I've been studying some very basic physics and metaphysics and there may be a connection between your sine wave (as measured by frequency) and the progression of your soul/spirit. Any thoughts on this?

Would you mind explaining how a person can "have" a sine wave?

Any chance someone explaining what a "sine wave" is? (In layman's terms mind).

a sine wave is the fundamental frequency at which you vibrate.
when i do readings for people, or feel the need to tell them what they need to hear ( freaks people out, having a stranger tell them about whats going on in their lives, and what they need to do )
i tune into their frequency, this opens a gateway so they can tell me what they need to hear.
on a scientific level.
our brains work on bioelectric energy. all electric energy has a frequency, in essence our brain acts as a cb radio, able to transmit and recieve.
primitive instuments pick up this energy as static, another radio will pick it up. hence telepathy.
two people saying the same thing at the same time, picking up the phone with intent to call someone and they are on the phone before it rings calling you.
mothers in the first while after birth have this ability hightend naturaly ( it is an instinct ) some will continue, some wont, depending on their own views and how much they have been trained to close it off.
people that come from a background where the whole idea is called crazy, and people are riddiculed have a harder time breaking the mental patterns.

Ahh thanks

So I am now presuming that the original poster was asking that could our soul progression be measured by our sine wave/vibration?

I am now interested to know that if by somehow raising the vibrations it could speed any such progression - not that I am sure that would be such a good thing mind, forcing it all.

"the eternal me", thanks for the info. Maybe you can help me with this response I have.

Layman's terms are all I have and I'm stealing from an array of sources who‘s titles I‘ve forgotten. Trying to ascertain the source of the "soul" coupled with the fact I was brought-up in a “Christian home“, I looked to the Bible; specifically, Genesis. Scripture there states (from memory - not quoting) on two occasions that God made light - the second occasion being the greater and lesser in the heavens (the sun and moon I assume). Another side argument for this belongs on another thread; namely, how did God create the things he/she did in “a day” before the sun was created?

I then asked myself, "what was the first light?" Is it our direct link to God? Is it the "sparks" of energy that make up our "souls"? Is this "light" the life force of the universe? Light has a duality to it: it is particles and waves. Further research led me to find that the wave-particle duality applies to all objects (Einstein's E=MC2 has proven that all is energy; therefore, everything we sense is energy including ourselves. Matter is made up of atoms. Atoms are 1% energy and 99% space. Atoms vibrate and the rate of vibration or the ossicilation of the energy will produce a sine wave when measured.).

Having studied some philosophy, I started thinking to myself that maybe Plato was right with his story of the Allegorical Cave - We don’t live in reality, we only see the “shadows” of the real world. Maybe, if we can tune our frequency to this real world we will be able to experience it more fully than just “shadows.”

Did the prophets of the major religions have this “fine attunement” of their frequency? If so, how does one acquire this “fine attunement” (fasting, meditating, dieting, confessing, etc.)? Is this what happens when you involve yourself with astral projection?

this is unrelated, and I apologize for that.

but your signature quote is the best. 'the unexamined life is not worth living.' what a thinker ol' socrates was~

anywho...back to the discussion. I don't really have anything to add...but I'ma keep on reading,

light and creation.

in the begining god created light.

light is energy, thought is energy.

the first light was the energy of creation - thought.

all energy has a frequency, weather our primitive instruments can detect frequencies as high as thought. not yet.
but you all know that buzz of energy you get when inspired. that is the energy of creation. from there anything is possible.

can your progress be measured by the sine wave you give off? yes.

the farther along you move, the more powerfull ( and higher in frequncy ) your thoughts become, and this is refected by the energy you give off, some people can "feel" this energy, and reffer to those that give it off as "old souls".

can it be used to speed things along? yes. going into a state of meditation you raise your vibrations to break free of the physical world. after a while this state of raised vibrations becomes your new vibration, the more frequently you raise your vibrations, the more aclimatized you become to that state.

plato was right in that we see a shadow of the real world, but is what we percieve a reflection of what we believe? if this is so, then the world we live in and the way we precieve it is a creation of our own.
two people in a room - how many rooms are they sitting in? 1 - no sorry, but each of the people sitting in that room have their own view of it. is it 2 rooms? maybe, but still there has to be some commonality that they agree on. so it would only stand to reason that they are sitting in 3 rooms. the one each of them sees as the room in their exsistance = 2 plus the common room that they share = 3
to see the common room as it truely is, would be like seeing everything sort of translucent.

the prophets you speak of, yes they were very in tune. speaking of things that most people are not "in tune" with set them apart, thats why people still gravitate to their teachings, it is within all of us and starts with the desire to learn.

all of the means that are used, and have been use to achieve this fine tuning of oneself are valid and work. all have the common thread of focus and clear thought, this is the central thread to all paths. when you calm your mind and let free the stress and emotional turmoil of life can we hear the voices on the wind. hear the "voice of god" ( the christ within, for you christians out there )

once you involve yourself with astral projection, and start becoming fluid and natural with it, then a higher state of learning begins. because then the purpose of you doing it changes and you are taught to go out and do what is asked of you by creator. it no longer is something that is a toy for you to play with. it is a tool for you to use. this is why the prophets became prophets ( named by the people surounding them ) they would be called teachers by themselvs. thats what all the writings are about, regarless of what religion you look at. because once you have the knowledge, what are you going to do with it? you want to share it, help people see the amazing things around them everyday, feel the amazing amount of love the universe is made of ( even thought there are things that would have you believe otherwise )
but once you start walking on the astral plane, the nature of life and death changes for you.

a good chunk of learning that takes place in astral projection is by family, gone and not born yet. ( as these people are in your lives across many lives ) as well as the nature of reencarnation becomes clearer, as time and space are concepts so we can share a reality in which we may live with each other and have the life experiances that teach us so much.

but once free of the body and walking the astral plane time and space do not exsist. you are free to go anywhere and anywhen. this is a hard concept to grasp, we are so used to one instance following another, how we think is a flow of one thought to the next. but a thousand years is but a day to god. this is why.

i want to write on reencarnation seeing as i brought it up.

we dont live one life after another. if time and space does not exsist to the spirit. it stands to reason that we live many lives at once. the concept of this is also being explored by quantum physics in the form of many dimensions reaching out in all directions.

i could keep going, but the body needs rest, and there is work to be done.

Bold above is mine.

Well after reading this you can color me just a little lost.....

Kevin A.

If there is a creation, there must be a creator. I beleive you are correct in asking "which creator." That is possibly what is being discussed here though it isn't obvious.

What do you mean when you say "I see amazing things around me everyday but they have nothing to do with love or a creator."?

What is your definition of "love"?

What things do you see everyday that have nothing to do with "love" or a "creator"?

I agree with you that your life/death perspective changes daily while the actual nature of life/death does not. Humankind has created an array of religions; each of which, attempt to bring these two together into one paradigm.

I, like you, am lost. Hopefully, after being lost one can find a "truer" path.

We came into existence. Some how, some way, we and everything around is came to be. There was a "creator" of some sort. A source of energy, a catalyst, a lucky chance happening etc. This does not mean there is a one conscious creator or some sentient being that put things into motion. Not a higher power or some god. Some THING happened, not some ONE.

When I say I see things around me that have nothing to do with love or a creator I mean I see all of what life is. I see people abiding by those four things I mentioned. Be born, survive, breed and die. Everything we do is a shade of one of these. We do not do things for love or because some creator endowed us to. Everything we do is a shade of survival.

Good things, bad things, cruel things, cold things, happy things, selfish things, selfless things etc etc. It all has to do with surviving. I see the beauty in nature but it has nothing to do with a creator. I see the amazing balance of nature and its not done for love.

Define love? I dont think Shakespeare himself managed that one did he? lol If I had to define it in simple scientific terms I guess it would be an addiction to the feelings we get when we are around some one or some thing. Some one or some thing make us feel good and we want to continue those feelings. No its not a very pretty or poetic take on it, and my girlfriend would probably be disappointed in that definition, but I think its just that simple.

I think humankind has created religions to feel better about itself. To feel more important than the other animals running around this planet. To feel superior. To not feel lost in this world. To not feel alone in this world. To feel or believe that death is not the end. To explain the unknown. To gain power and control. All in all very selfish reasons....

Kevin A.

My question regarding the "sine wave" is to possibly eliminate humankind's need for religions and their subsequent controls they place on us.

ok at first when reading your post I was starting to think you were just trying to deny the existance that at least someTHING had to have created our existance. ....and in turn I began to what I think of in a creator...and I have never referred to that something as a god, in particular, or a goddess...and mostly I've come to believe that those who do , do so in order to describe a particular aspect of their creator...not that the named god/goddess is actually the almighty one, or whatever.

but anyways...what I think of as amazing everyday are all the simple patterns that run our lives...the extreme intricateness of absolutely everything in life....there are no two living things/nonliving things that will at some point effect one another...no matter how far apart.it's the same as when you think about the choices in your life and how the smallest details have made major differences in ones life, and so on...The delicate designs of much of sea life and just the way how everything exists in order to survive, as you suggest..suggests a much more 'thought' out plan of action. even the fact that so much of life can be explained by science is pretty neat....imagine if life weren't so planned out, or patterned as it is....I don't think it would be quite so easy to track or have accurate scientific tests done with it...we'd be clueless without the bit of 'chaotic neatness' of our world.

now to my point...my "creator" is not someONE and I do think it is silly for anyone to think that there is just some guy sitting around conducting our lives....but the very basic elements of life that span over all existance...the stuff that binds us together no matter what and 'keep things moving' is the creator....not that my form of explanation is all mystical or anything....but would explain why so many will tell you, if they so prefer the term 'god' , that god is everywhere and within all of us......because everything that is,has been, or will be created....will take part of those basic elements of life and continue as we do until death...and even in death, springs life.

I just can't, for myself, get over the many little interweaving prospects of life.

I much agree with you about religions....religions are silly and tend to setback the people who partake in them...but definately not always, just those who think that their way is the only way and all others are condemned to 'insert horrible afterlife' ....those people don't really seem to know the true nature of wisdom or way of life and are really more self-doubting of their beliefs and need to rethink them, even if their beliefs remain, they should have more basis than fear or blindly following what people say is the only 'right' way to righteousness, etc. etc.. On the flip side though...many people do come to learn much more about themselves and the reality of creation that they live in through whichever religion it is that they choose and are able to accept that everyone has their own path of reasoning...in fact many of the more major religions all have the same stories with different names inserted....what's in a name?

i guess those are just my thoughts on that....interesting topic.

Very well put lucinda. I beleive that the term humankind calls "science" is simply the study of the laws of the creator. Religions do all have their good points; however, many have their bad points. I haven't seen any yet where the good outweigh the bad. "What is truth and how do we know it?" - Socrates

"now to my point...my "creator" is not someONE and I do think it is silly for anyone to think that there is just some guy sitting around conducting our lives....but the very basic elements of life that span over all existance...the stuff that binds us together no matter what and 'keep things moving' is the creator....not that my form of explanation is all mystical or anything....but would explain why so many will tell you, if they so prefer the term 'god' , that god is everywhere and within all of us......because everything that is,has been, or will be created....will take part of those basic elements of life and continue as we do until death...and even in death, springs life."

right.

i see creator as the consiosness of all living things that are bound by the energies that make us all.
not an individual.

during an out of body experiance, i went to the moon to reflect on the earth.
ask an astronoght what this viewpoint did to them.

i believe that science is looking for the question to the awnser that sits before us.

Kevin A. - i would not say that you are a little lost. far from it. one who asks questions along the jorney as to where this road goes where that road goes, is not lost. they are exploring the country side.

i like your questions, i like the way you think.
it gets other people thinking, and thats what its all about, dont let anyone think for you. find your own truth.
everyone has valid points in what they say. no one indavidual has all the awnsers, but if you listen to what people have to say? it changes your world just a tiny bit, weather you agree with them or not.

i am here sharing my insight of having grown up with psycic abilities and never having them closed off.
so i share what i believe, no more no less.
i help people open up and explore what the nature of reality and life are, i learn as much from them as they do from me, its a wonderfull exchange.
anyone can develop their psycic abilities, weather you chose to is your choice.

i love what you said about the two people in the room, sooooo cooool. you nailed it right on the head. the only reason i chose the example of two people sitting in three rooms is that it is far easier to grasp for most people then the infinit number of realities that suround us always.
if you look at it in that perspective, you are not 1. you are made of the consiousness of all the individual cells working in cooperation to give you form ( billions of them with their own view of what is real ). with your own consiousness being the driver ( if you relate your body to being a car ) even in machinery all the parts have to work together to function correctly. so as you sit with this concept, you are not alone hahahahahahaha. there are billions of you thinking about it.
do you see why i chose two people sitting in three rooms?

in the begining god created light.

just a quote.

the first light was the energy of creation - thought.

Maybe not.....

just how how i precieve it. some will agree some wont. thats fine.

actualy our instruments are still pretty primative, what the general population has access to will not measure frequencies that get into the range of deca hertz.

hertz
kilohertz
gigahertz
decahertz

as you know all multiples on a factor of 10. instruments that measure gigahertz have an antena in the millimeter to a fraction of that. when freqencies get into wave lengths that are shorter than the width of a molecule, it gets kind of hard to make an antenna that will pick it up and measure it.

but that is not why the computer industry has hit the proccesor speed wall we currently see. the next phase of processors will have to function on light, not because of the frequency, but due to the magnetic fields that electricity induces as it travels "through" a conductor. when you are dealing with speaker cables this is nothing ( unless you have lighting cables running parralel to signal cables, then you get that anouying 60 hz hm, 50 if you live in europe, aisa or asutrailia ) sorry way off topic. light does not induce a "field" that will cause distortion in a neigboring conductor.

the highest frequency instruments to date are in the gigahertz range, and they are not publicly accesible. consumer electronic measuring devices are tuned to what most housholds will have 50-60 hrtz ( europe and north america respectivly ) musical devices will generate frequencies into 196 kilohertz ( the human ear can only hear 20 hertz to 20 kilohertz, you "feel" the higher and lower frequencies )
and the devices that can pickup higher frequencies are particle accelorators ( not many people can go out and buy one of these babies, what most people dont know is that area 51 was built by bell. there is a particle accelorator under the ground there that was used in making the first atomic bomb. bell still owns area 51, but leases it out to aircraft manufacturers for testing of new "black" planes. they security guys in the black trucks and black helicopters are not government. they are a privetly owned security force with special rights granted by the government ) ok way off topic again.


Actaully that "Buzz of energy when you get inspired" is subjective. Out of the brilliant people I have met only a few get that "buzz" of energy when inspired. I have met several engineers that were quite lethargic when at their best.....


is it their passion? or their job? really big differance. these engineers that you speak of, they may be at their best at work, but what makes them passionate. what would they love to make a living at instead. and if it is the field they are working in, maybe they need a vacation ( just an obsevation )

Old souls, per the definition I am used to, means someone is wise beyond their years, has an interest in the old ways of doing things or believes in chivalry or older outlooks on life. Im not talking about some ancient forgotten culture way of life either. How did you come by this new definition as you use it?

wise beyond their years.

To see the common room as it truly is, would be like seeing everything as very very opaque and real. I like to call it reality....

have you tried LSD, aparently this is how the world looks to someone with schitsophreanea ( no clue how to spell it ) their reality is no less valid than your own, but your walls dont look like they are melting do they? ( in depth conversation with the brother of an ex who suffered from it, really feel for the guy, smart, inteligent, and able to remember what things looked like before it got him, and could describe the experiance by the use of using drugs as a referance, it didnt get him till he was 25, and by then he had done a fair bit of drugs. please people, dont blame drug use as the cause of it, it is a malfunction of the brains ability to chemicaly balance itself, and is a genetic disorder, not like narcotic psycosis, two completly different things here )

so it is your reality, remember we are sitting in a whole plethora of rooms right now.

What of those that have no god in this world? That have looked and see no hand of god? Hear no voices on the wind? See nothing when we look beyond? No, we are not blind. We see life for what there is to be seen. Like every other creature on this planet we have simple task in life. There is no higher calling, no destiny, none of that. Be born, survive, breed and die. Everything else is fluff.


i like this. it reminds me of a story i heard in a bible study ( a joke really )

a man was sitting on his roof, because a flood had covered the rest of his house, and the man cried out "lord please save me" and a couple minets later a man in a boat comes by nad says "get in, let me take you to safety" to which the man on the roof replies "no thank you, i am waiting for the lord to save me" so the man in the boat motors off.
so now the guy is up to his knees in water and he cries out "oh lord please save me" no sooner does another guy in a boat comes by and says "let me take you to safety" the man on the roof says once more"no thankyou i am waiting for the lord to save me" so the guy in the boat motors off.
now the guy is up to his neck in water and he is crying "oh lord why have you frosaken me?" and he drowns.
so now he is sitting in heaven asking his lord why he forsok the man.

to which the lord replies "what do you mean, when you asked me the first time did i not send someone to help you, and again when you asked the second time"

the man on the roof did not hear the voice of his lord but the men in the boats did.

i am not writing this down as proof of, just as a means of explaining what i was talking about.
havent you ever had someone show up out of the blue that had the awnsers that you needed, or with the helping hand. stopped to help you on the side of the road.
when i need a hand i ask "the universe" not a god or creator, i believe that my request goes out and is replied to by the nearest person that is willing to help. atheist or not. hell i have even had satanists show up, i even know satanists. but what they believe is no more nor less valid than what i believe. its what works for them.

what works for you?

Your perspective on life and death changes. Your beliefs may change. The nature of life and death will, most likely, remain as cold as ever....

thats a valid point. i am not here to change your opinion or your perspective. i believe otherwise. from what i have experianced ( people i have talked with, living and dead ) and where my life has taken me and the people that are in my life and have left my physical reality.

"When I say I see things around me that have nothing to do with love or a creator I mean I see all of what life is. I see people abiding by those four things I mentioned. Be born, survive, breed and die. Everything we do is a shade of one of these. We do not do things for love or because some creator endowed us to. Everything we do is a shade of survival. "

this brings up somthing interesting here. i will lay it out and explain what i mean.

meditation and the color spectrum ( chakras )

first the color spectrum and what the colors mean, and where they are located.

red - survival instinct - at the bass of the spine just behind the colon.
orange - procreation - in men, about an inch below the navel - in women, between the ovaries.
yellow - emotion - at the solar plexus
green - empathy - right over the heart
blue - comunication - the dip in the top of the rib cage where the colar bones connect
purple - the third eye - just above the centre of the brow about a finger width
violet - the crown chakra - the soft spot on a babys head - position remains the same troughout life
mauve - about 6 feet above your head.

now what i find interesting about what you said is that the world seems to teach you that this is the way things are, have always been, will always be.
this way of living only allows you to truely connect with the first three chakras red-orange-and with more or less extent yellow. but i have always noticed that moreso in women than men green and blue chakras are connected. its not often that men connect with green, for the most part when they are forced ( expriance with children ) with children blue will open in men as well.
but for the most part of what you stated these connections are only to red-orange. the primary chakras ( called so because of the function of keeping us alive and procreating, primary urges )
when i see someone starting to open chakras that have layed dorment, what happens is that more of their life experiances start to become centerd around that chakra till they get used to it.
but not a lot of people get to the mauve chakra.

lets get into the purple - violet - mauve chakras for a moment here.

purple - this is the one that gets used when you "see ghosts" or other unworldly things, things that are beyond vision ( illness in people for me, looks like a dark spot ) we have all had experiance with this one, you thought you saw someone that wasnt there is the most common. most people see them out of the corner of their eye. ( i lived in a house with a the ghost of a young girl that had oded, she would sit and watch me play guitar, it wasnt till a grilfriend of mine saw her and got freaked out that i had to ask the ghost to leave )

violet - this is the conection to the wisdom of the universe and the portal to which the energy of the universe can be drawn in. true inspiration comes through this, really inventive or creative people use this one quite freqently ( they are also somewhat more inteligent as well, better able to articulate their thoughts ) have you ever had an idea only to see it done by someone else. the story of the ivention of television is a really good example of this, two guys working on the oposite sides of the country with no knowledge of the other one, walk into the patent office the same day, but because the guy in the east is later in the day, he is awraded the patent. there was controversy over this, they walked in with almost the same drawing. both guys had their crown chakras open at the same time and picked up on the same idea. happens all the time, alot of them go to court, but we never hear of them. the tv thing was drawn out and is still taught in law schools.

mauve - this is the connection to the universe, the consiousness of all that is so to speak. thats as far as i can go on this right now. not many people get here. there are a couple of other people on here that are getting to purple and mauve and learning to keep them open. as well as open and close at will. mauve is a big one and takes a bit of time to fully sink in.

but when you really sit down and think about what each of these chakras mean, and start to contemplatet its function, you really start seeing how we are held back by this.
ok Kevin A - there a million examples of each of them being used in daily life, sure. but not what i am talking about - blue - comunication - we talk everyday, we have to comunicate or we wouldnt be able to get things done in or as a society - sure the most obvious thing to point out, blatantly obvious. one of those things that screams "come on, how stupid do you think i am".
but that is not what i am talking about - when you have a friend that you dont need to say alot because it always seems like you "know" what the other person is thinking, this is what i am talking about, this is the blue chakra at work. now imagine haveing that with everyone. how much less bull would there be in the world, how much easier would things get done. i can think of a million things that would go so much more smoothly. needless to say it would mess up games of stratagy, and sports, but it would also take them in directions that we cant imagine, dont you think? in sports ( lets take hockey ) you have the element of deception, faking a shot, deeking someone out. you have moves of agreesion, checking, charging. you have moves in defense ( ok lets not get to deep in this ) but you know what i am saying.
you take all of those deceptions out of the game ( because everybody would be broadcasting their intent ) and what are you left with. pure speed and skill. like how could you check someone that knows you are gong to check them? distraction. well would you pick up on the guy that is trying to distract you? just pure speed and skill.

now in that light i ask you to think about these things.

I agree with you all the way to the last two sentences. It sounds as though you beleive that life is an accident? Are you an existentialist?

Lets not call it an accident but a chance happening when the conditions were right. To expand on this, I think life is an eventuality not merely a possibility. Given enough time and enough material, life will come out of it. On any planet, anywhere, anytime I really think life is an eventuality. It will, eventually, be. It may not be any type of life we have ever seen, it may not live for very long at all because of countless obstacles but it will exist for some amount of time.

You have planets will all sorts of chemicals in all sorts of combinations. Infinite combinations. You have billions of years. Incredible amounts of time. In this time infinite numbers of things are happening to our infinite combinations of chemicals.

We only have earth as an example but even still, we see amazing diversity in life. From the simple to the incredibly complex. Seeing this I dont think there is one special combination that creates life. I think there are many ways to get to the same end, life.

Now we have a unknown number of combinations to get life, incredible amounts of time, infinite chemical combinations and infinite things happening to said chemicals. Its like you are in a room and the door is locked but there are infinite numbers of keys around you and you have nothing but time. Eventually the door will be opened.

I could expand further but this is enough for this topic.

I actually had to go look up existentialism and figure out what it means. I am not terribly familiar with all the different groups out there. I skimmed over what existentialists believe and I see some valid points but I have not dug that deeply into it. Though Im sure like some other systems I will agree with some of it, disagree with some and hold views that it does not. I will dig a bit deeper into this and see what I can find.

I'm guessing you don't have children. Would you give your life to save another or others?

No I do not have children but I know where you are going. We see the protection of children in many species not just our own. While this protection of the next generation is probably instinct it is bound to feel like much more than that. But even this is not perfect. We see parents abusing their children is horrific ways. In these cases both love and/or instinct have failed. I really think this imperfection of "love" shows that it is man made and not a gift from a creator.

Would I give my life for another or others? Part of me says yes but that is most likely because of my upbringing. My parents taught me self sacrifice and this is still ingrained in me. It has nothing to do with what IS the right thing to do but it because of what I THINK is the right thing to do. Then again there is the self survival at any cost part of me that says no. The self is more important than anything or anyone else. Though there are many things that could override both of these sides of me or anyone for that matter.




If we could eliminate mankinds need for religion then I really think it would be a huge step in the right direction. From my point of view this would require totally eliminating the belief in a god, deity or some higher power/guiding hand/whatever. I am not sure it could be any other way. Even if we disband all religions but people still believe they will congregate towards each other/those of like beliefs and start the cycle again. We would eventually be at this same point.

If this sine wave stuff can lead us to a better end and help us understand some of the truly unexplained mysteries out there, then I support its study whole heartedly. If there really is something to it and science can take these ideas and run with them all the better. Like any singular idea, I don't think it holds all the answers or even any, but this one is a bit interesting.....

Lucinda and Eternal Me, I will get to your posts in time. I have to run off now. Thank you all for the solid discussion.

Kevin A.

These are my thoughts. Please correct me if I'm wrong or being too rudimentary.

Over 90% of a human’s cells die each year.
therefore our physical body of now is not the same as it is tomorrow.
Therefore, based only on the physical, we are totally different person over relative time.
However, we still maintain a continuous identity of self
Therefore, our identify of self is consists of more than the physical.
Our identity of self is energy in itself

We are more than a physical entity.

Everything in the universe is made of energy.
Therefore our physical being is made of energy,
and our “more than physical entity” is made of energy.
Energy oscillates.
Oscillations are measured by frequency and produce a sine wave.
Then the “more than physical entity” can be measured with a sine wave.

Our “more than physical entity” can be measured with a sine wave.

What is the optimal sine wave of the self?

These are my thoughts. Please correct me if I'm wrong or being too rudimentary.

Over 90% of a human’s cells die each year.
therefore our physical body of now is not the same as it is tomorrow.
Therefore, based only on the physical, we are totally different person over relative time.
However, we still maintain a continuous identity of self
Therefore, our identify of self is consists of more than the physical.
Our identity of self is energy in itself

We are more than a physical entity.

Everything in the universe is made of energy.
Therefore our physical being is made of energy,
and our “more than physical entity” is made of energy.
Energy oscillates.
Oscillations are measured by frequency and produce a sine wave.
Then the “more than physical entity” can be measured with a sine wave.

Our “more than physical entity” can be measured with a sine wave.

What is the optimal sine wave of the self?

#1 - are cells take 7 years to be completly replaced with new cells ( the brain is the deciding factor here, nerve cells reproduce more slowly than any other, like hair cells, but these can be kept around much longer, since after the hair has grown 1/8 of an inch from the scalp it is dead )
memories can either be considered established pathways in the brain ( i think that is more muscle memory, and associated experiance ( react or respond )
but it has been studiesd and proven that when a person dies the body is mesurably lighter after death ( when you see someone die, there is no doubt, you see a differance in the physical aperance ) so that is two quantifiable bits of information that point to an unknown "energy".


#2 - the only problem with that is the instruments to measure it. once you start "tuning in" you can "feel" it, but that boils down to the indaviduals own experiance.

What about measuring the different types of brainwaves (i.e., alpha, beta, etc.)?

Here is site on explaining the sine wave: http://campus.murraystate.edu/tsm/tsm118/Ch6/Ch6_1/Ch6_1.htm

This is of course making a large assumption that the "self" resides in the brain.

here is a link.

http://www.web-us.com/brainwavesfunction.htm

and another.

http://www.gcse.com/waves.htm

this will get us into a discussion on order of chaos. because the two are completly related.

might not make sense right now, but it will.

and it still gets back to our intsruments being primitive.

Uh... What is a sine wave?

a couple more links.
chaos this time.

http://news-info.wustl.edu/tips/page/normal/6845.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chaos_theory

ok with the 4 links in the last 2 posts, i know this seems way off toipc, but its not.

the first one is an article on conected oscilators, this is how our brains generate a measurable signal. although there are millions of nurons firing.
the order from chaos ( this is for Kevin A. ) this is what generates the alpha and beta waves discussed in the link.

http://www.web-us.com/brainwavesfunction.htm

in this link the brain waves are said to cycle anywhere between 1.4 hz and 40 hz.

it is within these waves that all our thoughts are contained ( so to speak ) which gets into the physics of sound ( easier, because you can hear it )
the fundamental "sine wave" is the fundamental note that you hear the majority of in music, it is all the other frequencies that are carried along the wave that give it color ( the diference in sound between a violin and a trumpet ) although they are playing the same note, they sound different.

with audio devices for picking up sound waves ( frequency analizers ) as with electronic devices for measuring electrical current ( osciloscope, and devices for measuring brain waves ) it is in the quieter harmonics of the sine wave where the majority of the information lies. as with sound, without hearing it, you cannot tell weather it is a guitar, trumpet or violin.
and it is in the lack of ability of our curent technology to discern these diferences.

a psycic hooked up to a device to measure brain waves will give very much the same readings as anyone else.

this is the argument that is used by naysayers on the measurability of psycic phenominon.

and why i keep saying our instruments are still primitive.

in a piccalo the fundamental notes start at 580 hz and go up to 2.2 khz ( the fundamental notes )
but the harmonics go up to and above 23.2 khz ( well beyond the range of human hearing ) a frequency analizer will pick up these notes, what they wont be able to pick up are the harmonics that go out to 23.2 khz, well out of the range of human hearing ( 20 khz being the upermost limit, and less then 15 % of the population able to hear that high )

which finaly brings us to - does the self reside in the brain?

sorry about being so damn long winded on this whole topic ( really i am ) but i feel that a good solid understanding of what we are dealing with here is in order.
putting these links together to get a better understanding of how the brain works ( or rather what we can measure about it ) gives us a better understanding of the limitations of the flesh ( current and electrical limitations ( really havent gotten into that and would keep me going for far to long ) as well as limitations of conductors ) when we get into the physical limitations we start getting more questions on the matter of the nature of consiousness and the self.

so by the nature of flesh and sciencentific technologies we have a really large gap in the question of who we are.

the body is like a car, it has limitations the we as the driver can go beyond. the body is nothing more than an extremly complicated machine exquisitly designed to let us do what we have to do in the physical realm. therefore the nature of death to the physical form is still a very cold and real eventuality.

but that was not the question that was asked.

the question that was asked has to do with the spirit and the essence of our consoius self.

the awnser that SoCrazes is looking for has to do with the nature of the spiritual self. and once again i am sorry for being so long winded about the whole matter.
SoCrazes you are opening to your spiritual self and the science that you seek within will only lead to dead ends. as is the same with all that seek higher purpose.

granted you can learn alot ( and i mean alot ) about the nature of the physical and earthly sciences. as well as religion will lead to dead ends ( so sayeth the shepard, so sayeth the flock ) no one religion has all the awnsers ( none ) and if you do not ask questions and push the limits, one can never fully grow ( on a side note, all the bible studies i have attended, from roman catholic, christan ( a variety of churches ) as well as studies in other religions, there is a point at which they want you to stop asking questions. thats when you stop growing, let me rephrase that, they lay out at what point, and what kind of questions are of satan, and limit the boudries of what questions can be asked ( thats better ) in all my travels i have met many kinds of beings ( most good, some not so good :-) i have never met this one they call satan, nor have i met anyone in my astral travels that was aware of this one they call satan.

satan is a scary dude ( like the boogy man ) to keep people afraid ( if you are afraid you limit yourself to, what your will allow yourself to do ) that is the nature of church and religion in todays society.
dont try to talk to god yourself, you dont have the education. leave that to those who have studied it and have an ear with more learned people, and so forth and so on till it gets to the pope ( who by the way has a plaque above his pulpit that when translated directly from latin reads "in place of god" ) and i could get into a whole rant on the history of religion, but i will leave it to say "thanks constantine" all religion that calls itself christian is derived from this one man, and his shaping of it from the beggining to suit his purpose, and his purpose only. its not a matter of faith, its a matter of blind acceptance.

SoCrazes - the sine wave was a good question, and by the links i have posted it should keep your mind busy for a while. but when you are ready, go get your tarot cards read.


sorry everyone for the long winded rant.

Chad181 - this will awnser your question. http://www.gcse.com/waves.htm

I know tarot cards aren't evil, as many religions purport. But who do I see about this? How do you know who is reputable at reading the cards? Just pick a name from the yellow pages?

"eternal me", thanks for the ton of info, when I get more time I plan to email you about something.

ah! tarot cards are awesome. I got the most basic deck years ago (rider-waite) but then I avoided them to all extent...I don't know why, I think mainly because I probably wasn't ready. I know a lot of people will go crazy at me saying this, but I recently read my own cards and a friends' and it was right on the $.....what naysayers will jump my ass for is that many will say you can't read your own cards....I think it is mainly that you can't read your own cards if you can't look at yourself and your life objectively. If you can, there is no problem...but if you can't accept your strengths and weaknesses, then they will not be interpretted correctly.

definately a lot of fun....you can even use a regular deck of playing cards. lots of introspective fun.

Bold is mine.

Kevin A.

Kevin A.

Quote from Kevin A.
Well I DO personally deny the existence of a "Creator". I think I outlined my beliefs to SoCrazes above. Basically something happened and not someone, like you said. I am with you with that people who refer to it as a god are doing so for a representation of life/creation. Perhaps this is why I found religions that have multiple gods representing the many facets of life were always easier to understand.

No matter "how you cut it" if there is a creation there must be a creator - whether it is "someone or something" depends on your definitions of the two. Thomas Aquinas put it nicely with his argument of "First Cause."

I can see why you chose the two people sitting in three rooms example. It is easy enough to understand, for me at least. My only thought is does the universe itself contain enough energy to create the infinite realities? Can it keep up with all the infinite combinations of realities that come into existence and go away? If a reality is created does it take energy or does it not require this? Im just thinking out loud here....

ok - question here for ya. are you familiar with ZPE? ( zero point energy ) and the concept of dark matter and energy?

if you talk to pysicists, and ask them about the mass of the universe, that can get hem talking in circles.
broken down into a nutshell. we know or can have a reasonbly acurate mesusure of the mass of the universe. correct?
but the math that works so well in defining mass within a system or object within close reach ( a baseball, or the earth, even our own solar system ) is very acurate.
but when these same mathematical principals are applied to the much larger milky way, there seems to be a very large amount of mass that we are missing.
this is where the theories of dark matter come from.

the same princeples of energy also apply as well in the same manner.
little off topic here, but during an AP i was a part of a class that was taking a look at this ( not on this world ) amongst other things.
but i was given this as an awnser.

the realm of which we look at the universe is in a monoscopic view. one eyeball looking through a telescope. in order to see the "other" matter that exsists in the universe we need a sterioscopic view.
at the time all telescopes were earth bassed ( before hubble )
now that we have hubble in orbit looking into deep space, there should be another telescope put into orbit around another body ( as close as the moon ) to get this sterioscopic view.
what limits our view farther into space than what we can currently see is the presecnce of this dark matter ( like looking at mountains in the distance, the farther they get the more particles there are in the air to obscure your view, thus the farther the immage you are trying to look at, the hazier it will be )

funny how the space race is for mars and we really should have done this a long time ago.

but now to the topic of ZPE ( zippy ) it was nicola tesla in his experiments that discoverd what he called "ambient energy". more energy coming out of his experiments then could be explained with math.
x amount of energy goes in, z amount comes out. ( dosnt fit with the laws of energy conservation )
he was actualy the first one to start research into this, and this also happens to coincide with the media and "other" scientists saying that he was going mad ( he flipped out on edison on multiple occasions, mostly due to the evidence he had to support ambient energy, and edison being the king of poop hill at the time, well we know where this goes ) but in the field of quantum physics, there has been evedence of more energy than what is currently being measured.
this energy has been called many things chi by the chines is the first one that pops to mind. but acording to tesla there is no need to generate electricity from burning fossil fuels there is plenty around us, its just a matter of tapping into it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nikola_Tesla it was ZPE ( ambient energy ) that caused him to be known as a mad scientist.

but he discoverd this in the early part of the century. what if we had pursued it then? and now science is going after it?

the current theories into ZPE point to there being an abundance of enrgy, so if alternate universes "need" energy to be supported? its there.

One other thought is that I often find that when we come to understand the way something in our world works, it often seems beautifully simple. I always seem to get that feeling when reading about some new discovery or invention. This is kind of a stumbling block for me and the infinite realities idea. It all seems very messy and overly complicated. One reality for the most part would suffice based on all my understanding. Why would it be far more complex then it seemingly needs to be?

its not.

this is where we get back into the three rooms, and what i reffered to as "the common reality" this is what we study. this is where we live. this is where we interact with eachother in the waking state.
it does not "need" to be complicated, its not. a lot of what science is searching for is "the question for the awnser we see".
getting into multiple realities brings up a whole other ball of wax ( which is a long rant yet again - jeeez dont i ever shut up? )
but isnt it easier to study somthing that we all see rather then our own preceptions?
no two people see the world in the same way. nor should they. the more people you talk to about it, the more viewpoints you get. and there are as many as there are people.
your view is not the same as mine. nor is your view the same as your fathers ( although your view is influenced by him ) but it is not the same, it is yours.
with each view of the world is a different reality, that simple. but that complicated as well.

If we are talking wave lengths that are shorter than the width of a molecule how could any structure or cell in the human body detect these frequencies? In my mind you would almost have to have a special structure or group of cells specifically designed to pick these up. I don't know if something so small could be detected any other way. Also we are talking about people broadcasting these sine waves. What exactly is oscillating in the body to create these frequencies? If its the electrical energy in the body does it not work very linearly within the confines of the body and not like a broadcast antenna? I am almost certain we can measure the electrical charge in a persons body so we should be able to measure its frequency. I wouldn't think the the human body would need to operate at such high frequency.


this is getting into the "other" religions with many "gods".
each one of those that you look at ( my own ancestry is north american native ) there is a common thread.
you are not one being - meaning this - you are your physical form that lives within the confines of earth, but you are also a spirit living within the body.
all the things discussed about the "sine wave" and what we have been talking about is the physical form. and a greabut the spirit t deal of what the physical form is we can measure to a degree.
but in terms of the spirit ( counsious mind, what makes you, you ) this has been the question all along.

to drive our physical bodies, or spirit has to step down its frequency to interact with the body and allow us the ability to have the experiance of life. people that are beyond their years have a conection to the univers and the energy within it. psycics take the time to work with the frequencies that are "beyond" the bodies capabilities.

but we are getting into a whole other thing. yet this was the question in the first place.

Some of both. Some were perhaps burnt out but most were quite at home and enjoyed their jobs. I was just stating that the buzz of creative energy seems subjective.


it is, completly. not everyone can connect to the enrgies that suround us, i know that when i am inspired i totaly buzz to the point where people around me can "feel" it.

If someone is wise beyond their years I don't see how it helps them pick up on these vibrations. Wisdom comes with age and experience. A completely new way of receiving information I receiving think is included.

it dosnt help, it is the result of. and it is not age dependant. i have talked to children that have a far greater insight than they could ever have years of experiance. ( i dont talk to children like children )
this is the connection to the universe and the wisdom within it ( getting over to the previosly mentiond rant, reincarnation and the nature of reincarnation )

Though I can understand your asking the universe to help. I don't really find myself praying or anything like that but I do send out my wish or request to the universe as a whole. Sometimes it answers. Sometimes it does not. Just chance at work but it makes me feel better sometimes.

bang on - everybody does it to some degree.

Exactly how did we come by these chakra colors? Who defined what colors they are, where they are located and what they are for?

just as we have a physical body - so we have a spritual body - the chacras are the "parts" of our spiritual bodies, as in the physical we have a heart, lungs blah blah blah ( i dont need to list them do i? )
but the spiritual body is simpler in a way. when you talk about "shades" of living so do the colors of our chackras change. with all the same subleties.
the definitions of the chakras have been around for a while, a few religions point to a couple of them, and others point to others, but i find that the ones that overlap are the same colors and same meaning.

( i posted this on another thread, but i will write it out again )

RED - located at the base of the spine just behind the colon - survival
ORANGE - in men - about an inch below the navel - in women - between the ovaries - procreation
YELLOW - the solar plexus - emotional center
GREEN - over the heart - compassion
BLUE - top of the ribcage where the collerbones meet - comunication
PURPLE - at the centre of the brow and about a finger width up - the third eye, our view into other realities ( more to it but that simple enough )
VIOLET - at the top of the scull ( the soft spot on an infants head ) position never changes with age - crown chakra - where the "knowing" of the universe and energy flow into the body.
MAUVE - about 6 feet above the head - the connection to the universe.

with each of these there are subtle shades of what goes on within people.

We seem to have take a tangent with this chakra stuff and I am but lost as to how it relates here....I am not sure how any of this can gold anyone back....


because the question that was asked in the first place had to do with the spiritual self, and not the physical body ( once again i am sorry for taking you on such a winding path, but understanding the differance between the physical and spiritual was nessasary, and you have asked some really good question that got me thinking )

Now my question is if this type of communication is possible, why do we not see it in any other animal on this planet? Surely if it ever existed it would allow this animal to never be preyed upon by any other animal. Surely it would be a very successful animal and avoid capture by any hunter. But we still would know about it. Someone walking into the forest with a camera to document this animal would be allowed close to it but a hunter would never see one. Why is it we do not see this in any other animal? What makes us special?

do you have a pet?
i myself have 2 cats, both of them have been in turmiol because both of them want to claim me as their human, and just their human. they dont want to share.
cats are aloofe, for a reason. when cats started to become "pets" it was their choice. they for some reason decided it was benificial for them to cohabitate with humans.
dogs are pack animals and will follow whatever alpha is there for them to follow. it just their nature. birds fish and rodents are captured and trained out of self reliance ( but if you let them go they will survive )as for the comunication, if you have pets, how do you know how your pet is "feeling" if they dont have the muscle capacity to express what they are feeling when they are in good health?
dont you just "know" how they are feeling? this is exactly that comunication.

as for an animal not being preyed upon? there is such a thing as the food chain, and we being at the top of it cannot comprehend the mentality of being a part of it. we just know "this is how life is", same for animals that are food for other animals ( they dont "want" to be lunch, ie:survival instinct. but if they have to be? its how the world works )

Surely it would be a very successful animal and avoid capture by any hunter bigfoot if you believe it. and i wont finish that one, that for another thread hahahahahahahahaha.

Why is it we do not see this in any other animal? What makes us special? you dont, i do, that dosnt make me anymore special.

[quote name='the eternal me' date='Dec 20 2007, 11:37 AM' post='2049481']
I can see why you chose the two people sitting in three rooms example. It is easy enough to understand, for me at least. My only thought is does the universe itself contain enough energy to create the infinite realities? Can it keep up with all the infinite combinations of realities that come into existence and go away? If a reality is created does it take energy or does it not require this? Im just thinking out loud here....

Thanks for all the info and I agree with most of it (esp. about Edison). However, I'm still having a difficult time beleiving their isn't one true reality. For example, if you go to the hardware store and order a gallon of green paint, they have the colors defined in their database and know exactly what to add to the base gallon to get a green gallon. The green is "defined."

Another scenario, a human generally sees the sky is blue (thanks Lucinda), and some animals see it a different color, then the sky isn't truly blue. Perception is that the sky is blue; reality is the sky isn't blue due to how light waves are scattered. Ask the hard questions to get to the truth.

I agree that 3 people in a room will have different perceptions of the room; however, there is only one reality. If they discussed the attributes of the room together as well as making definitions to ensure what they meant is the same, they would come to a true perception, or reality, of the room.

One's perception may seem like reality, but if you were to examine things closely and ask yourself hard questions of the perception you will get to the truth, or should I say reality.

yes - this is what i keep calling 'the common reality" which contains all the things we agree on.
taking things out of the equasion like color blindness and different degres of myopia and other visual ailments.
we still come up with different perspectivs - it is when all the details are discussed that all see all the details that they did not see before.

is this reality? or a common reality?

reality in the most fundamental form - what "you" as an indavidual believs and preceives.

in the course of such a discusion, things will be noticed that were not in that persons "reality" before.

all men that are in a relationship have experianced this one.

come home and the significant other says "notice anything different?"
to which man thinks "oh poop, what the h### is she talking about. and in the process of looking at what details he remembers is trying to figure out what is different.
thought proccess goes something like "hair? - no, dress? - no, shoes? - no, does the house look the same? ( same scanning process ) till something is either found to be different or not.
if the differance is not found, it has to be pointed out, it does not "exsist in his reality yet. once pointed out becomes real ( so to speak )

or the wonderfull example that everyone has experianced.

looking for lost keys.

look in the usual places, not there ( may be four or five places by habit get thrown ) to which the search process goes out further.
looking in places that would not be in the usual routine. scanning table surfaces, pockets, drawers ( you get the idea ) and going through what one would consider a "complete" search.
no luck - start search pattern again - this time find keys in a place where habit dictates that would be a likely place ( didn't i look here already? i didn't see them there before. huh )
to which the experiance of the keys not being at that spot on a previous search ( maybe more than one search pattern ) but you were sure they were not there, because you started the search pattern again ( question comes up - am i going nuts? ) whole experiance gets dismissed and life goes on.

we have all been through this, looked at the table ( not just a glance, but stared at it for more then a second thinking about "where could they be" ) and the keys are not there the first time you look.

explain to me what medical condition could it be that could affect everyone at some point or another, regardless of age health or cultural and jenetic predisposition? and be gone as soon as it arrives? none that i am aware of ( there are disorders that can bring about such symptoms, but they are usualy permanent and degenerative disorders.

i am ranting now, and i apologise.

but it is the keys on the table. when you look at the table and do not see the keys, they are not a part of your reality, call it predetermind perception ( you see what you want to, till you change your mind ) but either way they don't exsist in your reality.

reality is preception. and a common reality is what we can agree on.

example, if you go to the hardware store and order a gallon of green paint, they have the colors defined in their database and know exactly what to add to the base gallon to get a green gallon. The green is "defined."

the particular shade of green you see versus the shade of green someone else sees, is mixing of the colors you see based on a predetermind percentage of colors that are made with a consistancy to reproduce the shade of green you select.

but even if you take the "swatches" outside into sunlight the shade of green will change. ( florecent lights give off blue light, incandecent light give off yellow ) so the ambient lighting has an effect on the color you "see" or perceive.

Another scenario, a human generally sees the sky is blue (thanks Lucinda), and some animals see it a different color, then the sky isn't truly blue. Perception is that the sky is blue; reality is the sky isn't blue due to how light waves are scattered. Ask the hard questions to get to the truth.

the sky is black ( or to be more precise, there is a lack of color in the sky ) its the oxygen that refracts blue light that we see as the color of the sky.
i remember the sky being a darker blue when i was a kid ( oxygen levels in the atmosphere )

One's perception may seem like reality, but if you were to examine things closely and ask yourself hard questions of the perception you will get to the truth, or should I say reality.


this one is tottaly subjective, why is it impolite to talk about religion and politics? because people take a look closely, and examine them and ask the hard questions, and they still come to many different truths. no matter how hard you try, your reality and your hard truth does not fit with everyone. the more people you talk to, the more people that agree with what you believe, these are the groups that you gravitate to, people that believe in reality as being close to what you see as reality. ( hindu, sikhe, buhdist, christian, hare kershna, jewdayism, muslim, scientology, pagan, wicka, see a pattern here )


if i sound like i am arguing, i really don't mean to. i am just trying to back up my point. trying to use common examples in such a way as to get people to relate to common things. common experiances in the common reality. its not 100% solid for anyone. but that is my perception.

and on a completly different note - my spelling is getting better. hahahahhaaahahahhahaaha

thankyou all

My old quotes are bold, eternal me's is normal, and my newest responses are italic-bold. Thanks for all the great info eternal me!

In reference to your color of the sky: You've proven my point, our subjective reality is eliminated when you ask the hard questions and get to the truth. In the example above, the sky is not blue, it only appears that way.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but what I think you are saying here is that we are all here (vibrating at low levels on earth) for different purposes; therefore, there is a different reality, or perspective of truth, for all of us? I can accept this.

No, I'm not taking your statements as argument, I'm taking them as sound dialogue to get to the Truth...and you do a great job.

Your spelling isn't as bad as my attempts to edit quotes. Please disregard the previous response (above) by me.

Happy Holidays Everyone!

Why this is so impolite to talk about is that you would need hours of dialogue with someone to get to the truth. Many people are taught from birth what to beleive in religion and politics, and it is a very personal thing to attempt shifting someone's paradigm on such matters. It is impolite because they haven't the time nor have accepted you personally as a paradigm shifter over the minister, priest, parent, etc, that has formed this paradigm(s) since birth. To "shake someone's foundation of beleif" even goes beyond the personal. My wife is a stout Christian and will hear nothing of my rantings as you see in this forum. She is very afraid of losing the painted picture of life she has...everything for, and many people I suppose, is in a nicley wrapped box.

I agree if what you are saying is we are all here for different "lessons" and/purposes and; therefore some of our paradigms will be shaded differently (purpose of life, maybe); however, I still beleive that if you keep digging for the truth you will find it...maybe just not in this lifetime To put it more succintly: yes we all perceive life differently because of our purpose in life; but, their is an underlying truth to everything we perceive.

aah...truth. it's funny that even when we find the truth, or our truth.......we won't know.

Plato, in his dialogues about Socrates, once wrote, "What is truth and how do we know it?" Socrates, according to Plato, said we can uncover the truth with good questioning. Socrates beleived that we all know the truth...we just have to "uncover" it through good questions; hence, the Socratic Method.

The sky is blue because of Ra