I dont know where else to turn to, this has been really weird for me and I completely understand if others dont believe me because I still dont quite believe it myself.

Growing up I have had a very close friend i will call Jake. We spent near every waking hour togather we played video games we went exploring in the woods as we grew up we even went to the same college and got an apartment togather. Jake was two years younger then me and when we were very small he would always cling to me when he was really sad or scared. This stopped after we got older because it didnt look right for a a guy to be clingy to another guy. But we were always close and didnt think anything of it. Well he was incredibly smart and skipped enough grades to get into the same as me, its like his brain worked different then ours or something, the teachers wanted to further progress him but he refused and would play dumb if they gave him tests. He was a genius of sorts.

He always talked about ghosts when he was little and that he saw them and wants to prove they are out there etc... he started practicing astral projection.

He got very skilled at after years of trying. After we moved into our apartment he tried to teach me to astral project. Well after a few weeks I had an experiance, he was apparently trying to meet me in the astral realm. Well needless to say whatever was happening I could comprehend it and instantly woke back up and have refused to try since then. Which seemed to hurt his feelings.

A year or so of us living togather passed and he continued to get successful astral projections about once every three weeks or so.

While I sort of believed in it because of my strange experiance I never quite new what to expect.

Well I went home to visit family for a weekend and left him there by himself. The woman living under us left a pizza in the stove and it caught on fire and burned our section of the apartments down.
The firemen came and said they found jake just laying on the couch with his arms at his sides. The position he would get in for astral projection.

Jake died.

He died from smoke inhalation.

The fire didnt spread up to our room but the smoke did. The doctors are baffled why he didnt wake up when he heard the alarm or smelled smoke. They figured he passed out or something or fainted.

Of course I was horribly upset. We attended his funeral.

Then two and a half months or so passed.

I was at work/school toiling away and had moved to another smaller apartment. And had just got content living by myself. I really didnt have any other friends besides him.

Well I came home from work about a week and a half ago to find my door was unlocked. I panicked. I grabbed a broom a neighbor left by the door and entered my apartment.
A fairly attractive girl was sitting on my couch watching tv.

She looked up at me said "You still leave the key in the same place dont you" and sighed disapprovingly. The way she sighed sent chills down my spine.

The first thing that came out of my mouth was "Who are you?"

She got this kind of sad look on her face like she was trying to tell me something that was very hard to tell.

"Well aparently my name is Amber"

Then a shocking conversation took place.

She began to explain to me that she was Jake.

Of course I thought it was some cruel joke.

She wouldn't leave the apartment and I considered calling the authorities.

Then she started relating memories to me that only he would have. It spooked me and I tried to think of some way that she just heard these. But I was always around jake and there were very few times that he would go out with out me much less talk to a girl especially one as attractive as her. I knew everyone he talked to on the internet etc and he never relayed stories especially about astral projection.

Then as a few days passed I noticed she had his same sort of habits, gestures, mannerisms. It was really creepy. I started to question my own sanity at this point because I was starting to believe her.

The only difference i noticed in her from him is that she was sort of shy around me almost.

I finally asked how it could possibly be jake.

She then explained to me that she astral projected the night of the fire and was making the usual rounds. Apparently during the fire jake died while he was astral projected. He said that it felt weird while projecting then all of a sudden he felt a great freedom and thinks while projecting got alot clearer. Thats when things went bad. He couldnt find his way back to his body, his ties to it were severed, he had died. He was still in astral form though. He said he followed me around a while and wanted to comfort me but I wouldnt repond anything he did. He said after the funeral he got the idea he wanted to at least solve the mystery of ghosts before he passed on to whatever fate he had. He said himself the whole ordeal was just a very very clear astral projection and felt like nothing more, there were no lights coming to collect him or anything like that.

So he went to a hospital emergency room and was waiting for someone to die so he could see there spirit leave there body or something, but he said it wasnt what he expected. He followed a fairly attractive girl as she was wheeled into the emergency room and the doctors were saying that she wasnt going to make it and it was too late. He thought this was his chance to witness a death. The girl had taken sleeping pills with tequila and they were pumping her stomach. Apparently she died. But when she died jake didnt see any thing but her aura just disappaited. He figured even though he was projecting he still couldnt see ghosts. Thats when after her aura disappeared he said he got a weird hollow feeling from her body. He said he went toward her body to investigate then everything just went black. He said he felt as he had slipped into something and it was warm.

He then apparently woke up in this girls body. He said he didnt know what to think at first. The nurses and doctors asked him questions and he feigned that he had amnesia.

Come to find out recently her parents died in some manner and the girl was so distrought she commited suicide with the pills and tequila.

He figured he slipped in some how after her spirit left her body and the doctors began to revive her. Like the body was being revived and his soul got drug in.

Apparent she stayed with an incredibly elder grand mother who she told she had amnesia and the grand mother began to teach her about being a girl with toiletries etc... i cut her off at that part and said I didnt need to know any of that. And then she aparently came to find me.

And that was her story....

Well after a few nights passed she began to get close to me on the couch and began to cling to me like jake use to. I asked what was wrong and she said it was difficult adapting and she just wanted comfort. It was just like jake.... after a while of her clinging i looked down and she was looking up, she came up and kissed me. Which highly freaked me out.

I asked what the hell she was doing. she said that we were always close, and now it doesnt feel so ackward.

I really dont know what to do, im kind of in a panic now, its morning and shes still asleep. She really does act like jake and know things only he could know. So many things that I dont think its possible for a human to relate, she easily answers any questions i give her.

I have a girl in my apartment claiming to be my dead friend and shes making a move on me... im starting to believe her... I feel like im going insane....

That is strange!
Im sorry for your loss.
Not sure what to think really

.....

Sounds exactly like a plot in a book I read recently...and very similar to the book 'Fluke'.

Without knowing you, and without knowing all the facts I;d say she's yanking your chain mate - sorry

I have no idea how to even reply to this. I have never heard anything like this. JN-

Wow R.A.

That's incredible! I'm sorry for your loss also, and I know your story sounds crazy - but (call me naive) - I believe you. I wish I had some advice but I don't. I will keep my eyes, ears and heart open for any information I can find that might be of help to you.

There is so much more to our physical bodies and physical realms that humans do not understand. I hope you are able to get some relief from your confusion quickly.

Keep us posted, 'k.
Magikal ~

I do know quite a bit about astrol projecting, and the swapping of bodies durning death, and you have nothing to fear, your not insane, you've been blessed in many way's, most of us who have lost a loved one can only guess where they are, what they are doing, and hope that we one day see them again, your friend found peace on the astrol plane, he found his higher self, and his curosity gave him a second chance, he was blessed, and so are you. Enjoy what you have been given and thank God for allowing it to happen....

Well after some serious talk with her theres no way humanly possible any one could know as much as she does only Jake would...

But a reincarnated jake showing romantic feelings for me? thats a little much... i ask if he was gay she just said once she was a girl her feelings evolved and that if shes going to be that way from now on that im the only guy she would think of to have a life with.... i mean we were a little closer then guys should have been, i never thought it was gay or anything... but after a heartfelt talk she says back then i was the older guy who always took care of her, he felt deeply for me, he said it wasnt sexual... but now its like she can be more honest with her feelings and it developed. While the aspect of my best and pretty much only friend is now an attractive girl who wants to spend her life me should be a no brainer, its still quite a shock and awkward... she said she did alot of thinking and thought it over while she was at her now grand mothers house. She said she would give me as much time as I needed to adjust but she wasnt going to give up.

but at the same time I can see she is terrified. shes going through something some people could only imagine, and I think its come to be that time of the month as well... and shes struggling with that, and I was introduced to the wonderful world of womens toiletries... that was an unpleasent trip to publics.

Anyways im rambling on... today has been eventful since she woke up.. I strangely feel like I have to be there for her...



Anyways someone mentioned a book or a movie, may I should buy/rent it and check it out and see how he handled things... could you tell me the story of what happened after he found out? Im completely at a loss...

The reincarnated Jake, is trying to adept to a females body, it's his soul (Emotions, Intellegence,etc) , but he's a host in someone's elses body, I'd say take that much needed time and allow yourself to adept to the change, once you can look past the point that Jake once resided in a male body, but is now residing in a female's body, you'll see things in a different light. We all have had over 400 lives, we have been male, female, animals, trees, etc, do a bit of research on Astrol planing, reincarnation, and all that surrounds these issues, the feelings of awkwardness may very well lift, once the issue comes into view a bit more clearly.

Your saying I should ignore preconceptions about Jake... now Amber who was a guy?

Shes made it very clear she wants a relationship...

I guess its just to hard to fathom...

You just need to relax and remember that you've been blessed, if you set aside the factor that Jake was once male, but is now a female and concentrate on the good things that have and will contuine to come out of this exp, you'll no longer feel awarkward, out of place, or confused. But if you feel you cannot do that, then let Jake/Amber know your true feelings, and an explanation as to why you cannot go forth with a relationship. Either way you are faced with a decision, that you must one day make, I wish you the best of luck, and I feel you know deep down what to do, to resolve the issue at hand.

I sent you a PM.

Wow that is something to hear. I have never heard of something like that, with the death and all. It lets me know that there is a lot more knowledge out there for us to pick up on. But to give you advice I wouldn't know where to start, I apparently have never had an experience quite like yours but it is interesting though. The knowledge that she brings sounds so practical like it could actually be true....

Could death only be the breakage of the link between the mind and the body or astral body and the physical body. What would happen if we pulled this connection closer and closer together. Will it become something else other than to seperate bodies. If you should take her great hospitality or not is up to you. When will you find someone that you get along with much ever again. This could just be his soul........I don't know. Take the chance, because you will only know if it is worth it until you try. Or if it just feels like she is bringing up too much memories just propose friends.

Things like this also brings upi knw questions about if you could swap bodies temporarily into dead body for while, or if you get that real close connnection could you bring your body back to life( not in case of fires or anything demolishing your body). Could this be possible could it go farther to actually going into someone's dream and interacting with them. These are all such extraodinary questions that should come with some extraordinary answers!!!

DhA...OraCle
-R.J.W

I got it:)

Maybe ur friend was gay and had a crush on u. Now hes a hot chick, stop thinking so much and take it as a blessing.

Ok I AGREE WITH HIM, SHE IS FINE AS HELL.........KEEP HER......Now you know everything about her without the years or bullcrtap to go through.

Say that all of this is real( not that I am not believing you), what other things did she see on her journey of a year or so. I mean she would have had to learn a lot about the world unseen. This would be valuable knowldge to some of the questions that we need answers to. Could you ask her some more questions about her voyage and what it was like, I mean it could bring us some great insight for those who are looking to astral porject to know the exact feelings and the limits.

DhA...OraCle
-R.J.W

wow


your friend is a "walk in"

it has been a while since the last time.

your friend was in the astral state when his death occured, this was planned ( appologies to his family ) the decission for this to happen was his.

jake, please take things slowly, your mother and father are still in very much pain, and for you to come into their lives as you are will devastate them and cause much dammage, when they are ready they will let you know, the urge to comfort them and let them know that you are "ok" is very overwhelming, but please, you will do more harm than good, if you must give them comfort, then i ask you both to lie in the form of this, you met somehow, and this cool new girl has very strong psicic ablities, and she has let you know that jake is fine and apoologizes for what has happened, please jake resist the urge to do a "reading" or contact "yourself" in the form of a psudo "trance", this will all go bad.

as for what is happening with the memories of who you are and you relationship with your "friend", please take it slow. let him adjust to this, he has not removed you from his life and suroundings becasue he "feels" that you are still you. but the adjustment to your "new form". will take some time, be patient. there is much that was left undone in your last manifestation, that is why you were "held" in your comfort zone in the astral plane. you were lead to where you would find the right canidate for this to happen ( the girl had other things to learn from those that left, and what was left undone will be picked up again in another manifestation ) her/your "grandmother" - "knew" that you are not the same person, but "knew" you needed help ( it was not just being the daughter of her dead daughter ) she has a higher sense of calling on this whole matter, and although your physical from is her blood she has a higher strength that is helping her through this time. when she comes to be at peace with what has transgressed she will leave the physical. ( she will come to you and let you know when this happens )

jake, there is so much riding on you and how you handle this. pleaze let those around you help to guide you, you guides have always been there with you you every step of the way.
you have not seen them because it has been your decision to not let them show themselves ( there are more then one around you, at all times )
the body you are now in is more "capable" of doing what it is you are ment to do ( this will come over time ) but for the moment you have to "go back" a few steps and start training this body to what you are comfortable with. there has been some internal damage to this form ( liver and kidneys ) that must be addressed. these you must get under control and heal. ( other minor things like some of the new physical discomforts you need to learn about and heal, some were caused by broken bones and sprains that were never fully healed, and address the the unhealed concussion " the headaches" )

i am sorry to all that came here hoping to find some insight to what this "happening" is all about. but they were compelled to get some help.

i am sorry that i could not awnser your questions to why you made the post in the first place.

jake, i am sorry that i have done this "reading" for you in a public forum, i have chosen not to disclose further detail than what was needed for this ( i dont know the higher purpose for this post, just that i have to )

please pm me.

Thanks everyone for your support.

However I have no shown her this thread or forum. I have another more detailed one going on in the Haunting/paranormal thread.

But we have talked alot and I have let her know that Im not agaisnt a relationship but I need time to adjust. She seems to be alot more calm just clinging to me or being around like it comforts her. She seems to have came out of her shock of it as it were. She came out of the bathroom after being in there for an hour and said something to the affect of "How the hell do women give birth"

I really do feel sorry for her. Jake was an introvert... he was kind of anti social to everyone but me. Now in his new form she gets alot of attention and it makes her really uncomfortable and an hellish trip to publix to get womens toiletries....

But all of it aside she seems really happy, more happy then she was before jake died. Especially after I accepted her as jake and told her a relationship wasnt too far fetched.

We've had a long few days.

Shes back to playing video games.

She also seems fairly entertained with her own chest and teases me horribly with them now. -_-;;

But I can tell shes still scared of whats to come and "her" new life. She keeps saying she can make it as long as im there.

Who knows... we'll see how things play out, i'll pm you eternal.

As for her astral experiances she would always talk about them before when she did them. It was very dream and he had little control back then. He could go places but never really had control of where he went. Sometimes things would go wrong and he would end up in weird looking places that didnt look like our world. He never really made sense out of it. He said though after his body died while he was projecting things became very clear and easy to control. Now hes her, she said that she felt like she could go in a new direction besides the 3dimensional feeling. Like you can go back forward up and down while flying or what ever, but you could also go in and out like it was a new direction that she never comprehended. it was really difficult for her to explain and i told her to not try and think so hard. She said however that she did not go this new direction because she was affraid of leaving our world or her perception of it before she figured out what she wanted to know. Thats when she followed me around for a few days feeling bad for me, then went to the hospital where she got her new body.

She said however she would see weird translucent things that were indescribable. She avoided them and they never bothered her.

Electra is so right... Wow, you are wise beyond your years dear.
I don't know why I am so compelled to write you R.A other than to just encourage you to look beyond the physical bodies and remember Jakes spirit and love.

Give yourself alot of time to contemplate and understand the situation beyond the (5) senses and limits that physicality imposes on us. Look deeper... past emotions, and ego and confusion and so forth and look at the pure love at hand.

By all means explain to Amber/Jake how you feel and that it's awkward right now until you have a better grasp on things. If she's truly been astral planing around recently and understands that aspect of life "out there" beyond the here and now, they will certainly have the patience necessary to allow you your time to comprehend. It's all about love.... pure and simple... everyone here just need a little bit of time and patience right now.

love to you,
Magikal ~

Well I have had a few heartfelt talks with her and let her know that I accept her as jake. and that a relationship is not totally out of the question but I defintely need time to adjust. That didnt stop her from clinging to me constantly like jake did when he was younger.

I guess while we were playing gears of war togather earilier and and she died and got pissed and that same determinated face jake got, i dunno it just sunk in a little there and It was almost a turn on.

I guess it doesnt help that she has become very entertained with her own breasts and teases me horribly with them.

Thank you Magikal', I've been studying the issue of astrol planing and reincarnation for a long time, and I'm so happy to hear that some out there has confirmed that there is a little more to life than what meets the eye, and that it's a postive outlook and not based on fear or negative notion.

'Remaining Anonymous'
Thank you for sharing your story and allowing me to apply a bit of wisdom...

Any wisdom is much more than appreciated

Thank you

Hi, I experienced OBE's or Astral Projection from the age of 5 till my 30's..At that time when I learned exactly what it was it didnt happen anymore and I cant make it happen which is fine with me. However, no one truly knows whether the soul leaves the body or we use our minds to go astral. So for someone to die, take off to an ER, wait for a girl to OD and take over her body doesnt sound logical or possible. Reincanation occurs when we die, and our body dies but I believe the soul lives on, and many times they come back in a new body, as a baby being born and start all over again. That is just my theory. If people can experience OBE's while meditating, that leaves me to believe the mind travels not the soul. There is something not right with this story or Amber. Your friend died of smoke inhalation, and if he was laying on the floor, arms stretched out, its possible he was running out and fell into a coma, then died. I have never heard of reincarnating soon into an adult body, and hitting on your best friend. There was a movie about that in the 80's where a man died and came back as a female but that was totally fictional. I think Amber or whoever it is, if she is real, is messing with your head. WHY would you consider having sex, with your best male friend who died, who is now a woman? Sorry, I am very open minded but this just doesnt make sense. However whatever you choose, ENJOY! JN

Have you felt her scalp for any scars?I can't help but wonder if there was a brain transplant that took place that you all weren't aware of.And the doctors transplanted Jakes brain into the Girls body to save her life? Just curious as I think that would be the first thing I'd check.
Ya just never know about what these doctors are gonna do next these days.

Quite honestly, it is beyond me how anyone could be so gullible as to believe this story. You offer absolutely no shred of proof or evidence to support your wild claims. Are the people on this form so silly as to be willing to accept anything which somebody claims to have happened? That is just plain foolish and immature.

I am very interested in the paranormal, however, I, like anybody with any grey-matter in his head, am not willing to accept anything someone comes up with, just because that someone takes the time to write a semi-convincing sounding story.

This is akin to believing the story of Cinderella, or Goldilocks, just because someone narrated to you the story and said it happened to somebody the knew.

Come on... if such a story really were true, it would be the greatest story of the century, hell, of all the centuries. And you, when confronted with such a huge and amazing occurence, are just calmly writing to this forum to tell us what happened. And some people actually believe you. Come on people get real.

your best friend just became a girl, if one of mine did that it would be awkward as i imagine it is for you, hmm, is it possible that jake deliberatly did this so he could be with you? i think i feel even more sorry for this poor girls family, i mean sure she's alive but she's not her, this is just bizzare no offence,

Now, there we go, we're loosening up a bit and having a little fun and laughter. Go with your instincts and just learn from this... and by all means keep taking your time. Decisions don't have to be made this moment.

Yes I agree. Did you feel compelled by this thread to join and post

Hi JN
I believe that we use our minds to go astral and that the souls leaves the body thus making reincarnation possible. But who says that the soul has to come back into a newborns body; why not someone who just died and has been physically been brought back on the ER table. And the movie in the 80's was fictional but why couldn't that have been based on someones experiences.. after all, people have so much fear most of the time that they don't come right out and talk about this stuff so if they are creative enough to have it made into a movie... well, then....

I give R.A. alot of credit to come out and talk about his situation and risk ridicule and rejection, albeit in an anonymous forum type format.

And Why would Amber mess with his head? How does she know all the things only Jake knew. What would be her purpose to mess with him?

Why consider having sex with this individual... ? Did you ever hear of soulmates? Personally, I think it's rare to find your soul mate but it could happen never-the-less. It has to do with spirit, love - not gender... geezz - if we could just get outside ourselves with the male-female thing.. but then hey that's why we're called human and we go round and round and continue this circle of life.

We need to lighten up and allow. Enlightenment = Lighten Up (people)

RA my advice put this girl to the bigger test . Tell her you wish to go public with this . seeing as its so extraordinary all the world would want to hear about it . she will then be subjected too some tests and you would know for sure . I think her reaction to you telling her this will be very telling if she is all for it then she may be telling you the truth if she runs a mile you will know why

Einstein, Bethoven, Tesla, etc... etc.. and many others this world over have been called many names... because they were able to think outside of mainstreams box and go against societal flow. Hell, I don't care if I'm called foolish or immature for believing something that goes against what might seem "Normal". big deal ~ Even if the Jake/Amber story turns out to be totally a fake story - so what - has it not made you think? Has it not made you wonder and question? Has it not sparked some slight idea inside you that maybe something like this could truly happen?

Maybe we need to strip off the cloak of "getting real" and get "Unreal". Like I just wrote in a previous response.... Lighten Up (think Enlightened)

Why? - Why not?

I'm curious - What test would they do exactly?

SS79, Elation and Belgis called it.

well any would be better than none . wouldnt it ?? obviously they would have to work with jakes family to ask some questions that even random wouldnt know the answer too . Its all ok to think your friends come back from the dead in the form of a female and then to have a relationship with her. but for me i would want to be sure someone wasnt pulling my leg . or trying to manipulate me when they knew i was grieving . it does happen sadly. So no i wouldnt be trusting enough too just take her word for it . sorry. if you would thats fine FOR YOU .

I am kind of concerned when people believe this kind of thing with no evidence at all. It's insane!
He's probably laughing at the reaction his short story got. Or he was being decieved and that is unfortunate. Maybe the question
shouldn't be wether his friend was gay, but wether he is (Not calling you gay). I don't mean to be mean but come on, it's funny how someone can post something that can have
a logical explanation and there is always those that say, yah, wow how incredible for you! Anyway, ask lots and lots of questions!
(Thats if the poster is telling the truth)

Edit: 1. Don't let others feed off your grief.

2. See someone qualified to help.

3. How old are you?

Yes, Withoutnight, it is a short story. I am unsure where you are going with your speculations about the author's sexual orientation, however.

Catastrophic change of sex stories have been penned by authors of both sexes, of all popular orientations, and for all audiences. I like the Teresias version personally, with some fondness for Orlando as well.

It is also a staple of episodic television drama, of course. I like the Next Generation episode, but as a single moment, my favorite is in Farscape where the guy ends up in the body of the incomparable Claudia Black, rips his short open, and admires her - now his - dairies. Woo hoo, indeed.

If speculate we must, then I thought that the author's preoccupation with menstruation was painfully straight. But, hey, there is as much diversity among gay men's attitudes about women's bodies as among women themselves.

Protip for the author: What would count more is what everyone does a few times every day, and now the ex-guy has to sit down to do it.

Again, What tests would that be specifically? Questions, right... ? Ok, ask Jake's family the questions and see what happens. I'm fine with that. Subject them too more grief too, hmm. ok... Are there any other proven scientific tests that you could suggest for RA to consult?

Do any of the posters think that we have but one life? Do you believe in reincarnation? If so, do you think we only come back as the same gender all the time. We have lived millions of lifetimes as different things all the time... kings, then paupers, whores then saints, different nationalities each life, or whatever....

"Protip for the author: What would count more is what everyone does a few times every day, and now the ex-guy has to sit down to do it."
Now there's a scientific test for ya

Guess it takes one person to call Shennanigans for all of the others to come out of the wood work.

As I said before I don't care if you believe me or not, in all honesty I dont expect you to.

But taking her out and declaring to the world what happened then turn her into a lab rat, how about NO.

Blessings SS79 x x x

Im not saying i dont believe your side of the story . Im saying you should be careful thats all .

Hi M, I think we all deserve credit for discussing our personal experiences. In any case, if the mind/brain is used for AP, then our soul remains in our bodies. So if someone should die during AP, his soul is still in his body, and his brain would have died anyway. So how could his brain find another body, NOW that is medically and physically impossible. The brain/mind is our consciousness, and our soul is who and what we are. To be honest, during AP one can bring themselves back ASAP if need be, and not lay there and let the body die? Its not that I dont believe it, but to be honest I dont but I am trying, but IF this is a true story this would be the most amazing story of all time, with all the answers to life and death, the world has been looking for since time began. Yes I have not only heard of soul mates, I met mine 17 years ago. I KNOW in a previous life he was just as important to me as he was then, and I love him more than life, but hence the word "soul" not mind or brain. I agree with the circle of life as we are reborn many times, IMO..But to die during AP and come back in a females body is I guess too much for my mind to comprehend. So this so called Amber has his soul and his mind a year or so later? Sorry I cant fathom the entire concept. Considering this is the first time EVER we have heard of something like this, I would say that its common knowledge that we come back, but not in another adults body. I am trying to believe this, I really am, but so far I just dont buy it. Even with a soul mate, I didnt come home and find him on my sofa as a female IF he had died, and if that did happen I sure wouldnt come here, and would probably go to the families and maybe at some point to a scientist..I dunno..LOL..JN

You already have in a sense, as you have just told the entire world about this. Why do you refer to your friend as "her"? Anyway, I have one question. From the get go, you stated your friend was "clingy" and the more you wrote the more I sensed he was probably homosexual, wasnst sure about you. This is NOT an insult just an observation. Did you ever think maybe he didnt die in the fire, but became a woman via plastic surgery? There has to be more to this RA..Maybe something you're not seeing. Lastly I know for a fact that folks from A&E and Discovery read this site, so she IS a lab rat, and you have already gone public..jn

You seem to forget the grief that this will cause random if it ever does transpire that she is not jake and she has been having him over the whole time . But thats probably because you so wish to believe this with no evidence that the fact that she could be lying never entered your head .

Random doesn't appear to be stupid or misguided or immature. I guess I trust him in that I think he can make decisions for himself. Honestly, I do not have a "wish to believe" one way or the other. Sure she could be lying - but I wonder what would be her motive.

I'm not sure where i stand on reincarnation . you seem to think its a fact rather than a theory however . Even if it was a fact . it still doesnt explain this situation does it . she still could be jake or she still could be lying . even if i could hand on heart say yes i believe we reincarnate . I couldnt believe this story without some real questions being asked first . anyone can say they are soemone else that doesnt make it so.

Because I believe strongly in reincarnation (and other things unseen at times), then yes, to me it is a fact. People believe in many things so for them it makes it So.... take the Bible for example,... oh,, nevermind - forget about opening that can of worms. Suffice to say, that as people believe then so it is - for them - each individually.

I was referring to what i would do in that situation .Random doesnt have to turn her into a lab rat at all he just has to suggest that hes going to go public to gage her reaction . I'm sorry you dont like it . or is the fact that it may be found that this body swap hasnt happened that upsets you . surely if you were in this situation you would want to know the truth before commiting to something with this stranger . I know i would .

So, you're suggesting he play head games to gauge her emotional reaction. Well, if she is so good at lying right now then what makes us think she would suddenly fall apart in her acting skills when he suggests going public? And yes, if he were to truly go through making this 'phenomenon' public then sure it would turn her into a spectacle for dissection; mentally, physically, and emotionally. Obviously coming from his point of view having had Jake as a friend before his death and knowing how sensitive he already is/was as a human then his (RA's) heart will tell him that is not what he would subject his friend to.

The possiblity (you used the word 'fact') that this body swap may not be true doesn't upset me at all. Why do you think it would? What emotionally vested interest do I have in the matter? I simply want RA to know that there is compassion and help at UM if he needs to really talk or get information. Maybe someone can help him with that.

Thus, I'm no longer interested in arguing with you regarding how I feel about it. Hopefully, the discussion can get back on track that can give RA something to go on... to further research for answers. My intention is to PM (and have done so already) and speak to him privately instead of babbling further about it.

Love and Light,
Magikal ~

Magiikal im sorry you felt that was arguing . I sure didnt. An open discussion from all different viewpoints is IMO what helps random gleen lots of different perspectives so that from there he can make a decision on what he chooses to do .

Blessings SS79 x x x

True or not....it's a brilliant story.....





I'm not sure if it's logical or possible....but I've recently had a lucid dream...and after this, that and the other went on (long story)
........everything went dark and I felt afraid. When it got light again...I was aware that I was in someone elses body!!

They were in a hospital of some kind....psychiatric one I think....I was trying to tell the nurses that they weren't talking to the person
that they thought they were....that I was asleep...and I was dreaming. They didn't believe me (them) of course!! And the lucid dream
ended with a strong drug being injected into my/their hand....and everything going dark again.

I'm actually starting to think that mental illness, depression and drugs can leave a person open to possession....not necessarily from
only the dead....but sometimes temporarily from the 'living'. And sometimes accidently...as happened to me...with the mental patient.

So....in theory...I CAN believe that a psychically knowledgeable person....astrally travelling....MIGHT be able to possess someone
else's body.

I believe that the moment your body dies, the soul leaves it. The soul never dies. I agree with you when you say your brain doesn't find another body. At least you're trying to believe RA's story/experience. And maybe the fortunate fact that you met your soul-mate is what lets you believe the things you do... beyond facts. Why is it so hard though to believe that we come back in another adult body. UM is full of stories about things unexplained.. .this is simply just another one that makes us really consider another way of thinking.

I love reading your posts. You manage to express yourself without judgment and with heart.
M~

I'm cool with that SS79. Thanks ~

Wow, bee

thanks for sharing!
M~

There is no woodwork for us to crawl out of, which BTW sounds so negative for someone who professes not to care about being disbelieved.

That was Elation's first post (and an auspicious debut it was, too. Welcome aboard). Belgis is well established hereabouts as nobody's fool, and I just chimed in because a buddy of mine was buying it. Oh well, there will be other days.

I noticed that in the other thread, you wrote


So I guess you liked that episode of Farscape, too.

Nice meeting you, RA. Best of luck with the writing.

Think i'm a little slow on the uptake today. LOL

I just had a ding ding moment