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Ghost Ship
How do 150 people suddenly disappear off an island? Roanoke Island was found devoid of its settlers, with the exception of a clue: The word "CROTOAN" and "CRO" found carved on a tree trunk. Where could they have gone?SOURCE

Stephen Kings Movie Storm of the Century was inspired by these true events. In the movie King theorized that a creature had came to them and gave them a choice. Give the creature what it wanted or they would be destroyed. Did something like this happen to these settlers?
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The Story
English explorers had been sailing across the Atlantic Ocean since the middle of the 1500s. Sometimes they explored the east coast of North America. Sometimes the English explorers also acted as royal pirates and attacked Spanish treasure ships carrying gold from Middle and South America. Francis Drake was England’s most famous explorer. He also stole treasure from the Spanish ships.

Elizabeth I was the queen of England at this time. She is one of the most important characters in this mystery because without her help and influence this story would never have taken place. Elizabeth wanted England to be powerful and rich. There was also a lot of competition between England and Spain during this time. The two countries were having a race to be the most powerful. Elizabeth I wanted England to win and she didn't want Spain to have control of the New World. Sir Walter Raleigh comes into the story at this time. Raleigh wanted great things for England but he also wanted them for himself. He wanted to become famous and to do this Raleigh needed Elizabeth to give him money, supplies, and ships to find treasures and colonies for England. Raleigh and Elizabeth both wanted a new empire across the ocean for England. They knew the lands across the ocean had great things.

In July 1585, Sir Walter Raleigh sent English colonists to an island off the coast of what is today North Carolina. The Indians called the island Roanoke Island. The English named the colony Virginia. In less than a year, the colony failed. The colonists did not know how to survive. When Sir Francis Drake visited the colony in 1586, he found the colonists starving. He rescued them and took them back to England. Raleigh’s first attempt had not worked. The Englishmen did not know how to survive in America.

In 1587, John White led 117 colonists to Roanoke. John White, had an idea to get people to go to Roanoke Island. It was to attract settlers who would bring their families with them and invest in the colony. Each settler would receive 500 acres of land and some view in the government of the colony. John White brought 91 men, 17 women, and 9 children.

In the spring of 1587, they set sail. When they got there they started repairing the old fort and the houses. It was clear that White would have to go back and get more supplies in order for the colony to survive the winter. So several weeks later he went back to England. He got delayed back in England for three years because England was fighting a war with Spain. All of England’s sailors and ships were needed to defeat the Spanish Armada. (The Spanish armada was Spain’s attempt to invade England. There were 130 ships in the armada).

After three years, John White was able to return to Roanoke Island. When White and his men reached the shore they saw a fire blazing in the woods on the northern end of the island. White got excited because he thought the fire was a signal from the colonists. White and his men searched the island but could not find any of the people or his family, but there were clues.

The men found no people but only the letters "CRO" carved on a tree and on another part of the island they found the word "Croatoan" carved on a wooden fence post. These carvings were the only clues they could find. White wanted to look for the lost people because he didn't see any signs of their deaths. He wanted to look for his family but fall was quickly coming. They knew it was the hurricane season and they could see a storm coming. White decided to return to England before the bad weather came. They left without ever finding the lost people.

Five Popular Theories
  1. The people of Roanoke simply left the settlement.
    This is one of the more probable theories. It is said that they have supposedly left Roanoke island and started settling in the Chesapeake Bay. And that they built rafts or a boat of some sort using materials torn apart from their houses. Close to twenty years had passed before John Smith and his group started the well-known settlement of Jamestown (where the popular story of Pocahontas takes place). This settlement was near the Chesapeake Bay. The evidence in this tale is that the ruler of the natives did indeed admit to killing the colonists. They said that they had been in their land (Chesapeake Bay area) and were then annihilated to prevent more English settlers form stealing their land.
  2. The whole population of Roanoke Island was killed by a disease.
    This is an absurd theory. It is true that the English had brought over some diseases. However, note, there were no bodies found and the houses had disappeared. Quite a ridiculous theory.
  3. The village was destroyed by a severe storm such as a hurricane.
    Another one of the incredulous theories. A hurricane could have washed away the colonists and destroyed the houses, true. But the huge problem with this theory is the fence was still standing. It is not possible for a storm to do as much damage as clearing away the whole settlement when the fence remained untouched.
  4. The people of Roanoke decided to leave Roanoke Island to live with the Natives.
    This theory is definitely probable. Crotoan, which was carved on the post, was the name of an island in the area. It was also the name of the group of the kind natives that inhabited it. It is possible that they colonists decided to live with the natives of Croatoan. Though there has not been a descent amount of evidence to prove this theory, there also has been no evidence against it.
  5. The colonists were killed by the Native Americans
    This is the most probable of all five theories. One important fact supports this theory. As one may not know, the English men had before tried to start the colony of Roanoke before. Twas a group of fifteen men. A little over a year had passed since they first started the colony, before explorers decided to check up on their hopeful progress. What these explorers found was one dead body. It was verified that it was the work of the Natives. From this past event we know that the Natives were capable of such atrocities and also capable of hiding the bodies. What’s interesting is that the Natives pulled all of that off in between less than a two year period. While the “lost colony” had been deprived of its leader for a number of three years. The “Indians” had a sufficient amount of time to tear down the buildings too. However there has still not been enough evidence to verify this theory.
Ghost Ship
Researchers Hope DNA Will Solve Roanoke Mystery

Read Here
glorybebe
QUOTE (Dark_Ambience @ Jan 1 2008, 09:22 PM) *
Researchers Hope DNA Will Solve Roanoke Mystery

Read Here


that's interesting, I wonder if they will be able to find anything using DNA?

Phantoms by Dean Koontz also speculated on what happened to Roanoke, but, his idea was a huge prehistoric globular creature that ate them. The book is 100 times better than the movie.
~ MacDDT ~
The theory that I always believed was that they were in danger if they stayed and were ambushed as they were moving on
glorybebe
QUOTE (MacDDT @ Jan 1 2008, 09:55 PM) *
The theory that I always believed was that they were in danger if they stayed and were ambushed as they were moving on


There are so many scenarios that could have happened. What makes it a mystery is that they supposedly never found any positive proof of anything. And we know how humans love a great mystery, myself included.
jaylemurph
QUOTE (Dark_Ambience @ Jan 2 2008, 12:12 AM) *
Five Popular Theories
  1. The people of Roanoke simply left the settlement.
    This is one of the more probable theories. It is said that they have supposedly left Roanoke island and started settling in the Chesapeake Bay. And that they built rafts or a boat of some sort using materials torn apart from their houses. Close to twenty years had passed before John Smith and his group started the well-known settlement of Jamestown (where the popular story of Pocahontas takes place). This settlement was near the Chesapeake Bay. The evidence in this tale is that the ruler of the natives did indeed admit to killing the colonists. They said that they had been in their land (Chesapeake Bay area) and were then annihilated to prevent more English settlers form stealing their land.
  2. The whole population of Roanoke Island was killed by a disease.
    This is an absurd theory. It is true that the English had brought over some diseases. However, note, there were no bodies found and the houses had disappeared. Quite a ridiculous theory.
  3. The village was destroyed by a severe storm such as a hurricane.
    Another one of the incredulous theories. A hurricane could have washed away the colonists and destroyed the houses, true. But the huge problem with this theory is the fence was still standing. It is not possible for a storm to do as much damage as clearing away the whole settlement when the fence remained untouched.
  4. The people of Roanoke decided to leave Roanoke Island to live with the Natives.
    This theory is definitely probable. Crotoan, which was carved on the post, was the name of an island in the area. It was also the name of the group of the kind natives that inhabited it. It is possible that they colonists decided to live with the natives of Croatoan. Though there has not been a descent amount of evidence to prove this theory, there also has been no evidence against it.
  5. The colonists were killed by the Native Americans
    This is the most probable of all five theories. One important fact supports this theory. As one may not know, the English men had before tried to start the colony of Roanoke before. Twas a group of fifteen men. A little over a year had passed since they first started the colony, before explorers decided to check up on their hopeful progress. What these explorers found was one dead body. It was verified that it was the work of the Natives. From this past event we know that the Natives were capable of such atrocities and also capable of hiding the bodies. What’s interesting is that the Natives pulled all of that off in between less than a two year period. While the “lost colony” had been deprived of its leader for a number of three years. The “Indians” had a sufficient amount of time to tear down the buildings too. However there has still not been enough evidence to verify this theory.


I grew upon Roanoke Island. It must have done something to me, because I grew up to be an Elizabethan scholar.

But the mystery really isn't that big. It's almost a sure thing the local Algonquians killed them. As your article points out, they weren't the first colony there. Ralph Lane, the governor of the first colony, started a minor war with the natives after planting a silver chalice of his in the village and claiming the natives stole it. He also forced them to hand over massive amounts of their food supply. Needless to say, the locals were not impressed when the next colony showed up, lost (they were making for the Chesapeake but a storm ran them out of time to get there).

And there's an important fact that almost always gets lost. A few days before John White left to return to England, a group of Hatterask indians, cousins to Manteo, the colonist's translator and friend, saw the English were virtually starving and brought them several baskets of food.
The English killed them all (including some women and children).

When Jamestown got started, one of the first things the local chief Powhatan told the leaders of the town was (in essence): "We're not afraid of you. There were people like you a few years ago a few miles away. We killed them."
There's no reason not believe Powhatan, really.

--Jaylemurph
Ghost Ship
The english killed them? Did they know they were trying to help? Why did they kill them? Were they afraid that they came to kill them?
~ MacDDT ~
QUOTE (Dark_Ambience @ Jan 2 2008, 01:33 AM) *
The english killed them? Did they know they were trying to help? Why did they kill them? Were they afraid that thery came to kill them?

you have to remember laws were tough to enforce in that place and time so if someone acted criminally for themselves (on either side) it would escalate into a small war of us vs them
TIMMAH
I remember hearing this story in school and loved it. Stories like these amaze me. How do large groups or people or even just a person simply vanish into thin air?

I vote for theory 5.
~Cheese~
As being taught by my history teacher i would say theory 5
1.618
I read something about this on the american archaeological societies web page. They had found some evidence of wooden structures that had been preseved underwater. No link, sorry.
jaylemurph
QUOTE (Dark_Ambience @ Jan 2 2008, 01:33 AM) *
The english killed them?


Yes.

QUOTE
Did they know they were trying to help?


Probably not.

QUOTE
Why did they kill them?


Because historical fantasy aside, the English were viciously xenophobic and didn't think the natives were quite human.

QUOTE
Were they afraid that they came to kill them?


Maybe, but it's doubtful.

--Jaylemurph
1.618
QUOTE (jaylemurph @ Jan 2 2008, 03:59 PM) *
Yes.



Probably not.



Because historical fantasy aside, the English were viciously xenophobic and didn't think the natives were quite human.



Maybe, but it's doubtful.

--Jaylemurph


lol, not much has changed.
glorybebe
QUOTE (jaylemurph @ Jan 2 2008, 07:59 AM) *
Yes.



Probably not.



Because historical fantasy aside, the English were viciously xenophobic and didn't think the natives were quite human.



Maybe, but it's doubtful.

--Jaylemurph


That's horrible, but so true. I wouldn't doubt that even if they knew that the natives were bringing them some help, they would still kill them. I have read a lot of history from that time period, and the mindset of the Europeans was not that reasonable. no.gif
SoLLiZ
I could have sworn that DNA tests tied the colonists in with the Lumbees. I seem to recall seeing that on a tv show a year or so ago.
Piney
QUOTE (jaylemurph @ Jan 2 2008, 10:59 AM) *
.Because historical fantasy aside, the English were viciously xenophobic and didn't think the natives were quite human.

--Jaylemurph


They considered us animals and we slaughtered them like animals. End of mystery.
Slave traders had been battering the East Coast for decades before the colonization had begun and we (Coastal Algonquians) still tried to be nice. Look where it got us. We ( Native Americans) are now 3 percent of the population of the U.S. But it wasn't genocide (according to Mike Medved and Rush Limbaugh)..................


Lapiche
jaylemurph
QUOTE (SoLLiZ @ Jan 2 2008, 08:44 PM) *
I could have sworn that DNA tests tied the colonists in with the Lumbees. I seem to recall seeing that on a tv show a year or so ago.


Where would you get DNA samples of the English colonists?

I'm not touching the whole Lumbee-ancestry thing. That a hot topic in NC.

--Jaylemurph
Piney
QUOTE (jaylemurph @ Jan 2 2008, 10:32 PM) *
Where would you get DNA samples of the English colonists?

I'm not touching the whole Lumbee-ancestry thing. That a hot topic in NC.

--Jaylemurph



They are just a convalecsence of all the Little independent Siouian tribes who lived in the area.
I was doing some work with the Pee Dees another Siouian tribe in NC and on a old census (1920) I have it lists members of the Chavis family as Croatan in the race column.
jaylemurph
QUOTE (Piney @ Jan 2 2008, 10:28 PM) *
They considered us animals and we slaughtered them like animals. End of mystery.
Slave traders had been battering the East Coast for decades before the colonization had begun and we (Coastal Algonquians) still tried to be nice. Look where it got us. We ( Native Americans) are now 3 percent of the population of the U.S. But it wasn't genocide (according to Mike Medved and Rush Limbaugh)..................


Lapiche


The Lost Colony gets billed in the Outer Banks as "History's Greatest Mystery" and I cannot for the life of me figure out why (except in the grossest advertising sense). I also don't know any historians who doesn't think the colonists a) got themselves killed or B) got exactly what they deserved.

And the play about it is beyond terrible, too.

QUOTE (Piney @ Jan 2 2008, 10:46 PM) *
They are just a convalecsence of all the Little independent Siouian tribes who lived in the area.
I was doing some work with the Pee Dees another Siouian tribe in NC and on a old census (1920) I have it lists members of the Chavis family as Croatan in the race column.


Incidentally, I live on the Catawba river, which is what the Pee Dee River is called in its northern reaches.

--Jaylemurph
Piney
QUOTE (jaylemurph @ Jan 2 2008, 10:54 PM) *
The Lost Colony gets billed in the Outer Banks as "History's Greatest Mystery" and I cannot for the life of me figure out why (except in the grossest advertising sense). I also don't know any historians who doesn't think the colonists a) got themselves killed or cool.gif got exactly what they deserved.

And the play about it is beyond terrible, too.
--Jaylemurph


"Grossest advertising sense" Tourism bro, Tourism! I saw the play. Retched on myself. I wish I brought a bushel of rotten tomatos to throw.............



Lapiche
SoLLiZ
QUOTE (jaylemurph @ Jan 2 2008, 09:32 PM) *
Where would you get DNA samples of the English colonists?

I'm not touching the whole Lumbee-ancestry thing. That a hot topic in NC.

--Jaylemurph



From the Colonists themselves, I have no idea. Perhaps by testing the Lumbee and tracing DNA towards other known living relatives such as great great nieces and nephews of the colonists. Science was never my strong suit.

Just out of curiousity, why is the Lumbee thing a hot topic in NC? PM me if you don't want to muck up the thread wit it.
Piney
QUOTE (SoLLiZ @ Jan 2 2008, 11:08 PM) *
Just out of curiousity, why is the Lumbee thing a hot topic in NC? PM me if you don't want to muck up the thread wit it.


Government anthropologists were trying to reclassify surving Native Americans on the East Coast as "Tri-racial isolates" so they would not have to fork out cash or recognize them.



Lapiche
Ghost Ship
QUOTE (SoLLiZ @ Jan 2 2008, 09:08 PM) *
From the Colonists themselves, I have no idea. Perhaps by testing the Lumbee and tracing DNA towards other known living relatives such as great great nieces and nephews of the colonists. Science was never my strong suit.

Just out of curiousity, why is the Lumbee thing a hot topic in NC? PM me if you don't want to muck up the thread wit it.



Researchers Hope DNA Will Solve Roanoke Mystery

DNA research in progress concerning the missing colonists from Roanoke.



Here is a website describing the current DNA research being done concerning the missing colony from Roanoke.
Piney
QUOTE (Dark_Ambience @ Jan 3 2008, 12:12 AM) *
Researchers Hope DNA Will Solve Roanoke Mystery

DNA research in progress concerning the missing colonists from Roanoke.



Here is a website describing the current DNA research being done concerning the missing colony from Roanoke.



The link on the 'Fox News' article just knocks back to 'Fox News'. This case is being made by ONE researcher Fred Willard who is "hoping DNA tests, will explain". There is no current ongoing research.
I see 'Fox News' as a sister site to the 'Weekly World News'. A lot of those archaeology articles on that site are road apples ( horse manure).


Lapiche

edit: testing Native American remains is illegal see : NAGRPA
1.618
QUOTE (Piney @ Jan 3 2008, 02:51 PM) *
The link on the 'Fox News' article just knocks back to 'Fox News'. This case is being made by ONE researcher Fred Willard who is "hoping DNA tests, will explain". There is no current ongoing research.
I see 'Fox News' as a sister site to the 'Weekly World News'. A lot of those archaeology articles on that site are road apples ( horse manure).


Lapiche

edit: testing Native American remains is illegal see : NAGRPA


having read the thread, wouldn't it be in the interests of native americans/pre european colonists to allow dna testing so things could be clarified?
:PsYKoTiC:BeHAvIoR:
Has a very similar ring to the Mayans and the Incans during Spanish exploration.
ravergirl
theory 6...Bunch of practical joking colonists wanted to go down into history and with the brand new world being all brand new, perfect oppotunity to pull a big haha. I think they uncolonized their lil Island and went back to the safety of England on a boat they built themselves called the Croatan.
jaylemurph
QUOTE (ravergirl @ Jan 3 2008, 11:30 AM) *
theory 6...Bunch of practical joking colonists wanted to go down into history and with the brand new world being all brand new, perfect oppotunity to pull a big haha. I think they uncolonized their lil Island and went back to the safety of England on a boat they built themselves called the Croatan.


There was at some point a few years ago some poor sod who published a theory that the colonists tore apart their houses, built a ship and tried to go home. Unfortunately, none of them were shipwrights or sailors. Had they tried that stupid a thing, it would've sunk, quick. And had they made it home, they would have been homeless and jobless, both of which were jailable offenses. (Personally, I don't think it would have occurred to a group of Elizabethans to try to do something like that.)

--Jaylemurph
Piney
QUOTE (1.618 @ Jan 3 2008, 10:02 AM) *
having read the thread, wouldn't it be in the interests of native americans/pre european colonists to allow dna testing so things could be clarified?


Native Americans would have nothing to gain. The only ones who would gain would be the tourist industry.
ravergirl
QUOTE (jaylemurph @ Jan 3 2008, 05:05 PM) *
There was at some point a few years ago some poor sod who published a theory that the colonists tore apart their houses, built a ship and tried to go home. Unfortunately, none of them were shipwrights or sailors. Had they tried that stupid a thing, it would've sunk, quick. And had they made it home, they would have been homeless and jobless, both of which were jailable offenses. (Personally, I don't think it would have occurred to a group of Elizabethans to try to do something like that.)

--Jaylemurph

well maybe. or maybe they notice how wrong the colonists were living and decided to build a boat and sink themselves.. or perhaps a group of them learned to build and sail.
Porthos1
QUOTE (jaylemurph @ Jan 2 2008, 10:54 PM) *
Incidentally, I live on the Catawba river, which is what the Pee Dee River is called in its northern reaches.

--Jaylemurph



OOps! better get out your maps. Incidentally where are you do you know where Lancaster is?
Lux Felix
QUOTE (Dark_Ambience @ Jan 2 2008, 06:12 AM) *
How do 150 people suddenly disappear off an island? Roanoke Island was found devoid of its settlers, with the exception of a clue: The word "CROTOAN" and "CRO" found carved on a tree trunk. Where could they have gone?SOURCE

Stephen Kings Movie Storm of the Century was inspired by these true events. In the movie King theorized that a creature had came to them and gave them a choice. Give the creature what it wanted or they would be destroyed. Did something like this happen to these settlers?
linked-image





linked-image


hehe that guy in the pic looks like Darth Sidious, the evil Sith lord from Star wars. That explain why he has superpowers.... grin2.gif
Porthos1
For more entertainment check out "The Wraith of Roanoke Island" i watched a little of it last night. I found it on one of the watch movies online sites.
ravergirl
i still say they saw what was going on, the fighting with the natives and decided to face the sea...what if the croatans helped them build the boat?
jaylemurph
QUOTE (Porthos1 @ Jan 5 2008, 12:26 PM) *
For more entertainment check out "The Wraith of Roanoke Island" i watched a little of it last night. I found it on one of the watch movies online sites.


That movie is hysterical. And it mentions Vikings!
And it shows the fabulously non-existent Tidewater Mountain range, just like Disney's Pochantas!

QUOTE (ravergirl @ Jan 5 2008, 12:37 PM) *
i still say they saw what was going on, the fighting with the natives and decided to face the sea...what if the croatans helped them build the boat?


Although the Natives had to have had some boat-building skills (none of them lived full time on the islands of the Outer Banks and so travelled back and forth from the mainland), I'm not aware of any of the tribes in that area having ocean-going craft, or craft big enough for 100+ people. And you can be pretty sure that by 1588 or so, there wouldn't have been many Indians who'd go out of their way to help the English.
Besides, it's a long way from where their colony was built to any practically navigable waters -- a dozen or so land miles, much of it through boggy salt marsh or thick forest, and then half a mile or so through the Roanoke Sound, which was too shallow for anything to sail across but just too deep to try to ford, and then across Bodie Island and south another mile or two through dunes and marshes to what they called Trinity Harbor. Even if the colonists somehow got it in their minds to try to build a ship (which would have been wildly out of characters for any Elizabethans), all the raw materials would have been on the mainland, transported across all that I just said /and/ across the shallow and alligator-infested Albermarle Sound, across the Great Dismal Swamp and then north or south to where the pine woods begin.

--Jaylemurph
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