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Blue Water
Now, this is a central theory of a secret power within. I can't state all of this as fact, only that there are many facts and much evidence to support this stuff. Here is the theory:

In various cultures around the world there is talk of a race of gods who flew here from the clouds. They came in massive space ships, and used 'flying saucers' to explore the world with. There were a group of human-like aliens -- humanoids -- who called themselves the Sons of the Serpent. This stuff is recorded in the runes and symbols of ancients, and by the ancient knowledge of the shamans. The evidence is all around, and anyone curious enough can explore it. Thing is, although all the evidence shows that the majority of alien races are peaceful, the evidence shows that the ones that came here, about 40 thousand years ago I believe, are not. They became the masters of the world, and given their godly technology, magical abilities and great wisdom, the human race was greatly inspired by them. Although, women were more inspired and showed more understanding than men, and thus were imitated as the leaders of humankind, as partly the aliens believed women were superior (the exact event which created sexism, and men have never forgiven women for their 'betrayal' long ago.)

linked-image

Some women became lovers of these alien overlords, and these especially became queen-like figures. They were called Virgins, as they did not mate with human males, and if they gave birth this was called a Virgin Birth (sound familiar?) Many of the earlier results of alien-human relations proved disastrous; there was something in the meeting of the DNA which would not hold together. However, in some cases it proved highly successful. The aliens, call them the Reptilians if you like -- although some researchers believe that the Reptilians were created later by the aliens as a warrior race to combat the humans for control -- became unsettled as men began rebelling against them and their appointed female leaders. So, the aliens tampered with human DNA to change the genetic makeup of some humans, and turned them into a super race -- a race which was partially human, partially alien. These were the first kings, and their rules would be succeeded by bloodline, as they were encouraged to breed only within their circles; to maintain their super human genetics.

Only, these super humans defied their masters and left. The alien overlords were obsessive over gold, and using humanity as a race of miners and builders ... and there are many theories for why gold was so important to them, but gold has ever since remained of material interest to humans. The aliens tampered with the DNA of humans, and especially in the genetic makeup of the males, to make them more mindless and obedient. But the advanced leaders swept over the masses with wisdom and encouragement, and inspired a major revolution which caused the alien overlords to lose power. Outraged, the alien overlords used their advanced technology to take control by force. The advanced ones led humanity to rebel. This was known as the War of the Gods, and appears in many ancient writings. There are descriptions of whole armies of sword and bow wielding warriors being destroyed by a single energy blast of the enemy. But the advanced ones stole alien technology and fought back. This caused so much radiation that there was much deformity, and some people grew third eyes or extra limbs, or were born very small or very large, according to the ancient texts (the ‘giants’, and so forth.)

A major catastrophe disrupted this war when it was at its height -- and event some believe was an alien world coming very close to ours, and the very same one which is hidden from the public although astrologers can prove it exists due to its gravitational influence on the other planets of our solar system. Others believe it was another celestial body passing through. But it caused much water to come down from above, and the waters of the world multiplied. This was the Great Flood, recorded throughout the ancient world. The War of the Gods never ended. If the aliens had won, all we'd have in the world today is evil and control. If the good had one, we'd have peace and enlightenment. So, the struggle goes on...

linked-image

The children of the alien-human relationships, as well as some branches of the advanced ones, continued their leadership and struggle for world dominance under the secret direction of the aliens. The Illuminati is the aliens' following, their children and the advanced ones who follow them, through bloodline connection to this day. They are centred in England, in London specifically. The British Empire was their empire (it was modeled by them and was under their secret control.) But its attempts to conquer the world, through war and through culture, failed. Yet again, human spirit bested the superior genius of the alien cult. But they would not stop for anything, and so went back to the old drawing board, yet again, to orchestrate a more manipulative plan, one which took the spirit and awareness of humanity to heart.

They concluded that the people will always rebel in the end, so the way to conquer was by doing it secretly. How does one escape a cell he does not know he is in? They created the Political System. This gave the people the illusion of say and influence, of power, without them really having it ... in theory. The people would believe in their influence, and would be coaxed into loving their Political Systems through their national achievements, religions and beliefs, and cultural strengths. They would be put into conflict with each other, to make them insecure about each other, and thus patriotic; believing in the Political System. Their minds would be assimilated, through the media, which would tell them how to think, and coax them into it with entertainment. Belief was vital to this, and so religion would play a vital role -- including Hinduism, but the Vatican is a central organization working for the alien overlords (the US government still pays rent to the Vatican, and its secret services and NASA's findings still have to pass approval of the Vatican's secret service. It remains the most official central power in the world.)

Even a few hundred years ago, the average person knew about aliens and UFOs extending back to the ancient times. Today, they don't. Even a few hundred years ago the average person knew about magic as a real power. Today, they don't. Even a few hundred years ago the average person knew the Roman Catholic Church was working hard to cover up much of the ancient knowledge, and taking over spiritually charged sites and claiming their happenings as Christian happenings. Today, they don't. In the time of the 'info super highway', the people are quite ignorant of many things. The Internet can help, but ultimately people keep to their enforced views, interested in observing the 'paranormal', but rarely interested in pealing back the layers to find the answers. People are comfortable with a sensation of deeper meaning, without finding it. Our world has become disgustingly sensationalistic ... living on the surface, afraid to look deeper, stuck up and blinded in common perspective which have been manufactured for them. School, religion and the media are the three major tools which the Illuminati use to suppress you. If you continue to buy into them, they will win.

The Illuminati love symbols. The Serpent, of course, which represents their proud alien bloodline, is their favourite. The letter ‘G’ represents a serpent, as in the lower case -- g -- it appears as a snake. Their soldiers all wear the same symbols, whether they're Nazis or British soldiers, or American or Canadian ones. People die on both sides of orchestrated wars for their patriotism, not knowing it was all designed. The Sons of the Serpent admire the sun, which is represented by the lion. They see the sun as the ruling power of existence, in mythical terms. Thusly, you find the symbols of the dragon and the lion in many places, of governments and banks. Dragons = flying serpents. Gargoyles = guarding serpents. The letter S also represents the snake, and is to be found in many places. Such as the dollar sign: $. Why do royals walk the red carpet? It represents the bloodline. Why do political leaders walk it? For the same reason. 32 American presidents had very close blood relation to Charlemagne, for example. All presidents had closer royal blood connection than their opponents. A democracy?

linked-image

The ancient Illuminati still rule. England still leads the world, not America. America is being used as the means to an end. It has been built up as the new enemy of the world, to create mayhem and destruction, as a way of taking people's eyes off England (now, I love England, and don't mean anything against the British. Just saying the Illuminati are cantered there.) The War on Terrorism has been orchestrated (study the evidence on how the World Trade Center was really collapsed if you don't believe me.) The same symbols of the Illuminati are found everywhere, if you can take the time to look. Your presidents and prime ministers and religious figures still walk the red carpet, your soldiers still don the same symbols, like your government buildings. The people are not interested in symbolism, but the Illuminati are obsessed with it. If you look for yourself, you will see it. And maybe you will begin to question things, to stand back and attempt to peal back the layers of deception, to see how we've been used. Like sheep, sheep dogs have been created to scare us, and leaders have been set up to lead us.

So...

To be perfectly honest, I do not know if these 'alien overlords' exist or not. There is a lot of evidence to show that they do, in whatever shape or form. What is clear, however, is that the Illuminati are an ancient group, represented everywhere by the symbol of the Serpent, and are the true but unseen rulers of the world. According to one woman's testimony, the War on Terrorism was in the planning decades ago. A War on Asteroids was to follow, and finally a War on UFOs, after which, in theory, the Illuminati would have taken power through their long planned New World Order, and will be in total and ever-lasting control. By the way, further DNA manipulation is planned, to make us even more mindless and obedient. The human race is to be further enslaved, body, mind, and soul. Unless they are stopped. And as long as their plans are unseen, how can they be? The people must take interest in looking for the truth. I believe that recent best selling novels like “the Da Vinci Code” and “the Templar Legacy” reflect a growing interest in the truth, sparked by those who have tried to peal back the layers.
Joe013
wow...
jaylemurph
QUOTE (Blue Water @ Nov 15 2007, 12:02 PM) *
To be perfectly honest, I do not know if these 'alien overlords' exist or not. There is a lot of evidence to show that they do, in whatever shape or form. What is clear, however, is that the Illuminati are an ancient group, represented everywhere by the symbol of the Serpent, and are the true but unseen rulers of the world. According to one woman's testimony, the War on Terrorism was in the planning decades ago. A War on Asteroids was to follow, and finally a War on UFOs, after which, in theory, the Illuminati would have taken power through their long planned New World Order, and will be in total and ever-lasting control. By the way, further DNA manipulation is planned, to make us even more mindless and obedient. The human race is to be further enslaved, body, mind, and soul. Unless they are stopped. And as long as their plans are unseen, how can they be? The people must take interest in looking for the truth. I believe that recent best selling novels like “the Da Vinci Code” and “the Templar Legacy” reflect a growing interest in the truth, sparked by those who have tried to peal back the layers.


If there is such a lot, maybe you could cough up some?

I mean, none of this is your /original/ speculation since this sort of stuff has been floating around since before the internet, but it'd be nice to see some reason this shouldn't be dismissed as arrant fiction.

I'd especially like to see any reason to believe that a) the Templars are an "ancient" group (the accepted date of their organization in the 12th Century is old, but arguably not "ancient") b) that they still exist and c) that they were represented by a serpent (I thought they used the cross of St George).

--Jaylemurph
Cryticman
Three words.

WTF?

That Picture of George Bush Made me laugh though..

avs76
QUOTE (jaylemurph @ Nov 16 2007, 07:28 AM) *
If there is such a lot, maybe you could cough up some?

I mean, none of this is your /original/ speculation since this sort of stuff has been floating around since before the internet, but it'd be nice to see some reason this shouldn't be dismissed as arrant fiction.

I'd especially like to see any reason to believe that a) the Templars are an "ancient" group (the accepted date of their organization in the 12th Century is old, but arguably not "ancient") cool.gif that they still exist and c) that they were represented by a serpent (I thought they used the cross of St George).

--Jaylemurph

He was talking about the Illuminati. Different from the Templars.

Avs
Lotus Flower
Obedient? I have no idea about obedience, from where I am standing the world seems anything but obedient today.

People go on about "reptilians", but the message always remains the same, all to do with physical and earthly things. Nobody ever mentions anything spiritual within the whole set-up. Has everyone really become so lost in the world according to the people that are so worried about these reptilians?

As an afterthought, what is behind the meaning of the word "Illuminati"? Would it not mean Illuminated Ones - enlightened?
jaylemurph
QUOTE (avs76 @ Nov 15 2007, 08:48 PM) *
He was talking about the Illuminati. Different from the Templars.

Avs


Oh. Well. That's even worse.

The Illuminati are demonstrably not ancient (the 18th Century was a while ago, but again hardly ancient), demonstrably disbanded and didn't use snakes as their symbol.
Although to be fair, a lot of people who don't actually know that much about the two groups are fond of saying they're related.

And I'm still waiting to see a pre-1970, pre-Doctor Who version of the Intelligent Reptile Men theory the OP mentions.

--Jaylemurph
kanji
Awesome. I completely admit that my own world theories are way out there on the edge of sanity, but this takes the cake. I would love to see some evidence of this.
The Sandman
DUDE Blue water.....is your REAL name David Icke???
mnemeion
For the spiritual side of this, a Catholic Priest who have performed many exorcisms stated in a newspaper report that possessed people has reptilian eyes.
avs76
QUOTE (mnemeion @ Nov 16 2007, 08:03 PM) *
For the spiritual side of this, a Catholic Priest who have performed many exorcisms stated in a newspaper report that possessed people has reptilian eyes.

That's very interesting. I had not heard that. I wonder what the connection is.
The Sandman
the priest must have had bad eyes! tongue.gif
The Sandman
this whole reptilian agenda was started and popularized by David icke! it would have been better if he had stayed as the goalie for coventry and hereford!!!
mnemeion
It is also interesting that the whole System of living in this planet all keeps us in a life of consumption. All road points out to a system of consumption. All the information fed to us by the mass media partitions us to a certain social group where we are supposed to spend all our money on a certain commodity, from vanity products to books saying that the government is the evil and demonic. It's as if we are all programmed to be in a certain group of people who will choose a certain pattern of interest(like basketball or the occult) wherein we choose to live our life of consumption. This is how "Life" is dictated to us by this certain System. This is Earth-life, the way humans are supposed to life. Well, the alternative life is the life of a Buddhist monk, wherein you give up this Earth life and live a life where money is considered to be of no value.

Watch out. Another crackpot. tongue.gif It's just my observation.
Reepa
Thats some contradiction for you there.

To be honest all this 'evidence' is mind blowing
mnemeion
Suppose everything he said was true, and that there is evidence to prove it. What can we do about it? How will the people react? What would we do? What would happen to us?
AmazingAtheist
Nice Story..

Not buying it though ..

The Sandman
QUOTE (mnemeion @ Nov 16 2007, 01:44 PM) *
Suppose everything he said was true, and that there is evidence to prove it. What can we do about it? How will the people react? What would we do? What would happen to us?


you tell me!
Star_girl
double wow!

Has anyone ever thought that if 'primitive people' saw us and how we lived today that we would also be called all kinds of wonderous things...
avs76
QUOTE (jaylemurph @ Nov 16 2007, 03:57 PM) *
Oh. Well. That's even worse.

The Illuminati are demonstrably not ancient (the 18th Century was a while ago, but again hardly ancient), demonstrably disbanded and didn't use snakes as their symbol.
Although to be fair, a lot of people who don't actually know that much about the two groups are fond of saying they're related.

And I'm still waiting to see a pre-1970, pre-Doctor Who version of the Intelligent Reptile Men theory the OP mentions.

--Jaylemurph

Apparently they are in various myths from around the world; from the Americas, Europe, India, East Asia and the Middle East. Not sure if that is what you were after.
avs76
QUOTE (Star_girl @ Nov 16 2007, 09:40 PM) *
double wow!

Has anyone ever thought that if 'primitive people' saw us and how we lived today that we would also be called all kinds of wonderous things...

They would probably be amazed at how fat we are...and would also think that we must be very wealthy. Seriously, they would be amazed at the gadgets and gizmos we have. People my parents' age have told me that when they were young, their elders were afraid of the radio, as it was a new concept. They thought it impossible that voices could be coming from a little box, and it must surely be the work of the devil. Sorry, this is getting a bit off topic...

EDIT: fixed grammar and spelling
Emma_Acid
QUOTE (Blue Water @ Nov 15 2007, 05:02 PM) *
I can't state all of this as fact, only that there are many facts and much evidence to support this stuff.


There is not one single fact in your entire rambling post. Not one.
Leonardo
QUOTE (avs76 @ Nov 16 2007, 11:33 AM) *
Apparently they are in various myths from around the world; from the Americas, Europe, India, East Asia and the Middle East. Not sure if that is what you were after.


Many of the cultures with serpent/snake/reptile people in their mythology also have other animal forms anthropomorphised as part of their folklore. Take the Mesoamericans who had/have jaguar-people as a common motif, or the subcontinental monkey-people often mentioned in folkloric tales throughout the region. There are many, many instances of other animals being humanised in folklore and a simple search will discover this.

My apologies if you did not mean to suggest that mythic lore of animal-people was some kind of evidence for the actual existence of such, but pointing out only one of the animal-human motifs without the context of all the others is very misleading. It was common for early cultures to humanise animals native to their environment as part of their folklore, and this was not exclusive to snakes/reptiles.
Emma_Acid
QUOTE
They came in massive space ships, and used 'flying saucers' to explore the world with.


Religious experience from biblical times is metaphor. We cannot read it as literal, and have no reason to.

QUOTE
There were a group of human-like aliens -- humanoids -- who called themselves the Sons of the Serpent.


Sons of the Serpent are from a Marvel comic book.

QUOTE
This stuff is recorded in the runes and symbols of ancients, and by the ancient knowledge of the shamans.


Sorry? Thats a pretty wide assumption to say that all ancient "symbols" and "knowledge" records the presense of aliens. In fact, none do.

QUOTE
They became the masters of the world, and given their godly technology, magical abilities and great wisdom, the human race was greatly inspired by them.


According to David Icke, and no-one else.

QUOTE
They were called Virgins, as they did not mate with human males, and if they gave birth this was called a Virgin Birth (sound familiar?)


The use of the virgin birth in mythology is symbolic of the offsrping being part-god. There is no evidence that they were half reptile. Prove it.

QUOTE
Many of the earlier results of alien-human relations proved disastrous; there was something in the meeting of the DNA which would not hold together.


Prove it.

QUOTE
However, in some cases it proved highly successful. The aliens, call them the Reptilians if you like -- although some researchers believe that the Reptilians were created later by the aliens as a warrior race to combat the humans for control -- became unsettled as men began rebelling against them and their appointed female leaders. So, the aliens tampered with human DNA to change the genetic makeup of some humans, and turned them into a super race -- a race which was partially human, partially alien. These were the first kings, and their rules would be succeeded by bloodline, as they were encouraged to breed only within their circles; to maintain their super human genetics.


Prove it.

QUOTE
The alien overlords were obsessive over gold


Yawn. Now you're getting into Sitchin and Icke territory - one of which was been proven to be a fraud, the other is certifiable.

linked-image

Well done, a drawing. That isn't proof.

QUOTE
To be perfectly honest, I do not know if these 'alien overlords' exist or not. There is a lot of evidence to show that they do


There is NO evidence at all that they ever existed.

QUOTE
What is clear, however, is that the Illuminati are an ancient group, represented everywhere by the symbol of the Serpent, and are the true but unseen rulers of the world.


All the evidence about the Illuminati show that they existed in europe in the 18th century, and there is no evidence that they existed past 1790. If you have any, and it is not from an internet source, show us.

QUOTE
According to one woman's testimony, the War on Terrorism was in the planning decades ago. A War on Asteroids was to follow, and finally a War on UFOs, after which, in theory, the Illuminati would have taken power through their long planned New World Order, and will be in total and ever-lasting control.


I don't doubt that the war on terrorism was planned a while ago, but "one woman's testimony" for all that other crap? Why on earth should anyone believe that?

What a waste of time.
REBEL
QUOTE (Emma_Acid_88 @ Nov 16 2007, 10:47 PM) *
Religious experience from biblical times is metaphor. We cannot read it as literal, and have no reason to.

Probably explains why i always found it just a touch confusing. wacko.gif

I thought it to be book of books, ya know place your right hand here(?)do you solemnly swear to tell the truth the whole truth nothing but the truth so help us God and all that? huh.gif

Blue Water
With all do respect, Emma Acid, your 'facts' are false. I have been a huge fan of world mythology. Joseph Campbell was like a mentor of mine (although I never met him), and I have always been interested in myths and symbols. But modern-day symbolists like Michael Tsarion are revealing a more literal meaning behind these symbols. And the visual images of UFOs, godly beings, snake worshipping and so forth go back tens of thousands of years and are hardly a modern-day invention.

I am not trying to tell people how to think, I am merely just exploring the possibilities for the truth. To be honest, I am quite surprised that more people on UM are not up-to-speed on this popular theory. And no, I am not Mr. Icke (I haven't even read any of his books yet, but I plan to.) wink2.gif

Some video sources of evidence:

The NWO Reptilian Truth (my cheeky intro):
http://video.google.ca/videoplay?docid=379...h&plindex=3

The Origins of Evil on the Earth:

http://video.google.ca/videoplay?docid=911...h&plindex=2

Reptilian Planet X History

http://video.google.ca/videoplay?docid=572...h&plindex=3

David Gergen - Alex Jones

http://video.google.ca/videoplay?docid=-23...h&plindex=6

Allagash Abductions, Part 2 (the hypnotist in this case was a friend of my girlfriend’s):

http://www.livevideo.com/video/ALIENDISCLO...ons-part-2.aspx

Peggy Kane Interview Part One:

http://video.google.ca/videoplay?docid=692...h&plindex=0

Peggy Kane Interview Part Two:

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-2280703618056368717

This is the Sound of Revolution:

http://video.google.ca/videoplay?docid=312...h&plindex=2
jaylemurph
QUOTE (Leonardo @ Nov 16 2007, 07:59 AM) *
Many of the cultures with serpent/snake/reptile people in their mythology also have other animal forms anthropomorphised as part of their folklore. Take the Mesoamericans who had/have jaguar-people as a common motif, or the subcontinental monkey-people often mentioned in folkloric tales throughout the region. There are many, many instances of other animals being humanised in folklore and a simple search will discover this.

My apologies if you did not mean to suggest that mythic lore of animal-people was some kind of evidence for the actual existence of such, but pointing out only one of the animal-human motifs without the context of all the others is very misleading. It was common for early cultures to humanise animals native to their environment as part of their folklore, and this was not exclusive to snakes/reptiles.


Thank you, Leo., you beat me to the punch and did it in a better way than I probably would have.

QUOTE (Blue Water @ Nov 16 2007, 11:32 AM) *
With all do respect, Emma Acid, your 'facts' are false. I have been a huge fan of world mythology. Joseph Campbell was like a mentor of mine (although I never met him), and I have always been interested in myths and symbols. But modern-day symbolists like Michael Tsarion are revealing a more literal meaning behind these symbols. And the visual images of UFOs, godly beings, snake worshipping and so forth go back tens of thousands of years and are hardly a modern-day invention.

I am not trying to tell people how to think, I am merely just exploring the possibilities for the truth. To be honest, I am quite surprised that more people on UM are not up-to-speed on this popular theory. And no, I am not Mr. Icke (I haven't even read any of his books yet, but I plan to.) wink2.gif

Some video sources of evidence:

The NWO Reptilian Truth (my cheeky intro):

http://video.google.ca/videoplay?docid=379...h&plindex=3

The Origins of Evil on the Earth:

http://video.google.ca/videoplay?docid=911...h&plindex=2

Reptilian Planet X History

http://video.google.ca/videoplay?docid=572...h&plindex=3

David Gergen - Alex Jones

http://video.google.ca/videoplay?docid=-23...h&plindex=6

Allagash Abductions, Part 2 (the hypnotist in this case was a friend of my girlfriend’s):

http://www.livevideo.com/video/ALIENDISCLO...ons-part-2.aspx

Peggy Kane Interview Part One:

http://video.google.ca/videoplay?docid=692...h&plindex=0

Peggy Kane Interview Part Two:

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-2280703618056368717

This is the Sound of Revolution:

http://video.google.ca/videoplay?docid=312...h&plindex=2


Is this the best you can dredge up -- Google videos? And of Alex "I can't be bothered to do research and then am dull enough to say so on tape" Jones, no less?

However, Emma despite your disdain, I am pleased that comic books are now consider a reliable, true source of fact. wink2.gif

--Jaylemurph
Blue Water
QUOTE (jaylemurph @ Nov 16 2007, 12:53 PM) *
Thank you, Leo., you beat me to the punch and did it in a better way than I probably would have.



Is this the best you can dredge up -- Google videos? And of Alex "I can't be bothered to do research and then am dull enough to say so on tape" Jones, no less?

However, Emma despite your disdain, I am pleased that comic books are now consider a reliable, true source of fact. wink2.gif

--Jaylemurph


Jay ... you have a problem with vocal evidence? It has to be written? huh.gif
Blue Water
Oh, and I know you didn't even bother to view them. Because I was viewing them again myself and before I was half way done you all ready made your reply. A pretty bold comment on such an important topic when you didn't even bother to consider my evidence. This will make it hard for me to respect your opinions in the future.
jaylemurph
Well, no, but as I hinted, Alex Jones isn't a source for anything (except perhaps amusement): even in his own productions, he's ill-informed to say the least.

I think you misunderstand what I'm asking for. I'd like to see some facts. By defintion, when they get put into some... I'll be generous and call them documentaries... on Google video, they are interpretations of facts.

(Far too often, the people making these videos (especially ones that talk about NWOs and the Illuminati) have a poor grasp of history and historiography and it's not worth my time to see them, however keen you think they are. As Emma amusingly pointed out, someone in that milieu tried to pawn off a comic book group title as a real one...)


--Jaylemurph
Pandora7321
huh.gif
Blue Water
Alex Jones has personally obtained classified documents to support much of what he says. Some of the great intellects of our time, including Mr. Tsarion (who I regard as the most important figure for modern culture since the late Joseph Campbell) have called him a Godsent. He personally managed to photograph Bohemian Grove, to which Mr. Gergen admitted to being a party to. You really should try doing your own research once and a while. I showed you facts and compelling evidence but you were too lazy (or otherwise unwilling) to examine them. You're like a party crasher, or on this case a conversation crasher; you're not in on the discussion, listening and giving feedback; instead you just throw in your uneducated views as gospel. I see no reason to waste my time with you any further.


Anyway, this is a massive and on-going subject on a global scale. Many are as uneducated of it as they are the alien and paranormal subjects, largely because they trust in modern media to inform them (and any educated person knows how reliable that is. Anyone who goes to a regular bookstore can speak on several important issues you rarely hear mention of on TV, radio, or your daily newspaper.) We have to educate ourselves. But before we can learn the truth we must be willing to be brave, open-minded, to consider both sides of every debate, and to do more listening than speaking. In the words of novelist Naquib Mahfouz: "You can tell whether a man is clever by his answers. You can tell whether a man is wise by his questions."

Hey ... my links stopped working. That's weird. Hope it's a temporary glitch...
jaylemurph
QUOTE (Blue Water @ Nov 16 2007, 03:00 PM) *
Alex Jones has personally obtained classified documents to support much of what he says. Some of the great intellects of our time, including Mr. Tsarion (who I regard as the most important figure for modern culture since the late Joseph Campbell) have called him a Godsent. He personally managed to photograph Bohemian Grove, to which Mr. Gergen admitted to being a party to. You really should try doing your own research once and a while. I showed you facts and compelling evidence but you were too lazy (or otherwise unwilling) to examine them. You're like a party crasher, or on this case a conversation crasher; you're not in on the discussion, listening and giving feedback; instead you just throw in your uneducated views as gospel. I see no reason to waste my time with you any further.


Anyway, this is a massive and on-going subject on a global scale. Many are as uneducated of it as they are the alien and paranormal subjects, largely because they trust in modern media to inform them (and any educated person knows how reliable that is. Anyone who goes to a regular bookstore can speak on several important issues you rarely hear mention of on TV, radio, or your daily newspaper.) We have to educate ourselves. But before we can learn the truth we must be willing to be brave, open-minded, to consider both sides of every debate, and to do more listening than speaking. In the words of novelist Naquib Mahfouz: "You can tell whether a man is clever by his answers. You can tell whether a man is wise by his questions."

Hey ... my links stopped working. That's weird. Hope it's a temporary glitch...


I've watched several of Jones' amusing little videos and listened several times to his radio show.
As I've said -- and as you'd know if you'd seen his Bohemian Grove videos -- the man doesn't do his research and seldom knows what he's talking about. He admits to it on film to a British telvison crew. And yes, he did take pictures of the Bohemian Grove, but this hardly makes him unique or groundbreaking; it's been done for more than 125 years now. I assume you mean it's unusual that he did so during their cremation of care ceremony.

And I'm sorry I disagree with you and that I say I want proof of your... grandiose claims, but this isn't the "Blue Water gets to say whatever he wants and no-one dare question it" website. This is a discussion forum.
It's a mistake many new members when they realize everyone here won't immediately swallow their pet theory. I'm sorry you think I'm so terribly closed-minded (a belief which you might have to revise if you stay here a while), but I -- and many others here -- don't equate "open-mindedness" with believing anything anyone says.

And for all this, you still haven't given any reason for people to give credence to what you're suggesting is true.

--Jaylemurph
avs76
QUOTE (Leonardo @ Nov 16 2007, 11:59 PM) *
Many of the cultures with serpent/snake/reptile people in their mythology also have other animal forms anthropomorphised as part of their folklore. Take the Mesoamericans who had/have jaguar-people as a common motif, or the subcontinental monkey-people often mentioned in folkloric tales throughout the region. There are many, many instances of other animals being humanised in folklore and a simple search will discover this.

My apologies if you did not mean to suggest that mythic lore of animal-people was some kind of evidence for the actual existence of such, but pointing out only one of the animal-human motifs without the context of all the others is very misleading. It was common for early cultures to humanise animals native to their environment as part of their folklore, and this was not exclusive to snakes/reptiles.

Thanks for your post, Leonardo. I did not know about the other animal forms you gave as examples. I will read up on it.

jaylemurph said the was "waiting to see a pre-1970, pre-Doctor Who version of the Intelligent Reptile Men theory the OP mentions". I felt that the link I posted showed that the idea of reptile-men existed before 1970, and the concept was not spawned by the writers of Doctor Who. They may not be the insidious reptoids who have reportedly infiltrated all levels of government and industry in an effort to achieve world domination, but I thought I would mention them. Thanks again for your reply.
jaylemurph
Avs --

Let me clarify a bit: I wasn't suggesting (as you very ably showed) there weren't tales of reptile-men (and as Leo. put into context).
What I am suggesting is that the specific concept of intelligent, technologically advanced, pre-human, Terran reptilian humanoids bent on taking over the world through stealth arises out of the pens of sci-fi writers. I usually trot out the Silurians from Doctor Who because they so exactly match that description; there may well be other sources for that exact concept of which I'm ignorant (also I really like Doctor Who...).
The fact that Icke and related authors started writing about exactly the same thing years later for me only strengthens the argument that they saw these things on TV and then consciously forgot about them, only for them to re-appear as "amazing new concepts given to us from the ancients"...

--Jaylemurph
avs76
QUOTE (jaylemurph @ Nov 17 2007, 12:54 PM) *
Avs --

Let me clarify a bit: I wasn't suggesting (as you very ably showed) there weren't tales of reptile-men (and as Leo. put into context).
What I am suggesting is that the specific concept of intelligent, technologically advanced, pre-human, Terran reptilian humanoids bent on taking over the world through stealth arises out of the pens of sci-fi writers. I usually trot out the Silurians from Doctor Who because they so exactly match that description; there may well be other sources for that exact concept of which I'm ignorant (also I really like Doctor Who...).
The fact that Icke and related authors started writing about exactly the same thing years later for me only strengthens the argument that they saw these things on TV and then consciously forgot about them, only for them to re-appear as "amazing new concepts given to us from the ancients"...

--Jaylemurph

Yep, no worries. I see where you are coming from. Thanks original.gif
Z498
I will believe this if I have some HARD EVIDENCE. If it is true man I am gonna start a revolution. NO FREAKING ALIEN IS TAKING OVER MY MIND ILL POP A CAP IN THEIR (CENSOR).
Leonardo
QUOTE (jaylemurph @ Nov 17 2007, 01:54 AM) *
(also I really like Doctor Who...).

--Jaylemurph


Who doesn't??? huh.gif
REBEL
The top 4 or 5 arn't linking there BW...never mind i've seen that top one before if it's the same one(?)
Tsarion's a good researcher/speaker IMO from other talks i've seen.
Just to clarify tho he dos'nt speak & or never has of reptilians & or an agenda in fact i've heard him say that dudes like Icke may even done damage to other researchers for even bringing up the reptilian topic. Incidentally it's guys like Tsarion i think Icke ripped a lot of his so called research off. Tsarion does in fact speak of secret societies from the beginning gone bad, hence what we have today in mega rich satanic sects/cults eg skull & bones/global elite etc. He dosn't press or push the issue/topic onto anyone, he'll tell ya straight out over & over you want proof don't believe me, it's all around us go out and see/do the research for yourself.
Evil Origins of the earth <--thats only one of dozen or so talks hes done.

Just my basic take on it...make of it whatever ya like.


later.
crystal sage
QUOTE (mnemeion @ Nov , 08:33 PM)
It is also interesting that the whole System of living in this planet all keeps us in a life of consumption. All road points out to a system of consumption. All the information fed to us by the mass media partitions us to a certain social group where we are supposed to spend all our money on a certain commodity, from vanity products to books saying that the government is the evil and demonic. It's as if we are all programmed to be in a certain group of people who will choose a certain pattern of interest(like basketball or the occult) wherein we choose to live our life of consumption. This is how "Life" is dictated to us by this certain System. This is Earth-life, the way humans are supposed to life. Well, the alternative life is the life of a Buddhist monk, wherein you give up this Earth life and live a life where money is considered to be of no value.

Watch out. Another crackpot. tongue.gif It's just my observation.



Yes we were designed to be consumers... of food.. or resources.. for our comfort... as we too have added curiosity...and perhaps low threshholds of boredom.. so we have to create..find other ways of amusement other that causing trouble.. with our Triune Brains.. we require 3 times the stimulation ..

Even the Monks consume.. require food..clothing .. shelter.. gew gaws to keep them distracted.. to add other creative interests beside wandering around in the minds via meditiation..of course they are above aquiring these things for themselves.. they allow others to do for them....

They too are firm believers that whatever you give .. you receive, ten fold.....they give us inspiration.. guidance of spirit.. morals....light..... hence they have? ?Receive? spirit.. are seen as spiritual

Where is this going???

grin2.gif
Blueguardian
ok that is interesting, no offence but this is strangly similar to stargate
heres the simalarities

1. you have the evil aliens wanting to enslave us Goa'uld
2. you have them manipulating our DNA
3. a majority of aliens are friendly (the asgard)
4. the sun being powerful aka Ra the sun god
5. the advanced technology
6. spaceships
7. the need for a queen
8. the anctients are mentioned tongue.gif
9. the first episode of stargate is titled "Children Of The Gods"
10. in stargate they do mention an uprising in egypt, which caused the aliens to leave. (< i think thats right, cant remember the episode tongue.gif)

but i guess it is believable, then again im gonna need a lot more evidence probably from ancient sources before i believe it completly.

these are just a few simarlarities, good times, if all this turns out to be true somebody save me a staff weapon and a ticket to ride in a asguard spaceship original.gif tongue.gif
Carcharoth
linked-image

It seems that for every crackpot that dies, there are two born.
draconic chronicler
QUOTE (jaylemurph @ Nov 15 2007, 10:57 PM) *
Oh. Well. That's even worse.

The Illuminati are demonstrably not ancient (the 18th Century was a while ago, but again hardly ancient), demonstrably disbanded and didn't use snakes as their symbol.
Although to be fair, a lot of people who don't actually know that much about the two groups are fond of saying they're related.

And I'm still waiting to see a pre-1970, pre-Doctor Who version of the Intelligent Reptile Men theory the OP mentions.

--Jaylemurph


In truth, the "reptile men" is more of a modern concept as you suspect. The so called "evidence" stems from the world wide belief in intelligent dragons who became mankinds earliest Gods, teaching man many things, and in the case of Yahweh, aka the cannanite dragon Yaw, one of the most enduring Gods.

Because people nowadays generally do not believe "dragons" existed, or think they were invented from seeing dinosaur bones, the great dragons that worldwide legends state could swallow a human whole, have now been "downsized" to human sized reptilian aliens of the type we saw in Star Trek. And since few people believe in gods, these reptilians came here in flying saucers.

But the original legends which the modern "reptilain theorists" use, say nothing about them flying in space craft. They have wings and we see the them recorded in artwork snce the earliest time, more like beasts than creatures with great technology. Their titles indicate that the ancients did believe they came from heaven however, such as a hymn to Enki, the diety of the original Garden of Eden, who is called "the Great Serpent Dragon of Heaven". Centuries later, after the original dragons apparently "left", many of the dragon Gods would be depicted in human form, including Enki. Yahweh too (who some scholars beileve is a recast of Enki) is no longer imaigned as a dragon, despite His dragon idol mentioned in the bible, but now is a "bearded white guy" on a golden throne surround by winged angels who also in the original scripture, were just more of Yahweh's "dragon buddies".

avs76
QUOTE (draconic chronicler @ Nov 18 2007, 12:32 AM) *
In truth, the "reptile men" is more of a modern concept as you suspect. The so called "evidence" stems from the world wide belief in intelligent dragons who became mankinds earliest Gods, teaching man many things, and in the case of Yahweh, aka the cannanite dragon Yaw, one of the most enduring Gods.

Because people nowadays generally do not believe "dragons" existed, or think they were invented from seeing dinosaur bones, the great dragons that worldwide legends state could swallow a human whole, have now been "downsized" to human sized reptilian aliens of the type we saw in Star Trek. And since few people believe in gods, these reptilians came here in flying saucers.

But the original legends which the modern "reptilain theorists" use, say nothing about them flying in space craft. They have wings and we see the them recorded in artwork snce the earliest time, more like beasts than creatures with great technology. Their titles indicate that the ancients did believe they came from heaven however, such as a hymn to Enki, the diety of the original Garden of Eden, who is called "the Great Serpent Dragon of Heaven". Centuries later, after the original dragons apparently "left", many of the dragon Gods would be depicted in human form, including Enki. Yahweh too (who some scholars beileve is a recast of Enki) is no longer imaigned as a dragon, despite His dragon idol mentioned in the bible, but now is a "bearded white guy" on a golden throne surround by winged angels who also in the original scripture, were just more of Yahweh's "dragon buddies".

Hi dc, I was wondering when you were going to show up on this thread. Great info, well researched, as usual.
The Sandman
each UM uswer has a pet subject

for draconic chronicler its dragons...as his user id suggests..he sees dragons even in the toothpaste!
BELOWIM is for ancient electricty - the ark of the covenant and the bhagdad batteries!
Garry Denke is fanatic about the stonehenge and feels that all the world's missing treasures including the ark of the covenant, the pot of gold atthe end of the rainbow, and even the gate way to atlantis is beneath the stonehenge!
Weareallsuckers/WAAS is for egyptians in Australia and ancient migrations of races!
Kmt_Sesh has got a fetish for the Pharoahs!

tongue.gif
I wish i halso had a pet topic to harp upon!
Blue Water
Thank you for your reply, Blueguardian. You seem to be like me; looking for the truth.

Just like Mr. Jones (and this could only 'discredit' me as it could him: in the eyes of one who merely wants to discredit), I would have to admit that I don't see and know all. If I did, I wouldn't be having this discussion (I would be trying to educate instead of discuss.)

But there are things that I do know; many little things. A handful include: That our scientific achievements have far outreached our spiritual growth. That there is true evil in (or behind) humanity that is not of nature (and can be found nowhere in nature.) That we are often ego-centred and the ego does not like being exposed as a coward or a fool, and will deny hard evidence and worship various forms of ignorance to protect its pre-eminence. That tens of thousands of years ago this world saw colossal scientific achievements which we can scarcely imitate or even fathom today. That there are mass conspiracies, as there have been throughout history, which frighten many people away from even considering them. That there are reasons behind all of these facts which deserve to be sought out and explored.

Draconic Chronicler, I understand what you are saying. But what some of our great intellects are now telling us is that the opposite is true. And after I have observed their points and evidence, I have come to believe much of what they are saying. I have all ready posted a lot of hard evidence, but I'll be posting more.

(And please let me point out, my interest here is not to say that Reptilian overlords are real and that's it. I honestly don't know for sure, as I've stated at least a few times now. I am merely exploring this issue. If anyone feels there is no point in doing this, no one is forcing them to participate. (And let me clarify on this position: I am not saying criticism is unwelcome, only that some of the criticisms voiced above display a total lack of consideration and are thus nothing short of pure reluctance, thus their having been posted in this discussion is rude and totally unhelpful.)

Of course, I am assuming that UM members understand that there is futuristic ‘UFO’ technology on our planet, which has been subject to a worldwide conspiracy to conceal the truth. Otherwise, this conversation could barely get off the ground, as many people well-educated in that subject have trouble considering the Reptilian aspect, because it’s an even more frightening sub-category. But, assuming that you are up-to-speed on the general alien technology subject, I’ll continue with the Reptilian theory...

The Reptilian Infiltration:

http://www.alienseekernews.com/writers/rea...filtration.html
(ASN is actually a fantastic website for alien/UFO subjects. I suggest viewing their video library.)

Great Zulu Shaman and Elder Credo Mutwa:

http://www.sabon.org/credo/index2.html

Scientists find Extraterrestrial genes in Human DNA:

http://www.agoracosmopolitan.com/home/Fron...1/08/01288.html

Astral Dreamscape Manipulation (this is true at least some extent):

http://www.reptilianagenda.com/exp/e090800a.shtml

Alien Artefacts:

http://www.ufocasebook.com/alienartifacts.html
(This page lists just several of the many artefacts revealing that aliens and UFOs have interfered in our world throughout history. Sadly this page does not give more information in these images. I used to have at least a few that did. The depiction to the bottom right is clearly that of a Reptilian.)

(Evidence of) Ancient Egyptian Flight Technology:

http://www.crystalinks.com/ancientaircraft.html













crystal sage
I have often wondered at the history of the 'Aliens'... How did they come into 'being'??... did they have an Adam and Eve story???

<a href="http://www.informantnews.com/brief/doc1.html" target="_blank">http://www.informantnews.com/brief/doc1.html</a>

Were our Adam and Eve pioneers??

Explorers??

Or were they like the Australian convicts.. kicked out of their planet for some infraction... 'disobedience' .. and cast out to live the remainder of their lives to a distant planet..Earth.

There is speculation that earth was originally settled for mining purposes, and that perhaps Earth was worked by convicts.. or cheap labor from their home planets..... just as we are planing to settle and mine other planets.. like the Moon and Mars...

<a href="http://www.space.com/businesstechnology/te...ing_041110.html" target="_blank">http://www.space.com/businesstechnology/te...ing_041110.html</a>

Mining the Moon, Mars, and Asteroids
Written by G. Jeffrey Taylor
Hawai'i Institute of Geophysics and Planetology
http://www.psrd.hawaii.edu/Nov00/mining.html
Lotus Flower
QUOTE (jaylemurph @ Nov 17 2007, 01:54 AM) *
Avs --

Let me clarify a bit: I wasn't suggesting (as you very ably showed) there weren't tales of reptile-men (and as Leo. put into context).
What I am suggesting is that the specific concept of intelligent, technologically advanced, pre-human, Terran reptilian humanoids bent on taking over the world through stealth arises out of the pens of sci-fi writers. I usually trot out the Silurians from Doctor Who because they so exactly match that description; there may well be other sources for that exact concept of which I'm ignorant (also I really like Doctor Who...).
The fact that Icke and related authors started writing about exactly the same thing years later for me only strengthens the argument that they saw these things on TV and then consciously forgot about them, only for them to re-appear as "amazing new concepts given to us from the ancients"...

--Jaylemurph

This is what I think too Jaylemurph.

There is a mental condition whereby people can think that any movie or TV programme is referring to themselves or the world in general. Reptilians (Dr Who and "V") - give me a break.

Drinking the blood of humans to retain their humanoid shape?? - Purlease.

David Icke and the rest of his ilk are thinking upon lines that are not in my own reality, that's for sure. Skeptical? Just a bit.......

Of course, this is only my opinion....
avs76
QUOTE (crystal sage @ Nov 18 2007, 01:32 PM) *
I have often wondered at the history of the 'Aliens'... How did they come into 'being'??... did they have an Adam and Eve story???

<a href="http://www.informantnews.com/brief/doc1.html" target="_blank">http://www.informantnews.com/brief/doc1.html</a>

Were our Adam and Eve pioneers??

Explorers??

Or were they like the Australian convicts.. kicked out of their planet for some infraction... 'disobedience' .. and cast out to live the remainder of their lives to a distant planet..Earth.

There is speculation that earth was originally settled for mining purposes, and that perhaps Earth was worked by convicts.. or cheap labor from their home planets..... just as we are planing to settle and mine other planets.. like the Moon and Mars...

<a href="http://www.space.com/businesstechnology/te...ing_041110.html" target="_blank">http://www.space.com/businesstechnology/te...ing_041110.html</a>

Mining the Moon, Mars, and Asteroids
Written by G. Jeffrey Taylor
Hawai'i Institute of Geophysics and Planetology
<a href="http://www.psrd.hawaii.edu/Nov00/mining.html" target="_blank">http://www.psrd.hawaii.edu/Nov00/mining.html</a>

I think there are a similarities between the modern "myths" about aliens, and european folklore concerning "little people" (pixies, fairies, sprites, etc).
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