Just to clarify, I'm not Nielson, Till, any member of, or have ever been a member of the Errant Years/errancy webmail group. Despite how Sky having a 'flashback' (in response to my 'Vintage Skyeagle409') may make it seem.
If you do your homework properly, and attempt to independently verify Sky's claims, you too will find that he's been posting the same argument over and over again for more than 12 years. His posting style and 'catch phrases' are almost as unique to him as his fingerprints are in real life.
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QUOTE (Evangium @ Apr 17 2008, 12:49 PM) 
Just to clarify, I'm not Nielson, Till, any member of, or have ever been a member of the Errant Years/errancy webmail group. Despite how Sky having a 'flashback' (in response to my 'Vintage Skyeagle409') may make it seem.
If you do your homework properly, and attempt to independently verify Sky's claims, you too will find that he's been posting the same argument over and over again for more than 12 years. His posting style and 'catch phrases' are almost as unique to him as his fingerprints are in real life.
If you do your homework properly, and attempt to independently verify Sky's claims, you too will find that he's been posting the same argument over and over again for more than 12 years. His posting style and 'catch phrases' are almost as unique to him as his fingerprints are in real life.
It is clearly evident that Farrell and the so-called student lawyer were wrong. The so-called student lawyer claimed that it was impossible to build any ship over 300 feet in length of wood and suggested anything structual useful over 300 feet, so I used the "Spruce Goose" as an example that he was on the wrong track. What is the wingspan of the wooden aircraft, the "Spruce Goose?" 319 feet, and it was the largest airplane ever built.
Apparently, he was unaware that a couple of ancient Egyptian boats were at least 525 feet long.
Why do I have to post historical facts to prove the skeptics wrong?!
QUOTE (skyeagle409 @ Apr 17 2008, 08:57 AM)
Apparently, he was unaware that a couple of ancient Egytian boats were at least 525 long.
I'd like to see a cite for that.
A short bit of homework (yes, this skeptic does his homework) shows this:
http://www.ancientegyptmagazine.com/boats23.htm
QUOTE
The surviving standing obelisk of Hatshepsut at Karnak is 29.6 metres high and, with an estimated weight of 323 tons, is amongst the largest obelisk ever erected.
It is estimated that the obelisk barge may have been over ninety-five metres in length and thirty-two metres wide. Too large to be equipped with a sail and not very manoeuvrable, the barge would have been towed downstream by smaller vessels, also using the current, from Aswan to Thebes.
It is estimated that the obelisk barge may have been over ninety-five metres in length and thirty-two metres wide. Too large to be equipped with a sail and not very manoeuvrable, the barge would have been towed downstream by smaller vessels, also using the current, from Aswan to Thebes.
Ninety-five meters is in the neighborhood of 285 feet.
And from Wiki:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_world...st_wooden_ships
QUOTE
115.0 m
(377.3 ft) 14 m
(46 ft) Thalamegos ca. 200 BCE destroyed Thalamegos (Ancient Greek θαλαμηγός = "leader of the rooms" from θάλαμος, -οι (thálamos, pl. -oi) = room(s) and ἡγεῖσθαι (hegeísthai) - to lead, guide) was a river going pomp boat of Ptolemy IV Philopator. It was divided in two storeys with different preciously designed rooms and halls, the upper one for the queen, the lower one for the pharao with a taller height. The ship had a twin hull like a catamaran, one single mast with a yard and sail on the forecastle and is said to be towed from the banks of the Nile. Columns surrounded the storeys like a temple. Athenaios' report doesn't tells us where the servants rooms have been installed, probably on both, the upper and the lower storeys. Some sources report of a second large ship, the Tessarakonteres (forty), of the same king.
115.0 m
(377.3 ft) 22.2 m
(72.8 ft) Rochambeau 1865-1874 scrapped This French ship was an iron-clad ship built in New York. About 50 feet of her length was a ram. She was not particularly stable or seaworthy, even with her substantial metal components, and only made one voyage in the open ocean to reach her new owners.
137.16 m
(450 ft) 15.3 m
(51.1 ft) Wyoming 1909-1924 sunk[24] This American ship had a tendency to flex in heavy seas, causing the long planks to twist and buckle.[25] This allowed sea water into the hold, which had to be pumped out.[26]
(377.3 ft) 14 m
(46 ft) Thalamegos ca. 200 BCE destroyed Thalamegos (Ancient Greek θαλαμηγός = "leader of the rooms" from θάλαμος, -οι (thálamos, pl. -oi) = room(s) and ἡγεῖσθαι (hegeísthai) - to lead, guide) was a river going pomp boat of Ptolemy IV Philopator. It was divided in two storeys with different preciously designed rooms and halls, the upper one for the queen, the lower one for the pharao with a taller height. The ship had a twin hull like a catamaran, one single mast with a yard and sail on the forecastle and is said to be towed from the banks of the Nile. Columns surrounded the storeys like a temple. Athenaios' report doesn't tells us where the servants rooms have been installed, probably on both, the upper and the lower storeys. Some sources report of a second large ship, the Tessarakonteres (forty), of the same king.
115.0 m
(377.3 ft) 22.2 m
(72.8 ft) Rochambeau 1865-1874 scrapped This French ship was an iron-clad ship built in New York. About 50 feet of her length was a ram. She was not particularly stable or seaworthy, even with her substantial metal components, and only made one voyage in the open ocean to reach her new owners.
137.16 m
(450 ft) 15.3 m
(51.1 ft) Wyoming 1909-1924 sunk[24] This American ship had a tendency to flex in heavy seas, causing the long planks to twist and buckle.[25] This allowed sea water into the hold, which had to be pumped out.[26]
As an enlightened person, I'm willing to accept credible evidence that shows otherwise, but I question the claim that there were ships in ancient Egypt roughly half the size of the Titanic.
QUOTE (skyeagle409 @ Apr 17 2008, 10:45 PM)
I sure have because the evidence wasn't with them. For instance, the skeptics in Europe were claiming that the Belgian UFO was an F-117 and others, a another type of secret aircraft, which is ridicules when the evidence was taken into consideration. First of all, the F-117 cannot hover silently nor is it a supersonic aircraft and those were clues they'd missed, and it was obvious from the description of the object, the object wasn't an F-117. Simply, that is the reason why I disagreed with them and later, it was revealed by the Belgian government that the objectr was neither of those, which meant they were wrong as I have said.
It really doesn't take much to ascertain the facts, but it seems that there are those who just don't bother to do so and that is where I have the advantage when they speak.
It really doesn't take much to ascertain the facts, but it seems that there are those who just don't bother to do so and that is where I have the advantage when they speak.
Nice try, but wrong case in question Hint-9/11
Maybe this will jog your memory-
Difficult Facts for 9/11 Skeptics to Deny Link
QUOTE ( skyeagle409)
posted on 18-6-2007 @ 10:01 PM
Originally posted by etshrtslr
No official report claims a pancake collapse so I guess your on your own with the theory.
Believe me, I know exactly what I am talking about and that is based on my own experience in regards to aircraft accidents. The plumes of both buildings are clear indications of compression (pancake effect). Now this;
NIST’s findings also do not support the “controlled demolition” theory since there is conclusive evidence that:
* the collapse was initiated in the impact and fire floors of the WTC towers and nowhere else, and;
the time it took for the collapse to initiate (56 minutes for WTC 2 and 102 minutes for WTC 1) was dictated by (1) the extent of damage caused by the aircraft impact, and (2) the time it took for the fires to reach critical locations and weaken the structure to the point that the towers could not resist the tremendous energy released by the downward movement of the massive top section of the building at and above the fire and impact floors.
Video evidence also showed unambiguously that the collapse progressed from the top to the bottom, and there was no evidence (collected by NIST, or by the New York Police Department, the Port Authority Police Department or the Fire Department of New York) of any blast or explosions in the region below the impact and fire floors as the top building sections (including and above the 98th floor in WTC 1 and the 82nd floor in WTC 2) began their downward movement upon collapse initiation.
In summary, NIST found no corroborating evidence for alternative hypotheses suggesting that the WTC towers were brought down by controlled demolition using explosives planted prior to Sept. 11, 2001.
NIST also did not find any evidence that missiles were fired at or hit the towers. Instead, photographs and videos from several angles clearly show that the collapse initiated at the fire and impact floors and that the collapse progressed from the initiating floors downward until the dust clouds obscured the view.
[edit on 18-6-2007 by skyeagle409]
QUOTE
Originally posted by etshrtslr
No official report claims a pancake collapse so I guess your on your own with the theory.
Believe me, I know exactly what I am talking about and that is based on my own experience in regards to aircraft accidents. The plumes of both buildings are clear indications of compression (pancake effect). Now this;
NIST’s findings also do not support the “controlled demolition” theory since there is conclusive evidence that:
* the collapse was initiated in the impact and fire floors of the WTC towers and nowhere else, and;
the time it took for the collapse to initiate (56 minutes for WTC 2 and 102 minutes for WTC 1) was dictated by (1) the extent of damage caused by the aircraft impact, and (2) the time it took for the fires to reach critical locations and weaken the structure to the point that the towers could not resist the tremendous energy released by the downward movement of the massive top section of the building at and above the fire and impact floors.
Video evidence also showed unambiguously that the collapse progressed from the top to the bottom, and there was no evidence (collected by NIST, or by the New York Police Department, the Port Authority Police Department or the Fire Department of New York) of any blast or explosions in the region below the impact and fire floors as the top building sections (including and above the 98th floor in WTC 1 and the 82nd floor in WTC 2) began their downward movement upon collapse initiation.
In summary, NIST found no corroborating evidence for alternative hypotheses suggesting that the WTC towers were brought down by controlled demolition using explosives planted prior to Sept. 11, 2001.
NIST also did not find any evidence that missiles were fired at or hit the towers. Instead, photographs and videos from several angles clearly show that the collapse initiated at the fire and impact floors and that the collapse progressed from the initiating floors downward until the dust clouds obscured the view.
[edit on 18-6-2007 by skyeagle409]
World leaders suspect the Bush administrationLink
QUOTE ( skyeagle409)
May 12 2006, 10:02 AM
[qoute]So in short, the US government staged a fake Osama to tape it.[\quote]
Sky---In short, the mastermind has already made his admissions and the whole incident should have been evident with documents found and arrest made in the Philippines. I guess those terrorist pilots were just taking flying lessons for recreational purposes only. Am I correct?
[qoute]So in short, the US government staged a fake Osama to tape it.[\quote]
Sky---In short, the mastermind has already made his admissions and the whole incident should have been evident with documents found and arrest made in the Philippines. I guess those terrorist pilots were just taking flying lessons for recreational purposes only. Am I correct?
Yes you are. If I hadn't seen the rest of your postings on UFOs et al, I might actually believe you're a dyed in the wool skeptic in the true sense. I stand by my earlier comments that this is the only time you've dealt in hard and fast fact...
QUOTE
And, they retained 3 of the psychic spies after 20 years after their budget was cut, and that is public knowledge as well. HINT!!!
Out of how many?
QUOTE
The program would have been cancelled the first year if no results were evident, and that is yet another hint!
Not necessairly... it could take a more than a year to complete the study just to find out that it doesnt work.
QUOTE (NigelTM @ Apr 17 2008, 01:11 PM)
I'd like to see a cite for that.
Try Time-Life books, which is where the information came from, along with the painting of what the boat looked like, or, you can go to Eygpt and visit some museums.
QUOTE
A short bit of homework (yes, this skeptic does his homework) shows this:
http://www.ancientegyptmagazine.com/boats23.htm
Ninety-five meters is in the neighborhood of 285 feet.
http://www.ancientegyptmagazine.com/boats23.htm
Ninety-five meters is in the neighborhood of 285 feet.
Do your homework further and find that the 525 boats I mentioned were factual.
And from Wiki:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_world...st_wooden_ships
How many ships were built that were over 300 feet in length, which is the issue?
QUOTE
As an enlightened person, I'm willing to accept credible evidence that shows otherwise, but I question the claim that there were ships in ancient Egypt roughly half the size of the Titanic.
Do your homework and confirm from the publication I mentioned, the length of those two Egyptian boats at 525 feet, which were royal barges!
QUOTE (skyeagle409 @ Apr 17 2008, 09:23 AM)
Try Time-Life books, which is where the information came from, along with the painting of what the boat looked like, or, you can go to Eygpt and visit some museums.
Do your homework and confirm from the publication I mentioned, the length of those two Egyptian boats at 525 feet, which were royal barges!
Do your homework and confirm from the publication I mentioned, the length of those two Egyptian boats at 525 feet, which were royal barges!
The particular series/book please? TimeLife has many series....
QUOTE (NigelTM @ Apr 17 2008, 01:11 PM)
I'd like to see a cite for that.
A short bit of homework (yes, this skeptic does his homework) shows this:
http://www.ancientegyptmagazine.com/boats23.htm
Ninety-five meters is in the neighborhood of 285 feet.
A short bit of homework (yes, this skeptic does his homework) shows this:
http://www.ancientegyptmagazine.com/boats23.htm
Ninety-five meters is in the neighborhood of 285 feet.
Then, you posted this:
QUOTE
115.0 m
(377.3 ft) 14 m
(46 ft) Thalamegos ca. 200 BCE destroyed Thalamegos (Ancient Greek θαλαμηγός = "leader of the rooms" from θάλαμος, -οι (thálamos, pl. -oi) = room(s) and ἡγεῖσθαι (hegeísthai) - to lead, guide) was a river going pomp boat of Ptolemy IV Philopator. It was divided in two storeys with different preciously designed rooms and halls, the upper one for the queen, the lower one for the pharao with a taller height. The ship had a twin hull like a catamaran, one single mast with a yard and sail on the forecastle and is said to be towed from the banks of the Nile. Columns surrounded the storeys like a temple. Athenaios' report doesn't tells us where the servants rooms have been installed, probably on both, the upper and the lower storeys. Some sources report of a second large ship, the Tessarakonteres (forty), of the same king.
115.0 m
(377.3 ft) 22.2 m
(72.8 ft) Rochambeau 1865-1874 scrapped This French ship was an iron-clad ship built in New York. About 50 feet of her length was a ram. She was not particularly stable or seaworthy, even with her substantial metal components, and only made one voyage in the open ocean to reach her new owners.
137.16 m
(450 ft) 15.3 m
(51.1 ft) Wyoming 1909-1924 sunk[24] This American ship had a tendency to flex in heavy seas, causing the long planks to twist and buckle.[25] This allowed sea water into the hold, which had to be pumped out.[26]
So, how many wooden boats were built that were over 300 feet in length?
In addition to the two Egyptian boats at 525 feet, I told the so-called student lawyer that there were wooden boats built that were over 300 feet in length and you have just confirmed that fact for me.
Thanks for your support on this issue of wooden boats that were over 300 feet in length.
QUOTE (NigelTM @ Apr 17 2008, 01:32 PM)
The particular series/book please? TimeLife has many series....
You might want to check their ancient-mysteries addition or something to that effect since it has been well-over 12 years or more since I went through the books at the library.
Hint, that boats over 300 feet long were built in ancient times. Just goes to show that the so-called student lawyer at Farrell's website, lost his case since there were wooden ships built over 300 feet as I indicated to him, but he didn't listen to me either amd the rest is history!
Note that the following ancient Egyptian ship wasn't your typical rowboat since it took 4000 oarsmen to operate the huge vessel that was 425 feet long, which is 125 feet longer than the 300 feet figure the so-called student lawyer who'd said that it wasn't possible after I told him it was, and as a result, he lost his case! Case-closed and another one bits the dust.
QUOTE
Ancient Egyptian Boat Rowboat
The hull of such size would involve great bend-induced stresses, which were dealt with using strake edge jointing. The plank shear issue was more directly addressed in the ancient practice of mortise and tenon-jointed planks (strakes), which "certainly goes back to 14th century BC and very much likely before that".
The average trireme was well short of this scale, intended as it was to be fast in the water and light enough to be hauled up on the beach by the crew. The large scale of ship's rams that could be cast in the ancient world was determined from a monument that once displayed them.
Length 425 feet (280 Greek cubits)
Beam 58 feet
Height from tip of sternpost to waterline 80 feet
Length of steering oars 45 feet 6 inches
Longest rowing oars used 57 feet 8 inches
Displacement 10000?
Oarsmen 4000
Other ratings 400
Marines 2850
QUOTE (Stellar @ Apr 17 2008, 01:13 PM)
Out of how many?
Stargate had about 22 remote viewers.
QUOTE
Spy versus psi: The Cold War induced powers to explore information gathering through psychic phenomena
The Stargate Project was the code name of one of several projects established by the U.S. Federal Government to investigate the reality, and potential military application of, psychic phenomena, particularly "remote viewing:" the purported ability to psychically "see" events, sites, or information from a great distance. These projects were active from the 1970s through 1995, and followed up early psychic research done at Stanford Research Institute (SRI).
Fort Meade drew its remote viewers from the ranks of the military. Artistic and extroverted types were said to be the best candidates, as were "dreamers" who were easily hypnotized. (Not your average military profile, surely.) Several viewers were formerly imagery interpreters, experts at evaluating overhead reconnaissance shots.
Programs were approved on a year-to-year basis and re-funded accordingly. Reviews were made semiannually at the Senate and House selectcommittee level. Work results were reviewed, and remote viewing was demonstrated with the results being kept secret from the "viewer". It was thought that if the viewer was shown they were incorrect it would damage the viewer's confidence and skill. This was standard operating proceedure throughout the years of military remote viewing programs. Feedback of any kind, to the viewer, was very rare. It was kept classified and secret
Remote viewing attempts to sense unknown information about places or events. Normally it is performed to detect current events, but sessions have also been known that may surprisingly sense things in the future. It is thought in these cases the material is being introduced from the future back to the present.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stargate_Project
Remote Viewers: The Secret History of America's Psychic Spies, Dell, 1997, pg 280)
The Stargate Project was the code name of one of several projects established by the U.S. Federal Government to investigate the reality, and potential military application of, psychic phenomena, particularly "remote viewing:" the purported ability to psychically "see" events, sites, or information from a great distance. These projects were active from the 1970s through 1995, and followed up early psychic research done at Stanford Research Institute (SRI).
Fort Meade drew its remote viewers from the ranks of the military. Artistic and extroverted types were said to be the best candidates, as were "dreamers" who were easily hypnotized. (Not your average military profile, surely.) Several viewers were formerly imagery interpreters, experts at evaluating overhead reconnaissance shots.
Programs were approved on a year-to-year basis and re-funded accordingly. Reviews were made semiannually at the Senate and House selectcommittee level. Work results were reviewed, and remote viewing was demonstrated with the results being kept secret from the "viewer". It was thought that if the viewer was shown they were incorrect it would damage the viewer's confidence and skill. This was standard operating proceedure throughout the years of military remote viewing programs. Feedback of any kind, to the viewer, was very rare. It was kept classified and secret
Remote viewing attempts to sense unknown information about places or events. Normally it is performed to detect current events, but sessions have also been known that may surprisingly sense things in the future. It is thought in these cases the material is being introduced from the future back to the present.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stargate_Project
Remote Viewers: The Secret History of America's Psychic Spies, Dell, 1997, pg 280)
QUOTE
Not necessairly... it could take a more than a year to complete the study just to find out that it doesnt work.
I would say that no more than 2 years at the most, but not only did the program go on for twenty years, the CIA retained 3 of the psychic spies afterwards.
KPIX-TV, San Francisco, covered the work of Stanford University that was assisting in the program. Interviews were conducted and it was found that the initial results were, in their own words, 66%, which is far above chance. Further results varied over the years.
And, there were those who ridiculed that, for which they didn't know about in regards to how the government was spending their money on RV research and soliciting and placingp sychic spies on the payroll (your tax dollars at work). They must have thought that I was mistaken, but I was already aware Project Star Gate and other programs for years and one thing the government feared, were efforts of the Soviet Union to use psychic spies as well.
These are the things some people were not aware of and why they riduled that, which was history already, but in the case of the government's research into that area, it is amazing they ridiculed that, which has been covered on the local news with interviews and everyithing else from time to time.
I guess the skeptics didn't know, which is typical as history has shown!
Now, Mexico has joined a growing list of countries around the world in stating that UFOs are real and the list of countries is growing!!
Even Argentina
The Argentinean Military's Role in UFO Research
According to Lt.Cmdr. Luis Sánchez Moreno, public information officer of the Puerto Belgrano naval base in Buenos Aires province, the government's official interest in UFOs began in 1952, although it wasn't until 1962 that the "First Official Committee" devoted to the subject was created. Named the "Permanent Commission for the Study of the UFO Phenomenon" (COPEFO, in Spanish), it was composed by captains Constantino Nuñez and Omar Roque Pagani, and journalists Eduardo Azcuy and Guillermo Gaínza Paz...
Iran
Tehran, Iran UFO Conclusion
"All of the Iranian military personnel involved in the incident became convinced UFO believers following their experience. Even today they unanimously express the view that the object they saw can only have been of extra-terrestrial origin."
QUOTE
Mexican DoD Acknowledges UFOs In Mexico
"The UFO Phenomenon in Mexico has been recognized as a fact in an historic and unprecedent decision taken by the mexican Department of Defense under his Secretary of Defense General Clemente Vega Garcia, commander of all armed forces in this country."
"The insolit measure that will change history here in Mexico was the result of a high level incident in wich a mexican Air Force airplane, military pilots and personal were involved in a situation with several UFOs while doing a routinary suveillance antinarcotics operation to detect a drug smuggling flight."
"The UFO Phenomenon in Mexico has been recognized as a fact in an historic and unprecedent decision taken by the mexican Department of Defense under his Secretary of Defense General Clemente Vega Garcia, commander of all armed forces in this country."
"The insolit measure that will change history here in Mexico was the result of a high level incident in wich a mexican Air Force airplane, military pilots and personal were involved in a situation with several UFOs while doing a routinary suveillance antinarcotics operation to detect a drug smuggling flight."
Even Argentina
QUOTE
The Argentinean Military's Role in UFO Research
According to Lt.Cmdr. Luis Sánchez Moreno, public information officer of the Puerto Belgrano naval base in Buenos Aires province, the government's official interest in UFOs began in 1952, although it wasn't until 1962 that the "First Official Committee" devoted to the subject was created. Named the "Permanent Commission for the Study of the UFO Phenomenon" (COPEFO, in Spanish), it was composed by captains Constantino Nuñez and Omar Roque Pagani, and journalists Eduardo Azcuy and Guillermo Gaínza Paz...
QUOTE
QUOTE
Iran
Tehran, Iran UFO Conclusion
"All of the Iranian military personnel involved in the incident became convinced UFO believers following their experience. Even today they unanimously express the view that the object they saw can only have been of extra-terrestrial origin."
Famous Quote:
In that regard, it was revealed decades later by the engineers who build spy satellites for NORAD, that UFOs have been tracked by NORAD from deep space and within the atmosphere, including the 1976 Iranian UFO incident where data from the DSP satelite was released.
It is just a matter of time
QUOTE
Of course UFOs are real--and they are interplanetary.....The cumulative evidence for the existence of UFOs is quite overwhelming and I accept the fact of their existence.\"
-Air Chief Marshall Lord Hugh Dowding, commanding officer of the Royal Air Force during WWII. Statement made in August of 1954.
_________________________________________________________________________
"The evidence that there are objects which have been seen in our atmosphere, and even on terra firma, that cannot be accounted for either as man-made objects or as any physical force or effect known to our scientists, seems to me to be overwhelming."
" A very large number of sightings have been vouched for by persons whose credentials seem to me unimpeachable. It is striking that so many have been trained observers, such as police officers and airline or military pilots. Their observations have in many instances... been supported either by technical means such as radar or, even more convincingly, by... interference with electrical apparatus of one sort or another..."
-Lord Hill-Norton, Chief of Defense Staff, Ministry of Defense, Great Britain, 1973; Chairman, Military Committee of NATO, 1974-77;
__________________________________________________________________________
It is time for the truth to be brought out... Behind the scenes high-ranking Air Force officers are soberly concerned about the UFOs. But through official secrecy and ridicule, many citizens are led to believe the unknown flying objects are nonsense.... I urge immediate Congressional action to reduce the dangers from secrecy about unidentified flying objects.
Former CIA Director Vice Admiral Roscoe Hillenkoetter, signed statement to Congress, August 22, 1960.
http://www.phils.com.au/hill.htm
_________________________________________________________________________
"I'm convinced that [flying] saucers have an out-of-world basis."
---Dr. Walter Reidel, noted German rocket expert. LIFE 4-7-1952.
________________________________________________________________________
"I've been convinced for a long time that the flying saucers are interplanetary. We are being watched by beings from outer space."
---Albert M. Chop, deputy public relations director, NASA, True Magazine , Jan. 1965.
________________________________________________________________________
"Of course the flying saucers are real, and they are interplanetary."
---Air Chief Marshall Lord Dowding (head of Royal Air Force during World War II) quoted by Rueters, August, 1954.
_______________________________________________________________________
"I feel that the Air Force has not been giving out all the available information on these Unidentified Flying Objects. You cannot disregard so many unimpeachable sources."
---Honorable John McCormack, Speaker of the House, January, 1965, True Magazine.
_______________________________________________________________________
"Unidentified Flying Objects are entering our atmosphere at very high speeds and obviously under intelligent control. We must solve this riddle without delay."
---Rear Admiral Delmar Fahrney, USNR, letter to NICAP, 1956.
_______________________________________________________________________
-Air Chief Marshall Lord Hugh Dowding, commanding officer of the Royal Air Force during WWII. Statement made in August of 1954.
_________________________________________________________________________
"The evidence that there are objects which have been seen in our atmosphere, and even on terra firma, that cannot be accounted for either as man-made objects or as any physical force or effect known to our scientists, seems to me to be overwhelming."
" A very large number of sightings have been vouched for by persons whose credentials seem to me unimpeachable. It is striking that so many have been trained observers, such as police officers and airline or military pilots. Their observations have in many instances... been supported either by technical means such as radar or, even more convincingly, by... interference with electrical apparatus of one sort or another..."
-Lord Hill-Norton, Chief of Defense Staff, Ministry of Defense, Great Britain, 1973; Chairman, Military Committee of NATO, 1974-77;
__________________________________________________________________________
It is time for the truth to be brought out... Behind the scenes high-ranking Air Force officers are soberly concerned about the UFOs. But through official secrecy and ridicule, many citizens are led to believe the unknown flying objects are nonsense.... I urge immediate Congressional action to reduce the dangers from secrecy about unidentified flying objects.
Former CIA Director Vice Admiral Roscoe Hillenkoetter, signed statement to Congress, August 22, 1960.
http://www.phils.com.au/hill.htm
_________________________________________________________________________
"I'm convinced that [flying] saucers have an out-of-world basis."
---Dr. Walter Reidel, noted German rocket expert. LIFE 4-7-1952.
________________________________________________________________________
"I've been convinced for a long time that the flying saucers are interplanetary. We are being watched by beings from outer space."
---Albert M. Chop, deputy public relations director, NASA, True Magazine , Jan. 1965.
________________________________________________________________________
"Of course the flying saucers are real, and they are interplanetary."
---Air Chief Marshall Lord Dowding (head of Royal Air Force during World War II) quoted by Rueters, August, 1954.
_______________________________________________________________________
"I feel that the Air Force has not been giving out all the available information on these Unidentified Flying Objects. You cannot disregard so many unimpeachable sources."
---Honorable John McCormack, Speaker of the House, January, 1965, True Magazine.
_______________________________________________________________________
"Unidentified Flying Objects are entering our atmosphere at very high speeds and obviously under intelligent control. We must solve this riddle without delay."
---Rear Admiral Delmar Fahrney, USNR, letter to NICAP, 1956.
_______________________________________________________________________
In that regard, it was revealed decades later by the engineers who build spy satellites for NORAD, that UFOs have been tracked by NORAD from deep space and within the atmosphere, including the 1976 Iranian UFO incident where data from the DSP satelite was released.
It is just a matter of time
Mr. Eagle, and I say this with respect, I'm trying to confirm your claim about 525 foot long barges from ancient Egypt online. I clicked my links again, and nothing is there about Egyptian boats. Greek, yes, but not Egyptian.
I also found this:
http://www.kingtutshop.com/freeinfo/egyptian-boats.htm
Now, can I prove your claim false? Maybe not, but I've not found solid proof that it's true. Is there anything online to back up your claim? I'd honestly like to learn--one thing I do know for certain is the ancient Egyptians were pretty effing amazing in their accomplishments.
More to the point again of the thread, I'll quote you again:
What can we make of that statement? On its face, it seems pretty cut and dried. But the concrete, incontrovertible evidence shown since 1954 is shall we say, a bit on the scant side.
Another question for you: When will disclosure occur? It seems it's been "soon" for 50+ years.
I also found this:
http://www.kingtutshop.com/freeinfo/egyptian-boats.htm
QUOTE
Khufu's barge measured 150 feet from long beam to stern.
*******************
The famous Royal Ship of King Cheops (fourth dynasty ruler of the Old Kingdom), more formally known as Khufu, is a perfect example of a papyriform boat. ..... Once completed, the Royal Ship measured approximately 150 feet in length.
*******************
The famous Royal Ship of King Cheops (fourth dynasty ruler of the Old Kingdom), more formally known as Khufu, is a perfect example of a papyriform boat. ..... Once completed, the Royal Ship measured approximately 150 feet in length.
Now, can I prove your claim false? Maybe not, but I've not found solid proof that it's true. Is there anything online to back up your claim? I'd honestly like to learn--one thing I do know for certain is the ancient Egyptians were pretty effing amazing in their accomplishments.
More to the point again of the thread, I'll quote you again:
QUOTE
Of course UFOs are real--and they are interplanetary.....The cumulative evidence for the existence of UFOs is quite overwhelming and I accept the fact of their existence."
-Air Chief Marshall Lord Hugh Dowding, commanding officer of the Royal Air Force during WWII. Statement made in August of 1954.
-Air Chief Marshall Lord Hugh Dowding, commanding officer of the Royal Air Force during WWII. Statement made in August of 1954.
What can we make of that statement? On its face, it seems pretty cut and dried. But the concrete, incontrovertible evidence shown since 1954 is shall we say, a bit on the scant side.
Another question for you: When will disclosure occur? It seems it's been "soon" for 50+ years.
Quotes are easy to find.
"We still don't have any proof that they are vehicles from another planet."
Dr. J. Allen Hynek, June 1977
Link
"We still don't have any proof that they are vehicles from another planet."
Dr. J. Allen Hynek, June 1977
Link
QUOTE (skyeagle409 @ Apr 17 2008, 12:32 PM)
I don't think so!!
QUOTE
On June 17, 1949, a Headquarters U.S. Air Force Europe plane was flying a classified photographic mission photos de-classified in 1982 that included Mt. Ararat in Turkey, just eighteen miles south of the former Soviet Union's border, and twelve miles west of the Iranian border· The mountain is over 300 square miles in area and in a remote corner of northeast Turkey.
The U.S. Air Force plane then flew around to the north side of the mountain and recorded in three sequential photo frames
from different angles from distances of about two miles to a half-mile another large "structure" (possibly 600-800 ft. long) on the western plateau, apparently in close proximity to the first "Anomaly."
The U.S. Air Force plane then flew around to the north side of the mountain and recorded in three sequential photo frames
from different angles from distances of about two miles to a half-mile another large "structure" (possibly 600-800 ft. long) on the western plateau, apparently in close proximity to the first "Anomaly."
If it looks like a boat (!)....Remindes me of another "anomaly".....on Mars.
Quick questions Sky, do you believe that aliens built that "face" we see in the Viking pictures? And what about the rest of "Hoaglands city", Cydonia, is sure looks like pyramides, right??
If it looks like a boat...MAAN YOU ARE BUSTED!! You dont even seem to get it.
This thread has shown us all who you really are...Just another credolous believer. But hey, keep posting some old documents that supports your fantasies, if that will make you feel better.... QUOTE (DEBUNKER @ Apr 17 2008, 05:39 PM)
Quick questions Sky, do you believe that aliens built that "face" we see in the Viking pictures? And what about the rest of "Hoaglands city", Cydonia, is sure looks like pyramides, right??
Interesting! And, I have stated that NASA needs to send a spacecraft to that location to get a closer look, so why doesn't it do so?
QUOTE
If it looks like a boat...MAAN YOU ARE BUSTED!! You dont even seem to get it. This thread has shown us all who you really are...Just another credolous believer. But hey, keep posting some old documents that supports your fantasies, if that will make you feel better....
This thread has shown us all who you really are...Just another credolous believer. But hey, keep posting some old documents that supports your fantasies, if that will make you feel better....LOL!!!
The old documents I have been posting have already been substanciated offially and unrefuted to this very day, which is why those case files remain unexplained in terrestrial terms to this very day and look what you posted!!!
QUOTE (theSOURCE @ Apr 17 2008, 05:38 PM)
Quotes are easy to find.
"We still don't have any proof that they are vehicles from another planet."
Dr. J. Allen Hynek, June 1977
Link
"We still don't have any proof that they are vehicles from another planet."
Dr. J. Allen Hynek, June 1977
Link
That isn't what the Air Force said back in 1948 and 1952, and the verdict was: The UFOs were, in its own words, "interplanetary spaceships."
QUOTE (theSOURCE @ Apr 17 2008, 05:38 PM)
Quotes are easy to find.
"We still don't have any proof that they are vehicles from another planet."
Dr. J. Allen Hynek, June 1977
Link
"We still don't have any proof that they are vehicles from another planet."
Dr. J. Allen Hynek, June 1977
Link
I might add that J. Allen Hynek was a UFO skeptic, but became a skeptic no more after his UFO investigations ended.
Let's do a recap
QUOTE
MANEUVERED MOTION AND "INTELLIGENT CONTROL
Following the nearly year-long 1952 UFO sighting wave in which there were repeated instances of jet interceptors chasing after UFOs that also showed on radar, the Central Intelligence Agency convened the so-called Robertson Panel to evaluate the data. Among the presentations made to the scientific panel was one by Dewey J. Fournet (USAF, Ret.) who had worked with scientific analysts conducting a rigorous motion analysis study of hardcore unexplained cases.
Edward J. Ruppelt, former Chief of the Air Force Project Blue Book investigation, later reported that the study was "very hot and very controversial...[it] was hot because it wasn't official and the reason it wasn't official was because it was so hot. It concluded that UFOs were interplanetary spaceships."
Air Force analysts had reached this conclusion before. Project Sign in 1948 had issued a Top Secret Estimate of the Situation drawing the same conclusion. (Hall, 1964, p. 110) But both times outside scientific consultants, on the basis of what were arguably superficial and excessively skeptical reviews, disputed the conclusion. (Hall, 1988, pp. 155-163)
Many of these jet interception cases included a sort of "cat-and-mouse" behavior on the part of the UFOs, pulling away from the pursuing jets and then slowing down until they caught up again. This behavior has been repeated throughout the history of UFOs, and is one of the many indicators of intelligence behind the phenomenon. Case after case can be cited of UFOs apparently playing interactive games with (a) military aircraft
"This fantastic game of hide and seek was observed from the ground by a great number of witnesses, among them 20 national policemen who saw both the object and the F-16s. The encounter lasted 75 minutes, but nobody heard the supersonic boom which should have been present when the object flew through the sonic barrier. No physical damage was reported. Given the low altitude and the speed of the object, many windows should have been broken."
_______________________________________________________________________________
* Professor Emille Schweitzer, working at the Center for the Study of Electronic warfare, testified--also on video-- that it is highly unlikely that a radar failure in all radars can be the cause. Furthermore he says the UFO used "infinite acceleration" and it is very highly likely to have been an extraterrestrial craft."
* The French physicist Jean Pierre Petit concurred: "In reality," he told Paris Match, "there is no machine made by man, either an airplane or a missile, that is capable of such performance. Specifically, flying at the speed of sound without making a sonic boom."
Seconds after Heading Speed Altitude
lock-on (degrees) (knots) (feet)
00 200 150 7000
01 200 150 7000
02 200 150 7000
03 200 150 7000
04 sharp 200 acceleration 150 6000
05 turn 270 = 22 g 560 6000
06 270 560 6000
07 270 570 6000
08 270 560 7000
09 270 550 7000
10 210 560 9000
11 210 570 10000
12 210 560 11000
13 210 570 10000
14 270 770 7000
15 270 770 6000
16 270 780 6000
17 270 790 5000
18 290 1010 4000
19 290 1000 3000
20 290 990 2000
21 290 990 1000
22 300 990 0000
22.5 300 980 0000 Break lock
Now, refute anything I posted above with the objects as those of mankind since trhey have been proven to have been intelligently controlled crafts. If you unable to do so with any factural data, then I rest my case the information depicts an alien spacecraft.
QUOTE (skyeagle409 @ Apr 17 2008, 06:51 PM)
Interesting! And, I have stated that NASA needs to send a spacecraft to that location to get a closer look, so why doesn't it do so?
Is that a -Yes, I believe that the face, and cydonia, was built by aliens.?
QUOTE (skyeagle409 @ Apr 17 2008, 06:51 PM)
The old documents I have been posting have already been substanciated offially and unrefuted to this very day, which is why those case files remain unexplained in terrestrial terms to this very day and look what you posted!!!
There is nothing to refute.
And your doing it again, with your "unexplained in terrestrial terms"...YOU believe that it means Aliens from another planet. It does not. It simply means no explanation we/they can think of... unexplained, that is it.
QUOTE (NigelTM @ Apr 17 2008, 05:35 PM)
Mr. Eagle, and I say this with respect, I'm trying to confirm your claim about 525 foot long barges from ancient Egypt online. I clicked my links again, and nothing is there about Egyptian boats. Greek, yes, but not Egyptian.
I also found this:
http://www.kingtutshop.com/freeinfo/egyptian-boats.htm
Now, can I prove your claim false?
I also found this:
http://www.kingtutshop.com/freeinfo/egyptian-boats.htm
Now, can I prove your claim false?
No, and here's why in regards to Egyptian boats over 300 feet in length.
"A hull of such size would involve great bend-induced stresses, which were dealt with using strake edge jointing. The plank shear issue was more directly addressed in the ancient practice of mortise and tenon-jointed planks (strakes), which "certainly goes back to 14th century BC and very much likely before that..."
Length 425 feet (280 Greek cubits)
Beam 58 feet
Height from tip of sternpost to waterline 80 feet
Length of steering oars 45 feet 6 inches
Longest rowing oars used 57 feet 8 inches
Displacement 10000?
Oarsmen 4000
Other ratings 400
Marines 2850
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tessarakonteres
QUOTE
Another question for you: When will disclosure occur? It seems it's been "soon" for 50+ years.
My prediction is; Around 15 years or so, but not beyond, but the way things are shaping up today with more and more countries stating that the UFOs in question are those of intelligently controlled crafts after opening up their declassified UFO files, that revelation could come much sooner.
QUOTE (skyeagle409 @ Apr 17 2008, 07:02 PM)
Now, refute anything I posted above with the objects as those of mankind since trhey have been proven to have been intelligently controlled crafts. If you unable to do so with any factural data, then I rest my case the information depicts an alien spacecraft.
Everything you have been posted has been refuted as clear scientific evidence of aliens on our planet.
Of course, most of us here that have been reading your cut/paste from old documents and news papers from back in the 50s..we all know that you are sold on this idea.
We, the skeptics are not...we need real evidence. Let me say that again...REAL EVIDENCE...SCIENTIFIC EVIDENCE. The problem here, I think, is that you dont seem to know the difference.
But ok, please, tell us about those alien trace cases again.
QUOTE (skyeagle409 @ Apr 17 2008, 06:53 PM)
That isn't what the Air Force said back in 1948 and 1952, and the verdict was: The UFOs were, in its own words, "interplanetary spaceships."
Another perfect example how you choose to believe in the military/government only when it supports your belief.
QUOTE (DEBUNKER @ Apr 17 2008, 06:08 PM)
There is nothing to refute.
I posted that radar data, but apparently, you are afraid to tackle the data for everyone here to see as that of mankind, in regards to that craft.
QUOTE (DEBUNKER @ Apr 17 2008, 06:19 PM)
Another perfect example how you choose to believe in the military/government only when it supports your belief.
LOL!!!
It is already documented H-I-S-T-O-R-Y already and look what you posted!!
Now, when we can we expect you to try and refute the data I posted as a craft of mankind???
QUOTE
Seconds after Heading Speed Altitude
lock-on (degrees) (knots) (feet)
00 200 150 7000
01 200 150 7000
02 200 150 7000
03 200 150 7000
04 sharp 200 acceleration 150 6000
05 turn 270 = 22 g 560 6000
06 270 560 6000
07 270 570 6000
08 270 560 7000
09 270 550 7000
10 210 560 9000
11 210 570 10000
12 210 560 11000
13 210 570 10000
14 270 770 7000
15 270 770 6000
16 270 780 6000
17 270 790 5000
18 290 1010 4000
19 290 1000 3000
20 290 990 2000
21 290 990 1000
22 300 990 0000
22.5 300 980 0000 Break lock
lock-on (degrees) (knots) (feet)
00 200 150 7000
01 200 150 7000
02 200 150 7000
03 200 150 7000
04 sharp 200 acceleration 150 6000
05 turn 270 = 22 g 560 6000
06 270 560 6000
07 270 570 6000
08 270 560 7000
09 270 550 7000
10 210 560 9000
11 210 570 10000
12 210 560 11000
13 210 570 10000
14 270 770 7000
15 270 770 6000
16 270 780 6000
17 270 790 5000
18 290 1010 4000
19 290 1000 3000
20 290 990 2000
21 290 990 1000
22 300 990 0000
22.5 300 980 0000 Break lock
You favorite "evidence"... again.
We have all been through this before Sky. There is no way to even prove that these numbers are real.. and that means...we cant use this as evidence of aliens flying around. If indeed real...For all we know it could have been lots of things.... even timetraveler from the future.
Prove me wrong!
QUOTE (DEBUNKER @ Apr 17 2008, 06:25 PM)
You favorite "evidence"... again.
We have all been through this before Sky. There is no way to even prove that these numbers are real.. and that means...we cant use this as evidence of aliens flying around. If indeed real...For all we know it could have been lots of things.... even timetraveler from the future.
Prove me wrong!
We have all been through this before Sky. There is no way to even prove that these numbers are real.. and that means...we cant use this as evidence of aliens flying around. If indeed real...For all we know it could have been lots of things.... even timetraveler from the future.
Prove me wrong!
In other words, you can't measure up to the challege to prove the craft as that of mankind.
I'll be back a a few hours and I will be expecting a response from you on that challenge in the form of advanced technical data and if not, then........
QUOTE
Stargate had about 22 remote viewers.
Why did they only retain 3 then? Were they still doing the same job? If I am not mistaken, the CIA canvassed its own members too for the program, so it makes sense that they would retain them after the project, but have them go back to their old jobs.
QUOTE
I would say that no more than 2 years at the most, but not only did the program go on for twenty years, the CIA retained 3 of the psychic spies afterwards.
Why did they shut it down?
QUOTE
KPIX-TV, San Francisco, covered the work of Stanford University that was assisting in the program. Interviews were conducted and it was found that the initial results were, in their own words, 66%, which is far above chance. Further results varied over the years.
Yet they shut down the program due to lack of results...
Oh, hey! I just flipped a coin 4 times and guessed the resulting face correctly 3 times! Thats 25% more than chance would dictate! I must be psychic, according to those initial results.
QUOTE
Seconds after Heading Speed Altitude
lock-on (degrees) (knots) (feet)
00 200 150 7000
01 200 150 7000
02 200 150 7000
03 200 150 7000
04 sharp 200 acceleration 150 6000
05 turn 270 = 22 g 560 6000
06 270 560 6000
07 270 570 6000
08 270 560 7000
09 270 550 7000
10 210 560 9000
11 210 570 10000
12 210 560 11000
13 210 570 10000
14 270 770 7000
15 270 770 6000
16 270 780 6000
17 270 790 5000
18 290 1010 4000
19 290 1000 3000
20 290 990 2000
21 290 990 1000
22 300 990 0000
22.5 300 980 0000 Break lock
lock-on (degrees) (knots) (feet)
00 200 150 7000
01 200 150 7000
02 200 150 7000
03 200 150 7000
04 sharp 200 acceleration 150 6000
05 turn 270 = 22 g 560 6000
06 270 560 6000
07 270 570 6000
08 270 560 7000
09 270 550 7000
10 210 560 9000
11 210 570 10000
12 210 560 11000
13 210 570 10000
14 270 770 7000
15 270 770 6000
16 270 780 6000
17 270 790 5000
18 290 1010 4000
19 290 1000 3000
20 290 990 2000
21 290 990 1000
22 300 990 0000
22.5 300 980 0000 Break lock
Thanks! You just proved the flying spagetti monster exists!
QUOTE (skyeagle409 @ Apr 17 2008, 02:15 PM)
No, and here's why in regards to Egyptian boats over 300 feet in length.
"A hull of such size would involve great bend-induced stresses, which were dealt with using strake edge jointing. The plank shear issue was more directly addressed in the ancient practice of mortise and tenon-jointed planks (strakes), which "certainly goes back to 14th century BC and very much likely before that..."
Length 425 feet (280 Greek cubits)
Beam 58 feet
Height from tip of sternpost to waterline 80 feet
Length of steering oars 45 feet 6 inches
Longest rowing oars used 57 feet 8 inches
Displacement 10000?
Oarsmen 4000
Other ratings 400
Marines 2850
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tessarakonteres
My prediction is; Around 15 years or so, but not beyond, but the way things are shaping up today with more and more countries stating that the UFOs in question are those of intelligently controlled crafts after opening up their declassified UFO files, that revelation could come much sooner.
"A hull of such size would involve great bend-induced stresses, which were dealt with using strake edge jointing. The plank shear issue was more directly addressed in the ancient practice of mortise and tenon-jointed planks (strakes), which "certainly goes back to 14th century BC and very much likely before that..."
Length 425 feet (280 Greek cubits)
Beam 58 feet
Height from tip of sternpost to waterline 80 feet
Length of steering oars 45 feet 6 inches
Longest rowing oars used 57 feet 8 inches
Displacement 10000?
Oarsmen 4000
Other ratings 400
Marines 2850
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tessarakonteres
My prediction is; Around 15 years or so, but not beyond, but the way things are shaping up today with more and more countries stating that the UFOs in question are those of intelligently controlled crafts after opening up their declassified UFO files, that revelation could come much sooner.
I've asked for evidence online for the 525 foot claim. Can you provide it, or no? The length above is 425 feet, not 525 feet, and in that same link:
QUOTE
Record-holder
The Guinness Book of Records recognizes it as the world's Largest Human Powered Vessel.
The Guinness Book of Records recognizes it as the world's Largest Human Powered Vessel.
So there seems to be no evidence of your claim of a 525 foot long ship from ancient Egypt. What other claims of yours are suspect (alluding to this particular thread)?
QUOTE (skyeagle409 @ Apr 17 2008, 07:31 PM)
In other words, you can't measure up to the challege to prove the craft as that of mankind.
I'll be back a a few hours and I will be expecting a response from you on that challenge in the form of advanced technical data and if not, then........
I'll be back a a few hours and I will be expecting a response from you on that challenge in the form of advanced technical data and if not, then........
I agree with you on one thing though, the data is straight to the point, I just dont agree with your interpretation. And since others dont either, you havent really shown anything, and the data certainly havent proven you to be correct. You think it has, but the reaction to your "evidence" speaks for it self.
Most believers suffer from this selective miss interpretation.
Skyeagle sure is one of them...Everything he presents, which is actually inconclusive in support of an extraordinary claim, since its just rather ordinary observations without any explanation, is presented in order to substantiate his beliefs.
Obviously your experience is lacking, since from you have shown you grossly misinterpretate said evidence and cherry pick data, avoiding that which goes against you.
Lets have a look at that Belgian example again shall we...
QUOTE (skyeagle409 @ Apr 17 2008, 07:31 PM)
QUOTE (skyeagle409 @ Mar 26 2008, 05:16 PM)
Even a professor in Belgian who is an expert in radar techonogy on video, threw in ET as responsible.
Even a professor in Belgian who is an expert in radar techonogy on video, threw in ET as responsible.
Then I said...
QUOTE
Where did he make any mention of ET???? It specifically says that the Belgian airforce WAS UNABLE TO IDENTIFY THE NATURE OR ORIGIN OF THE PHENOMENA. That of course makes it a classic UFO....and absolutely nothing more. There is no mention of ET in this document.
And your, by now, classic response....
QUOTE (skyeagle409 @ Apr 17 2008, 07:31 PM)
QUOTE (skyeagle409 @ Mar 26 2008, 05:16 PM)
Behind closed-doors, you can best-believe that they are saying otherwise.
Behind closed-doors, you can best-believe that they are saying otherwise.
Its painfully obvious that you failed with the Noas ark claim. You failed to show the evidence of the ET starsystem trace elements and Im not even going to ask about the other things you believe in, EVP, ESP, Bermuda triangle, The face on Mars and ghosts, alien abductions and cow mutilations(!)
DEBUNKER has a point in that last post, Sky...
QUOTE
There is no way to even prove that these numbers are real.. and that means...we cant use this as evidence of aliens flying around. If indeed real...For all we know it could have been lots of things.... even timetraveler from the future.
Prove me wrong!
Prove me wrong!
You need to show us evidence Sky, beyond all other possible explanations, that there are alien spaceships on Earth. How can you be 100% sure that the UFOs you believe to be ETs arent terrestrial timetravelers from our future? Or someother "unknown exotic" explanation.
Answer... You cant be sure!
And if your not 100% sure, well then, as I see it, you are wrong and the skeptics are right.
Well, as I have said before skyeagle, you've lost! Nearly everyone on this thread thinks this aswell. And I hate to do this but I believe people should now come forward and start telling him this. Skyeagle you are posting C.R.A.P (Cruddy Refuted Actual Pooey) evidence. Post some new stuff please, so we can pick that off from the bone and gobble it up. Please look at other peoples views!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Thanks, GUNNARYSEARGENTHARTMAN
Thanks, GUNNARYSEARGENTHARTMAN
[quote name='DEBUNKER' date='Apr 14 2008, 07:39 PM' post='2246347']
What exactly are you saying?
There are lots of things we cant do, or explain, today, that is in noway evidence of anything paranormal. It just means that we cant explain it. Yet.
Ah yes that is what i am saying but while its not nessacarily proof of anything it could be so what im saying is someone who can should say **** the rules im investigating this fully no matter what i have to do, of course no one will. And just a question why if its unexplained do people offer a million other reasons but never say ok maybe just maybe it is aliens
What exactly are you saying?
There are lots of things we cant do, or explain, today, that is in noway evidence of anything paranormal. It just means that we cant explain it. Yet.
Ah yes that is what i am saying but while its not nessacarily proof of anything it could be so what im saying is someone who can should say **** the rules im investigating this fully no matter what i have to do, of course no one will. And just a question why if its unexplained do people offer a million other reasons but never say ok maybe just maybe it is aliens
QUOTE (isittrue @ Apr 17 2008, 05:38 PM)
Ah yes that is what i am saying but while its not nessacarily proof of anything it could be so what im saying is someone who can should say **** the rules im investigating this fully no matter what i have to do, of course no one will. And just a question why if its unexplained do people offer a million other reasons but never say ok maybe just maybe it is aliens
Because that would be unfounded speculation. Most of the explanations offered are based on phenomena that have been verified with empirical proof. Where no clear explanation is available, then theories based on scientific research are put forward. If I were to stub my toe and developed a bruise on it I could claim that evil toe-hating fairies sprinkled magic dust on it to make it turn purple. I would be proven wrong in an instant because medical science has proof that the reason for the discoloration is due to broken capillaries under the skin, not because of fairy dust.
The same goes for aliens. There is no proof that aliens have ever visited earth. Until such time when empirical proof of ET comes forward they will remain in the same category as the toe-hating fairies.
QUOTE (Stellar @ Apr 17 2008, 07:43 PM)
Thanks! You just proved the flying spagetti monster exists!
Apparently, that is not what the data is depicting nor what the Belgian Air Force had said in at its international press confernece where it depicted the data I just posted.
Now, would you care to determine the specfics of what the data depicts in regards to that craft?
QUOTE (Stellar @ Apr 17 2008, 07:40 PM)
Why did they only retain 3 then?
That is a very good question! Why did they retain 3 psychic spies after 20 years?
QUOTE
Yet they shut down the program due to lack of results...
Acutally, there were results and common sense indicates that apparently, the results could have been as bad as one would think after 20 whole years the program was carried on and retention of 3 other psychic spys after all of those years.
IN other words, if the results were as bad as you think, the program would not have been allowed to go on for 20 years nor would they have retained those 3 employees. You have to learn how to read between the lines when the CIA is involved and what happened in Alaska and the CIA's claim that it wasn't interested in UFOs when documents that have been release have shown otherwise and that the CIA was very much involved in UFOs and why CIA leaders have also indicated that fact.
If one had done their homework, they would have known that!
QUOTE (NigelTM @ Apr 17 2008, 07:46 PM)
I've asked for evidence online for the 525 foot claim.
And, I told you where I got the information and where I saw the image of what the vessel look like, but that is not the original issue, and that issue is: were there wooden ships built that were OVER 300 feet in length and the answer was: yes, there were wooden vessels that were built over 300 feet and you posted some of those wooden vessels as well that proved me correct, so I congradulate you for doing your homework that prove me correct.
I am flying back to California from Texas tomorrow morning so I will go to that library again and check it out, after more than 12 years or so.
QUOTE (hazzard @ Apr 17 2008, 10:06 PM)
I agree with you on one thing though, the data is straight to the point, I just dont agree with your interpretation. And since others dont either, you havent really shown anything, and the data certainly havent proven you to be correct. You think it has, but the reaction to your "evidence" speaks for it self.
Actually, I posted several months ago, a video on the incident along with interviews of the lead F-16 pilot who stated on that video that both he, and his wingman locked up the object at the same time and that it wasn't the result of meteorlogical conditions and of course, when the professor examined the data on that video, which inclded the Colonel who conducted the press conference, that based on the data, the object was extraterrestrial.
So you see, the experts agreed with my assessment, but all you have are skeptics who don't know the difference between a radar dish and a dishpan on you side, so that is where the difference stands now.
QUOTE (skyeagle409 @ Apr 17 2008, 10:13 PM)
Actually, I posted several months ago, a video on the incident along with interviews of the lead F-16 pilot who stated on that video that both he, and his wingman locked up the object at the same time and that it wasn't the result of meteorlogical conditions and of course, when the professor examined the data on that video, which inclded the Colonel who conducted the press conference, that based on the data, the object was extraterrestrial.
So you see, the experts agreed with my assessment, but all you have are skeptics who don't know the difference between a radar dish and a dishpan on you side, so that is where the difference stands now.
So you see, the experts agreed with my assessment, but all you have are skeptics who don't know the difference between a radar dish and a dishpan on you side, so that is where the difference stands now.
And of course this claim was backed up by the extraterrestrial craft that's on display at the Smithsonian.
Speculation at best, utter nonsense at worst.
QUOTE (hazzard @ Apr 17 2008, 10:06 PM)
Skyeagle sure is one of them...Everything he presents, which is actually inconclusive in support of an extraordinary claim, since its just rather ordinary observations without any explanation, is presented in order to substantiate his beliefs.
It goes far beyond belief, let's use the word; reality.
Say for instance, you own a red Ford, so is it just a belief that you own that red Ford or is it more than that, such as reality?! In other words, you say, it is my belief that I own a red Ford.
Doesn't quite sound right!
QUOTE
Its painfully obvious that you failed with the Noas ark claim.
I don't think so!!
When I was in the debate, the issue I had with that so-called student lawere was, were there wooden ships built that were over 300 feet in length. As a skeptic, he thought he was right, but reality wasn't on his side as another skeptic on this thread has proven for me, and I can thank him for doing his homework that listed wooden ships that were in fact, over 300 feet in length and one, 450 feet long that proved me correct! .
So you see, it is not prudent to speak out or ridicule that , when you don't know the rest of the story that was spelled out in Tim Printy's demise when I educated on the facts surrounding Kirtland AFB and the Rendlesham lighthouse and I may begin to post passed messages on some skeptics in that regard since he likes to go back into time and uncover my messages, but then again, I welcome him and others to do so and see what else they will uncover and if they don't, perhaps I will post what they missed or fail to post in regards to my confrontations with skeptics where they bit the dust when I posted historical facts that proved them wrong.
QUOTE
You failed to show the evidence of the ET starsystem trace elements and Im not even going to ask about the other things you believe in, EVP, ESP, Bermuda triangle, The face on Mars and ghosts, alien abductions and cow mutilations(!)
Not long ago, I suggested that NASA send a probe to the Cydonia region to have a closer look at the area and I hope they do so in the near future.
I don't know much about cow mutilations, nor up-to-speed on abductions, but I am very familiar with the specifics of American Flt 191 and Eastern Flt 401 and Stanford Unversity's experimentations that assisted the CIA and according to those involved, there were results of up to 66% so now, we have to look at the real reason why the program was kept going for 20 l-o-n-g years and retaining 3 psychic spies afterwards, cut apparently, there are skeptis who didn't know that.
Read between the lines of the CIA to determine the truth. Another case in point, the CIA claimed that the U-2 was ipassed off as a UFO, but I posted actual historical facts that prove that the CIA was lying becaue the U-2 was passed off as a high alitude weather aircraft, not a UFO as the CIA falsely claimed.
Now, for some historical facts on the U-2.
QUOTE
U-2 Spy Plane
7 May 1956
- NACA Director Dr. Hugh L. Dryden issues a press release stating that U-2 aircraft are conducting weather research for the NACA with Air Force support from Watertown, Nevada.
22 May 1956
- A second press release is issued with cover story for U-2 aircraft operating overseas.
1 May 1960
- Francis Gary Powers is shot down near Sverdlovsk.
6 May 1960
- U-2 with fictitious NASA serial number and NASA markings is shown to news media to bolster cover story of NASA weather research flights with U-2.
7 May 1960
- Soviet Premier Kruschev announces capture and confession of Powers.
1960
- Dr. Hugh L. Dryden tells senate committee that some 200 U-2 flights carrying NASA weather instrumentation have taken place since 1956.
2 April 1971
- NASA receives two U-2C aircraft for high-altitude research. These were the first U-2s to actually be operated by the NACA or NASA, as opposed to the CIA or U.S. Air Force.
So you see, Hazzard, it helps ot learn how to read betwent he lines when dealing with the CIA.
QUOTE
UFO Quotes
* Unidentified Flying Objects are entering our atmosphere at very high speeds and obviously under intelligent control. We must solve this riddle without delay."
Rear Admiral Delmar Fahrney, USNR, letter to NICAP, 1956.
Is it any wonder then, that Aerojet engineers have been releasing official documents at conferences proving that NORAD has been tracking UFOs flying in from deep space up to 500 times per year and tracked by DSP satellites 2 to 3 times per month within the atmosphere?
QUOTE
* Maximum security exists concerning the subject of UFOs.”
CIA Director, Allen Dulles, 1955.
* “Behind the scenes, high-ranking Air Force officers are soberly concerned about UFOs. But through official secrecy and ridicule, many citizens are led to believe that unknown flying objects are nonsense.”
Former CIA Director, Roscoe Hillenkoetter, public statement, 1960.
* “Saucers exist (I saw two). They were intelligently flown or operated (evasive tactics, formation flight, hovering). They were mechanisms, not United States weapons, nor Russian. I presume they are extraterrestrial.”
Lt. Colonel Richard Headrick, radar bombing expert, 1959
CIA Director, Allen Dulles, 1955.
* “Behind the scenes, high-ranking Air Force officers are soberly concerned about UFOs. But through official secrecy and ridicule, many citizens are led to believe that unknown flying objects are nonsense.”
Former CIA Director, Roscoe Hillenkoetter, public statement, 1960.
* “Saucers exist (I saw two). They were intelligently flown or operated (evasive tactics, formation flight, hovering). They were mechanisms, not United States weapons, nor Russian. I presume they are extraterrestrial.”
Lt. Colonel Richard Headrick, radar bombing expert, 1959
In regards to American Flt 191 and Eastern Flt 401, heck, I thought almost everyone knew about the events surrounding those airlines, but I guess the skeptics who ridiculed the incidents were totally unaware of the involvement of the airlines in question and of the FAA, and the amazing thing about it all, is that they are no longer secrets and in fact, not only were the newspapers and other publications reporting on them, but one was made into a movie based on the facts and documentation kept by the FAA and the airlines, but I guess the skeptics didn't know that either and one of the FAA officials of Cincinati who was directly involved, realized that something extraordinary was taking place and sent mechanics all over the place to try and prevent the crash, which happened days later on the day and manner as predicted, days earlier.
I heard that actress Lindsey Wagner was suppose to be on that flight, but had a strange feeling about that flight and backed off at the last moment, which is why she is alive today.
It is prudent to get to the heart of the story, which the skeptics fail to do because they would have out why the government kept the Star Gate program going for 20 years and retaining 3 psychic spies afterwards.
Reading between the lines of the CIA can help determine the real story behind closed-doors. After all, you only have to look at the histoy to see what I mean, so are you up to the task?
QUOTE (theSOURCE @ Apr 18 2008, 05:25 AM)
And of course this claim was backed up by the extraterrestrial craft that's on display at the Smithsonian.
Speculation at best, utter nonsense at worst.
Speculation at best, utter nonsense at worst.
Who knows?!
Perhaps, that truck you passed on the highway recently was carrying alien bodies or parts of a flying saucer and you would never have known!
QUOTE (GUNNARYSEARGENTHARTMAN @ Apr 17 2008, 10:26 PM)
Well, as I have said before skyeagle, you've lost!
Now, that's funny considering that the skeptics have been unable to refute the object covered in the data with any terrestrial explanation, so in that case, you are on the wrong side of the fence..
QUOTE
Nearly everyone on this thread thinks this aswell.
I heard that before when a number of people disagreed with me that a weather balloon was not responsible for the Roswell incident and guess what, the Air Force concurred and the majority of people were proven wrong afterwards, but I told them so and they didn't listen to the facts anymore than the skeptics on this thread, but you know, I thrive in such an environment because I love the challenge.
QUOTE
Please look at other peoples views!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I have, and the reason why I have asserting they are wrong, and the reason is, I do some serious research and, I have had my own encounter with a real flying saucer and based on that fact, the ultimate question has already been made known to me, and my military compatirots who also come out ont he side of ET reality after their own experiences.
What you need to do is to lilsten to what others have been saying.
QUOTE
These UFOs are interplanetary devices systematically observing the Earth, either manned or under remote control, or both.” “Information on UFOs, including sighting reports, has been and is still being officially withheld.”
Colonel Joseph J. Bryan III, founder member of the CIAs psychological warfare staff, advisor to NATO.
But, I already knew that!
QUOTE
“This was no ordinary UFO. Scores of people saw it. It was no illusion, no deception, no imagination.”
Air MarshallAzim Daudpota, Zimbabwe speaking about a UFO sighting over the country in 1985.
“More than 10,000 sightings have been reported, the majority of which cannot be accounted for by any ‘scientific’ explanation, eg that they are hallucinations, the effects of light refraction, meteors, wheels falling from aeroplanes, and the like…. They have been tracked on radar screens… and the observed speeds have been as great as 9,000 mph.
I am convinced that these objects do exist and they are not manufactured by any nation on earth. I can therefore see no alternative to accepting the theory that they come from an extraterrestrial source.”
Air Chief Marshall Lord Dowding, Commanding Officer of the RAF during WWII.
“I am convinced there was thought behind the thing’s manoeuvres.”
Lieutenant George Gorman, F51 pilot after being in a 30 minute dogfight with a small UFO in 1948.
“UFOs are real and they may come from outer space…photographs and various materials show scientifically that there are more advanced people piloting the saucers and motherships.”
General Kanshi Ishikawa, Chief of Air Staff, 1967.
“Air Force interceptors still pursue UFOs as a matter of national security to this country and to determine technical aspects involved.”
Major General Joe W. Kelly, 1957.
“Something is going on in the skies… that we do not understand. If all the airline pilots and Air Force pilots who have seen UFOs and sometimes chased them… have been the victims of hallucinations, then an awful lot of pilots should be take off and forbidden to fly.”
Captain Kervendal, French Gendarmerie.
“The Air Force had put out a secret order for its pilots to capture UFOs.” For the last six months we have been working with a congressional committee investigating official secrecy concerning proof that UFOs are real machines under intelligent.”
Major Donald Keyhoe, during a live TV broadcast on CBS in 1958 in which he was pulled from the air when he began to deviate from the prepared format of the programme.
I posted just the other day, a list of countries stating that the UFOs in question, are craft under intelligent control, which actually confirms what Major Donald Keyhoe was revealing on "Live TV" in 1958.
In the last quote, Major Donald Keyhoe was revealing ET reality on "Live TV" on CBS, but the censors pulled the audio plug so the public could not hear what he had to say and as one CBS official noted; "It was done in the interest of national security."
That was actually the first time (January 22, 1958) that actual disclosure of ET reality was made and many people today, are unaware of that fact, but I am old enough to remember the program on CBS.
Had the Major been allowed ot continue on with the audio intact, we may not be having this debate today, and why I am reiterating right now, base that program and my own UFO experience and those of my compatriots, in addition to what I have uncovered over the years with the assistance of the Air Force, that ET reality is a fact and my prediction is: full disclosure will come within 15 years or less.
QUOTE (skyeagle409 @ Apr 17 2008, 11:20 PM)
Who knows?!
Perhaps, that truck you passed on the highway recently was carrying alien bodies or parts of a flying saucer and you would never have known!
Perhaps, that truck you passed on the highway recently was carrying alien bodies or parts of a flying saucer and you would never have known!
But isn't it your aim to prove that ETs are here? Why the sudden shift to melodrama?
QUOTE (DEBUNKER @ Apr 17 2008, 07:08 PM)
There is nothing to refute.
Once again, are you up to the challenge to ascertain what the information in the data I posted, indicates?
The only thing I have to say nice about Tim Printy, is that he confirmed what I have been telling skeptics for a very long time, and that is, the mode the radar system was in when it locked onto the UFO, and why I challenged you to post advanced data on that particular radar mode, which would have proven me correct on what the data depicted, and that is, it depicted an intelligently controlled craftt that was not of this earth.
The skeptic websites falsely said that the radar depicted the UFO crashing into the ground, which raised my eyebrows because the data depicted on such thing when MSL was taken into consideration and HAZZARD, as a helicopter pilot, should have known that as well by knowing the difference between MSL and SL in relation to what I have just said.
I did a demonstration a couple of years back to make it easy to understand what I was talking about in regards to the altitude of Denver, Colorado and an aircraft flying at a particular altitude over Denver. I am a pilot of over 38 years and knew that the skeptical websites were getting their facts all wrong and why I presented that demonstration to show that the UFO did not contact the ground at all.
QUOTE (theSOURCE @ Apr 18 2008, 07:03 AM)
But isn't it your aim to prove that ETs are here? Why the sudden shift to melodrama?
The fact of the matter is, I asserted that the data depicts an alien spacecraft and that fact has gone unrefuted.
Let's do a recap to underline my point in the data, and why we have these following messages, that no doubt will grow as a number of other countries begin to open their UFO files, which will depict the flying crafts as intelligentLY-controlLED vehicles as scientist in New Mexico noted in the late 1948, and for whom documented their observations in a number of documents available under the FOIA.
Wilbert Smith, Engineer
I made discreet enquiries through the Canadian Embassy staff in Washington who were able to obtain for me the following information:
a. The matter is the most highly classified subject in the United States Government, rating higher even than the H-bomb.
b. Flying saucers exist.
c. Their modus operandi is unknown but concentrated effort is being made by a small group headed by Doctor Vannevar Bush.
d. The entire matter is considered by the United States authorities to be of tremendous significance.
The Colorado Study
A UFO paced an RAF fighter plane for 10 minutes while ground radar tracked it. The Colorado report said of this case that the "probability that at least one genuine UFO was involved appears to be fairly high." (Bantam, 248-256).
A Scientific Analysis of Four Photographs of a Flying Disk Near Lac Chauvet (France)
Pierre Guerin, Institut d'Astrophysique, Paris, France
A series of four photographs of a disk-shaped object apparently flying in the sky was physically analyzed. Certain details led us to develop a mathematical model of the supposed trajectory. The model was validated by measurements on the photographs, which demonstrated that the disk was distant from the camera, flying along a straight and horizontal trajectory, and was not a fabrication.
TURKEY: UFOS ARE REAL CRAFT" SCIENCE CONCLUDES
After Professor OKtem had it analyzed, the report stated:"The objects sighted in the aforementioned footage that have a structure that is made of specific material are definitely not made up by any kind of computer animation nor are they any form of special effects used for simulation in a studio or for a video effect therefore in conclusion it was decided that the sightings were neither a mockup or hoax. "
CHILE announces UFOs are for real:
"UFO Sighting of Arica is Confirmed by La Direccion General de Aeronautic Civil."
Chile did start to join the small number of countries who officially stated that the nature of UFOs is of intelligent driven flying machines. A DECISIVE OBSERVATION OVER ARICA: Luis Sanchez, Chilean Director of Skywatch International said this was the first time such an organization had attached its name to a confirmed UFO observation statement. La Direccion General de Aeronautic Civil wrote that they publicly recognised that Chile was experiencing UFO sightings and that the phenomenon was real, not a natural, conventional phenomenon such as meteorotic or climatic.
BRAZIL Relaxes Its UFO Secrecy
The nation of Brazil is relaxing its policy of UFO secrecy. It is the first among a number of countries known to be considering the idea of abandoning the secrecy mandate that has been in place worldwide since the phenomenon first began to be publicly known nearly fifty years ago.
A.J. Gevaerd of the Brazilian Committee of UFO Researchers reports that a number of important files have just been released, including a folder containing documents from 1977 that cover dozens of cases of UFOs in the Amazon with over 100 pictures made during Operation Saucer, an official Brazilian military investigation that was carried out between September and December, 1977."
BRAZIL: Trindade Flying Saucer
The President Goes Public
"Given these precautions and nearly fifty witnesses, it is not surprising that when the Brazilian Navy requested analysis of the film it was pronounced genuine and released to the press by the President of Brazil, Mr Joscelino Kubitschek."
INDIA to annouce UFO's are REAL
India Daily News
New Delhi is in the middle of a big secret internal debate. On one side the largest democracy of the world is eager to explain to its citizens and to the world about the ongoing contacts with the UFOs and extra-terrestrials. On the other hand there are invisible untold international protocols that..."
Rash of UFO sightings in China -
Government Pays Attention to Phenomenon
The Associated Press
At the beginning of the new year, China is astir with sightings of otherworldly visitors and the sightings are treated with unexpected seriousness in a country led by no-nonsense communist officials. China has a bimonthly magazine - circulation 400,000 - devoted to UFO research. The conservative state-run media report UFO sightings.
Defense Minister Ishiba Considers Japan's Options in UFO Attack
By Stuart Biggs
Dec. 21 (Bloomberg) -- Japan's Defense Minister Shigeru Ishiba is considering how his Self-Defense Forces could respond to an attack by space aliens while adhering to limits on military action under the country's war-renouncing Constitution.
Ishiba is the second Cabinet member to profess his belief in unidentified flying objects after Chief Cabinet Secretary Nobutaka Machimura suggested on Dec. 18 they are the only explanation for ``unexplainable'' things like the Nazca Lines, pre-Columbian etchings in the desert south of Lima, Peru.
SYMPOSIUM ON UNIDENTIFIED FLYING OBJECTS
HEARINGSBEFORE THE COMMITTEE ON SCIENCE AND ASTRONAUTICS
U.S. HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES
NINETIETH CONGRESS
SECOND SESSION
JULY 29, 1968
STATEMENT OF DR. JAMES A. HARDER, ASSOCIATE PROFESSOR OF CIVIL ENGINEERING, UNIVERSITY OF CALIFORNIA AT BERKELEY, CALIF
Over the past 20 years a vast amount of evidence has been accumulating that bears on the existence of UFO's. Most of this is little known to the general public or to most scientists. But on the basis of the data and ordinary rules of evidence, as would be applied in civil or criminal courts, the physical reality of UFO's has been proved beyond a reasonable doubt. With some effort, we can accept this on an intellectual level but find a difficulty in accepting it on an emotional level, in such a way that the facts give a feeling of reality. In this respect, we might recall the attitude many of us have toward our own deaths: We accept the facts intellectually, but find it difficult to accept them emotionally.
The Extraterrestrial Hypothesis Is Not That Bad
Robert M. Wood, McDonnell Douglas Corporation, Huntington Beach, CA 92647
Journal of Scientific Exploration, Vol. 5, No. 1, 1991, pp. 103-112
The Extraterrestrial Hypothesis (ETH) explanation of Unidentified Flying Objects (UFOs) has not been attractive to many scientists because of the apparent requirement to exceed the speed of light in making such trips. It is postulated that if the basis of gravity control systems were discovered, and that if the speed of light can either be raised or exceeded using such devices, then the pattern of UFO reports is consistent with the ETH.
UFOs - EXTRATERRESTRIAL PROBES?
Astronautics and Aeronautics,
James E. McDonald
On the basis of an intensive study of the UFO problem, I believe that the extraterrestrial origin hypothesis must now be given extremely serious scientific attention.
Dr. Jung Says 'Flying Disks' Suggest Quasi-Human Pilots
.NEW YORK HERALD TRIBUNE
Associated Press report from Alamogordo, N.M., July 29, 1958.
Dr. Carl Jung, Swiss psychologist, says in a report released yesterday that unidentified flying objects are real, and show signs of intelligent guidance by quasi-human pilots.
[/b]
QUOTE
Wilbert Smith, Engineer
I made discreet enquiries through the Canadian Embassy staff in Washington who were able to obtain for me the following information:
a. The matter is the most highly classified subject in the United States Government, rating higher even than the H-bomb.
b. Flying saucers exist.
c. Their modus operandi is unknown but concentrated effort is being made by a small group headed by Doctor Vannevar Bush.
d. The entire matter is considered by the United States authorities to be of tremendous significance.
The Colorado Study
A UFO paced an RAF fighter plane for 10 minutes while ground radar tracked it. The Colorado report said of this case that the "probability that at least one genuine UFO was involved appears to be fairly high." (Bantam, 248-256).
A Scientific Analysis of Four Photographs of a Flying Disk Near Lac Chauvet (France)
Pierre Guerin, Institut d'Astrophysique, Paris, France
A series of four photographs of a disk-shaped object apparently flying in the sky was physically analyzed. Certain details led us to develop a mathematical model of the supposed trajectory. The model was validated by measurements on the photographs, which demonstrated that the disk was distant from the camera, flying along a straight and horizontal trajectory, and was not a fabrication.
TURKEY: UFOS ARE REAL CRAFT" SCIENCE CONCLUDES
After Professor OKtem had it analyzed, the report stated:"The objects sighted in the aforementioned footage that have a structure that is made of specific material are definitely not made up by any kind of computer animation nor are they any form of special effects used for simulation in a studio or for a video effect therefore in conclusion it was decided that the sightings were neither a mockup or hoax. "
CHILE announces UFOs are for real:
"UFO Sighting of Arica is Confirmed by La Direccion General de Aeronautic Civil."
Chile did start to join the small number of countries who officially stated that the nature of UFOs is of intelligent driven flying machines. A DECISIVE OBSERVATION OVER ARICA: Luis Sanchez, Chilean Director of Skywatch International said this was the first time such an organization had attached its name to a confirmed UFO observation statement. La Direccion General de Aeronautic Civil wrote that they publicly recognised that Chile was experiencing UFO sightings and that the phenomenon was real, not a natural, conventional phenomenon such as meteorotic or climatic.
BRAZIL Relaxes Its UFO Secrecy
The nation of Brazil is relaxing its policy of UFO secrecy. It is the first among a number of countries known to be considering the idea of abandoning the secrecy mandate that has been in place worldwide since the phenomenon first began to be publicly known nearly fifty years ago.
A.J. Gevaerd of the Brazilian Committee of UFO Researchers reports that a number of important files have just been released, including a folder containing documents from 1977 that cover dozens of cases of UFOs in the Amazon with over 100 pictures made during Operation Saucer, an official Brazilian military investigation that was carried out between September and December, 1977."
BRAZIL: Trindade Flying Saucer
The President Goes Public
"Given these precautions and nearly fifty witnesses, it is not surprising that when the Brazilian Navy requested analysis of the film it was pronounced genuine and released to the press by the President of Brazil, Mr Joscelino Kubitschek."
INDIA to annouce UFO's are REAL
India Daily News
New Delhi is in the middle of a big secret internal debate. On one side the largest democracy of the world is eager to explain to its citizens and to the world about the ongoing contacts with the UFOs and extra-terrestrials. On the other hand there are invisible untold international protocols that..."
Rash of UFO sightings in China -
Government Pays Attention to Phenomenon
The Associated Press
At the beginning of the new year, China is astir with sightings of otherworldly visitors and the sightings are treated with unexpected seriousness in a country led by no-nonsense communist officials. China has a bimonthly magazine - circulation 400,000 - devoted to UFO research. The conservative state-run media report UFO sightings.
Defense Minister Ishiba Considers Japan's Options in UFO Attack
By Stuart Biggs
Dec. 21 (Bloomberg) -- Japan's Defense Minister Shigeru Ishiba is considering how his Self-Defense Forces could respond to an attack by space aliens while adhering to limits on military action under the country's war-renouncing Constitution.
Ishiba is the second Cabinet member to profess his belief in unidentified flying objects after Chief Cabinet Secretary Nobutaka Machimura suggested on Dec. 18 they are the only explanation for ``unexplainable'' things like the Nazca Lines, pre-Columbian etchings in the desert south of Lima, Peru.
SYMPOSIUM ON UNIDENTIFIED FLYING OBJECTS
HEARINGSBEFORE THE COMMITTEE ON SCIENCE AND ASTRONAUTICS
U.S. HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES
NINETIETH CONGRESS
SECOND SESSION
JULY 29, 1968
STATEMENT OF DR. JAMES A. HARDER, ASSOCIATE PROFESSOR OF CIVIL ENGINEERING, UNIVERSITY OF CALIFORNIA AT BERKELEY, CALIF
Over the past 20 years a vast amount of evidence has been accumulating that bears on the existence of UFO's. Most of this is little known to the general public or to most scientists. But on the basis of the data and ordinary rules of evidence, as would be applied in civil or criminal courts, the physical reality of UFO's has been proved beyond a reasonable doubt. With some effort, we can accept this on an intellectual level but find a difficulty in accepting it on an emotional level, in such a way that the facts give a feeling of reality. In this respect, we might recall the attitude many of us have toward our own deaths: We accept the facts intellectually, but find it difficult to accept them emotionally.
The Extraterrestrial Hypothesis Is Not That Bad
Robert M. Wood, McDonnell Douglas Corporation, Huntington Beach, CA 92647
Journal of Scientific Exploration, Vol. 5, No. 1, 1991, pp. 103-112
The Extraterrestrial Hypothesis (ETH) explanation of Unidentified Flying Objects (UFOs) has not been attractive to many scientists because of the apparent requirement to exceed the speed of light in making such trips. It is postulated that if the basis of gravity control systems were discovered, and that if the speed of light can either be raised or exceeded using such devices, then the pattern of UFO reports is consistent with the ETH.
UFOs - EXTRATERRESTRIAL PROBES?
Astronautics and Aeronautics,
James E. McDonald
On the basis of an intensive study of the UFO problem, I believe that the extraterrestrial origin hypothesis must now be given extremely serious scientific attention.
Dr. Jung Says 'Flying Disks' Suggest Quasi-Human Pilots
.NEW YORK HERALD TRIBUNE
Associated Press report from Alamogordo, N.M., July 29, 1958.
Dr. Carl Jung, Swiss psychologist, says in a report released yesterday that unidentified flying objects are real, and show signs of intelligent guidance by quasi-human pilots.
[/b]
QUOTE (skyeagle409 @ Apr 18 2008, 12:23 AM)
The fact of the matter is, I asserted that the data depicts an alien spacecraft and that fact has gone unrefuted.
And again I ask, based on what? Sightings and radar tracking are still not proof that the object was extraterrestrial in origin. What can you offer besides words that would prove beyond any reasonable doubt that alien space craft are flying in our skies? A simple specimen of alien DNA or a sample of space craft that was not man made would suffice, yet where is it?
That is not an unreasonable request.
QUOTE (theSOURCE @ Apr 18 2008, 07:37 AM)
And again I ask, based on what? Sightings and radar tracking are still not proof that the object was extraterrestrial in origin.
Oh yes it can ascertain such facts and in fact, radar has been used to track UFOs in space and radar contact with UFOs were mentioned in the document posted by the scientist in New Mexico who were observing flying saucers as they hovered some 200 miles above Earth and radar ihas been used to track flying saucers after they meddled around our Minuteman missile sites and in one offficial Air Force document, USAF security personnel lost sight of the UFO as it climbed and visual contact was lost by them after radar tracked the UFO climbing above 200,000 feet.
The USAF documented the UFO encounter in official documents available under the FOIA and the Air Force noted that NORAD was involved and that NORAD tracked the UFO with its surveillance radar and F-106 interceptors were scrambled as a result..
Which reminds me, I have to scramble to fly out of Texas to California right now, so I will be back in touch sometime tomorrow afternoon or later, California time.
QUOTE (theSOURCE @ Apr 18 2008, 06:37 AM)
A simple specimen of alien DNA or a sample of space craft that was not man made would suffice, yet where is it?
That is not an unreasonable request.
That is not an unreasonable request.
Certainly no problem sir....Can I see your security clearance?
QUOTE (skyeagle409 @ Apr 18 2008, 12:07 AM)
And, I told you where I got the information and where I saw the image of what the vessel look like, but that is not the original issue, and that issue is: were there wooden ships built that were OVER 300 feet in length and the answer was: yes, there were wooden vessels that were built over 300 feet and you posted some of those wooden vessels as well that proved me correct, so I congradulate you for doing your homework that prove me correct.
I am flying back to California from Texas tomorrow morning so I will go to that library again and check it out, after more than 12 years or so.
I am flying back to California from Texas tomorrow morning so I will go to that library again and check it out, after more than 12 years or so.
You claimed the specific length of 525 feet for wooden ships. While 525 feet is certainly over 300 feet, it is not the same thing. Ten miles is also over 300 feet...doesn't make a whit of difference.
You haven't been able to back up your claim of a 525 foot long ancient wooden ship.
Nor have you been able to conclusively prove, beyond reasonable doubt, your claim that aliens from a planet other than Earth have been visiting Earth. 50+ year old opinions, even those of high ranking military officers, don't constitute proof.
As a member of the jury in the court of public opinion, I pronounce you guilty of wishful thinking.
Aliens visiting the earth is a subject that will always cause controversy, but what you must decide before posting things, is what type of person you are. Are you a person who sees signs, miracles? Or are you the type of person who thinks it is all just coincidence? Then, when you've figured it out, you'll then truly know whether you believe aliens have visited the earth.
Thanks, GUNNARYSEARGENTHARTMAN
Thanks, GUNNARYSEARGENTHARTMAN
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