stillcrazy
Feb 7 2004, 10:19 PM
redacted
babyforrest
Feb 7 2004, 10:22 PM
I like my government.

By the way, where did you get the statistic of 92.6% ? Just curious.
| QUOTE |
| By the way, where did you get the statistic of 92.6% ? Just curious. |
Apparently I am the other 7.4%
stillcrazy
Feb 7 2004, 10:42 PM
redacted
Talon
Feb 7 2004, 10:45 PM
I can't stand the Labour party because their now more right wing than the Tories... okay not that far right, but still. Furthermore, since the Scottish parilament is simply a puppet to the Uk government, as far as I'm concerned I'm run by a bunch of people elected by the English. Until the papers talk about an SNP government in power I hate my government. (I could give a better arguement, but I'm just back from work and can't be bothered

)
Blood Angel
Feb 7 2004, 11:01 PM
I do not like my government for one simple reason, its not exercising democracy...its exercising totalitarilism. (a example can be read in my hidden agenda colmun, and the thread)(shameless advertising o_o;;)
This may surprise most of you but I don't really like my government either.
I trust George Bush but his administration is spending way too much money
on social programs. Where is the guts Reagan had when it comes to
spending? We have to win the war and that's all I care about at present.
Everything else takes a back seat.
buggyelfmaiden
Feb 8 2004, 12:26 AM
Guess I'm a jaded American.
I like how our government is set up here, but I don't like how the plans set forth by America's forefathers is now being twisted. Now, if we could vote someone in there who's really lived outside the government and knows what it's like to get their hands dirty by doing something like working in a garden, working hard to suport themselves (And I mean if someone would run who grew up poor) it would be different. But the only one who's had a hard life that's running now seems to have gone to Westpoint instead of Yale..
I'd love to have the money to go to Westpoint... But let's see.... *Tallies up the checkbook real quick* The rate it looks so I can even think to afford going there... Looks to be about 300 years... and that's if I was lucky enough to get a scolarship.
I don't think any politician on the hill has done anything for themselves for the most part, most of them come from families that are well off to begin with, and they become lawyers and such.
But... that's just the jaded side of me talking.
And to lighten the mood....
I was useful once
I was useful once
Useful to many who had me
Now I am cast away like a child's plaything
Never to taste the sweet bliss of warriors' blood upon my lips
I was useful once
I was useful once
Used to protect my master's name
A blade, a sword, carried to protect the name of my master's people
A Noble's true arm!
Now a symbol of war
But I was useful once
Now I lie in some attic
Growing only dust and rust
Underneath, master's people talk of wars
Wars with no meaning, not meetings with the
enemy for the whens and wheres of battle
The battlefield as I called home, where bravery,
skill and cowardice were shown
Is now buildings, hundreds of leagues apart
there switches are the warriors and the
kings are cowards
Gone are the days I was needed
My tales, unlearned, my way of life unheeded
Gone are the knights and gilded horses
Replaced my 'tanks' and human automatons
Gone is peace
Gone are the days of the brave
Here is the time of false heroes
But I was useful once
This was written for a class I was in in highschool. It's an exercise in personification. We were told to take any object we could think of and I thought that it would be interesting to try to put the actions of modern war from the perspective of the famous sword Excalibur.
And written by be... I'm shutting up now. goes to go figure out where she put some papers so she can figure out her taxes....
Blood Angel
Feb 8 2004, 01:53 AM
That was a very good poem buggy, thanks for sharing ^_^
Xenojjin
Feb 8 2004, 02:02 AM
I am okay with most of our government , after all america is a nice place to live .
Im mainly only concerned with a few things , such as political correctness ... which has gone completely insane in every way . Little logic is seen in the recent additions to what PC-ness is . And along with the occasional media lies .
I also feel the public school system is being used as a mind control for young kids rather then actually teaching them anything ( many teachers dont even have credentials ) . The media outlook on women's ideal figure is a bit messed up too .
but its generally not half bad .
Talon
Feb 8 2004, 02:14 AM
I hate my government because its pro-england; England benifits from Scottish and Welsh taxes, because unlike English taxes which go into the local area, celtic taxes go to London and are spent on that city, we then get a small amount of that back. They also take North Sea oil in territory which used to belong to Scotland (until the English MPs had a vote and decided it was a good idea to change our water boarders). North sea oil revenvues go straight to the English economy and not to the Scottish economy dispite it being our oil. Furthermore Scotland is used as a testing ground for small things such as the ..oh oh Poll Tax... which I remember bing introduced in Scotland a year before England and Wales, and despite widespread protests we were told to deal with it. A year later England gets it, one small protest in London later its revoked. Furthermore the Highlands are used as the UKs dumping ground for nuclear waste, and often jobs government pays companies to movie Scottish jobs to England such as the Nestle 1980s incident.
Until the SNP win the elections I wont be happy.
buggyelfmaiden
Feb 8 2004, 02:24 AM
thanks BA
And as for PC.. they need to just stop
I remember in high school we had to read Huck Finn. My teacher actually made a big deal about the 'N' word.
I mean come on... When the book was written the term was more derogitory than it is now. I remember being in the hall and the students who were African-American (Forgive me for being PC I just don't like pissing people off... I mean I'm a short (Sorry vertically challenged) person who's 100 pounds soaking wet and wearing wool) calling each other the dreaded 'N' word as a joke.
But We were given 'edited' copies of the book, and I'm sorry, but if you're going to teach history in a lit class, you should let the students read the versions that aren't censored.
In Japan I know they show the violence on TV where little kids can see it in hopes that that violence doesn't make it out on to the streets. They have less reported violent crime in a year than we do in a month.
I say SHow our American Rugrats the horrors that humans can do to others... Give them nightmatres, stop trying to Disny-ize everything so that when they get into the real world they find out that not everything has a happy ending.
Then again... I may just be a little more read than most Americans (Those of us who have to call tech suport to turn on a computer they just bought) because I try to figure out things, and I think for myself.
heh... okay Now I'll really shut up. I mean I don't want to get into trouble.

And I really doubt any of you guys and girls here fit into the category mentioned. That's more for the people who are afraid of playing with anything to see how it works. Those people I've noticed only use a computer to write a letter that they print off then snail mail to people. (My mother's that way... I had to teach her how to turn on her computer, then how to connect to the internet so that she could check her e-mail. after three minutes she said it was too hard and went back to making a quilt.)
DrStrangelove
Feb 8 2004, 03:57 AM
To paraphrase someone who is famous... "The U.S. government is the worst; exept for all the rest."
I agree with that. I think that the US government is a jewel among ruins (other contries).
bathory
Feb 8 2004, 04:12 AM
as much as people love to badmouth america and its goverment, its allot better than most:P
i'm from Australia, and i think unfortunately with our government its a case of "best of the worst", our government isn't great, but the alternatives are worse:)
Fluffybunny
Feb 8 2004, 04:37 AM
| QUOTE (joc @ Feb 7 2004, 04:10 PM) |
This may surprise most of you but I don't really like my government either.
|
Oh my god I share an opinion with joc...
The reason that I coose to vote Libertarian is that they believe in a minimal government intervention in peoples lives. Less taxes, less regulations. Privatize more of the social programs...Get a good infrastructure in place and protect the shores...
Basically to trust people with thier own money, instead of taking half(or more) of it from them to pay for public programs that may or may not be doing a good job.
My concern with the US government is a trust issue. To hold a high office you have to be incredibly rich and well connected, not to mention very good looking and media savvy. If youy have a good sound mind, and good moral standing that is great, but not a primary concern. Again and again candidates promise the world and say what a team of advisors(That run constant polls to figure out what people want to hear) tell them to say. I can't think of a president in recent memory that really seemed to answer a question directly in a debate. Answers come in pre-planned sound bites crafted by pollsters to have the greatest effect on a given crowd. The Terminator "Ahnold" getting to be a governor of California is a great example. He can't even pronounce the name of the state that he governs. He is rich, and has the cool factor, and is connected to the right families. Is he a good governer? Is he smart??? No one knows, but he got the vote...
Once some of these media savvy rich folks get into office, it seems that their primary concern is themselves and their political future, and not the fine folks that voted them into office in the first place. Promises go out the window...
It seems that the primary concern of our government these days is to keep itself in business by treating people as less and less compitent to take care of themselves. Even the republican party keeps spending more, getting bigger, and getting deeper and deeper into peoples lives...
I have a hard time trusting people whose only apparent job is to keep themselves in business at my expense...
Kismit
Feb 8 2004, 05:24 AM
I actually admire my government and being the fence sitter that I am I even admire the oposition . Not that I would ever vote the money hungry , big buisness butt kissers into power , but they do like to make sure Helen Clarck dosen't get to carried away and give everything to those people who don't need to work , solo parents , sickness beneficiaries,
unemployed people 
.
Still, running a country is a pretty big responsibility and we're all still eating and have shelter over our heads . I guess they're doing a pretty fine job when all is said and done .
Daughter of the Nine Moons
Feb 8 2004, 05:52 AM
Edit out
Dot9M
<bleeding_heart>
Feb 8 2004, 06:33 AM
| QUOTE |
| I do not like my government for one simple reason, its not exercising democracy...its exercising totalitarilism. |
Same here! We will not get a vote on what are currency should be and even if we do we will definately not be getting a vote on the European Constitution which will override all other decisions made by are country so if they say it's the euro it's the euro. To all the SNP supporters dont forget who have two Scots in charge in england and it's no better.
stillcrazy
Feb 9 2004, 02:15 AM
redacted
Talon
Feb 9 2004, 02:53 AM
| QUOTE |
| To all the SNP supporters dont forget who have two Scots in charge in england and it's no better. |
Hate to tell you but those two Scots are in charge of us as well, not like we have different leaders. Anyway if your talking about Blair, he might have been born here but he's made it perfectly clear he consideres himself English.
Nancy
Feb 9 2004, 03:13 AM
I like the "basic idea" of my government. However, that has been lost in the shuffle decades ago.
As has been stated, it takes millions of dollars, great make-up and a pristine background in order to even consider running for any "meaningful" governmental position. Odds are the first two "requirements" are a given. The latter is an impossibility.
The original gentlemen who composed our Constitution were wealthy in their own right. That has not changed in centuries.
The President (no matter whom) is always responsible, no matter the problem. However, it is the Congress that "runs" this Country of mine. 99.999% of whom have not stood in line at a Welfare Office or waited for hours for medical assistance. It is therefore, in my opinion, impossible for anyone in Washington, DC to understand everyday life.
All in all? Thanks to those few who really care, this government, to me...... is better than the majority around the world.
crosswarrior
Feb 9 2004, 03:17 AM
My Government is not perfect. It has many men in power who I do not feel should hold public office. But all in all; I still am loyal to and love America.
wunarmdscissor
Feb 9 2004, 03:12 PM
| QUOTE |
| can't stand the Labour party because their now more right wing than the Tories... okay not that far right, but still. Furthermore, since the Scottish parilament is simply a puppet to the Uk government, as far as I'm concerned I'm run by a bunch of people elected by the English. Until the papers talk about an SNP government in power I hate my government. (I could give a better arguement, but I'm just back from work and can't be bothered ) |
Talon in my opinion the snp are a bunch of no-hopers who are just as right wing, if not more so than the tories, All theyre interested in are soundbites and their policies have been proven to be , if implemented, a tool that would just destroy our economy.
Theyre just about as right wing as the tory's as well.
I am a patriotic scot but we're better bein part of the UK than not.
I am a loyal labour supporter who has come to doubt them recently, But dont worry when Gordon Brown gets in charge we'll see a left wing labour back again.
wunarmdscissor
Feb 9 2004, 03:14 PM
| QUOTE |
Where is the guts Reagan had when it comes to spending? |
Joc you lived through the reagon years right.?
Dont you remember that under reagon america was nearly bankrupted, it went from being the single biggest creditor to debtor on the planet. I wouldnt call that guts id call it stupidity lol.
Talon
Feb 9 2004, 03:21 PM
| QUOTE |
| but we're better bein part of the UK than not. |
Did you not read my reason why we're second class citizens?
wunarmdscissor
Feb 9 2004, 03:33 PM
Yeah i know what you mean but your forgeting that while we get taxed more than people in england (an there are differences regionally), we also take more than any other of the home nations from the national budget.
The oil issue was a disgrace, but that was thatcher, not a labour government.
I do agree with you but the SNP are not even close to the answer, all they ever say is "what about the oil?" and "fishing". these have been proven to not be viable solutions to sustaining an ebitre economy.
Like i said when Gordon Brown gets his chance i think we'll see changes.
I dont particularly like our government as it stands but what else do we have.
A prime minister Michael "theres something of the night about him" Howard is unthinkable, and Prime Minister Charles Kennedy is laughable.
Whatever we say labour are the only decent party to run the country. Can you imagine if we'd let the tories carry on.
Their mishandling of practically every issue that affected the country has left our education, health service and public services in chaos. They nearly destroyed the economy and unemployment was soaring at an unbelievable rate.
I agree scotland has been mistreated but that was previous governments all tory. The poll tax was a discgrace but we cant do anything about it now.
Stamford
Feb 9 2004, 03:36 PM
| QUOTE |
| I am a patriotic scot but we're better bein part of the UK than not. |
I'm with you on this one wunarmdscissor, I find it quite strange that anyone would want to divide Britain up into England, Wales and Scotland again; it seems funny that Australia (which let's face it is slightly bigger than Britain) doesn't have this problem, i.e. people from Queensland wanting independence from New South Wales, etc.
I think as a unit we work pretty well together - long live the Union!
stillcrazy
Feb 9 2004, 03:40 PM
redacted
wunarmdscissor
Feb 9 2004, 03:40 PM
Yeah stamford just look back at history.
Divided we were an insignificant speck of land on the map together we created the most powerful and largest empire the world has ever seen and will ever see.
Not bad for four wee countries eh?
wunarmdscissor
Feb 9 2004, 03:41 PM
| QUOTE |
YO Folks
I asked that you respect the Post of others without making comments on others ideas or beliefs. |
What?? I was commenting on reagon not joc
stillcrazy
Feb 9 2004, 03:46 PM
redacted
wunarmdscissor
Feb 9 2004, 03:48 PM
Ok i see , wasnt actually trying to start an argument that time lol
Nxt2Hvn
Feb 9 2004, 03:57 PM
Loaded question....
And all I will say is...
It depends on what part of the Government you refer to.
But for the most part... I do have a good opinion of my Government.... and yes I do mean President Bush.
I also think highly of Pres. Reagan.
And remember these are
my opinions.... so let's not bash them
doomgirl
Feb 9 2004, 04:08 PM
anything I have to say abt my government can't be said here

this is our PM, looks like a chimp or chump to me
stillcrazy
Feb 9 2004, 04:12 PM
Nxt2Hvn
Feb 9 2004, 04:13 PM
Hey Doomie... off the wall question here....
Has the eyes on your Avatar always flashed red???
Cool!
Talon
Feb 9 2004, 04:20 PM
| QUOTE |
| Yeah i know what you mean but your forgeting that while we get taxed more than people in england (an there are differences regionally), we also take more than any other of the home nations from the national budget. |
Em, no, England takes the most from the budget, and Scotland puts in more than it draws out.
| QUOTE |
| The oil issue was a disgrace, but that was thatcher, not a labour government. |
The oil issue arose before Thatcher, and I don't see Labour changing it.
| QUOTE |
| I do agree with you but the SNP are not even close to the answer, all they ever say is "what about the oil?" and "fishing". these have been proven to not be viable solutions to sustaining an ebitre economy. |
Have you ever read the SNP maefesto? I have, they discuss a lot more than oil and fish. As for sustaining the economy, where do you people get this idea that small countries can't survive on their own, some examples of those which have - Ireland, Luxemburgh, Norway etc. Even US economists such as Robert Mundell say that Scotland in the EU could have an economy as stable as Denmark or Finland, not like you seem to think - Afganistan.
| QUOTE |
| Like i said when Gordon Brown gets his chance i think we'll see changes. |
Yet another individual who has defected nationalities
| QUOTE |
| I dont particularly like our government as it stands but what else do we have. |
We could if we stood up for ourselves have an independant parliment.
| QUOTE |
| A prime minister Michael "theres something of the night about him" Howard is unthinkable, and Prime Minister Charles Kennedy is laughable. |
In case you didn't notice, voting SNP would not mean the victory of either of these individuals.
| QUOTE |
| Whatever we say labour are the only decent party to run the country. Can you imagine if we'd let the tories carry on. |
Again, voting SNP would not mean the victory of these individuals.
| QUOTE |
| Their mishandling of practically every issue that affected the country has left our education, health service and public services in chaos. They nearly destroyed the economy and unemployment was soaring at an unbelievable rate. |
And once again, voting SNP would not mean the victory of these individuals.
You seem very much unaware that the SNP, Tories, and Liberal Democrates are three different parties.
| QUOTE |
| I agree scotland has been mistreated but that was previous governments all tory. The poll tax was a discgrace but we cant do anything about it now. |
All Tory? noncense! It's still happening, 500 Scots jobs have resently mean moved to India, if those were English jobs the government would have gone nuts. What about claiming that Scots MPs shouldn't have a say in English matters despite English MPs having a say in Scottish matters for the last 300 years. The Scots are still outnumbered 10 to 1, so our vote is serverly diluted by theirs. We are still used as a dumping ground for Nuclear waste, didn't you see the uproar a while ago were London waste was being bured about 7 miles outside a town up north?
| QUOTE |
| I find it quite strange that anyone would want to divide Britain up into England, Wales and Scotland again; it seems funny that Australia (which let's face it is slightly bigger than Britain) doesn't have this problem, i.e. people from Queensland wanting independence from New South Wales, etc. |
1. Australia is MUCH bigger than the UK.
2. Australia is a single country, you seem to ignoring that Scotland existed as an individual country for 1000 years before the union. This is not an attempt to break up an established country into seperate unions, this is about gaining freedom for the Celtic nations which were subdagated 300 years ago.
Aslan
Feb 9 2004, 04:51 PM
Now now. Let's try not to turn this thread into an exercise in banner waving or party politics.
doomgirl
Feb 9 2004, 04:56 PM
Joc made it for me Nxt
| QUOTE |
stillcrazy Posted on Feb 10 2004, 02:12 AM I will put that in the "not too impressed" slot
|
our PM or what I said
stillcrazy
Feb 9 2004, 05:03 PM
redacted
Stamford
Feb 9 2004, 05:05 PM
| QUOTE |
QUOTE I find it quite strange that anyone would want to divide Britain up into England, Wales and Scotland again; it seems funny that Australia (which let's face it is slightly bigger than Britain) doesn't have this problem, i.e. people from Queensland wanting independence from New South Wales, etc.
1. Australia is MUCH bigger than the UK. |
Thanks for clearing that up for me Talon.
Xenojjin
Feb 9 2004, 05:26 PM

I like nancy's post .
wunarmdscissor
Feb 9 2004, 06:45 PM
| QUOTE |
| We are still used as a dumping ground for Nuclear waste, didn't you see the uproar a while ago were London waste was being bured about 7 miles outside a town up north? |
Im not gonna argue with that point at all .
| QUOTE |
| Em, no, England takes the most from the budget, and Scotland puts in more than it draws out. |
I was talking about in relative terms, englands popunlation is around 42 million of course they will take more.
| QUOTE |
| Have you ever read the SNP maefesto? I have, they discuss a lot more than oil and fish |
Yes but if you look it all includes higherr taxation.
| QUOTE |
| What about claiming that Scots MPs shouldn't have a say in English matters despite English MPs having a say in Scottish matters for the last 300 years. |
This is a contentious issue , we cant keep fihgting centuries old feelings of injustice, I amnt really sure what to think about the whole scots MP's voting on issues that only affect england and walers. They have a point though, i mean english mp's cant vot at the scottish parliament. Then again they could also introduce devolution because as it stands it is a brittish parliament.
| QUOTE |
| You seem very much unaware that the SNP, Tories, and Liberal Democrates are three different parties. |
I am aware that these are all seperate political parties , all i meant was i wouldnt want any of them in power. Although the lib dems are ok , i suppose lol.
| QUOTE |
| It's still happening, 500 Scots jobs have resently mean moved to India, if those were English jobs the government would have gone nuts |
This is unacceptable i agree but it is happening elswhere in the UK as well, this is down to the big companies though not the government. Theres nothing much they can do, i mean the companies see cheap labour an think "here we go to hell with everyone else".
| QUOTE |
| This is not an attempt to break up an established country into seperate unions, this is about gaining freedom for the Celtic nations which were subdagated 300 years ago. |
Im sorry but these sentiments are a bit outdated, I mean we arent exactly shackled slaves are we? I am as patriotic as the next person but i just cant see how we would benefit from going it alone.
When scotland was independant it relyed heavily on an agricultural styl of living and i dont think you can equate the two seperate times.
stillcrazy
Feb 9 2004, 08:22 PM
Redacted
stillcrazy
Feb 9 2004, 08:32 PM
Talon
Feb 9 2004, 10:53 PM
| QUOTE |
| Now now. Let's try not to turn this thread into an exercise in banner waving or party politics. |
As much as I'd like to continue debating this with you Wunarmdscissor, looks like if we do the thread'll be locked. I'll bid my time before converting you
wunarmdscissor
Feb 9 2004, 11:19 PM
lol true
thepsychoticseaotter
Feb 10 2004, 02:48 AM
All in all I am pretty happy. there are a few points I do wish would change like:
- Stiffer penalties on illegal immigration and a total closing of the southern border until they can stop the smuggling of Illegals in. (this is a two fold standpoint 1. I hate illegals from any country and 2 the torture that is put on some of these poor people by the smugglers)
- Treason Charges should be leveled against coorporations that shut down US plants for cheaper overseas labor.
- Much higher taxes for the Rich
- lower taxes for the working and lower classes
- A retooling of welfare where Working families, Children, the elderly, and pregnant women benifit before career welfare users.
- the end to the discrimination of smokers and an end to PC think.
- Penalties that include the death sentence for drug dealers and child Molestors.
- an end to gun control Laws.
- Withdrawl from and expulsion of the UN from US soil.
there are other issues but they are moral and I don't feel comfortable discussing them.
stillcrazy
Feb 10 2004, 03:28 AM
redacted
thepsychoticseaotter
Feb 10 2004, 03:30 AM
| QUOTE (stillcrazy @ Feb 9 2004, 09:28 PM) |
| QUOTE | | Penalties that include the death sentence for drug dealers and child Molestors. |
I will agree with understanding of proof beyond all doubt. I don't want to sentence anyone to death if there is a question of innocence. Thanks for the Input earthling. |
Oh yeah, there has to be proof I don't want to see a mass slaughter just a bigger deterrant for these actions....
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