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crystal sage
Been wondering what is going to happen to all the "Space Junk"..

Are they going to design some form of space junk collecter ( imagine what the collected space junk will sell for on Ebay ?)..that will clean up our mess and make it a safer place for future exploration????

QUOTE
http://www.wired.com/science/space/news/2006/09/71794
It's a junkyard out there in space and sometimes astronauts accidentally contribute to the litter. In 1965, the first American spacewalker, Ed White, lost a spare glove when he went outside for the first time. From that time on, astronauts have accidentally added some of the more unusual items to the 100,000 pieces of space trash that circle Earth.

Last July, spacewalker Piers Sellers sheepishly reported that he lost a spatula. Nicknamed "spatsat" by space junk watchers, it returns to Earth in a fireball early next month.

This week the Atlantis astronauts made their own contributions to the space debris in low orbit: a couple of bolts that escaped from the addition they were connecting to the international space station.

To engineers, this isn't funny. Many of those pieces of space junk can kill astronauts, puncture satellites or at the very least scratch up expensive space shuttle windows.

"It's one of these problems that is growing in seriousness," said William Ailor, director of the Center for Orbital and Re-entry Debris Studies at the Aerospace Corp. in Los Angeles. "It's really the small things that will get you."

Using radar and telescope sensors, NASA and the Air Force track objects bigger than about 4 inches. The official "box score" of that space debris as of Thursday was 9,925. But the 90,000 objects smaller than that can be as dangerous, zipping around Earth at more than 15,000 mph. They are just harder to track.

NASA has even seen debris hits of dried-up urine, toothpaste and shaving cream — all from space shuttle waste dumps — in an experiment placed outside of the Russian space station Mir, said officials at the NASA orbital debris program lab. An Indonesian satellite was struck by urine and fecal matter. Now NASA doesn't dump human waste outside much anymore.



Even an object the size of a medicine tablet "will do a significant amount of damage to most spacecraft."

And there are much bigger objects to worry about, including giant rocket bodies from launches dating back to 1958. But those are often in the most hazardous area for space junk, which is about 400 miles above the space station and shuttle, Matney said.
Killer Moth
What if all that dangerus junk zipping around keeps us pinned down on earth huh.gif
crystal sage
..From an earlier thread...

QUOTE
What you are about to see is quite remarkable. It seems that some of the stars above us are not stars at all...as you shall see. A young man by the name of John Lenard Walson has discovered a new way to extend the capabilities of small telescopes and has been able to achieve optical resolutions - at almost the diffraction limit - not commonly achievable. With this new-found ability, he has proceeded to videotape, night and day, many strange and heretofore unseen objects in earth orbit. The resulting astrophotographic video footage has revealed a raft of machines, hardware, satellites, spacecraft and possibly space ships which otherwise appear as 'stars'...if they appear at all.

There are, indeed, hundreds of satellites in Earth orbit as you will read in the summary which follows. However, the iamges you will see are clearly of large and sizeable machines which have not been seen before.


For the full story please visit: http://www.rense.com/general79/wdx1.htm

crystal sage
The famed lost glove of Ed White
[/quote]

http://blogcritics.org/archives/2006/10/07/201709.php
Ed White lost a glove on the first American spacewalk in 1965, cosmonaut Michael Collins misplaced his camera near the Gemini 10 spacecraft in 1966[/quote]

More on Ed White...
QUOTE
http://history.nasa.gov/Apollo204/zorn/white.htm

During the third revolution, the crew received a go ahead for both decompression and EVA. Accordingly, the spacecraft's atmosphere was reduced to a vacuum and White's hatch was opened. As Ed stood in his seat, preparing for egress, he checked his camera equipment three times. "I wanted to make sure I didn't leave the lens cap on... I knew I might as well not come back if I did." (31)

At 2:45 P.M., as Gemini 4 passed beyond Hawaii, Ed White emerged through the hatch. "When I departed the spacecraft, there was no pushoff whatsoever from the spacecraft... The gun actually provided the impulse for me to leave the spacecraft." (32) As he began his space walk, Ed was fully aware that all of his VOX transmissions were being heard by millions of people who were glued to their radios and television sets. "I thought, 'What do you say to 194 million people when you're looking down at them from space?' Then the solution became very obvious to me... 'They don't want me to talk to them. They want to hear what we're doing up here.' ... So what you heard were two test pilots conducting their mission in the best manner possible." (33)

Ed relayed that he did not experience any disorientation or sensation that he was falling. In spite of the fact that Gemini 4 was whipping through space at speeds in excess of 17,500 mph, White felt very little sensation of speed. He reported that "the maneuvering unit is good. The only problem I have is that I haven't got enough fuel". (34) With the fuel exhausted in the hand unit, White had to rely on the twenty five foot tether to maneuver himself. He soon discovered that the gun provided much better control than the tether and that moving was much more difficult and awkward without it.

Ed, a photography buff, then turned his attention to capturing the spectacular views he was witnessing on film. cool.gif [b]"I'm going to work on getting some pictures... I can sit out here and see the whole California coast," (35) he remarked. While White snapped away with his 35 mm camera, Jim McDivitt took some photos of Ed as he came into full view of the window. As he maneuvered away, Ed accidently bumped into the spacecraft, leaving a mark on McDivitt's window. The world delighted in hearing the banter between two friends as Jim stated, "You smeared up my windshield, you dirty dog. You see how it's all smeared up there?" (36)


White's suit held up well and the special helmet visor provided the necessary protection from the sun. White noted that, "The sun in space is not blinding but it's quite nice." (37) The entire space walk was progressing extremely well. It was clear that White was enjoying himself thoroughly as he exuberantly radioed, "I'm very thankful in having the experience to be first... This is fun!" (38)
thumbsup.gif
Ed's final view during his space walk was of the state of Florida. "I could see all the lower part of the state, the island chain of Cuba and Puerto Rico." (39) All too soon, the flight director ordered White back inside Gemini 4 and America's first walk in space came to a close. No one was sorrier to see it end than Ed White. "It's the saddest moment of my life," (40) he commented as he slowly maneuvered his way back. Without the benefit of the self propulsion unit, Ed needed extra time to return to the hatch. Some contended that the delay was an indication that he had suffered from a kind of narcosis of the deep or euphoria. However, Ed insisted that this was not the case. "I can say in all sincerity and honesty that I enjoyed the EVA very much, and I was sorry to see it draw to a close, and I was indeed reluctant to come in. But when the word came that the EVA phase was over, I knew it was time to come in and I did. There was no euphoria, but getting back into the cabin took just as much time as getting out; I had to do the same things, only in reverse order, handing my gear in to Jim, and so on." (41) White had achieved his goal of becoming the first man to propel himself in space. In addition, his space walk had lasted twice as long as Leonov's ten minute excursion. Ed had felt many things during those twenty minutes, but "the biggest thing was a feeling of accomplishment". (42)

Gemini 4 made sixty two orbits around the earth, flying a grand total of 1,609,700 miles before splashing down in the Atlantic. Skeptics had predicted that astronauts would suffer horrendous physical side effects from a long duration flight and that the recovery crews would find either dead bodies or unconscious astronauts hovering on the brink of death once they opened the hatches. However, the recovery helicopter pilot saw a totally different sight. "They were like a couple of kids playing on the beach, splashing in the salt water." (43) Ed White was doing some kind of exercise that resembled deep knee bends. Both astronauts appeared to be in fine shape, aside from a slight case of seasickness on Ed's part and being in desperate need of a shower and shave. Commenting on their distinct aroma after the flight Ed quipped, "I thought we smelled fine. It was all those people on the carrier that smelled strange." (44) On board the recovery carrier Wasp, Ed stated, "I felt so good I didn't know whether to hop, skip, jump or walk on my hands!" (40) His spirits were so high that he danced a jig on the way to the crew quarters.

In spite of their good mood, the astronauts had experienced some practical concerns during their flight. They found the work/rest cycles to be inadequate. Thoughts about running out of water had caused the crew to be overly conservative in their water intake, putting them at risk for dehydration. In addition, "White noted that about four or five hours after eating, he began to feel as if his energy level was going downhill in a more pronounced manner than it did on earth. Each time he ate, he noted definitely that his energy level bounced up." (45) Those who knew Ed White were not at all surprised to learn that hunger pangs were his biggest discomfort during the flight. He was known to have the most voracious appetite in the entire astronaut corps. "Although space doctors failed to find an ounce of fat on his 170 pound frame, White could put away two full course dinners at one sitting and then ask for dessert with a straight face." (46) Needless to say, it did not take Ed long to gain back the eight pounds he had lost during his flight.
MID
There's a whole lot of crap up there....

Mike Collins lost a camera, and all his pictures, durning a GT-10 EVA (1966)..and Suni Williams lost her digital camera on an EVA during the STS-116 mission (early 2007)...

These are substantial pieces of orbiting stuff...but remember that these things are orbiting in the same direction, basically, that all manned spacecraft orbit. They may be going something like 17500 MPH, but so are we when we get there, and in the same relative direction.

The odds of a catastrophic collision with any of this stuff is negligible.


But someday, someplace, that white-covered digital of Suni's is going to be seen glinting in the sunlight, perhps a mile or more off in the distance, on some flight. It'll probably be photographed, or filmed.

It'll be a UFO, no one will be able to get a handle on what it is...and the images will be fodder for more talk of aliens, and NASA lies and coverups...and all it really will be is one of the thousands of bits of orbital debris floating up there...


crystal sage
There would be quite a profit involved in collecting the space junk and selling it at auction.... maybe some sort of space recycling station that sent ships to suck them in like street sweepers...

Could you imagine how much that camera would go for if anyone ever found it???

Then just think of how many puzzeling things we'd find to... bits of exploded comets... meteors.. wink2.gif exploded UFO's... or their rubbish... laugh.gif

early prehistoric attempts at space flight....

You could have your own space archeology....

The way things are going now with all the space junk... we'll soon have rings around us like Saturn......


wink2.gif cool.gif
HMMM Could the rings of Saturn be spack junk????

A lesson for us???? to keep our own neighbourhood... spacehood clean...???

Do you think some nasty corporations could have been rocketing up their toxic waste????

crystal sage
http://www.space.com/peopleinterviews/khalili_profile.html

QUOTE
Currently, billions of pieces of old spacecraft, satellites and rocket boosters, also known as space junk, are in low Earth orbit. These floating heaps of trash pose serious problems for the future of spaceflight.

"As the shuttle ascends to orbit to work on a space station built to hold four or so people, it will throw away the equivalent of a small office building," Space Frontier President Rick N. Tumlinson wrote in a release during shuttle Atlantis' mission to the International Space Station (ISS) in September. "This will be the 99th of these giant structures to be wasted. Ironically, instead of there just being Mir and the infant ISS in space, there could have been 99 active space platforms by now. And it could have been done through recycling."

So what do we do with all that orbital garbage?

Some of the proposed solutions include using laser blasters to pulverize the debris or launching them to the Moon to bypass low Earth orbit. NASA has been working with the United Nations for five years to pass an international law forcing countries and private companies to abide by new regulations on orbital debris. But these solutions are expensive. This, combined with a slow bureaucratic pace, has stalled any progress on solving this problem.

Khalili's vision for the future of manned spaceflight and habitation offers NASA a way to minimize the trash we send to space by stopping space pollution in its tracks -- when you send a man to the Moon, let him build his home from lunar soil.
MID
QUOTE (crystal sage @ Jan 3 2008, 08:21 AM) *
There would be quite a profit involved in collecting the space junk and selling it at auction.... maybe some sort of space recycling station that sent ships to suck them in like street sweepers...

Could you imagine how much that camera would go for if anyone ever found it???


Well, the only people with the capability of possibly finding and grabbing hold of such stuff, like cameras, would be mighty interested in having them. I would have no idea if the film in Mike Collins' GT-10 camera would be viable at all, but I'd imagine that the unit itself might be given to him as a momento.

Suni's camera...well, it's digital, and well insulated...It would be valuable certainly for its content.

QUOTE
The way things are going now with all the space junk... we'll soon have rings around us like Saturn......


wink2.gif cool.gif
HMMM Could the rings of Saturn be spack junk????


Sure they're space junk! Well, debris at any rate.
In a billion years or so, we might have accumulated enough such debris in orbit to create a ring!




QUOTE
Do you think some nasty corporations could have been rocketing up their toxic waste????


Naaah.
AtomicDog
It seems to me that Collins' camera would have reentered a long time ago.
MID
QUOTE (AtomicDog @ Jan 4 2008, 09:32 AM) *
It seems to me that Collins' camera would have reentered a long time ago.




Depends on the camera's orbit...

But could be it already has decayed to re-entry.
Would've been a hefty meteor!

Mekorig
This remaind me of something. There is an anime, Planetes, set in a near future, that deals whit space debris and people in charge of recolecting it. IN the series, it became of public awareness after a single bolt cause a disaster in a civilian orbital flight.
MID
QUOTE (Mekorig @ Jan 8 2008, 11:07 PM) *
This remaind me of something. There is an anime, Planetes, set in a near future, that deals whit space debris and people in charge of recolecting it. IN the series, it became of public awareness after a single bolt cause a disaster in a civilian orbital flight.



I wonder about the real possibility of a high velocity contact between orbiting debris and a spacecraft...high enough to cause a structural failure or depressurization.


I don't discount the somewhat remote possibility of contact, but I tend to think about it this way.
Everything on-orbit is essentially moving in the same general direction...west to east. Of course there are altitude differences and inclination differences that may amount to something in the realm of 20 degrees between some objects.

For most all altitudes, we tend to orbit at similar inclinations. When we get into orbit, we're basically going to be going the same direction and velocity as all the junk, so the possibility of a high velocity collision is rather reduced.

Nonetheless, if two objects in orbit, that happen to be at say 20 degrees different inclination, happen to meet at the very same place in space and precisely the same instant of time (a really remote possibility, I think), there would still be a collision between the "bolt" and a spacecraft...on the order of 6,000 miles per hour.

Wouldn't be a good day... sad.gif
crystal sage
Would some objects ...space junk fly faster than others???


Aren' t they are in the process of building a jetplane that can fly to the moon ..???


Will it have to dodge space junk? to get there?


Doesn't every launch into space have to dodge space junk?


what about every trip to and from space stations or other space missions.. ? again a case of russian roulette??


then.. all the space junk that eventually makes it's way back to earth??


http://www.arpansa.gov.au/radiationprotect.../ausconplan.cfm
QUOTE


http://www.thewest.com.au/d

Flaming space junk narrowly misses jet

28th March 2007, 11:15 WST


Pieces of space junk from a Russian satellite coming out of orbit narrowly missed hitting a jetliner over the Pacific Ocean overnight.


The pilot of a Lan Chile Airbus A340, which was travelling between Santiago, Chile, and Auckland, New Zealand, notified air traffic controllers at Auckland Oceanic Centre after seeing flaming space junk hurtling across the sky just five nautical miles in front of and behind his plane about 10pm last night.
Killer Moth
Cant we do anything about all that junk or is the only thing to avoid it and not mak more
MID
QUOTE (crystal sage @ Jan 18 2008, 04:32 AM) *
Would some objects ...space junk fly faster than others???


Yes, to a degree. Objects in lower orbits move faster than objects in higher orbits. However, most of the "space junk" up there is all within a range of altitudes where there isn't too much difference in velocity.

QUOTE
Aren' t they are in the process of building a jetplane that can fly to the moon ..???


No. Jet planes cannot operate in space.
We are in the process of designing a new manned spacecraft which, among its other functions, will provide a method of transport for 4 people to the Moon.


QUOTE
Will it have to dodge space junk? to get there?

Odds are, no. There may be alot of pieces of debris in orbits...but orbit is a very big place, and the odds of getting hit are proportionally small.



QUOTE
Doesn't every launch into space have to dodge space junk?


No, actually, the odds of encountering space junk are relatively slim.


QUOTE
what about every trip to and from space stations or other space missions.. ? again a case of russian roulette??


No. Ditto above answer.

QUOTE
then.. all the space junk that eventually makes it's way back to earth??


Flaming space junk narrowly misses jet

28th March 2007, 11:15 WST


Pieces of space junk from a Russian satellite coming out of orbit narrowly missed hitting a jetliner over the Pacific Ocean overnight.


The pilot of a Lan Chile Airbus A340, which was travelling between Santiago, Chile, and Auckland, New Zealand, notified air traffic controllers at Auckland Oceanic Centre after seeing flaming space junk hurtling across the sky just five nautical miles in front of and behind his plane about 10pm last night.



Some of it certainly does make it back.
Much of it will stay up for years and years.

The incident you describe is over-dramatized by the report, and rather confusing.

Seeing "flaming space junk" implies you are seeing it re-entering the atmosphere. No pilot I can imagine would use the term, "Five Nautical Miles in front of and behind the airplane".


As a controller, I'd have said, "Roger, uh...which is it, in front or behind?! And while you're at it, please advise on how can you see behind the jet?"

How "5 nautical miles" could be estimated is also somewhat confusing.

Flaming debris is way up there...30 to 60 miles aloft...5 to 10 times higher than any commercial jet flies...and it's going probably 12 to 25 times faster than the airplane can.

I think if you were to get hold of the actual transcripts, you'd merely see the reports of a re-entry being observed, and nothing about it would imply anything resembling a "narrow miss" of a jet liner.



MID
QUOTE (Killer Moth @ Jan 18 2008, 10:05 PM) *
Cant we do anything about all that junk or is the only thing to avoid it and not mak more




I think the only thing to do is to keep track of it at this point.


Not making any more is somewhat impossible, since when men go into space, some form of debris is a by product of that activity. We take pains to minimize it, but occasionally, something comes loose and floats away...
crystal sage
QUOTE (MID @ Jan 20 2008, 09:24 AM) *
Yes, to a degree. Objects in lower orbits move faster than objects in higher orbits. However, most of the "space junk" up there is all within a range of altitudes where there isn't too much difference in velocity.



No. Jet planes cannot operate in space.
We are in the process of designing a new manned spacecraft which, among its other functions, will provide a method of transport for 4 people to the Moon.

how about these??? http://www.nasaexplores.com/show2_articlea.php?id=03-065

QUOTE
Odds are, no. There may be alot of pieces of debris in orbits...but orbit is a very big place, and the odds of getting hit are proportionally small.





No, actually, the odds of encountering space junk are relatively slim.









Some of it certainly does make it back.
Much of it will stay up for years and years.

The incident you describe is over-dramatized by the report, and rather confusing.

Seeing "flaming space junk" implies you are seeing it re-entering the atmosphere. No pilot I can imagine would use the term, "Five Nautical Miles in front of and behind the airplane".


As a controller, I'd have said, "Roger, uh...which is it, in front or behind?! And while you're at it, please advise on how can you see behind the jet?"

How "5 nautical miles" could be estimated is also somewhat confusing.

Flaming debris is way up there...30 to 60 miles aloft...5 to 10 times higher than any commercial jet flies...and it's going probably 12 to 25 times faster than the airplane can.

I think if you were to get hold of the actual transcripts, you'd merely see the reports of a re-entry being observed, and nothing about it would imply anything resembling a "narrow miss" of a jet liner.





QUOTE
http://astronomyspace.suite101.com/blog.cf...threatens_plane


Now the most likely explanation for the flaming objects is that of a meteor breaking up as it entered our atmosphere. This meteor was reported to have been only five nautical miles from the airplane, or 20 seconds away from collision.


[i]Ithink that they are trying to minimize the fear here...by suggesting other possibilities..instill doubt.. a court...lawyers trick.. the pilot's intuition should be trusted...[/i

QUOTE
Space junk is a real concern, not only to space shuttles and the space station (as objects have hit the space shuttle). About 150 pieces of space junk de-orbit and fall back to Earth every year. Most of these are designed to fall into the Pacific Ocean, where there is mostly water and only the occasional island or airplane. However some of these fall where they wish. Most of them burn up significantly before ever reaching the ground.

Meteors are the more pressing threat of the two, however. They occur much more frequently (approximately 50 per day), and they cannot be predicted. While they make spectacular shows in the sky as they enter, both at night and sometimes during the day for larger pieces, most of them burn up completely before reaching the ground. Not all, however. And this also does not protect aircraft which fly in the troposphere and stratosphere, where these objects are still whole and flaming.

What can we do about this hazard from space? Not much, as it turns out. Most of these pieces are too small for us to ever detect before they reach our atmosphere. Fortunately a lot of the pieces are too small to damage an aircraft also, many of them being the size of grains of sand. But the rock-sized pieces, which could slice through airplanes at that speed, cannot be tracked and therefore cannot be avoided. We can just be thankful that there are not more space rocks bombarding our atmosphere and that the odds of hitting a tiny airplane in the sky are in our favor.

For more on dangerous space objects, read Death from Above - Meteors.
MID
QUOTE (crystal sage @ Jan 21 2008, 04:40 PM) *


Well, crystal, those are advanced aerospace research vehicles, designed to probe advanced areas of atmospheric flight. That's a big part of what NASA does. These X planes have been involved in all sorts of investigation into realms of aerodynamics that needed to be explored, like the sound barrier, and hypersonic flight (imagine being able to fly to Australia from the United States in a matter of hours...rather than the current horrifically long airplane ride!).

The technology of the Space Shuttle's operating envelope was proved out by these X planes, and we even had a program for lifting body research that was going on along side the early Mercury program, attempting to design a space plane that would be borne by rocket into orbit, and then land like an airplane.


But none of these are designs for craft that will go to the Moon and land on it. Aerodynamics has no place in the design of such spacecraft.


QUOTE
[i]Ithink that they are trying to minimize the fear here...by suggesting other possibilities..instill doubt.. a court...lawyers trick.. the pilot's intuition should be trusted...[/i



The article seems to state that this was likely a meteor enetring the atmosphere. Now, a large meteor may well cause some debris to reach the lower atmosphere before having been consumed by atmosheric friction, and can be a rare, albeit real hazzard, perhaps to an aircraft that happens to be in its path, or even to someone on the ground.

I was questioning the statement, "five miles in front of and behind the airplane", which doesn't make a whole lot of sense, and of course, the data showing that this debris was five nautical miles from the aircraft. Perhaps it was radar data?

One way or the other, without any reference to what it is, pilot's can't make an estimate pertaining to something's distance from them very well.


This points to the media's insufficiency when reporting on subjects which are technically oriented. They lack the requisite ability to speak in technical terms...or to translate them into plain English for their reader's understanding.

crystal sage
http://www.videosift.com/video/Rocket-re-e...-caught-on-film
http://www.thedenverchannel.com/news/10669...il.html?taf=den



QUOTE
http://www.espionageinfo.com/Mo-Ne/Near-Sp...nvironment.html
In addition to the natural meteoroid material, solar wind plasma, and cosmic rays, the space above Earth's atmosphere contains several hundreds of satellites and thousands of tons of space debris. Space debris orbiting the Earth consists of mostly non-functional man-made objects, many of which are fragments of satellites or rockets and residues from launches.


On February 1, 2003, the space shuttle Columbia tragically ended its 16-day mission during its re-entry into Earth's atmosphere. One of the first questions that the scientific community investigated was whether Columbia had been struck by space debris.
http://www.news.com.au/heraldsun/story/0,2...5005961,00.html

Both meteoroids and space debris pose a serious hazard to spacecraft and astronauts. The vast majority of meteoroids are small dust particles with typical sizes of tenths of a millimeter. Although they are small, due to their high speeds, up to 70 km/s, they represent a hazard in space. Current satellites are well shielded to withstand meteoroid impacts. Nevertheless, meteoroid collisions on spacecraft can be devastating for their operations. During a collision of a meteoroid, it evaporates partially or completely, and it may cause the evaporation of a small area of the external material on the spacecraft. The result is a plasma of electrons and ions. These particles are capable of inducing high electric currents on spacecraft, interfering with their basic control operations
MID
QUOTE (crystal sage @ Jan 22 2008, 07:10 PM) *



crystal:

The question regarding Columbia was logical at the time, but of course we know that a strike by orbital debris had nothing to do with that disaster...


QUOTE
Both meteoroids and space debris pose a serious hazard to spacecraft and astronauts. The vast majority of meteoroids are small dust particles with typical sizes of tenths of a millimeter. Although they are small, due to their high speeds, up to 70 km/s, they represent a hazard in space.



They always have presented a hazard.
It's part of the realm of spaceflight. The odds of a significant strike, are so slim as to make the risk more than acceptible.


When you think about it for a minute, we've never experienced a strike in the history of U.S. manned spaceflight (we were mighty well protected against micrometeoroid strikes). The ISS has been manned on orbit for going on 8 years. No strikes...

I think the hazard is overblown. It exists, to be sure, but it's not a likelyhood.

crystal sage
QUOTE
http://www.flybynews.com/archives/ref/debris.htm HOUSTON -- A small piece of unidentified orbital debris destroyed the expended third stage of a modified Minuteman 2 Intercontinental ballistic missile during a January test flight over the Marshall Islands, a Ballistic Missile Defense Organization (BMDO) official said last week.
The Multi-Service Launch System booster was launched from Vandenberg Air Force Base, Calif. at 7:25 Pacific Standard Time Jan. 15. Its impact with orbital debris apparently occurred approximately 30 minutes later over the Pacific Ocean near Kwajalein in the Marshall Islands.

Reports of the apparent collision have circulated on the Internet in recent weeks.

Lt. Col. Rick Lehner, spokesman for the BMDO at the Pentagon, confirmed the incident in a telephone interview Feb. 12. "Apparently, it did collide with some piece of space junk, he said. "It was after third-state separation and did not affect the actual mission."





QUOTE
http://app1.chinadaily.com.cn/star/2002/1107/bz09-2.html
Satellite debris hits boy

Shanghai Star. 2002-11-07
DEBRIS from a space satellite that fell from its orbit struck a six-year-old boy in Shaanxi Province last week, according to a report in the Beijing Youth Daily.

Wu Fusheng, the father of the boy named Wu Jie, remembers hearing a "thundering" sound and saw a piece of metal plummet from the sky, finally hitting a persimmon tree under which his son was playing with other children.

The boy was taken to hospital where doctors found he had suffered a fractured toe and a swelling on his forehead.

The satellite debris was a block of aluminum, 80 centimetres by 50 centimetres and weighing 10 kilograms.

The freak accident also hit the Wu family's finances. They had to borrow 400 yuan (US$48) from a neighbour to pay for the medical treatment.

After the remains of the satellite had crashed to earth, the village head noticed that the air had a smoky, gunpowdery smell and thought a plane had crashed nearby. He requested that the village be evacuated.





crystal sage
http://www.space.com/news/raining_boosters_000510.html

QUOTE
WASHINGTON -- The remains of rockets are raining from space, hitting Earth with disturbing frequency.

While no one yet has been killed or seriously hurt, scientists say the risk of injury is greater, as more and more pieces reach the ground.

Through the years, the space business has seen some spectacular falls from grace.

Whole chunks of Skylab fell over Western Australia in July 1979. And NASA is preparing to bring the school-bus sized Compton Gamma-Ray Observatory into a "controlled" reentry into the eastern Pacific Ocean early next month.

But scientists are most worried about space junk that hits land.

Late last month, the skies over Cape Town, South Africa, thundered with sonic booms as white-hot pieces of metal slammed to the ground around several farms.

Eyewitnesses to the late-afternoon plunge from space on April 27 heard and watched the fragments come down. Not surprisingly, the incident touched off rumors of an out-of-control UFO or a fallen aircraft.

U.S. space-debris experts have now identified the more than 700 pounds (318 kilograms) of space junk that fell that day as the remains of a Delta 2 second stage.


QUOTE
http://www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/N19424891.htm

CAPE CANAVERAL, Fla., July 19 (Reuters) - Two crewmen aboard the International Space Station on Thursday prepared for a spacewalk during which more than 1,600 pounds (726 kg) of obsolete gear will be tossed overboard and left to burn up in Earth's atmosphere.

Space station commander Fyodor Yurchikhin and flight engineer Clay Anderson were due to begin a 6-1/2-hour spacewalk on Monday to make room and prepare equipment for the arrival of new research modules built by Europe and Japan.

Their tasks include jettisoning a refrigerator-sized device containing ammonia that was part of the station's first cooling system. NASA upgraded the station's power and cooling systems and no longer needs the 1,400-pound (635-kg) tank.

NASA managers initially had planned to return the ammonia tank to Earth on a space shuttle. But with only 14 flights remaining to the outpost before the U.S. shuttle fleet is retired in three years, there was no room for the carrier rack needed to transport the device in the shuttle's cargo bay.

NASA said ditching the tank was the best option available even though the agency dislikes creating more space junk.

"We agonized over this for a very long time before we came to this decision," said deputy space station program manager Kirk Shireman.

Anderson also will release a 212-pound (96-kg) camera stand that is taking up needed space on a storage platform. NASA's immediate concern is that the jettisoned objects do not fly back into the station's orbit.
crystal sage
linked-image
Debris from a Delta II Second Stage Rocket Falls in South Africa
QUOTE
http://www.gpswaypoints.co.za/FAQ_delta_debris.htm

On April 27 2000, mysterious glowing objects began falling out of the Western Cape sky. The largest fell on a farm about 37 km NE of the centre of Cape Town, only 13 km from the centre of the suburb of Durbanville. Another landed about 70 km further ESE at Lemoenpoort (100 km ENE of Cape Town and 25 km south of the town of Worcester). A third hit the ground another 24 km further ESE, near the town of Robertson. The story about the Lemoenpoort `space ball' broke first, with 15-year old Theodore Solomons telling how a `glowing hot' ball `came out of nowhere, straight at me. It didn't come from straight above, but at an angle. Then I ran away and I heard something like two gunshots when the ball hit the ground' only meters away, but it `didn't make much of a dent'. It was still too hot to touch half an hour later, when farmer Pieter Viljoen arrived. Labourers in his vineyards had told him about a shining ball that hit the ground 50 m from where they were working, and as soon as it was cool enough he loaded the mysterious intruder into his bakkie (pickup truck) for storage in his barn. It eventually ended up being investigated by the Department of Civil Aviation at Cape Town International Airport, who soon realized this was not part of any known aircraft.
MID
OK, crystal, you don't want to reply but simply post articles about alleged space debris that hit the Earth.

So what? It happens sometimes...but not all the time....

For instance:


QUOTE
CAPE CANAVERAL, Fla., July 19 (Reuters) - Two crewmen aboard the International Space Station on Thursday prepared for a spacewalk during which more than 1,600 pounds (726 kg) of obsolete gear will be tossed overboard and left to burn up in Earth's atmosphere.

Space station commander Fyodor Yurchikhin and flight engineer Clay Anderson were due to begin a 6-1/2-hour spacewalk on Monday to make room and prepare equipment for the arrival of new research modules built by Europe and Japan.

Their tasks include jettisoning a refrigerator-sized device containing ammonia that was part of the station's first cooling system. NASA upgraded the station's power and cooling systems and no longer needs the 1,400-pound (635-kg) tank.

NASA managers initially had planned to return the ammonia tank to Earth on a space shuttle. But with only 14 flights remaining to the outpost before the U.S. shuttle fleet is retired in three years, there was no room for the carrier rack needed to transport the device in the shuttle's cargo bay.

NASA said ditching the tank was the best option available even though the agency dislikes creating more space junk.


Anderson also will release a 212-pound (96-kg) camera stand that is taking up needed space on a storage platform. NASA's immediate concern is that the jettisoned objects do not fly back into the station's orbit.



Typical media representations of what they don't understand.
No one created space junk on these EVA's. They were discarded precisely in a manner which would allow them to re-enter the atmosphere and burn up...completely...which they did. Efficient disposal of un-needed gear. Perhaps you think they just tossed these hunks of metal out into random orbits?

QUOTE
Shanghai Star. 2002-11-07
DEBRIS from a space satellite that fell from its orbit struck a six-year-old boy in Shaanxi Province last week, according to a report in the Beijing Youth Daily.

Wu Fusheng, the father of the boy named Wu Jie, remembers hearing a "thundering" sound and saw a piece of metal plummet from the sky, finally hitting a persimmon tree under which his son was playing with other children.

The boy was taken to hospital where doctors found he had suffered a fractured toe and a swelling on his forehead.

The satellite debris was a block of aluminum, 80 centimetres by 50 centimetres and weighing 10 kilograms.

The freak accident also hit the Wu family's finances. They had to borrow 400 yuan (US$48) from a neighbour to pay for the medical treatment.

After the remains of the satellite had crashed to earth, the village head noticed that the air had a smoky, gunpowdery smell and thought a plane had crashed nearby. He requested that the village be evacuated.


Shanghai Star, eh?
Really?
A thundering sound?
Saw a piece of metal plummeting from the sky? How could anyone determine "metal" in such circumstances, I wonder?
A 22+ pound "block" of aluminum, after re-entering the atmosphere and plummeting at a couple hundred miles an hour?

That was not a "block" of aluminum measuring ~32" x 20" and weighing 22 pounds. It was a thick sheet of aluminum, which couldn't have been more than about 5/16" thick.
How do you suppose a 5/16" thick sheet of aluminum could survive a fall from orbital velocities and a heating of 5000 degrees, almost 3 times the melting point of aluminum, and twice it's boiling point?

Further, how do you suppose the kid walked away with a broken toe and "swelling" on his forehead, after being struck by this weapon that was traveling some 300 feet per second when it hit him?


It sounds like a crock.










crystal sage
QUOTE (MID @ Feb 6 2008, 12:21 PM)
OK, crystal, you don't want to reply but simply post articles about alleged space debris that hit the Earth.

So what? It happens sometimes...but not all the time....


huh.gif .. sorry... I missed the question...

QUOTE
For instance:





Typical media representations of what they don't understand.
No one created space junk on these EVA's. They were discarded precisely in a manner which would allow them to re-enter the atmosphere and burn up...completely...which they did. Efficient disposal of un-needed gear. Perhaps you think they just tossed these hunks of metal out into random orbits?


there is still concernn...
QUOTE
http://www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/N19424891.htm

CRASH AND BURN

The discarded equipment is expected to remain in space for at least 300 days before friction from crashing into atmospheric particles drags them into the atmosphere.

The camera stand is expected to burn up completely, but chunks of the ammonia tank as heavy as 39 pounds (17.5 kg) could survive re-entry and fall to Earth.

NASA said that while the debris is most likely to land in an ocean, there is about a 1 in 5,000 chance it will hit a populated area.

The agency said tracking radars will follow the objects until they are about two hours away from atmospheric re-entry. Warnings would be issued if the debris seems likely to pose a threat.

QUOTE
Shanghai Star, eh?
Really?
A thundering sound?
Saw a piece of metal plummeting from the sky? How could anyone determine "metal" in such circumstances, I wonder?
A 22+ pound "block" of aluminum, after re-entering the atmosphere and plummeting at a couple hundred miles an hour?

That was not a "block" of aluminum measuring ~32" x 20" and weighing 22 pounds. It was a thick sheet of aluminum, which couldn't have been more than about 5/16" thick.
How do you suppose a 5/16" thick sheet of aluminum could survive a fall from orbital velocities and a heating of 5000 degrees, almost 3 times the melting point of aluminum, and twice it's boiling point?

Further, how do you suppose the kid walked away with a broken toe and "swelling" on his forehead, after being struck by this weapon that was traveling some 300 feet per second when it hit him?


It sounds like a crock.


yes.gif

The kid could have just been lucky...

here's another report of a lucky person that survived being hit by 'space junk'..

QUOTE
http://searchwarp.com/swa19408.htm

Imagine yourself taking an early morning walk in Tulsa, Oklahoma only to see a “big bright light, like a fire" in the sky. The object continues to get bigger as it approaches overhead. A few minutes later, you feel a gentle tap on your shoulder. You look around only to find a light piece of charred metal, about the size of your hand. You’ve been hit! Impossible you say?

Just ask Lottie Williams of Tulsa, Oklahoma about her early morning walk on January 22, 1997. The metal mesh-like fragment which hit her came from a rocket that had been used to put a satellite into orbit for the U.S. Air Force in 1996. After nine months in space, a fuel tank from the rocket crashed into an empty field in Texas. The fragment which hit Williams on the shoulder came from that particular fuel tank. Fortunately, she was not injured.

http://www.aero.org/capabilities/cords/faq8.html
linked-image

An average of one space object reenters the Earth’s atmosphere every day and this number is likely to increase. As early as 1961, nearly four years after Sputnik I, the U.S. Air Force had already discovered and tracked approximately 60 objects. By 1966, the number of objects tracked had risen to over 1,300. Today, United States Space Command tracks and catalogues over 8,900 man-made objects larger than ten (10) centimeters diameter which orbit the Earth in a 200 mile-deep sphere of space. Of these objects, approximately 23% are inactive satellites, 10% are burned out rocket stages, 62% are fragments, and only 5% are active satellites.
MID
So what?

What's the point?
crystal sage
QUOTE (MID @ Feb 6 2008, 12:48 PM)
So what?

What's the point?


I'm just concerned that they are still dumping junk...

Are they working on some sort of space clean up shuttle..station... that cleans up all this junk...??? maybe recycles it for building other space stations.. or transporting them to the moon..for use there in their future settlement schemes??? or would it all be too radioactive???

QUOTE
http://www10.antenna.nl/wise/index.html?ht...se/629/5699.php

The last satellite containing a nuclear power source and intended for Earth orbit was launched in 1988. However a renewed interest in radioisotopes power systems (RPSs) and nuclear propulsion could lead to new nuclear power sources in orbit around the Earth later on in this decade or the next. Today, at least eight radioisotope thermoelectric generators (which use the heat from decaying radioisotope to produce electricity), 13 nuclear reactor fuel cores and 32 nuclear reactors (one from the US and 31 from the former Soviet Union) are known to be still circling the Earth in orbits below 1700 km. So, in total about one ton of nuclear fuel is orbiting the Earth.

The United States has launched 22 missions with nuclear power sources. Three accidents have occurred, one resulting in release of radioactive materials. The U.S. launched one experimental space reactor, in 1965. It is now in a 3,000-year orbit.

The Soviet RORSAT program (a spacecraft equipped with a nuclear-powered radar) began sporadic operations in 1967. The program ceased flight operations in 1988 after five serious mishaps in 33 missions, including two nuclear reactors falling back to Earth from orbit and two launch failures. The nuclear reactor and high altitude storage system (needed to maneuver the reactor from its operational orbit of 250 km to a long-lived disposal orbit of 900-1,000 km) accounted for 1,250 kg and slightly more than half (5.8 m) the length of the spacecraft. The fuel assembly consisted of 37 cylindrical fuel elements with 31.1 kg (beginning of life) of 90% enriched uranium.

MID
QUOTE (crystal sage @ Feb 5 2008, 09:02 PM) *
I'm just concerned that they are still dumping junk...

Are they working on some sort of space clean up shuttle..station... that cleans up all this junk...??? maybe recycles it for building other space stations.. or transporting them to the moon..for use there in their future settlement schemes??? or would it all be too radioactive???



Well, no one's actually "dumping" junk. In other words, we don't don't just toss stuff overboard at random up there.
This material is a natural result of activities. We lose stuff, sometimes a satellite dies, something like a camera goes floating away, or a tool of some sort, and of course there are spent rocket stages that have attained orbit floating about as well.


As far as plans to clean it up, I can only say that the items are tracked, and paid attention to. The idea of cleaning it up is most assuredly being discussed somewhere...but I think at this point it's simply talking about it. I know of no concrete and plausible ideas regarding how we would do such a thing.

As to radioactive...nope, I don't think you have anything to worry about there.
Killer Moth
Well i think they should try hard to think of ways to clean it up, not just track it

I know its going to be really hard to do, but I think we can come up with something instead of just leaving it up there to crash into people and things.

The person who invents a good way to clean up space junk might become rich!
Czero 101
QUOTE (Killer Moth @ Feb 12 2008, 06:17 PM) *
Well i think they should try hard to think of ways to clean it up, not just track it

I know its going to be really hard to do, but I think we can come up with something instead of just leaving it up there to crash into people and things.

The person who invents a good way to clean up space junk might become rich!



Maybe NASA or private industry could take a cue from this classic late 70's tv show:

linked-image

linked-image


w00t.gif



Cz
crystal sage
cool.gif Wow... there's a committee to handle this... but apparently unsupported...


http://www.islandone.org/LEOBiblio/SPBI1RE.HTM

QUOTE
RECYCLING SPACE JUNK

According to Jonathan's Space Report there are about 6600 useless american rockets and satellites in Earth orbit. At least 10,000 objects are larger than 10 centimeters. About 100,000 objects are larger than 1 centimeter. According to a report published in journal Science (J.C. Liou and N. L. Johnson, January 20, 2006, vol. 340-341) the pieces of space junk measuring 10 centimeters or more have the total mass of 5,500 tons. Junk mass in low Earth orbit (up to the altitude of 2000 kilometers) is about 2000 tons. Most of the junk is located between the altitudes of 900 km and 1000 km. Inter-Agency Space Debris Coordination Committee (IADC) has been advocating, without success, to enact international law restricting the pollution. Junk in the geostationary orbit needs just a little nudge to be corralled into one lump, but junk in the unpredictable, low Earth orbits is much more difficult to remove. Most of the low Earth orbit junk are russian objects in nearly polar orbits (inclination greater than 70 angle degrees).

Precession of polar and equatorial orbits is negligible, so these orbits are predictable. Furthermore, electrodynamic tethers work well in polar and nearly polar orbits because they can easily change their orbits to match the junk orbits. To make sure that new low Earth orbit satellites have predictable orbits and are easy to remove, the following restrictions are necessary:
- The new satellites are launched toward South Pole.
- Their orbits are circular and polar.
- Altitude of the new satellite (measured in kilometers) equals its right ascension (measured in angle degrees).

Some satellite makers and owners may complain that these restrictions force them to launch the new satellites into less than optimum orbits. This complaint is justified only if the satellite owner pays for the cleanup of his space junk. I am sure that the reduced cost of the cleanup justifies the restrictions.

Small pieces of junk can be captured in a large net attached to the end of the electrodynamic tether. Large pieces must be prepared for the capture by telerobots which despin the junk and guide it to the tether.


linked-image
Telerobot grabbing a spinning piece of junk





ohmy.gif they better start lobbying hard as we are reaching the critical space junk threshold!!!
QUOTE
http://space.newscientist.com/article/dn86...pproaching.html

n January 2005, the US Space Surveillance Network saw a 31-year-old US Thor rocket body collide in space with part of the third stage of the Chinese CZ-4 rocket that exploded in March 2000. At least three pieces broke off the Thor rocket stage, adding to the growing collection of space junk orbiting Earth.

Now, NASA researchers have calculated that such occurrences will only increase. Even without launching any additional spacecraft, the number of new fragments created by collisions will exceed the number falling back to Earth and burning up by 2055.


Space Junk Cleanup Needed, NASA Experts Warn


http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/20...ace_junk_2.html
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