I want to start this topic because often time people are always looking at the Bible from a scientific perspective, a skeptical perspective, or a historical perspective; but people never try to look at the complexity of the Bible. I am not as educated in many things as people on this forum (and I'm not the only one). But, there's one thing I can do and that is read the Bible and make connections within the Bible or with other pieces of knowledge. This topic if for things that you just find amazing in the Bible and even for discussions about the truths in the Bible. Let's try looking at the Bible with a new angle! Let me give some examples.

The creation of woman:
Genesis 2:18
"And the LORD God said, It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him an help mate."

Genesis 2:20
"And Adam gave names to all the cattle, and to the fowl of the air, and to every beast of the field; but for Adam there was not found an help mate for him."

So, God was going to make a help mate for Adam because clearly the animals were made for one another and not to have relations with man. So God had to make a help mate for him, or literally "like him".

This always reminds me of Genesis 1:26-27:
"And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness; and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creeps upon the earth. So God created man in his own image, in the image or God created he him; male and female created he them."

The only suitable helper for Adam was one like Adam. Just like how the only helper suitable for God is own made in His image or likeness. Also, if animals aren't suitable helpers for man, how much more for an all powerful God!

Here's another amazing thing about the creation of woman:
Genesis 2:21-22
"And the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam, and he slept: and he took one of his ribs [literally "side], and closed up the flesh instead thereof; And the rib [literally side], which the LORD God had taken from man, made he woman, and brought her to the man."

There's a couple of things to point out here. First of all, why did God put Adam into a deep sleep? It was not to relieve suffering because suffering hadn't even entered into the world yet. But, it seems that Adam had to "die" in order to obtain a bride. Secondly, God took one of the sides of Adam; which includes flesh, bone, and in the bone, blood which is the life of the flesh. This is why in 2:23 Adam says, "This is now bone of my bone, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called woman, because she was taken out of man."

This reminds me of John 19:34
"But one of the soldiers with a spear pierced his side, and forthwith came there out blood and water."
Jesus was pierced and the side, which proved that he was dead. He had to die on the cross and be pierced in the side, yet come back to life three days later for us to receive life. The church (meaning each individual believer that Jesus Christ is the Son of God and Messiah) is the bride of Christ. This is why it says in Ephesians 5:30:

"For we are members of his body, of his flesh, and of his bones."

Just like how woman was made of man's flesh and bone.

Hope those will help to get this topic going or some discussion going about the Bible. Thanks for your replies,
~Apostle

I look at all the terrible things in the bible. Death, torture, persecution,etc. There is just as much bad as there is good.

Not to mention the open sexism which the world only really got over in the 1960's. Proving yet again, the Bible is mans creation, void of any divine influence.

I did not say "bad and good"; I said amazing and many of the "bad" things in the Bible are also amazing in that there is deep meaning and purpose behind them.
~Apostle

You say the Bible is sexist? Maybe if you bring up some examples, we could clear that up; thanks,
~Apostle

I find it amazing that people swallow Genesis


fullywired

I find Genesis Amazing. Also, if anyone believes in any part of the Bible, they must believe in all of the Bible. *2 Timothy 3:16:

"All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness."

~Apostle

Scary....
The Bible is extremely sexist, and otherwise reads like a Conspiracy Theorist's post.
http://www.seesharppress.com/20reasons.html#
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9K8GUL5x7QY

I got a little confused with your post. Could you please repeat again why you think the Bible is amazin?

Ok, females are made from males (ie: they owe us males something). Thats from the outset of the Bible (Genesis).

Nearly every command or parable is given unto man, yet the women is not mentioned, indicating that whatever law or rule that males must observe, females must also do it without question, or mention.

Another factor including the whore of Babylon. Again patronizing the typical image of the oldest working profession in the world, though crude, still a profession.

Why not say the evil sorcerer of Babylon? Surely that would conjure an image of a male... Nope has to be a whore.

Oh and the fact that Jesus is a man and femininity doesn't get a mention in the trinity never mind the rest of the Bible...

The list is endless.

Yes, I am so glad you said this. The Bible is not sexist at all. It's funny that all you males are telling me that the Bible is sexist against females and I am a female.

Man can refer to either a man or the human race. Genesis 1:27
"So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them."

Here it is obvious that man is referring to both male and female.

Did any of you read my point in the OP?

Woman was made from man, but every other man comes from woman.

What I'm going to say next is completely amazing about the Bible.

Jesus is considered the second Adam. 1 Corinthians 15:45
"And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was a quickening spirit."

So, woman, Adam's bride, was made from the flesh and bone of the original Adam (see OP) just as Jesus' bride the Church was made from his flesh and bones (See OP). This was not only to give a picture of Jesus, but to set up marriage. Marriage= one man and one woman. Genesis 2:24
"Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave to his wife; and they shall be one flesh."

Understand?

Do you not realize that Jesus is described as a helper just like woman in Psalm 115:9?

I'll will have to get back to the rest of this later. I just find it so funny that you are all disagreeing with me on this though, silly boys...
~Apostle

You just pointed out another sexist example. Females should be helpers, no more no less.

Here are three examples. I think they illustrate the point clearly:

Genesis 3

16 To the woman he said,
"I will greatly increase your pains in childbearing;
with pain you will give birth to children.
Your desire will be for your husband,
and he will rule over you."

1 Corinthians 11:
7 A man ought not to cover his head, since he is the image and glory of God; but the woman is the glory of man.
8 For man did not come from woman, but woman from man;
9 neither was man created for woman, but woman for man.
10 For this reason, and because of the angels, the woman ought to have a sign of authority on her head.

1 Timothy 2:
11 A woman should learn in quietness and full submission.
12 I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man; she must be silent.

How about, the wife being the servant of the husband?

I guess you forgot ruby the judge.

Yes. Apparently, I have.

Deborah, the Judge, however, I remember with perfect clarity. Perhaps that's who you mean.

In the four thousand years or so before Christ, a single female authority figure is recorded.

And my point was...?

I believe that sara told abraham how to have a child.


Genesis 3

16 To the woman he said,
"I will greatly increase your pains in childbearing;
with pain you will give birth to children.
Your desire will be for your husband,
and he will rule over you."

This was eve's punishment for tempting adam.

Biblically.

Biblically, Eve is very naughty and so all women must pay forever.

Biblically.

And that, is precisely the point that people are making.

Actually, thinking of this sort seems pretty *amazing* to me as well.

Although, I don't think it's the same sort of *amazement* the OP was referring to.

Then Christians themselves have been ignoring that verse from the beginning. There originally were far more scriptures that were used by the early Church that were later thrown out. And even in Genesis we see two completely differents creations stories attributed to TWO DIFFERENT Gods, Yahweh and El. And there can be no doubt these are different Gods. The Bible actually says so, and we see these same two different Gods in the Cannanite legends. In fact, some of the Pslams are older cannanite hymns!

generally speaking at least from what i have heard the more the pain the more the love.

so stoning prostitutes really must be an outpouring of love while the bible did nothing to the johns.

It is strange how several say they believe in the Bible word for word, yet I know of no Christian church today that doesn't let women speak at all in church.
Just another example of how Fundamentalist Christians always leave out the parts that aren't convenient.

But then, you would think the parts that contradict most of modern science aren't convenient.

Hi Apostle,
Hope you did not mind me snipping away some of your post -- also, do my thoughts about God’s purpose for mankind, as I see it from the following snippets, resonate with your own ideas?

"What is man …? You have made him a little lower than the angels … and set him over the works of Your hands. You subjected all things under his feet. … But now we do not see all things having been subjected to him. But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honor, that He by the grace of God should taste death for all. For it became Him, for whom are all things and by whom are all things, in bringing many sons into glory, to perfect the Captain of their salvation through sufferings. … for which cause He is not ashamed to call them brothers” (Heb 2:6, 7 – 10, 11).

“… now we are children of God, and it has not yet been revealed what we shall be” (1 Jo 3:2).

“… we are God's children … Now if we are children, we are heirs -- heirs of God and co-heirs with Christ” (Rom 8:16, 17).

no the love of the mother for the child.

It's the "he will rule over you" part that I emphasised which is explicitly sexist, rather than the "I will greatly increase your pain in childbearing" part.

If time permits I will address every quandary that you all have with the Bible being sexist against women. Please read all of it because I can tell from your posts that none of you have read my posts, seeing how you have quandaries over things that I have already explained. However, I will repeat all of that information in this post. Please read it all though it may be lengthy.

The first female was made from a male.

Genesis 2:21-2
"And the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam, and he slept: and he took one of his ribs [literally "side], and closed up the flesh instead thereof; And the rib [literally side], which the LORD God had taken from man, made he woman, and brought her to the man."

This is very important in Scripture and actually much deeper than just the surface that you all are looking at. Let me explain, though I still haven't gotten that deep with it.

The creation of man and woman happened on the 6th day along with all the animals that creep along the earth (Genesis 1:24-25). On that same day, God had Adam name all of the animals (naming the animals shows dominion over the animals, just as God told man he would have in Genesis 1:28-29). However, among the animals "there was not found a help mate for him," (Genesis 2:20). This has a couple of significant points:

1. Though man could interact with animals, there was to be no "significant" fellowship between man and animals. Though things such as pets are fine.

2. Man had dominion over animals.

3. Man was made in the image of God and are therefore set apart from animals because we are able to have a relationship with God, though he has dominion over us (see the connection to #1?). If animals are not suitable helpers for a human, how much more for an All-Powerful God! (We are set cout bhere ame thwith apart from animals).

So God had to make "a help mate for Adam" (or literally, "a help mate like Adam"). Do you see that connection (to #3)? Animals were not suitable helpers for man because they are not like man and are not able to have a intimate relationship with man. Therefore God had to make a "helper like man" in order for Adam to have an intimate relationship with her. So God made woman from man's own flesh and bone.


Genesis 2:21-22
"And the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam, and he slept: and he took one of his ribs [literally "side], and closed up the flesh instead thereof; And the rib [literally side], which the LORD God had taken from man, made he woman, and brought her to the man."

This is an amazing verse. Since, seemingly, none of you have read or understood my posts before I will reexplain this here.

Would did God made Adam fall into a deep sleep? It was not to reduce his pain and suffereing because those had not yet entered the world; the world was still perfect. However, God still made Adam seemingly die to obtain his bride. God took one of Adam's sides; which includes flesh, bone, and in the bone, blood. This immediatly reminds me of Jesus' blood being poured out on the cross.

John 19:34
"But one of the soldiers with a spear pierced his side, and forthwith came there out blood and water."

Jesus' blood had to have been spilled and he had to die for a little while in order for us to obtain life (See the connection to Adam's deep sleep?). Jesus' had to die for a little while to obtain his bride (the Church) just like Adam had to seemingly die to obtain his bride (Eve).
And just like Eve was "bone of his bones and flesh of his flesh," (Genesis 2:23), the church (in other words every believer in Jesus as the Messiah) gets to become flesh of Jesus flesh and bone of his bone.

Ephesians 5:30
"For we are members of his body, of his flesh, and of his bones."

The way woman was made even points to Christ. It is in no way degrading to woman. Woman was not made from man's feet, which would signify that they are lower than man, however, nor was she made of man's head which would signify superiority. Man and woman are equal according to Biblical standards.


I will have to hit all your other points later because I have no more time right now. However, I hope you read all of this. If you still have any misunderstandings on this point just ask and I would be more than happy to help out. However, know this. You have to know the Bible to try and argue a point against it. I am a female and I know the Bible, you are males and don't know the Bible. You've got no chance. God bless,
~Apostle

[quote name='Apostle' date='Feb 26 2008, 05:21 PM' post='2169498']
I






Genesis 2:21-22
"And the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam, and he slept: and he took one of his ribs [literally "side], and closed up the flesh instead thereof; And the rib [literally side], which the LORD God had taken from man, made he woman, and brought her to the man."

This is an amazing verse. Since, seemingly, none of you have read or understood my posts before I will reexplain this here.





You only find it amazing ???? I find it astounding !!!!!!


fullywired

while i myself am not religious i do think that the bible has some good points and if people follow some of the scriptiours the world would perhaps be a better place. however there are, as pointed out by people before me, many contradictions and things that it says that are wrong.

I must add to this that there was a definite purpose why woman was made from man's own flesh and blood; in that we find the purpose of marriage.

Genesis 2:23-24
"And Adam said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man. Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they shall be one flesh."

This is where we get marriage= one man and one woman. They become one flesh again.

Also, I need to add that, yes, woman is called a "help mate for him". However, this is far from being an insult or sexist in any way. The Lord is described the same way in Psalm 115:9.

"O Israel, trust in the Lord: he is their help and their shield."
Seeing how this is referring to the Lord who is the "Father" figure and comes as a male, clearly this is not insulting at all. Jesus is our helper.

~Apostle

Hi,

Well, that verse in Hebrews is talking mostly of Jesus. Jesus is the one who brought many sons into glory by dying on the cross and giving us the opportunity to become a child of God. Our purpose is basically to love and praise God. And since sin has entered the earth, we are all called to be disciples and to share the love of Christ. If this doesn't help or anything I've said is unclear just ask for me to clarify. Hope this helps,
~Apostle

I agree, i've always found the The Good Book a maze.

Same could be said for the entire bible.

Alright, now moving on past the creation of woman. If any needs more clarification on that, just ask. Let's now look at the curse on creation.

Genesis 3:16
"To the woman he said, I will greatly multiply your sorrow and your conception; in sorrow you shall bring forth children; and your desire shall be to your husband, and he shall rule over you."

This was a consequence to Eve directly disobeying the Word of the Lord. Why would this be the consequence though?
Genesis 3:6
"And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also to her husband with her, and he did eat."

(As a side note of another thing that I find really awesome, you see here that that the fruit of the knowledge of good and evil was appealing to the physical, bodily appetite-good for food, appealing to emotions, the esthetic senses- pleasant to the eyes, and appealing to the mind and spirit and to a pride of knowledge and physical insight- desired to make wise. This description is parallel to 1 John 2:16- "For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.")

Back to sexism. Here we see that Eve was tricked, Adam just blatantly disobeyed (1 Timothy 2:14). Adam and Eve were both very intelligent. They both sinned, yet it is because of the sin of Adam that sin entered the world (Romans 5:15). In marriage the man and the woman become one flesh (in other words united physically and spiritually). Here's what I've always heard about marriage; the man may be the head of the household (I Corinthians 11:3), but woman is the neck that turns it.

Since I'm on it, I will talk about chapter 11 in I Corinthians. I would type most of this chapter, except for my doubt that many of you will read it, so I'll just summarize.

Let me start by saying that when we come before the Lord, it needs to be humbly, in other words not for our own glory. The head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God. There is no inferiority in submissiveness, just different God-ordained roles. Leadership never implies being "greater". Jesus, the greatest leader, came as a humble servant. The highest honor is found in submission and service.Jesus was even submissive to the Father, yet he was completely equal with God.

Woman was made from man and woman is man's glory (11:7). The woman was made from Adam's side, close to his heart, and under his protective arm. Hair is the glory of woman (15). When women cover their hair, they not only humble men by covering men's glory, but they also humble themselves by covering their own glory. In Paul's day, this was a sign of modesty and honor.

But, back to Genesis. Eve and Adam were both cursed for their sins; there was no sexism. Hope this helps,
~Apostle

I've already addressed the first part of this, but let me get the rest.

Man is not just a word for "man", but also for the human race. It really depends on the context of the Scripture to determine who it is talking to.

The anti-christ will be a male. It would be sexist toward men to not make it a whore. Lol. But, really, she is to contrast the bride of Christ (the church).

Would you rather Jesus was a woman? But then that would be sexist against men...
Thinking practically, you could come to the conclusion that Jesus was a man so he could take the brutal beating he needed to without dying, because no one will argue that men are naturally physically stronger. Thinking Biblically, man is the head in marriage, and Jesus is at the head of his bride.
~Apostle

I've addressed the first two in earlier posts, though if you'd like more of an explanation just ask.

This verse is in no way saying that women are less intelligent or less capable of having positions over men, however this is not how God designed the church to function. Men and women both have God-ordained roles. The only thing women are restricted from doing is to have authority over men and as I've said before submission is in no way inferior, Jesus came as a humble servant, submissive to the Father. The reason being that "Adam was formed first, and then Eve. And Adam was not the one decieved; it was the woman who was deceived and became a sinner." It is in part because of the sin of Eve that woman are to be submissive to men. Women are called to be ministers to others, just as men are, but there place in ministry is not over a man. However, they were made "for man" and therefore are called to be ministers to men, but not over men.
Hope this helps,
~Apostle

Misunderstandings? Well, just one, actually.

I'm still a little confused as to how you think any of what you've just said magically wipes away the last few Millennia of documented female repression.

Talking of which, I find it interesting that you bring up the fact that you're female and we're male, as if that makes any difference whatsoever as to the odds of whether you are incorrect or not. Especially in a discussion concerning sexual equality.

As for having no chance... you really are new here, aren't you?

Tiggs

You go girl.......

Actually, I would like more of an explanation, as it happens.

Please explain the words "He will rule over you" from Genesis 3:16. Feel free to continue to try and justify it by telling me that Eve was the sinner, and not Adam, because, each time you do, you're making my point for me, rather succinctly, I might add.

Think about it.

?????????????

I had thought so. However, I've never said that it's because Eve was a sinner and Adam was not. Have you read any of my posts? They both sinned, but in fact it is through the sin of one (not two) that many die (Romans 5:15) and that one is not Eve, but Adam (1 Corinthians 15:22).

The earth was originally put under man's dominion (Genesis 1:28-30). When Satan deceived woman, he might have been thinking that he would have generations of obedient slaves, for she believed his word over God's and had demonstrated her control over the man who ate when she told him to even though he wasn't deceived (Genesis 3:6).

Genesis 3:16b
"...and your desire shall be to your husband, and he shall rule over you."

This is amazing. First know that this Scripture is not a description of marriage, but of misery. It is part of woman's curse. There is a parallel between this verse and Genesis 4:7, talking about Cain and his unpleasing sacrifice, which he is upset about and God tries to warn him of the sin that he is about to commit.

Genesis 4:7
"If you do well, shall you not be accepted? and if you do not well, sin lies at the door. And you shall be his desire, and you shall rule over him."

The words are virtually the same in Hebrew. Though you can't see it as well in English, you can still see it.

"Your desire is for your husband, and he shall rule over you."
"Sin's desire is for you, and you shall rule over it."

Now the reason this is important to see is that it shows us more clearly what is meant by "desire." When 4:7 says that sin is crouching at the door of Cain's heart (like a lion, Genesis 49:9) and that it's desire is for him, it means that sin wants to overpower him. It wants to defeat him and subdue him and make him the slave of sin.

Now when we go back to 3:16 we should probably see the same meaning in the sinful desire of woman. When it says, "Your desire shall be for your husband," it means that when sin has the upper hand in woman she will desire to overpower or subdue or exploit man. And when sin has the upper hand in man he will respond in like manner and with his strength subdue her, or rule over her.
Source: http://www.soundofgrace.com/piper89/5-21-89.htm

Man is the head of the household (which comes from different verses), but it's not like a dictatorship; considering in marriage, the man and woman become one flesh. Hope helps,
~Apostle

Well, first of all the only thing I've been doing is clearing up misconceptions about the Bible. Secondly, there's nothing magical about it, all it is is studying. Thirdly, I find it very funny that you men and yet are trying to convince me that the Bible is sexist against my sex. Yet, none of you actually know the Bible, and I do, though not as well as I would like, but more than any of you. I don't mean that to sound prideful, but it's the truth...and it makes me laugh.
~Apostle

I guarantee you that you'll be far more amazed by Stephen Hawkings A Brief History of Time than the bible.

1 Timothy 2:9 - 15*

11 Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection
12 But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence

in other words your breaking the law by studying the bible unless it's your husband who is teaching it to you. and breaking it by posting here. ...... if you understand the bible that is.

lol - ah pride comes before a fall.

Hi Apostle -- so what is your opinion of Scriptures that promise eternal life and immortality to humans who wil become sons and daughters of God -- and be heirs and co-heirs with Jesus -- to inherit the universe?

Hi Apostle -- maybe (???) MAN was given the “office” of elder and teacher because MAN was not deceived by the serpent, but WOMAN being deceived, disqualified herself as a spiritual teacher?

I’m just tossing this up for comments. Any differences in male-female relationship should NOT result in men treating women as inferior, in any way whatsoever. Woman was not meant to be oppressed by man. They were given different roles to support each other as partners, is the way I see it.

Out of curiosity -- why do you claim superior biblical knowledge over all the other contributors here? Could it be that you are deceived?

Ah, yes the pride before the fall,

"But I want you to understand that Christ is the head of every man, and the man is the head of a woman, and God is the head of Christ," (1 Cor. 11:3).

"For man does not originate from woman, but woman from man; ⁹ for indeed man was not created for the woman’s sake, but woman for the man’s sake. ¹⁰ Therefore the woman ought to have a symbol of authority on her head, because of the angels," (1 Cor. 11:8-10).

“I will greatly multiply your pain in childbirth. In pain you shall bring forth children; yet your desire shall be for your husband, and he shall rule over you,” (Gen. 3:16).

"Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ also loved the church and gave Himself up for her; ²⁶ that He might sanctify her, having cleansed her by the washing of water with the word, ²⁷ that He might present to Himself the church in all her glory, having no spot or wrinkle or any such thing; but that she should be holy and blameless," (Eph. 5:25-27).

http://www.carm.org/questions/man_head

I say this from experience on the forum. I really did not mean it to be boasting, but it really just erks me when people try to argue that the Bible is full of flaws when all they do is get those from websites from people who don't know the Bible either. I am a female and I would not want to be in a faith that oppresses my sex. Honestly, I wouldn't. That is why I have studied these things, and that's all it took. I will have to make a post later on the laws protecting women (even women captured from their enemies) and the godly women of the Bible, but it will take a lot of time because I will try to include everything, so I'll have to do it a little later. However, my reasoning for "superior Biblical knowledge" is that anyone who would argue that the Bible is sexist cannot fully "know" the Bible. I'm sorry if anyone took offence or thought I was being prideful by saying that becuase that was not my purpose in saying it. Honestly, a part of the reason of why I said it was to try and slow down the post so I could keep up, lol.

Books have been written on that, but it does sound like a good subject-topic. Why not start a new thread?

I think sandee summed up that issue very nicely in her post; however there seem to be some on the forum who do think that the bible is sexist. I wonder if a poll could be conducted for opinions on this?

Oh, I somehow doubt if any "took offense". On the "prideful" question though... ???

You need to notice that this is talking about Church positions. A woman is not to be in a position of leadership over a man in the church; in that area, they are to be silent. A woman can be in a position of leadership in the church, just not over a grown man. These are the God-ordained positions.

What people don't seem to understand is that there is nothing humiliating or inferior or subordinate in obedience. Christ came to serve and walked in obedience of the Father, who is the head of Christ (1 Corinthians 11:3), yet because of His obedience, God made his name greater than every other name; that at the name of Jesus every knee will bow and every tongue confess that he is Lord (Philippians 2:8-10). Jesus is one with God, yet Jesus was obedient to God, even to the death of the cross (Philippians 2:8). This is a picture of man and woman. Of course though, they are hard callings, because God is perfect and we can't be perfect. Before the fall, Adam would have always made decisions that were the absolute best for him and his family and Eve would have humbly obeyed; yet woman is man's "helper" or literally "a helper like man" and therefore can always help out a man in his responsibility and decisions. People are going to make mistakes and fall and that is why it is better to be in pairs, then if one falls, the other can help him up (Ecclesiastes 4:9-10).
~Apostle

I think that is a part of it. Also, Eve's curse was measure for measure; because she had wrongly caused her husband to be obedient to her because she encouraged him to sin, she didn't have the opportunity for that position anymore. So, yes, I think you could very well say that Eve disqualified herself for that position. Also, because substance now became the result of hard labor, she would naturally become dependent on the physically stronger man.



Very good point. This reminds me of Ecclesiastes 4:9-10:

"Two are better than one, because they have a good return for their work: If one falls down, his friend can help him up. But pity the man who falls and has no one to help him up!"

~Apostle