Full Version: 44% of Americans believe in this.
Unexplained Mysteries Discussion Forums > Unexplained Mysteries > Spirituality, Religion and Beliefs
In the Perspective section of today's (Dec 30) Chicago Tribune I stumbled across an interesting and rather alarming statistic. The Tribune reported that 44% of Americans "believe the freedom to worship does not extend to all religions." I was wondering what the members of the forum thought of this statistic and how it reflects on the American people in general, 86% of whom believe in God, by the way.
QUOTE (churchanddestroy @ Dec 30 2007, 05:53 PM) 
In the Perspective section of today's (Dec 30) Chicago Tribune I stumbled across an interesting and rather alarming statistic. The Tribune reported that 44% of Americans "believe the freedom to worship does not extend to all religions." I was wondering what the members of the forum thought of this statistic and how it reflects on the American people in general, 86% of whom believe in God, by the way.
It just reinforces my belief that an unfortunate number of my fellow Americans are utter idiots. It's also reflects badly on our educational system. We have a nation moving more towards backwards, superstistious mythology and that will only bode badly for our social and economic future.
QUOTE (capeo @ Dec 30 2007, 10:59 PM)
It just reinforces my belief that an unfortunate number of my fellow Americans are utter idiots. It's also reflects badly on our educational system. We have a nation moving more towards backwards, superstistious mythology and that will only bode badly for our social and economic future.
It is surprising that these are the same people who will preach about taking a leap of faith, yet will refuse to take a leap of faith and move forwards, but instead decide they wish to remain fixed or do a complete turn around and head back to the dark ages.
I have found that most people are sheep & tend to follow the masses. Not everyone who believes in God belives in the God of the bible or the christian God. Most people will say or do anything to be liked by others.
Doesn't surprise me one bit !
Well, I hope those 44% Americans do not passionately claim how free America is, when they boast about it. If it is not free for everyone, than it's not free country period!
if true it is sad and very disturbing. ( not to mention Anti American. because I know how people who think in such a disgusting manor pride themselves on being 'Americans')
Doesn't surprise me either.
QUOTE (Lt_Ripley @ Dec 30 2007, 07:45 PM)
if true it is sad and very disturbing. ( not to mention Anti American. because I know how people who think in such a disgusting manor pride themselves on being 'Americans')
Darn Lt. took the words right out of my mouth!
All that this shows is that you can produce any result you like if you ask an open ended question. The interesting thing would be why different people answered this way.
For example I do not believe people should be able to PRACTICE a religion which harms people. Would you be happy to have an incan religion or baal worshippers sacrifing peole in the name of their religion. I have difficulty with religions which enforce genital mutilation of young women. I personally would not allow a religion which enforced harmfulpractices on non adults(such as refusing blood transfusions. Right or wrong, adults in a free country can make such decisions for themselves, but they do not have the moral authority to force their practces on those not old enough to make fully informed consent.
While one cannot prevent the BELIEF of any religion, WORSHIP, to me, includes practicing it. I do not believe people have the right to practice their religion, where it does any harm to individuals, other than themselves, or consenting adults. Religions which promote, or allow, obvious self harm are also problematic, but you have to draw an ethical line somewhere. Flagellation and mystical practices of some eastern religions both come to mind here, but unhealthy dietary practices is another one which comes up every now and then, when someone dies as a result.
My point is that you have to be careful in jumping to conclusions based on the results of such a survey. It may include many simply bigoted people, but it might include just as many thoughtful and ethical responses. I find it interesting that most posters, so far, have made the assumption that those Americans who responded were of the former kind, rather than the latter.
For example I do not believe people should be able to PRACTICE a religion which harms people. Would you be happy to have an incan religion or baal worshippers sacrifing peole in the name of their religion. I have difficulty with religions which enforce genital mutilation of young women. I personally would not allow a religion which enforced harmfulpractices on non adults(such as refusing blood transfusions. Right or wrong, adults in a free country can make such decisions for themselves, but they do not have the moral authority to force their practces on those not old enough to make fully informed consent.
While one cannot prevent the BELIEF of any religion, WORSHIP, to me, includes practicing it. I do not believe people have the right to practice their religion, where it does any harm to individuals, other than themselves, or consenting adults. Religions which promote, or allow, obvious self harm are also problematic, but you have to draw an ethical line somewhere. Flagellation and mystical practices of some eastern religions both come to mind here, but unhealthy dietary practices is another one which comes up every now and then, when someone dies as a result.
My point is that you have to be careful in jumping to conclusions based on the results of such a survey. It may include many simply bigoted people, but it might include just as many thoughtful and ethical responses. I find it interesting that most posters, so far, have made the assumption that those Americans who responded were of the former kind, rather than the latter.
QUOTE
WORSHIP, to me, includes practicing it.
I thought that it was Practicing which tended to include Worship. I mean, Worship, to the dictionary, does not include Practicing from what I've read.
QUOTE (Mr Walker @ Dec 30 2007, 08:33 PM)
All that this shows is that you can produce any result you like if you ask an open ended question. The interesting thing would be why different people answered this way.
For example I do not believe people should be able to PRACTICE a religion which harms people. Would you be happy to have an incan religion or baal worshippers sacrifing peole in the name of their religion. I have difficulty with religions which enforce genital mutilation of young women. I personally would not allow a religion which enforced harmfulpractices on non adults(such as refusing blood transfusions. Right or wrong, adults in a free country can make such decisions for themselves, but they do not have the moral authority to force their practces on those not old enough to make fully informed consent.
While one cannot prevent the BELIEF of any religion, WORSHIP, to me, includes practicing it. I do not believe people have the right to practice their religion, where it does any harm to individuals, other than themselves, or consenting adults. Religions which promote, or allow, obvious self harm are also problematic, but you have to draw an ethical line somewhere. Flagellation and mystical practices of some eastern religions both come to mind here, but unhealthy dietary practices is another one which comes up every now and then, when someone dies as a result.
My point is that you have to be careful in jumping to conclusions based on the results of such a survey. It may include many simply bigoted people, but it might include just as many thoughtful and ethical responses. I find it interesting that most posters, so far, have made the assumption that those Americans who responded were of the former kind, rather than the latter.
For example I do not believe people should be able to PRACTICE a religion which harms people. Would you be happy to have an incan religion or baal worshippers sacrifing peole in the name of their religion. I have difficulty with religions which enforce genital mutilation of young women. I personally would not allow a religion which enforced harmfulpractices on non adults(such as refusing blood transfusions. Right or wrong, adults in a free country can make such decisions for themselves, but they do not have the moral authority to force their practces on those not old enough to make fully informed consent.
While one cannot prevent the BELIEF of any religion, WORSHIP, to me, includes practicing it. I do not believe people have the right to practice their religion, where it does any harm to individuals, other than themselves, or consenting adults. Religions which promote, or allow, obvious self harm are also problematic, but you have to draw an ethical line somewhere. Flagellation and mystical practices of some eastern religions both come to mind here, but unhealthy dietary practices is another one which comes up every now and then, when someone dies as a result.
My point is that you have to be careful in jumping to conclusions based on the results of such a survey. It may include many simply bigoted people, but it might include just as many thoughtful and ethical responses. I find it interesting that most posters, so far, have made the assumption that those Americans who responded were of the former kind, rather than the latter.
All very good points, Walker. Perhaps there is a web version of the poll so we could see what other perspective answers were. That would certainly give a better picture.
44% of Americans... how many voted in this poll?
QUOTE
For example I do not believe people should be able to PRACTICE a religion which harms people
and yet people of the 3 biggies do and have. sadly.
QUOTE (Mr Walker @ Dec 31 2007, 01:33 AM)
All that this shows is that you can produce any result you like if you ask an open ended question. The interesting thing would be why different people answered this way.
For example I do not believe people should be able to PRACTICE a religion which harms people. Would you be happy to have an incan religion or baal worshippers sacrifing peole in the name of their religion. I have difficulty with religions which enforce genital mutilation of young women. I personally would not allow a religion which enforced harmfulpractices on non adults(such as refusing blood transfusions. Right or wrong, adults in a free country can make such decisions for themselves, but they do not have the moral authority to force their practces on those not old enough to make fully informed consent.
While one cannot prevent the BELIEF of any religion, WORSHIP, to me, includes practicing it. I do not believe people have the right to practice their religion, where it does any harm to individuals, other than themselves, or consenting adults. Religions which promote, or allow, obvious self harm are also problematic, but you have to draw an ethical line somewhere. Flagellation and mystical practices of some eastern religions both come to mind here, but unhealthy dietary practices is another one which comes up every now and then, when someone dies as a result.
My point is that you have to be careful in jumping to conclusions based on the results of such a survey. It may include many simply bigoted people, but it might include just as many thoughtful and ethical responses. I find it interesting that most posters, so far, have made the assumption that those Americans who responded were of the former kind, rather than the latter.
Wonderful points Bro, Walker.For example I do not believe people should be able to PRACTICE a religion which harms people. Would you be happy to have an incan religion or baal worshippers sacrifing peole in the name of their religion. I have difficulty with religions which enforce genital mutilation of young women. I personally would not allow a religion which enforced harmfulpractices on non adults(such as refusing blood transfusions. Right or wrong, adults in a free country can make such decisions for themselves, but they do not have the moral authority to force their practces on those not old enough to make fully informed consent.
While one cannot prevent the BELIEF of any religion, WORSHIP, to me, includes practicing it. I do not believe people have the right to practice their religion, where it does any harm to individuals, other than themselves, or consenting adults. Religions which promote, or allow, obvious self harm are also problematic, but you have to draw an ethical line somewhere. Flagellation and mystical practices of some eastern religions both come to mind here, but unhealthy dietary practices is another one which comes up every now and then, when someone dies as a result.
My point is that you have to be careful in jumping to conclusions based on the results of such a survey. It may include many simply bigoted people, but it might include just as many thoughtful and ethical responses. I find it interesting that most posters, so far, have made the assumption that those Americans who responded were of the former kind, rather than the latter.
Do no Harm, to me this means less remorse, because I feel acountable,And compasionate.
Also my Father sugested this.
Curious about this one though,
I personally would not allow a religion which enforced harmfulpractices on non adults(such as refusing blood transfusions. Right or wrong, adults in a free country can make such decisions for themselves, but they do not have the moral authority to force their practces on those not old enough to make fully informed consent.
If not the adults, or care givers or parents, do you sugest we let the adolesent make life and death decisions, be it his own?
Love Omnaka
I question this poll, However there are so many stupid youth out there.
QUOTE (Pfc. Lovekamp U.S. Army ROTC @ Dec 31 2007, 05:24 AM)
I question this poll, However there are so many stupid youth out there.
I believe there are alot of Ignorant Adults out there also, but who's to judge, I, may be one.
Every thing being relative and all.
Love Omnaka
I'm not suprised with the poll. There's just too many idiots in this country.
QUOTE (Walter Sullivan @ Dec 31 2007, 05:55 AM)
I'm not suprised with the poll. There's just too many idiots in this country.
Are they the one's making the polls, Taking the polls , Or the one's talking about the polls?
Love Omnaka
I'm not sure what you mean. I was talking about the 44% who believe in that.
QUOTE (Walter Sullivan @ Dec 31 2007, 06:21 AM)
I'm not sure what you mean. I was talking about the 44% who believe in that.
I was not sure what you meant either, thats why all the choices.
Love Omnaka
QUOTE (BlindMessiah @ Dec 30 2007, 08:02 PM)
44% of Americans... how many voted in this poll?
I wish I knew, the Chicago Tribune declined to give a count or a +/- error percentage.
QUOTE
If not the adults, or care givers or parents, do you sugest we let the adolesent make life and death decisions, be it his own
No omnaka, people too young to make informed choices need to be protected, both from the consequences of their own decisions, and those of the care givers who other wise have legal control over them. I can see how my initial statement migh have seemed confusing. I just meant in areas which may bring harm, parents/caregivers do not have a right to impose their own religious practices on a child. This is pretty standard law in most western countries, but only in recent yeard.
In a western democratic society that would mean children are protected by laws based on the ethical/moral codes developed by the society. This would ensure they got adequate medical care and diet, as well as preventing them participating in pornography or underage sex. There are a couple of problems, particularly when is an appropriate age of consent. Given modern medical discoveries which show that humans do not develop good risk assessment/judgement until in their twenties, perhaps the "good old days" limit of 21 was more logical than one of 15 or 16.
QUOTE (Mr Walker @ Dec 31 2007, 06:49 AM)
No omnaka, people too young to make informed choices need to be protected, both from the consequences of their own decisions, and those of the care givers who other wise have legal control over them.
In a western democratic society that would mean children are protected by laws based on the ethical/moral codes developed by the society. This would ensure they got adequate medical care and diet, as well as preventing them participating in pornography or underage sex. There are a couple of problems , particularly when is an appropriate age of consent. Given modern medical discoverys which show that humans do not develop good risk assessment/judgement until in their twenties, perhaps the good old days limit of 21 was more logical than one of 15 or 16.
In a western democratic society that would mean children are protected by laws based on the ethical/moral codes developed by the society. This would ensure they got adequate medical care and diet, as well as preventing them participating in pornography or underage sex. There are a couple of problems , particularly when is an appropriate age of consent. Given modern medical discoverys which show that humans do not develop good risk assessment/judgement until in their twenties, perhaps the good old days limit of 21 was more logical than one of 15 or 16.
Ok, So we let laws and society dictate life and death situations when minors are in peril, Who inforces these laws. People, Usually adults , who are dictated to by their moral and ethical self.
For letting laws dictate what;s up w/ life and death of our youngsters I disagree, and would rather have a compassionate persone , Adult If I were a minor that a system at the helm. THis world is full of Grey areas , and not so many black and white.
Health and Justicely speaking.
Love Omnaka
QUOTE (Mr Walker @ Dec 30 2007, 06:33 PM)
All that this shows is that you can produce any result you like if you ask an open ended question. The interesting thing would be why different people answered this way.
For example I do not believe people should be able to PRACTICE a religion which harms people. Would you be happy to have an incan religion or baal worshippers sacrifing peole in the name of their religion. I have difficulty with religions which enforce genital mutilation of young women. I personally would not allow a religion which enforced harmfulpractices on non adults(such as refusing blood transfusions. Right or wrong, adults in a free country can make such decisions for themselves, but they do not have the moral authority to force their practces on those not old enough to make fully informed consent.
While one cannot prevent the BELIEF of any religion, WORSHIP, to me, includes practicing it. I do not believe people have the right to practice their religion, where it does any harm to individuals, other than themselves, or consenting adults. Religions which promote, or allow, obvious self harm are also problematic, but you have to draw an ethical line somewhere. Flagellation and mystical practices of some eastern religions both come to mind here, but unhealthy dietary practices is another one which comes up every now and then, when someone dies as a result.
My point is that you have to be careful in jumping to conclusions based on the results of such a survey. It may include many simply bigoted people, but it might include just as many thoughtful and ethical responses. I find it interesting that most posters, so far, have made the assumption that those Americans who responded were of the former kind, rather than the latter.
For example I do not believe people should be able to PRACTICE a religion which harms people. Would you be happy to have an incan religion or baal worshippers sacrifing peole in the name of their religion. I have difficulty with religions which enforce genital mutilation of young women. I personally would not allow a religion which enforced harmfulpractices on non adults(such as refusing blood transfusions. Right or wrong, adults in a free country can make such decisions for themselves, but they do not have the moral authority to force their practces on those not old enough to make fully informed consent.
While one cannot prevent the BELIEF of any religion, WORSHIP, to me, includes practicing it. I do not believe people have the right to practice their religion, where it does any harm to individuals, other than themselves, or consenting adults. Religions which promote, or allow, obvious self harm are also problematic, but you have to draw an ethical line somewhere. Flagellation and mystical practices of some eastern religions both come to mind here, but unhealthy dietary practices is another one which comes up every now and then, when someone dies as a result.
My point is that you have to be careful in jumping to conclusions based on the results of such a survey. It may include many simply bigoted people, but it might include just as many thoughtful and ethical responses. I find it interesting that most posters, so far, have made the assumption that those Americans who responded were of the former kind, rather than the latter.
Excellent points, I am glad that not everyone is immediately jumping to the "ZOMG, IGNORANT ALERT!!!1!" stance.Personally I would have voted with the 44%. Let's be reasonably about this, and not to automatically call that 44% idiots. Honestly, with the appearance of a religion like Scientology (not saying it's violent) appearing within a century, who is to condemn the possibility of someone creating a random religion that has the practice of killing infants? Yes, the major religions can generate hate and violence, but generally it isn't a major aspect of that religion. Take Islam as an example. They teach to take a stance for their religion, but not to take it to far. It's that aspect that these radical Muslims ad Islam bashing people easily overlook.
We should moderate on what can be considered a religion or not. Christianity is a religion. Me burning down an entire town because my dog told me to do it is not. The controversy would be to how and who determines what faiths are reasonable and which ones are not.
QUOTE (Omnaka @ Dec 31 2007, 04:25 PM)
Ok, So we let laws and society dictate life and death situations when minors are in peril, Who inforces these laws. People, Usually adults , who are dictated to by their moral and ethical self.
For letting laws dictate what;s up w/ life and death of our youngsters I disagree, and would rather have a compassionate persone , Adult If I were a minor that a system at the helm. THis world is full of Grey areas , and not so many black and white.
Health and Justicely speaking.
Love Omnaka
For letting laws dictate what;s up w/ life and death of our youngsters I disagree, and would rather have a compassionate persone , Adult If I were a minor that a system at the helm. THis world is full of Grey areas , and not so many black and white.
Health and Justicely speaking.
Love Omnaka
I understand what you are saying and this may in fact work for individuals, particularly where the adults are rational beings, as well as compassionate, but when society needs to protect all its citizens, en masse, only codified laws, with all their failings, will give a reasonably consistent positive outcome. Young lives, particularly, are too vulnerable, and valuable, to leave entirely to arbitrary emotions like compassion, (some families have it in droves , in others it is completely missing) Compassion, or caring, does not always equate with logical or beneficial treatment. You can think you are doing the right thing and still do great harm.
I must admit my personal view is coloured by my long time love, and concern, for young people, which has seen me a teacher for over 35 years. Teaching has also shown me that there are many types of children and families, and that some are completely dysfunctional, and the children need the protection of wider society. I am required by law to report even a reasonable suspicion of any mis- treatment of a child at any time. This does not provide perfect results every time, but any action is beter than sitting back and doing nothing.
That's 44% of American that's completely idiotic and unintelligent. Why can't they learn some respect, and allow others to believe in their own Gods? Everyone has a right to believe what they want. It's not like their blood thirsty God was ever proven to be the "only true" God to begin with...
QUOTE (churchanddestroy @ Dec 30 2007, 05:53 PM)
In the Perspective section of today's (Dec 30) Chicago Tribune I stumbled across an interesting and rather alarming statistic. The Tribune reported that 44% of Americans "believe the freedom to worship does not extend to all religions." I was wondering what the members of the forum thought of this statistic and how it reflects on the American people in general, 86% of whom believe in God, by the way.
Freedom to worship religion will be out of our hands one day, You will be told who and what and how to worship, I can't help but think what will happen to people when they have no choice to choose, to decide if thats right for them and how we will be affected by the results. I am and will always be a christian, and If I was told I had to denounce God as my saviour and worship someone or something else, I would die trying to worship and do Gods will, I would never, Could never live in a world without God in my life. As important as God is to me, There are more like me and more who have different beliefs. I consider my "right" To worship God a priviledge, I don't know why, Other than I think about how people over the past decades have had to fight for the right and the bloodshed from those people dying to reserve the right to pray, to worship and to choose whats right for them. God does give us the choice of our beliefs, We have the freewill to pick and choose and what we want to believe, I choose God. I know some members often bring up the fact that christians killed,and they say still kill in the name of God and while I do not know the history like some here I think that some religions kill to prove something they are trying to say and as they do they lose people who was important to their religion beause a true religion would not choose to kill to make a point. I think with all thats happening in the world today, Religions that tend to be violent, Should have to Re-earn the right to practice that religion if they show violence towards anyone. I know people make a religion, and one person don't speak for tne whole religion, But then that one person or two, or fifty need to be ousted as they don't represent everyone when they decide to use violence to get their points, veiws across.Always a pleasure, Its nice to see 86% Of the tribune believe in God.
QUOTE (m. Moe @ Dec 31 2007, 02:28 AM)
Excellent points, I am glad that not everyone is immediately jumping to the "ZOMG, IGNORANT ALERT!!!1!" stance.Personally I would have voted with the 44%. Let's be reasonably about this, and not to automatically call that 44% idiots. Honestly, with the appearance of a religion like Scientology (not saying it's violent) appearing within a century, who is to condemn the possibility of someone creating a random religion that has the practice of killing infants? Yes, the major religions can generate hate and violence, but generally it isn't a major aspect of that religion. Take Islam as an example. They teach to take a stance for their religion, but not to take it to far. It's that aspect that these radical Muslims ad Islam bashing people easily overlook.
We should moderate on what can be considered a religion or not. Christianity is a religion. Me burning down an entire town because my dog told me to do it is not. The controversy would be to how and who determines what faiths are reasonable and which ones are not.
That would be a very difficult panel/board to bring together, that you could get several religions to agree to it would suprise me. I would want to make sure that God is worshiped and that no other false Gods be involved, And that I had my fair shot at getting them to see things God's way. I would think every religion on the panel would want the same thing, To make theirs the one that perserveres. And then you have to think about the cults" that will want their obviously silly, man made religion, reconized as true religions ( Like the example of burning the town down
because some idiot decided to declare their dog a religion to be worshiped, Now if there is somebody here at UM that has a friends dog as their God and worship him, Please I am positive I don't care to know. Always a pleasure and I thank you all here for taking the time to read my opinions. Thank you my UM mem friends.
Got a link to the pol. I would like to know how the question was posed and were the pol was conducted. It is a complex question. You don't want people running around doing human sacrifice, but how about a Voodoo priest doing a chicken sacrifice? I don't have a problem with that, many of us eat chicken and you have to kill it to eat it. Many people don't like the Pagan religions cause we do occult practices and worship Gods other than the God of Abraham and they would like to do away with our religions. If wasn't that long ago we Pagans were outlawed. Under the US Constitution we are now safe from those who want to do us harm, but they still do it anyway. Baning Pagan shops and schools from towns and harassing Pagans in their homes.
No surprise there then, i could have told you that without doing a poll, its been obvious for a while.
QUOTE (churchanddestroy @ Dec 30 2007, 05:53 PM)
In the Perspective section of today's (Dec 30) Chicago Tribune I stumbled across an interesting and rather alarming statistic. The Tribune reported that 44% of Americans "believe the freedom to worship does not extend to all religions." I was wondering what the members of the forum thought of this statistic and how it reflects on the American people in general, 86% of whom believe in God, by the way.
Only in America...
Was this poll done in a red state? Wouldn't surprise me to learn that it was.
QUOTE (capeo @ Dec 31 2007, 12:59 AM)
It just reinforces my belief that an unfortunate number of my fellow Americans are utter idiots. It's also reflects badly on our educational system. We have a nation moving more towards backwards, superstistious mythology and that will only bode badly for our social and economic future.
I am afraid you're right about that .
QUOTE (norwood1026 @ Dec 31 2007, 01:18 AM)
I have found that most people are sheep & tend to follow the masses. Not everyone who believes in God belives in the God of the bible or the christian God. Most people will say or do anything to be liked by others.
And some are just hypocrits .
QUOTE (norwood1026 @ Dec 30 2007, 06:18 PM)
I have found that most people are sheep & tend to follow the masses. Not everyone who believes in God belives in the God of the bible or the christian God. Most people will say or do anything to be liked by others.
I am only speaking for myself of course, But I am going to speak loud. God is not a toy you can play with when you want and leave just lying around when you want. You do not don't present yourself to God in the frame of mind thats not really serious, It is to be taken very seriously. When you are sure You are ready God will know too, God knows when you are not genuine, And a bit of advice God is the last person I would ever try and fool or pull one over on, He knows before you do what you will acually do. Please don't think you will outsmart God because it Will NEVER happen. And to fit into a group or to be like the crowd is a INSULT to God in my opinion. Always a pleasure
QUOTE (sandee @ Dec 31 2007, 04:56 PM)
I am only speaking for myself of course, But I am going to speak loud. God is not a toy you can play with when you want and leave just lying around when you want. You do not don't present yourself to God in the frame of mind thats not really serious, It is to be taken very seriously. When you are sure You are ready God will know too, God knows when you are not genuine, And a bit of advice God is the last person I would ever try and fool or pull one over on, He knows before you do what you will acually do. Please don't think you will outsmart God because it Will NEVER happen. And to fit into a group or to be like the crowd is a INSULT to God in my opinion. Always a pleasure
I use to think the same, But Father (God) actually is a Great spirit who loves to laugh , and Feels Good when we do and sad when we are , Father is not as serious as many would like to believe.
I use to Put I love G-d on my phone for a welcome message, One morning I woke up and the Hyphen was gone in it's place was an O..
God does not need to be worshiped, and only wants our love, but by no means does it detract from God's love for us.
Love God or not , God will always love us, This is unconditional. even if one thinks he hates Father, or God, This will not afect God's love for us.
But the one thinking God hates, and who hates God will find it hard to reconcile with his own spiritual remorse after this truth is shown him after this life (In spirit), and this will keep him from melding with the love of God .
You are correct, One can not fool God, or the Guardian spirit, Father sent with each spirit incarnate.
I guess I do not insult Father, because I do not belong to any religious org, and state my Love as a way of life.
(Also he told me, "in you Omnaka, Iam proud")
However I do warn against blaspheming God Father Or Holy spirit Mother, for even Though they do forgive and love unconditionally, the Blasphemer won't forgive himself.
Love Omnaka
QUOTE (churchanddestroy @ Dec 30 2007, 10:53 PM)
In the Perspective section of today's (Dec 30) Chicago Tribune I stumbled across an interesting and rather alarming statistic. The Tribune reported that 44% of Americans "believe the freedom to worship does not extend to all religions." I was wondering what the members of the forum thought of this statistic and how it reflects on the American people in general, 86% of whom believe in God, by the way.
Before we go condemning 44% of us. How was the question to the phrased? Because if I were asked Does the freedom to worship extend to all religions I would be inclined to say not really, or only with conditions. because look I think that a targeted church bombing counts as freedom snatching.
and also which 44% of americans were asked this question, i mean which demographic are we talking about.....the kids that aren't allowed to pray in school, or what?
1. Print media is dead. (brain dead as well)
2. Sometime in the not to far distant future, this time will be referred to as the "Second Dark Age".
Before we totally condem these people, you should understand that in many other countries it is illegal to practice many or most religions. Even in countries like Germany many religions are called Cults and are outlawed. I think you'll find that most of the world is actually far LESS tolerant then the US.
QUOTE (churchanddestroy @ Dec 30 2007, 10:53 PM)
In the Perspective section of today's (Dec 30) Chicago Tribune I stumbled across an interesting and rather alarming statistic. The Tribune reported that 44% of Americans "believe the freedom to worship does not extend to all religions." I was wondering what the members of the forum thought of this statistic and how it reflects on the American people in general, 86% of whom believe in God, by the way.
I love how people just think that this means Christians mean you can't be Jewish or Muslim
And don't consider that probably what this refers to is that some things held up as a "religion" have practices that some people feel are immoral and shouldn't be sanctioned under religious freedom.
Like for example
Blood sacrifice
Child Marriage
Polygamy
Pedophile
Honor Killings
Arranged Marriage
Etc Etc Etc.
http://www.skeptictank.org/hs/mormpedo.htm
But no its just got to be those nasty Christians not wanting others to have the same rights.
This is why though i believe in God with my whole heart, I do not claim religious doctrines.
QUOTE (Darkwind @ Dec 31 2007, 06:22 AM)
Got a link to the pol. I would like to know how the question was posed and were the pol was conducted. It is a complex question. You don't want people running around doing human sacrifice, but how about a Voodoo priest doing a chicken sacrifice? I don't have a problem with that, many of us eat chicken and you have to kill it to eat it. Many people don't like the Pagan religions cause we do occult practices and worship Gods other than the God of Abraham and they would like to do away with our religions. If wasn't that long ago we Pagans were outlawed. Under the US Constitution we are now safe from those who want to do us harm, but they still do it anyway. Baning Pagan shops and schools from towns and harassing Pagans in their homes.
Just wait, there will probably be another witch-hunt in the future. I hope that will never happen.
My 300th post!
QUOTE (truethat @ Dec 31 2007, 01:36 PM)
I love how people just think that this means Christians mean you can't be Jewish or Muslim
And don't consider that probably what this refers to is that some things held up as a "religion" have practices that some people feel are immoral and shouldn't be sanctioned under religious freedom.
Like for example
Blood sacrifice
Child Marriage
Polygamy
Pedophile
Honor Killings
Arranged Marriage
Etc Etc Etc.
http://www.skeptictank.org/hs/mormpedo.htm
But no its just got to be those nasty Christians not wanting others to have the same rights.
And don't consider that probably what this refers to is that some things held up as a "religion" have practices that some people feel are immoral and shouldn't be sanctioned under religious freedom.
Like for example
Blood sacrifice
Child Marriage
Polygamy
Pedophile
Honor Killings
Arranged Marriage
Etc Etc Etc.
http://www.skeptictank.org/hs/mormpedo.htm
But no its just got to be those nasty Christians not wanting others to have the same rights.
Oh come on, We did not do anything. How can you say such a thing? I am a christian and I don't always agree with ones belief and I do tend to preach to them even if they fuss, But I am a nice person I would nver Try and ban ones belief.We have been there done that, lets look to the future, where one day we will be in the paradise God built for us. Now if your not a believer in God , Then let me tell you he is really close just call and God will be at your side. Now you just know I really had to say that , Always a pleasure, really though you camn just call.
QUOTE (capeo @ Dec 30 2007, 02:59 PM)
It just reinforces my belief that an unfortunate number of my fellow Americans are utter idiots. It's also reflects badly on our educational system. We have a nation moving more towards backwards, superstitious mythology and that will only bode badly for our social and economic future.
This is true and unfortunate. "towards backwards"; lol, oxymoron
QUOTE (sandee @ Dec 31 2007, 02:02 PM)
Oh come on, We did not do anything. How can you say such a thing? I am a christian and I don't always agree with ones belief and I do tend to preach to them even if they fuss, But I am a nice person I would nver Try and ban ones belief.We have been there done that, lets look to the future, where one day we will be in the paradise God built for us. Now if your not a believer in God , Then let me tell you he is really close just call and God will be at your side. Now you just know I really had to say that , Always a pleasure, really though you camn just call.
It wasn't a personal attack, rather a generalization of Christians. Generalizations allow exceptions. Also, you may be Christian, but these are doctrines of Christianity. It's Holy Books offer many scriptures against all that was written down, so you either don't follow certain parts or any of the scripture, are not fundamentalist, or haven't read much of th Bible's Old Testament.
Also, why do some, or maybe even most, of you people always put little irrelevant redundant God poems in everything you say? Keep the discussion secular, unless the situation calls otherwise, and merits it because of it's context.
QUOTE (DieChecker @ Dec 31 2007, 07:30 PM)
Before we totally condem these people, you should understand that in many other countries it is illegal to practice many or most religions. Even in countries like Germany many religions are called Cults and are outlawed. I think you'll find that most of the world is actually far LESS tolerant then the US.
Any religion that is proven harmful in a court of law will not be allowed to exist or be labeled a cult, depending.
They stilil have fathers doing honor killings over here (killing their daughters) in the name of their faith. People actually got out of getting punishment because it was part of their faith/belief. But this has finally stopped.They are getting punished or deported.
But they can't ban Islam, because they all don't practice honor killings. It's a complicated issue.
I believe people should be allowed to believe in anything they wish to, as long as they don't break they law.
QUOTE (capeo @ Dec 30 2007, 04:59 PM)
It just reinforces my belief that an unfortunate number of my fellow Americans are utter idiots. It's also reflects badly on our educational system. We have a nation moving more towards backwards, superstistious mythology and that will only bode badly for our social and economic future.
I don't think you can fault the material that is available to educate, in other word, we have nothing else to learn with. When the system gets bogged down with ways to demonstrate things that have been demonstrated and shown and prodded and blown apart, you get irritated and want to find another
way. But you can't! There's nothing else! That's why everything seems to be going backwards because people are trying to explain the present with the past.
QUOTE (stackofbooks @ Feb 8 2008, 05:05 PM)
It wasn't a personal attack, rather a generalization of Christians. Generalizations allow exceptions. Also, you may be Christian, but these are doctrines of Christianity. It's Holy Books offer many scriptures against all that was written down, so you either don't follow certain parts or any of the scripture, are not fundamentalist, or haven't read much of th Bible's Old Testament.
Also, why do some, or maybe even most, of you people always put little irrelevant redundant God poems in everything you say? Keep the discussion secular, unless the situation calls otherwise, and merits it because of it's context.
Also, why do some, or maybe even most, of you people always put little irrelevant redundant God poems in everything you say? Keep the discussion secular, unless the situation calls otherwise, and merits it because of it's context.
You people? I put what """"" I """""" feel is appropriate in "my" post. I have the right to do so and who says what the disscussion merits, You? I do not find God irrevelent and I will continue to place my "God poems" in whatever context I feel is appropriate, irrevelent and redundent is your opinion and while I respect your beliefs and point of veiw I will not alter my post to please you. I also do not know exactly how you meant the ""you people"' statement but it came off as pretty offensive. I respect everyones religion and beliefs or lack of and would never presume to think I could change ones mind by posting my "God Poems" so I am not pushing my belief or religion on anyone I am simply stating my beliefs as that is my right as it is everyones right to do so.
I did not see your post as a personal attack and generalizations are dangerous when religion is involved, I do read and study the bible and I am not perfect far from it but every christian is different just as every person is different so to generalize a whole group is silly and ineffective. Always a pleasure ( I did not realise you ere only 13, so if I as harsh then forgive me)
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