Though less well-known than the other haunted places, the Fox Sisters cottage is perhaps the most important haunted house of all, since the phenomena here in many ways set the standard for later hauntings and even launched a religion. In 1848 Hydesville, western New York, two young sisters named Maggie and Katie Fox began supposedly communicating with the ghost of a murdered peddler. The sisters, in a sort of crude seance, would ask questions of the spirit, who would answer back with mysterious knocks or raps. Many people, including their mother, were amazed at what seemed to be genuine contact with the dead. Both sisters eventually admitted that they had actually faked the sounds--there had been no murdered peddler, it had all been a prank. The women even demonstrated how they had done it. But by then the belief had taken on a life of its own as a religion called Spiritualism, which is still practiced today.
http://www.livescience.com/strangenews/top...d_places-1.html
In 1888, Maggie made the infamous appearance when she denounced Spiritualism as a total sham. The years of alcohol abuse, loneliness and grief had taken their toll on her and she weighed the idea of committing suicide before finally choosing confession instead. She booked the stage at the New York Academy of Music and walked out on stage to announce she and Kate had created the strange rappings heard in their Hydesville home by simply cracking their toes. She also stated that Leah had forced them into performing as mediums for the public. "I have seen so much miserable deception," she reportedly said. "That is why I am willing to state that Spiritualism is a fraud of the worst description." Sitting in a box overlooking the stage, Kate silently affirmed her sister's confession.
While the critics laughed and cried “I told you so”, devoted Spiritualists denounced Margaret’s confession as the ravings of a sad and tired drunk. Kate, who did not speak at the public appearance, later stated that she did not agree with her sister and she continued to perform as a medium. In 1891, Margaret would recant her confession. Many have said that the confession was a sham itself. They maintain that Maggie and Kate only renounced the movement to spite their sister Leah, who they had grown to hate. Leah had since married a wealthy and respectable businessman and using the fortune that had been gained for her by her sisters, she had long ago turned her back on Maggie and Kate, who she considered an embarrassment.
http://www.prairieghosts.com/foxsisters.html
so if the founders of spiritualism,the fox sisters and they claimed it to be a tottal hoax .how has this form of deception survived so long...taking advantage of people in pain just hoping to get one last message from lost loved ones has got to be the worst hustle a conman can come up with.
Full Version: spiritualism based on a hoax
Unexplained Mysteries Discussion Forums > Unexplained Mysteries > Spirituality, Religion and Beliefs
As far as I am aware, the body of the peddlar was found, link below:
The Fox Sisters and The Peddlar
Now if it was, indeed the body of the peddlar, the question begs to be asked why would The Fox Sisters say they had faked the whole thing? If they had not faked it but were just saying they had, perhaps it was because they wanted privacy, which their "fame" was denying them.
The Fox Sisters and The Peddlar
Now if it was, indeed the body of the peddlar, the question begs to be asked why would The Fox Sisters say they had faked the whole thing? If they had not faked it but were just saying they had, perhaps it was because they wanted privacy, which their "fame" was denying them.
Spiritualism was around alot longer than the fox sisters as it has been in my family for many generations , we come from a long line of spiritualists. There are many fraudulent people out there but this does not prove spiritualism is a hoax, it only proves people will cash in on anything and disrespect honest people.
QUOTE (Lotus Flower @ Nov 19 2007, 12:57 PM) 
As far as I am aware, the body of the peddlar was found, link below:
The Fox Sisters and The Peddlar
Now if it was, indeed the body of the peddlar, the question begs to be asked why would The Fox Sisters say they had faked the whole thing? If they had not faked it but were just saying they had, perhaps it was because they wanted privacy, which their "fame" was denying them.
The Fox Sisters and The Peddlar
Now if it was, indeed the body of the peddlar, the question begs to be asked why would The Fox Sisters say they had faked the whole thing? If they had not faked it but were just saying they had, perhaps it was because they wanted privacy, which their "fame" was denying them.
i did some further research after making this post,and it all depends on the web sight,if they are more pro spiritualism then they say the peddlers body was found..if the web sight is using the story as prof of a hoax they say nothing about the body or a body was never found..but they allll acredit the fox sisters for starting the spiritual movement.
QUOTE (asc.rudeboy @ Nov 19 2007, 08:12 PM)
i did some further research after making this post,and it all depends on the web sight,if they are more pro spiritualism then they say the peddlers body was found..if the web sight is using the story as prof of a hoax they say nothing about the body or a body was never found..but they allll acredit the fox sisters for starting the spiritual movement.
Ahh right, that explains the diverse explanations then.
I too, after reading your OP, went onto different sites and found differences.
I do remember reading, many years ago, an article on the Fox Sisters and how the Spiritualist Movement "took off" because of their claims.
Post more information if you find any Asc, I doubt whether it will ever be discovered that the Peddlars body was indeed discovered for sure though. Shame
QUOTE (asc.rudeboy @ Nov 18 2007, 06:37 PM)
Though less well-known than the other haunted places, the Fox Sisters cottage is perhaps the most important haunted house of all, since the phenomena here in many ways set the standard for later hauntings and even launched a religion. In 1848 Hydesville, western New York, two young sisters named Maggie and Katie Fox began supposedly communicating with the ghost of a murdered peddler. The sisters, in a sort of crude seance, would ask questions of the spirit, who would answer back with mysterious knocks or raps. Many people, including their mother, were amazed at what seemed to be genuine contact with the dead. Both sisters eventually admitted that they had actually faked the sounds--there had been no murdered peddler, it had all been a prank. The women even demonstrated how they had done it. But by then the belief had taken on a life of its own as a religion called Spiritualism, which is still practiced today.
http://www.livescience.com/strangenews/top...d_places-1.html
In 1888, Maggie made the infamous appearance when she denounced Spiritualism as a total sham. The years of alcohol abuse, loneliness and grief had taken their toll on her and she weighed the idea of committing suicide before finally choosing confession instead. She booked the stage at the New York Academy of Music and walked out on stage to announce she and Kate had created the strange rappings heard in their Hydesville home by simply cracking their toes. She also stated that Leah had forced them into performing as mediums for the public. "I have seen so much miserable deception," she reportedly said. "That is why I am willing to state that Spiritualism is a fraud of the worst description." Sitting in a box overlooking the stage, Kate silently affirmed her sister's confession.
While the critics laughed and cried “I told you so”, devoted Spiritualists denounced Margaret’s confession as the ravings of a sad and tired drunk. Kate, who did not speak at the public appearance, later stated that she did not agree with her sister and she continued to perform as a medium. In 1891, Margaret would recant her confession. Many have said that the confession was a sham itself. They maintain that Maggie and Kate only renounced the movement to spite their sister Leah, who they had grown to hate. Leah had since married a wealthy and respectable businessman and using the fortune that had been gained for her by her sisters, she had long ago turned her back on Maggie and Kate, who she considered an embarrassment.
http://www.prairieghosts.com/foxsisters.html
so if the founders of spiritualism,the fox sisters and they claimed it to be a tottal hoax .how has this form of deception survived so long...taking advantage of people in pain just hoping to get one last message from lost loved ones has got to be the worst hustle a conman can come up with.
http://www.livescience.com/strangenews/top...d_places-1.html
In 1888, Maggie made the infamous appearance when she denounced Spiritualism as a total sham. The years of alcohol abuse, loneliness and grief had taken their toll on her and she weighed the idea of committing suicide before finally choosing confession instead. She booked the stage at the New York Academy of Music and walked out on stage to announce she and Kate had created the strange rappings heard in their Hydesville home by simply cracking their toes. She also stated that Leah had forced them into performing as mediums for the public. "I have seen so much miserable deception," she reportedly said. "That is why I am willing to state that Spiritualism is a fraud of the worst description." Sitting in a box overlooking the stage, Kate silently affirmed her sister's confession.
While the critics laughed and cried “I told you so”, devoted Spiritualists denounced Margaret’s confession as the ravings of a sad and tired drunk. Kate, who did not speak at the public appearance, later stated that she did not agree with her sister and she continued to perform as a medium. In 1891, Margaret would recant her confession. Many have said that the confession was a sham itself. They maintain that Maggie and Kate only renounced the movement to spite their sister Leah, who they had grown to hate. Leah had since married a wealthy and respectable businessman and using the fortune that had been gained for her by her sisters, she had long ago turned her back on Maggie and Kate, who she considered an embarrassment.
http://www.prairieghosts.com/foxsisters.html
so if the founders of spiritualism,the fox sisters and they claimed it to be a tottal hoax .how has this form of deception survived so long...taking advantage of people in pain just hoping to get one last message from lost loved ones has got to be the worst hustle a conman can come up with.
I know that the Fox sisters encountered many nay-sayers and critics, but I have also visited the community that they founded and still exists today. The town is in the far west side of New York state and is called Lily Dale. It is a closed community of phychics, mediums and healers. Some live year-round and others just for the summer when they open to the public, where anyone can rent a room at a B&B over 100 years old. You can attend a genuine sweat lodge ceremony on Fridays, go to the outdoor message services in the woods, or just relax by the lake. I was able to take night pictures that showed a see-through threesome by a lighted fountain, looking like they were having a light conversation in early 1900's dressware! It was great!
The museum has pictues of famous guests, like Susan B. Anthony and even today they get visitors like John Edwards, James von Praugh etc. These people are tested before they can even live there. They are the real deal. I have experienced it. Even the grass there feels alive somehow. It's a place of some kind of energy that I have never experienced before. I came out changed, I was a Spritualist before, just by nature and defualt, but after that, I have to say that there is no going back now.
I doubt very much that they were fakes, what I do think is that they could not hold out under the pressure of those days. Even Susan B. Anthony was often advised not to go there as it would give her reputation a black eye. Her cousin was part of the community and had a home there and besides "No one" told Ms. Anthony what to do. Or so said the curator of the museum.
I found and joined a church in my area and now I feel that there is a place that I finally fit in. I believe in the eternal nature of our spirit. I believe that there are people that have the ability to discern the presence of spirit. I beleive that they exist side by side with us on a differnet level of existence learning how best to move forward on their journey to higher planes and finally to ascend into the light of the "Creator", and where we came from.
QUOTE
Even Susan B. Anthony was often advised not to go there as it would give her reputation a black eye. Her cousin was part of the community and had a home there and besides "No one" told Ms. Anthony what to do. Or so said the curator of the museum.
I know very little about the Fox sisters. Other than Houdini spent an inordinate amount of time challenging that era's "Spiritualists" and probably more accurately "psychics" to contests so he could debunk them. Honestly, he did a pretty good job. He made fools of more of them than I can count.
Regarding Susan B. Anthony, she is a well known Christian Spiritualist being a Quaker. It's always been pretty tough to tell any Quaker woman what she can and can't do. haha. And thank goodness, Quaker women were instrumental in the suffregette movement, precisely because they couldn't be told how to behave or act, and they were backed up by their men (husbands, fathers, uncles, sons, brothers).
Lotus
I'm not too well up on the sisters either but i read a book by aurthur conan doyle in which he said this about the toe cracking .
This is a link to his e book its long but the hydesville account can be found starting on page 22 half way down . He also mentions that the remains of the supposed peddlar was found 56yrs later in the basement later by children.
aurthur conan doyle - hydesville
I'm not too well up on the sisters either but i read a book by aurthur conan doyle in which he said this about the toe cracking .
QUOTE
The neighbours came flocking in as some rumours of these wonders got about, and the two children were carried off by one of them, while Mrs. Fox went to spend the night at Mrs. Redfield's. In their absence the phenomena went on exactly the same as before, which disposes once for all of those theories of cracking toes and dislocating knees which have been so frequently put forward by people unaware of the true facts.
This is a link to his e book its long but the hydesville account can be found starting on page 22 half way down . He also mentions that the remains of the supposed peddlar was found 56yrs later in the basement later by children.
aurthur conan doyle - hydesville
QUOTE
In the summer of 1848 Mr. David Fox, with the assistance of Mr. Henry Bush, Mr. Lyman Granger, of Rochester, and others, resumed digging in the cellar. At a depth of five feet they found a plank, and further digging disclosed charcoal and quicklime, and finally human hair and bones, which were pronounced by expert medical testimony to belong to a human skeleton. It was not until fifty-six years later that a further discovery was made which proved beyond all doubt that someone had really been buried in the cellar of the Fox house.
This statement appeared in the BOSTON JOURNAL (a non-Spiritualistic paper) of November 23, 1904, and runs as follows:
Rochester, N.Y., Nov. 22nd, 1904: The skeleton of the man supposed to have caused the rappings first heard by the Fox sisters in 1848 has been found in the walls of the house occupied by the sisters, and clears them from the only shadow of doubt held concerning their sincerity in the discovery of spirit communication.
The Fox sisters declared they learned to communicate with the spirit of a man, and that he told them he had been murdered and buried in the cellar. Repeated excavations failed to locate the body and thus give proof positive of their story.
The discovery was made by school-children playing in the cellar of the building in Hydesville known as the "Spook House," where the Fox sisters heard the wonderful rappings.
This statement appeared in the BOSTON JOURNAL (a non-Spiritualistic paper) of November 23, 1904, and runs as follows:
Rochester, N.Y., Nov. 22nd, 1904: The skeleton of the man supposed to have caused the rappings first heard by the Fox sisters in 1848 has been found in the walls of the house occupied by the sisters, and clears them from the only shadow of doubt held concerning their sincerity in the discovery of spirit communication.
The Fox sisters declared they learned to communicate with the spirit of a man, and that he told them he had been murdered and buried in the cellar. Repeated excavations failed to locate the body and thus give proof positive of their story.
The discovery was made by school-children playing in the cellar of the building in Hydesville known as the "Spook House," where the Fox sisters heard the wonderful rappings.
^ hmm it's interesting, but I wouldn't really take anything Arthur Conan Doyle says seriously. He was really into the supernatural, and really quick to believe anything even when there was no evidence to support his claims. He tried to convince everyone that Houdini had super powers, even though Houdini himself tried to explain it was simply magic tricks - Doyle didn't believe him. There was also the Cottingley Fairies, which were clearly fake, but of which he was a big supporter. I think he just had a big imagination and took everything that was told to him as truth in order to support his personal fantasies.
QUOTE (NatalieK @ Nov 20 2007, 01:00 AM)
^ hmm it's interesting, but I wouldn't really take anything Arthur Conan Doyle says seriously. He was really into the supernatural, and really quick to believe anything even when there was no evidence to support his claims. He tried to convince everyone that Houdini had super powers, even though Houdini himself tried to explain it was simply magic tricks - Doyle didn't believe him. There was also the Cottingley Fairies, which were clearly fake, but of which he was a big supporter. I think he just had a big imagination and took everything that was told to him as truth in order to support his personal fantasies.
Oh really wow its the only book i ever read on spiritualism really . i never really bought into the whole spiritualism thinking of theres only good spirits and only mediums can see them and such all seemed too convenient . so its the only book in which i ever heard of the fox sisters . which was why i posted it .
I'll think twice next time LOL . i will have to do some research on him now i guess . thanks
I never heard of the Fox Sisters, even if they were fake doesn't mean all psychics, mediums, and healers are too. Yeah there are people who take advantage of people when a loved one past doesn't mean they should all be called frauds.
By the way I would love to go to Lily Dale, New York that would be really cool to meet people I can relate to.
By the way I would love to go to Lily Dale, New York that would be really cool to meet people I can relate to.
QUOTE (spiritual_soul79 @ Nov 19 2007, 09:07 PM)
Oh really wow its the only book i ever read on spiritualism really . i never really bought into the whole spiritualism thinking of theres only good spirits and only mediums can see them and such all seemed too convenient . so its the only book in which i ever heard of the fox sisters . which was why i posted it .
I'll think twice next time LOL . i will have to do some research on him now i guess . thanks
I'll think twice next time LOL . i will have to do some research on him now i guess . thanks
I think you'd do a lot better if you did some research on Edgar Cayce who is not so easily dismissed. He could diagnose a patient in a sleep or trance state even at long distances. He was more often on the money than not, and no one could ever explain away how he could do it. For your information, there aren't just "good spirits and only mediums can see them and such". Spiritualists believe that we all have the ability to connect with spirit, not all of us choose to tap into that ability. Some are born with a thinner veil between them and the other plane of existence, some people experience strange things but choose to ignore them. Some "spirits" may not know that they are dead, have unfinished business, may be strongly emotionally tied to a place or fear judgment, some just lose their way. Depending on their temperaments in life, or the circumstances of their death, they may be angry or consider others in their home an intrusion.
I just found this Site on Edgar Cayce, it is quite interesting:
Edgar Cayce
Out of interest, wasn't there some sort of report of Edgar Cayce levitating out of a window and back in again? I wish I could remember where I read that though.
Edgar Cayce
Out of interest, wasn't there some sort of report of Edgar Cayce levitating out of a window and back in again? I wish I could remember where I read that though.
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