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Alex01
Navy Tests Incredible Sci-Fi Weapon

The U.S. Navy yesterday test fired an incredibly powerful new big gun designed to replace conventional weaponry aboard ships. Sci-fi fans will recognize its awesome power and futuristic technology.

The big gun uses electromagnetic energy instead of explosive chemical propellants to fire a projectile farther and faster. The railgun, as it is called, will ultimately fire a projectile more than 230 miles (370 kilometers) with a muzzle velocity seven times the speed of sound (Mach 7) and a velocity of Mach 5 at impact.

The test-firing, captured on video, took place Jan. 31 in Dahlgren, Va., and Navy officials called it the "world's most powerful electromagnetic railgun."

The Navy's current MK 45 five-inch gun, by contrast, has a range of less than 23 miles (37 kilometers).

The railgun has been a featured weapon in many science fiction universes, such as the new "Battlestar Galactic" series. It has also achieved newfound popularity among the 20-something-and-under generation for its devastating ability to instantaneously shoot a "slug" through walls and through multiple enemies in video games such as the "Quake" series of first person shooters.

The Navy's motivation? Simple destruction.

The railgun's high-velocity projectile will destroy targets with sheer kinetic energy rather than with conventional explosives.

"I never ever want to see a Sailor or Marine in a fair fight. I always want them to have the advantage," said Chief of Naval Operations, Admiral Gary Roughead. "We should never lose sight of always looking for the next big thing, always looking to make our capability better, more effective than what anyone else can put on the battlefield."

The railgun's lack of explosives means ships would be safer, said Elizabeth D'Andrea, Electromagnetic Railgun Program Manager.

The Navy's goal is to demonstrate a full-capability prototype by 2018.

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nickoli
Another big gun builder was Gerald Bull,he knew too much and got himself shot. http://www.fas.org/nuke/guide/iraq/other/supergun.htm
nickoli
Another big gun builder was Gerald Bull,he knew too much and got himself shot. http://www.fas.org/nuke/guide/iraq/other/supergun.htm
Sardukar
This tech was developed here in Australia! yay!....its actually sh** to think we came up with the new way of killing for the next 50 years or so. They also have hand held versions too.
the eternal me
the technology has been around for a while ( particle accelorators )
and testing the effects of high speed impact ( space porpouse, space mamals yeah thats it ) nasa has been using non wepon versions of this for a while.
so now its a gun. yipee lets kill more people more eficently.
DieChecker
It is interesting that people associate these weapons with Sci-Fi space weapons. When compared to a rather normal meteroid these weapons are not so great. Modern railguns can fire at 20 km/s or maybe a little higher, while most meteroids that hit the Earth as "falling stars" are moving at 30 to 40 km/s. So, logically, if we were to put a warship of some kind into space it would be fairly large and it would need to be able to stand up to these meteroids, and therefore would also be able to stand up to the less powerful (speed and mass wise) of a rail gun round. The Earth is hit by around a hundred tons of these small rocks each day.

How the space station avoids being hit every so often I am not sure.

I guess they don't:
QUOTE
It is the first time a meteorite hole has been found so close to the crew’s quarters on the ISS, although several holes have been observed on the big solar panels that spread out from the station.

http://space.newscientist.com/article/dn12...ce-station.html
DieChecker
QUOTE (the eternal me @ Feb 5 2008, 02:15 AM) *
the technology has been around for a while ( particle accelorators )

Actually this is a different technology. Railguns use electricity to pull a conductive slug out the barrel along conductive rails. A coilgun, or gauss weapon, uses magnetics to push the projectile. Particle accelorators work like a coilgun and use magnetics.
Blauvelt
If you read the article it says that it will use no explosive propellants, or in the warhead. This will increase the "ammo" capacity on the said warship. Also the most important thing is the said weapon will have an incredible rate of fire. There is a multiple barrel version of this technology, already in production, with a rate of fire of 1,000,000 rounds/minute. This is the new, although it has been used by NASA for years, way of "shooting" a bullet. Whether it is by a cannon, gun, or pistol just as long as you have a charged battery on hand! It is just easier to provide the amount of electricity this technology needs onboard a massive nuclear powered warship, rather than a handheld infantry weapon. That is why it is just now being used on navy guns, not an M16... but that will come.
Legatus Legionis
the creation of this was rather both sad and amazing, amazing because we had proceeded and advanced "somewhat". and sad because I see a lot more potential than it being a weapon to kill.
SRCivic98
QUOTE (Blauvelt @ Feb 5 2008, 02:13 PM) *
If you read the article it says that it will use no explosive propellants, or in the warhead. This will increase the "ammo" capacity on the said warship. Also the most important thing is the said weapon will have an incredible rate of fire. There is a multiple barrel version of this technology, already in production, with a rate of fire of 1,000,000 rounds/minute. This is the new, although it has been used by NASA for years, way of "shooting" a bullet. Whether it is by a cannon, gun, or pistol just as long as you have a charged battery on hand! It is just easier to provide the amount of electricity this technology needs onboard a massive nuclear powered warship, rather than a handheld infantry weapon. That is why it is just now being used on navy guns, not an M16... but that will come.

Electronic M-16's and M-4's...now that would be something. The only concern of mine would be how to reload the damn thing under a huge fire fight. No one likes running out of ammo when the time doesn't call for it. I'm not sure about anyone else but that might be okay in a sniper rifle, lol. Just make sure you can reload it, that's all!
Blauvelt
QUOTE (SRCivic98 @ Feb 5 2008, 04:27 PM) *
Electronic M-16's and M-4's...now that would be something. The only concern of mine would be how to reload the damn thing under a huge fire fight. No one likes running out of ammo when the time doesn't call for it. I'm not sure about anyone else but that might be okay in a sniper rifle, lol. Just make sure you can reload it, that's all!


I agree, the only thing this would be useful on, at this time, would be a sniper rifle.

As stated by Legatus Legionis it will probably lead to other unforeseen weapons. This unfortunately happens. Think of this: A Teleporter like on Star Trek. If this were real you could take apart anything, and put together anything. You could build, copy, rearrange any item if you had a scan of the object first. Buildings would be put up in minutes. Tornadoes, Hurricanes, Flood Waters they could all be disassembled and stopped. At the other end of the scope SO COULD PEOPLE. You could beam people right into a jail cell. Or you could take them apart and not put them back together at all!!! This could be both the most useful invention, as well as the most horrible invention mankind could ever unleash!!!
Sardukar
Their excellent for use as a rifle or shotgun. Ofcourse as stated ammo is a problem...and a power source.
Dowdy
I think they should first work on their tactics rather then looking for a new way to kill.
HolyRocketPropelledGrenade
This is only gonna lead to the weaponization of outer space. Star Wars SDI projects are NOT something we want. Sending people out into space is expensive enough as it is, but now you have suppy a ship with ammo and defensive countermeasures.
badeskov
QUOTE (Blauvelt @ Feb 5 2008, 11:13 AM) *
If you read the article it says that it will use no explosive propellants, or in the warhead. This will increase the "ammo" capacity on the said warship. Also the most important thing is the said weapon will have an incredible rate of fire. There is a multiple barrel version of this technology, already in production, with a rate of fire of 1,000,000 rounds/minute.


I presume you are thinking of "metal storm". While it has some impressive numbers with respect to rounds per minute, reality is a bit more complicated. It is a bugger to reload and magazine size is the size of the barrel, meaning that the amount of rounds you can expend is rather limited.

Cheers,
Badeskov
badeskov
QUOTE (HolyRocketPropelledGrenade @ Feb 7 2008, 06:56 AM) *
This is only gonna lead to the weaponization of outer space. Star Wars SDI projects are NOT something we want. Sending people out into space is expensive enough as it is, but now you have suppy a ship with ammo and defensive countermeasures.


While a very noble idea, I seriously doubt that the weaponization of space is something can avoid. As we evolve as a species space is a new territory that we will explore and with that comes the usual old grudges and thus weapons.

I would love to see a different reality, but that is how I honestly see it.

Cheers,
Badeskov
Incorrigible1
As if space hasn't already been "weaponized." All those shuttle missions..................the one's not glamorized and sensationalized.
Blauvelt
QUOTE (badeskov @ Feb 10 2008, 12:06 AM) *
I presume you are thinking of "metal storm". While it has some impressive numbers with respect to rounds per minute, reality is a bit more complicated. It is a bugger to reload and magazine size is the size of the barrel, meaning that the amount of rounds you can expend is rather limited.

Cheers,
Badeskov


Yes that's the name of it. I couldn't remember it, but thanks for reminding me. You are completely right about its drawbacks. Even the pistol they showed has the same multiple barrels. It just seemed ridiculous, and impractical. The only thing this type of "weapon" seems to be practical on is a replacement for an M16 grenade launcher. If you coupled it with air-burst grenades and 3 rounds in each tube it could be useful, IMO.
Nik Xues
yay another step closer to my supra system.

think of the defense tech that will pop-up because of this.

although it would be puny to my weapon [uses absolute field theory]. i just wish i knew how to build the damn thing.
(SG)Max
Yeah another step closer to the MAC(Magnectic accelerated cannon) guns in the halo novel.
DeathCaboose999
QUOTE ((SG)Max @ Feb 18 2008, 05:40 AM) *
Yeah another step closer to the MAC(Magnectic accelerated cannon) guns in the halo novel.

the rail gun has the potential to be way more powerful than the "MAC" gun or in real life the gause gun
DeathCaboose999
max this is the basic principle of a rail gun
Click to view attachment
Never Here
The rail gun is really not new at all.Kinda cool,but not that high tech.(Really)...Take a look at this: Rense.com
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Horrifying US Secret
Weapon Unleashed In Baghdad
Exclusive By Bill Dash
c. 2003 All Rights Reserved
8-25-03


A nightmarish US super weapon reportedly was employed by American ground forces during chaotic street fighting in Baghdad. The secret tank-mounted weapon was witnessed in all its frightening power by Majid al-Ghazali, a seasoned Iraqi infantryman who described the device and its gruesome effects as unlike anything he had ever encountered in his lengthy military service. The disturbing revelation is yet another piece of cinematic evidence brought back from postwar Iraq by intrepid filmmaker Patrick Dillon.

In the film, al-Ghazali, whose english is less than fluent, describes the weapon as reminiscent of a flame thrower, only immensely more powerful. It is unclear what principle the weapon is based on. Searching for a description, al-Ghazali said it appeared to be shooting concentrated lightning bolts rather than just ordinary flames. Drawing on his many years as a professional engineer, al-Ghazali speculates that radiation of some kind probably figures into the weapon's hideous capabilities. Like all men in Saddam's Iraq, al-Ghazali was compelled to serve in the Iraqi equivalent of the Army National Guard and fought in three wars over the past thirty-odd years. Via email, he told me he has seen virtually every type of conventional weapon employed in battle, and is well acquainted with their effects on people and machines, but nothing in his extensive combat experience prepared him for the shock of what he saw in Baghdad on April 12th.

On that date, al-Ghazali and his family sheltered in their house as a fierce street battle erupted in his neighborhood. In the midst of the fighting, he noticed that the Americans had called up an oddly configured tank. Then to his amazement the tank suddenly let loose a blinding stream of what seemed like fire and lightning, engulfing a large passenger bus and three automobiles. Within seconds the bus had become semi-molten, sagging "like a wet rag" as he put it. He said the bus rapidly melted under this withering blast, shrinking until it was a twisted blob about the dimensions of a VW bug. As if that were not bizarre enough, al-Ghazali explicitly describes seeing numerous human bodies shriveled to the size of newborn babies. By the time local street fighting ended that day, he estimates between 500 and 600 soldiers and civilians had been cooked alive as a result of the mysterious tank-mounted device.

In a city littered everywhere with burned-out civilian and military vehicles, US forces were abnormally scrupulous about immediately detailing bulldozers and shovel crews to the job of burying the grim wreckage. Nevertheless, telltale remnants remained as Dillon found when al-Ghazali later took him to the site. Dillon said they easily uncovered large puddles of resolidified metal and mounds of weird fibrous material that, al-Ghazali explained, were all that remained of the vehicles' tires. Dillon, who accumulated plenty of battlefield experience as a medic in Viet-Nam, and has since covered a number of wars from Somalia to Kosovo, told me that he has witnessed every kind of conventional ordnance that can be used on humans and vehicles. " I've seen a freaking smorgasbord of destruction in my life," he said, "flame-throwers, napalm, white phosphorous, thermite, you name it. I know of nothing short of an H-bomb that conceivably might cause a bus to instantly liquefy or that can flash broil a human body down to the size of an infant. God pity humanity if that thing is a preview of what's in store for the 21st century."

For Majid al-Ghazali, images of the terrifying weapon and its victims haunt his every day. In addition to his work as an engineer, he is also a highly accomplished classical violinist, occupying the first chair in the Baghdad Symphony. He is widely acknowledged as one of the preeminent violinists in the Middle East. Besides his family, one of his greatest joys is teaching at Baghdad's premier music conservatory. Unfortunately, the conservatory was utterly destroyed. Yet somehow, despite the war's horrors and its seemingly endless privations, he manages to maintain a remarkably hopeful outlook. He recently informed me that the Baghdad Symphony continues to exist and has been invited to perform in the United States in December.

Copyright ©2003 - Bill Dash

See also associated article by Bill Dash...

Iraqi Commander Swears He Saw US Evacuate Saddam




Comment

From Fred Gunn

Hi Jeff,

Found this article from Cox News published on Thursday, August 15, 2002 and knew I had to send you this link:

http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/national/82658_micro15.shtml

It was truly terrifying reading the article on your newsite about Patrick Dillon's far reaching journalism into the war in Iraq. There's a true hero in my mind. The weapons described by Majid al-Ghazali would seem to me to fit into the electromagnetic pulse weapons category. And then, these weapons are mentioned in a New York Post article the day before the Cox News article appeared, and President Bush speaks of using these pulse weapons as a means to "disable Saddam (Hussein)'s entire command and control structure."

Super surge protectors are being designed that would possibly block the pulse of the weapon. I put the two together in my mind's eye and I saw the opening scene from the Terminator movie.

It had better be a brave new world, with governments beginning to wield these sorts of weapons into our battlefields now. Who knows where next.

The Cox News article goes on to say China, Great Britain and France are also experimenting with these arsenals. No mention of Russia, though. Interesting.

Peace please,

Fred Gunn
San Diego


Super-Secret Microwave Weapons May Be Used In Iraq

By George Edmonson
Cox News Service
August 15, 2002

WASHINGTON -- An army may still travel on its stomach, but a vital point of attack these days is the brain -- the electronic brain.

With modern warfare so dependent on computers and communications devices, a weapon that renders them useless could be invaluable. And after decades of research, U.S. scientists and engineers may be close to fielding an effective technology known as high-powered microwave weapons.

At least, that is the latest buzz. Recent articles have speculated microwave weapons could be deployed if the United States invades Iraq. But some experts -- including Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld -- say considerable work remains.

"It's been this elegant promise for decades that never quite seems to happen," said John Alexander, author of "Future War: Non-Lethal Weapons in Twenty-First Century Warfare" and a retired Army colonel who directed non-lethal weapons development at Los Alamos National Laboratory. "The check's always in the mail."

The concept behind high-powered microwave weapons is simple. A burst of electromagnetic energy is created and directed at an enemy's electronics. The force burns them out much like a lightning strike can destroy home appliances.

Challenges, though, lie in a number of areas, according to several experts.

For example, delivering the weapons would likely be done by cruise missiles or unmanned aerial vehicles to help get close to the target. That requires making the weapons not only high powered, but also rugged and relatively small, which Air Force Col. Eileen Walling labeled "extremely challenging and technically difficult" in a paper she wrote in 2000 on the weapons.

Alexander explained another problem: unpredictability, even when everything goes right.

"Electrical components are really rather tricky," he said. "You can put the same amount of energy into 10 identical targets and you can destroy two of them, upset five of them and, in three of them, nothing happens."

High-powered microwave weapons are one component of a broader category known as directed energy weapons that includes lasers.

"When people are talking about high-powered microwave weapons, they're not talking about a single device like the stealth bomber," said John Pike, director of globalsecurity.org, a Washington-area policy organization seeking to reduce reliance on nuclear weapons. "Rather, they're talking about a physical principle and an effect which can be generated a number of different ways for a number of different purposes."

Most of the Defense Department's work on high-powered microwave weapons takes place at Kirtland Air Force Base in Albuquerque, N.M..

"We are looking at different sources and devices that can produce that microwave energy and propel it," said Rich Garcia, a spokesman for the project where nearly all of the work is classified.

Researchers also are exploring ways to block incoming high-powered microwave weapons. That will require something of a super surge protector, experts point out, because the blasts are so intense and brief they can escape detection.

The former Soviet Union once was deeply involved in exploring high-powered microwave weapons, but it is now thought Russia is no longer pursuing them. Other nations believed to be conducting research are China, Great Britain and France.

Earlier this month, the widely respected magazine Aviation Week & Space Technology printed an article stating that "an attack on Iraq is expected to see the first use of high-power microwave weapons..."

The New York Post, citing unnamed U.S. military officials, reported yesterday that a preliminary Iraq battle plan "outlined for President Bush last week calls for the most extensive use of electronic and psychological warfare in history -- including secret new electromagnetic pulse weapons to disable Saddam (Hussein)'s entire command and control structure."

P.S on a side note,i personaly heard rummy talk of using this weapon before this,so.....



loathed muskrat
THAT GUN IS CRAZY AWESOME!!!! WHEN CAN I SHOOT ONE. ITS SOO COOL.
DieChecker
QUOTE (DeathCaboose999 @ Feb 18 2008, 06:11 PM) *
the rail gun has the potential to be way more powerful than the "MAC" gun or in real life the gause gun

Gauss technology is only limited by how much energy you can get into the magnetic feild. There is not part on part contact here. No moving parts at all are needed.

Rail guns are limited by such physical barriers as the wear on the rails. Rail guns will really be dangerous when they invent adamantium (ala the comic hero Wolverine) or some other super metal that can take a lot of friction and take no damage. Otherwise the parts need to be changed out after several uses.
Atheist God
QUOTE (DieChecker @ Feb 20 2008, 03:27 PM) *
Gauss technology is only limited by how much energy you can get into the magnetic feild. There is not part on part contact here. No moving parts at all are needed.

Rail guns are limited by such physical barriers as the wear on the rails. Rail guns will really be dangerous when they invent adamantium (ala the comic hero Wolverine) or some other super metal that can take a lot of friction and take no damage. Otherwise the parts need to be changed out after several uses.


There are alloys now that are virtually indestructible and harder then diamond... In 06 I believe researchers created a new alloy that was harder then diamond and relatively cheap to make as well.

Rail guns will be dangerous when the power supply is shrunk and hand held versions come out...

DieChecker
QUOTE (AtheistGod @ Feb 21 2008, 05:32 AM) *
There are alloys now that are virtually indestructible and harder then diamond... In 06 I believe researchers created a new alloy that was harder then diamond and relatively cheap to make as well.

Rail guns will be dangerous when the power supply is shrunk and hand held versions come out...

Sweet! With better metals engineers will be able to make a lot more powerful and messed up weapons and (maybe) defenses.

I think railguns will be really useful when humans get out into space. They could be used to accelerate unmanned shipments much faster and more energy efficently then chemical rockets.
Atheist God
QUOTE (DieChecker @ Feb 21 2008, 06:05 PM) *
Sweet! With better metals engineers will be able to make a lot more powerful and messed up weapons and (maybe) defenses.

I think railguns will be really useful when humans get out into space. They could be used to accelerate unmanned shipments much faster and more energy efficently then chemical rockets.


I was watching discovery and they were talking about using rail gun technology to launch vehicles into space from a mountain complex... Problems arise however due to friction cause by the air which gets hot enough to melt iron etc.

Cherus
QUOTE (AtheistGod @ Feb 22 2008, 03:02 AM) *
I was watching discovery and they were talking about using rail gun technology to launch vehicles into space from a mountain complex... Problems arise however due to friction cause by the air which gets hot enough to melt iron etc.

There isnt just one problem with that...being excelerated to those speed ther'd be alot og G's...not including the drag. Until we figure out some type of G represser(i know it sounds liek star trek) or something like thant, we are really sitting duks...even if we have those rockets that run out of fuel in 1 hour...
new technologies must be developed to go furhter into space.
Atheist God
QUOTE (Cherus @ Feb 22 2008, 03:08 PM) *
There isnt just one problem with that...being excelerated to those speed ther'd be alot og G's...not including the drag. Until we figure out some type of G represser(i know it sounds liek star trek) or something like thant, we are really sitting duks...even if we have those rockets that run out of fuel in 1 hour...
new technologies must be developed to go furhter into space.


The technology proposal did not include using such vehicles to propel humans into space but rather cargo which would then be intercepted once in orbit.

New propulsion systems like ion engines and antimatter powered vehicles are being worked on. Hyperspace is also currently being explored as a way to avoid the laws of physics and travel faster then light.

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