But you see, I am disproving Christ with the Christian Bible. If they believe it is the word of God, they will have to accept that Jesus is not the Messiah. If they hold that the Bible is True, than they must accept he is not the Messiah. I don't need to convince those who already don't believe in him. I don't fight spirituality with science, I fight it with spirituality. If, because of the Bible, they believe in Christ. Than I, using the Bible, have disproved him.

You havent disproved christ for real ...actually real using real evidence


I on the other hand dont believe in christ...only cuz none of the bible makes sense to me, but then again for years I havent hid behind back doors in saying so

but I must admit this is the 1st time I have ever seen someone on line turn away from being a christian to something else so quickly and the 1st time i have ever seen anyone try and disprove Jesus with a christian bible lol <--that should go down in UM history lol

Knight of Zion...weren't you the one who said God talked to you personally?

LOL thats right

What makes him real? The only reason people believe in Christ is the Bible. So if I use the Bible and disprove him, he's no longer a reality.



BM, I am a sworn to the Truth. If I find out something is a lie, I change from it quickly. Jesus is not the Messiah, and I'd die saying it.

God does talk to me personally. Which is why I started my search. For the past two months I have been searching into the Messiahship of Christ because in my personal talks with God he NEVER mentioned Christ. So I asked God about it and he said "Look into it, and then we shall speak again." So I looked into it and found that Christ was not the Messiah. Then I spoke to God and said "So he is not the Messiah." And God said "Go here, and I will confirm what you have learned" I went where he showed me and alas it was confirmed.

So what belief system, if any, do you follow now?

Chadissius. I am a Nochide Chassid, which is like Judaism for Gentiles. I follow God forever and eternally. My sins are atoned through repentance. I gain righteousness by showing trust and love in HaShem. There is no need for Jesus. Or any mediator whatsoever.

Uh huh.. so I suppose my repose with God--which say something else--is false?

Don't be a dork dude.

You've crossed the line kiddo (lest we not forget, I never said what God's Word was for me.)

Does the God you speak to acknowledge Christ? If he does, I'd me a tad weary. I have no doubt against your personally relationship, I had my personal relationship when I believed in Jesus. But I never felt right with Jesus and I found out he is not the Messiah.

You can believe what you like COI...

Let me tell you that I've never had any doubt. 2 weeks ago you didn't either.

You need to take a step back and watch your words kiddo. I understand that you feel you've found what's right for you and that's fine, but you can not make the mistake of thinking that you're right and everyone else is not--you did that with your christian faith and it did not serve you well. I'm concerned since your fervor seems to be very much over the top.... tread carefully dear. it's ok if you want to convert, kids your age go through this from time to time... some really do convert, but be careful with how you treat others and their beliefs... if you do not, you are no better than those you don't care for here because of their seemingly unoganized patterns and lack of consistency.

Take it down a notch.

You sure could act as though you felt right with Jesus...you were hard core about it.....you pounced on anyone that claimed Jesus neveer existed..now look, the worm has turned lol

KARMA - NEVER FAILS...what goes around...DOES COME AROUND...COI is living proof

So you lied when you said Jesus spoke to you? You told me he told good jokes... so I take it that was all fabrication?

I've had a fair few friends who have gone from being christians to being... well, believers in god without the christ bit. They all claimed to have a personal relationship with Jesus, until they found he wasn't real and admitted they'd been forced along by not wanting to be outcasts in their church, or in their family... and by not wanting to be seen as "less than" when other christians talked of their personal experiences of Jesus. At some point in our lives most of us get swept along by emotions, ideas, and desires to be part of something.

I would say you are about 50% correct in your statement. You are getting closer to fullfilling your own prophecy.

Nothing, makes for a good heart-warming story, but that's about all it is to me. What other person in all of history has caused so many of his followers to kill, torture, and rape people who don't believe in him? Yes, Jesus taught a lot of good things in the NT, but it was obvious his followers didn't follow that path. They use Jesus as a shield to achieve their lust for wealth and power. (In summary, it's not really Jesus who I take offense to, but just the people who follow him and go against everything he taught them.)

Knights Of Zion we cant any any point in time say for sure that Jesus is not the Messiah. To me the reaso i believe in Jesus as at very least a Prophet/Messenger of God is because i have had a dream of him.
I will never forget this dream. I was stuck atop of my grave and i saw a man in a white robe and long hair (But kinda different than mainstream Jesus images) walking down the cemetery aisle.
People were calling out to him and some people got unstuck from their graves and joined him down the aisle in bliss and happyness...Jesus didnt even look at me and he walked right passed me
and i felt so rejected and upset and that made me wake up abit more...Jesus is the man that inspires me to become a better man and i love him dearly. People can say he doesnt exist but i know
it was him in that dream and i know he was trying to give me a message to get closer to him and thats all the proof i will ever need. Peace to you.

Thats true he did claim Jesus spoke to him a lot


but this NOW proves that people can and have made up some serious things ....then back pedel

It reminds of how I claimed I dont know god on a personal level like i would my mom or dad.........people like COI told me if i didnt know God like my mom or dad on a PERSONAL level..then my god was be weak


Who's weak now?? KARMA you gotta love it

Not Jesus. God. Big difference.


I didn't say that Jesus did. I said God did. You can search my posts. I only mention Jesus when giving information. Never in a personal experience.

What lies?


You have proved nothing, you have only discovered, that for you, it is no longer a belief.



You cannot, however, disprove Jesus Christ to those that do not read the Bible, or very rarely look at it. Not everything is black and white, cut and dried.



Actually, that is not the only reason people believe in Christ as not everyone reads the Bible. You used the Bible to your own ends and for YOU He is no longer a reality. However, you cannot speak for anyone else at all. Some people believe, others don't, it is nothing to do with the Bible in many, many cases.

You are sworn to your own truth and no-one else's and I have no idea how anyone else is feeling about all this, but CoI you seem to be taking it upon yourself to talk for everyone else. You seem set on the idea that just because you have found a new belief that a few quotes from the Bible will suddenly and miraculously change everyone else's mind. Nothing could be further from the truth at all. You have found it is a lie for YOU, no-one else, the best thing you can do is to stick to your own beliefs and leave everyone else's alone, because nothing you can say will have any effect on anyone else - personally nothing you say rings true with me therefore I do not believe you.





By the way, are you sure this God you are speaking to is Truth? Stranger things have happened ...

I could give you quite a good Biblical Quote, but as it is from the New Testament you wouldn't believe it anyway.

Regardless: Corinthians I Chap. 12 v.3: Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed; and that no man can say the Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Spirit.

IMO, he wasn't King of the Jews.


Maybe so, but as far as I'm concerned the Bible says he is not the Messiah.



If you believe in Jesus without the Bible than prove he is who he said he was without using the Bible.


Really? How else does one learn about Christ without the Bible?


I'm not trying to convert. That's not my goal. My goal is to educate people about my beliefs, and to learn about others.



Well, I can say that Jesus is Lord, so...?

As I said not everyone follows the Bible, sometimes it depends if you actually look into your heart, if it feel rights, then for you it will be. I fully understand that one person's belief is another person's curse however.

Are you saying Jesus is Lord?

Okay, in regards to KoZ (CoI) and his recent change of views about Jesus, I would like to give a few quotes from him from different threads:





And this is the last quote I will use, CoI you told me this after I told you I was a christian for 3 years and turned away from it because i found out how ignorant i was being:



Hypocrisy at it's finest. Sorry CoI, but after making this kind of statement to me and then you go and do the same thing kinda pisses me off...

No, but I can say that he is. I used to, remember?







I have never said that I KNOW that Jesus is God. I have only said I KNOW that there is a God. I said that I haven't converted anywhere, I have merely realized that I didn't believe in Jesus in the first place, and have decided to come out into the open with it. Yes, I said Christ and God were the same, and that was only to explain how a person who never heard of Christ could find God because if Christ and God are the same, than by seeking God you seek Christ. Did I ever really think Jesus and God were the same? No I haven't. So yes there is some hypocrisy, however, I have admitted that I never really believed in Christ in the first place. I only rarely mentioned him as COI. But as one who hates excuses, I shall say, yes, I have been a hypocrite on this matter and I came off in a way that would lead one to assume that I KNEW Christ is God. However, now you know, I have never believed that he was. I merely instilled him into my relationship with God because of tradition. But hey, if you want to call me a hypocrite, fine, I don't care. I am a hypocrite. I most certainly am not perfect.