Whats been going on with UM?

When I first discovered UM I became a memeber on the sole design that this site was almost an endless abyss of information. I can come on here and access information from archives anytime I feel the need to learn about something of interest. More attractive though was the fact that I could come onto UM and gain a concensus of opinion on any topic via live discussion with a global community, I could gain new insight from participants from every experience through beautiful discussion. The best thing was that everytime I participated and contributed to a thread, I logged off with new knowledge and a sincere appreciation for my UM experience.

Lately the threads are so unnecessarily antagonistic towards what UM members should attempt to preserve!

Discussions are competitive and take off on tangents of a personal nature......and then nothing is accomplished, noone learns, nothing is gained, everyone loses. If someone comes onto this site in search of insight they have to dredge through 2 pages of nonsensical material just to get to some substance. You know what I do when I hit a thread like that...I skip it! If the whole forum is like that then one is apt to find another forum in order to achieve what they set out for.....answers.

In the past there was more mod intervention when threads turned into octopus type discussions with tentacles flailing everywhere off topic.

Here is a good example of how people may use UM in a practical nature, there was a thread about it here. http://www.unexplained-mysteries.com/forum...=112523&hl=
In this movie the character logs onto UM in search for answers. Alot of the threads aren't able to supply this service nowadays because of the issues I've stated.

Can we gather a concensus on this issue?

An avid and loyal member.

Chauncy

This is bound to happen when you are discussing the same small pool of topics over and over and over again.

In the begining I spent alot of time in the U.F.O/E.T forum.... after awhile everything became a "what would you do?" or "an unreliable source as some wacked-out information that makes no sense but will help kill some time, WOOT!"/

So now I prance around everywhere else contriubting my wisdom to the lowly masses.

YOU'RE WELCOME CHAUNCY!

This is true in a sense. there is alot of recycled topics. It seems more though that when topics are brought up again its because the OP'er is at that stage of understanding or questioning.....we all travel down paths of learning.



I appreciate your prancing InHuman!!...........lol

Maybe that is why most users only stay a couple of years.............after that you get fed up

Sometimes it is just a random mix of people regularly contributing to a particular topic that can make it difficult. Once they move on it gets back to normal. People get too personal and make UM their life it seems.

The ghost forum sort of imploded in on itself late last year through a mix of egos etc.

Edit: But thinking about it more I read UM for ages before I joined and started posting. And I did used to view it more as a great archive of knowledge - which you are right it doesn't seem to be that way now. But I just thought it was the change in perspective from being a reader to contributer.

I agree and I would suspect it would have something to do with the 'report' button by members like yourself. Mods aren't psychics and they don't read every post that comes through UM. Mods normally do check the reports often it would seem and the last few reports I've put in were dealt with in quite a short period of time. Explain your reasoning as well in your report so they know what they're looking at when they go to the thread.

edit: bloody typo demons

I don't know if your really going to find answers here, this is Unexplained mysteries if you think your going to find the truth between divine creation and evolution here your going to continue skipping and skipping through threads because there are no answers here only personal opinions that (with the exception of MID's) have no facts or proof to back them up

This is certainly true.

The fact is that over the years UM has grown a LOT. I'm only a relatively new mod And I at first was overwhelmed, but for those who remember UM as a smallish site it must be astounding.

And the fact is that we can not read all the threads, there are simply way, way, way to many about. So when you notice a problem the best thing in the world to do is either hit the report button or PM a mod who is on at the time. Because otherwise it may well be missed.

50 thousand odd people is a lot to police for the 20 odd Mods we have. While we do the best we can to ensure the threads and Chat is as good as possible, we can not get everything. So any help that you members can give will be more then appreciated

I do think that we do a good job as is but any help to make the site better is appreciated more then you can imagine

AtlantisRises

Well if the mod's can't even keep this place organized maybe that means we have too many forums on the board.

back page news is a perfect example of this; I mean look at the forum description and the content in it, they have nothing to do with each other.

Also why do we need a Space News and a Space and Astronomy forum? It's pretty obvious that there are a lot of forums on this site which could be merged.

Thank you for your feedback. One problem I have with some of the concerns raised here is that they are somewhat subjective in nature which makes them difficult to address; one member's experiences are generally very different to another's and it depends on which topics you look at, which sections of the board you frequent and what you are looking to achieve or find on the forum. If one member's perception of the community changes then there's not much we can do about that apart from trying to understand where they are coming from and do the best we can to address their concerns.

Our members make over a thousand posts on a daily basis and only a very small number of threads actually experience any problems, however the best way to help the forum is what Atlantis Rises suggested and that is to hit 'report' whenever you do see anything you feel is a problem, we take all reports seriously and it will be looked in to.


One thing to note is that the entire back catalogue of posts and threads from our seven years on-line is still here, it hasn't gone anywhere. You can find anything you are looking for by using the search feature.


Asking people to report things they feel need a moderator's attention does not mean that we are unable to keep the forum organised and merging forum sections isn't going to help identify problems. We have the number of forums we do in order to keep things organised and so that members know exactly which area to visit to find what they are looking for.

UM is a very popular and widely read site.....and at times probably hits on areas of sensitivity
where 'the powers-that-be' are concerned.....often areas of the forum that aren't political.....
probably mesh with 'things' that are of concern to politicians/defense/powerful groups.(who-ever-they
may-be)

It is highly possible....in my opinion....that a few? people come here to steer topics away from the subject
at hand....deliberately start an arguement....in a sly, or open way....so that the 'tone is set'.....
bury information that may be innocently touching on the 'sensitive' areas....see how easily it can be done..from what
you have said above.

I don't think I'm being paranoid....I'd say this kind of thing is par for the course....in the age of the internet
and would go on all over the web.

There are also just arguementative and egotistical people....so this has to also be taken into account.
Although I believe the majority of UM members to be decent and honest.


I love UM.....and have learnt a lot from being here....so thanks to Saruman, the
Mods. and anyone else involved in keeping this forum afloat.....

I used to always go to the Paranormal forum, stories were great, alot of information...Then it got to be the same people coming on and bashing, turning topics into a personal vindetta....The mods took care of these members, but there is still something missing over there..I've never had to report anyone, although there has been times when I wanted to, but handled it myself....Too many members come on with their "I"m right, your wrong attitude"...But I still find UM informative and it covers just about everything I'm interested in...What does bug me, is when a thread is pulled up that's two years old...The OP is usually long gone, and at times I start reading one or two pages and then realize, hey this is old stuff

I think discussion would go a lot more smoothly if people remembered this important rule: Just because it happened to you doesn't make it interesting.

This is a dilemma the new members run into though, I've seen where a new member starts a thread and an older member tells them there is already a thread on that subject so when they try to add to it they get ripped for bringing up an old thread. There are only so many topics and UM has covered just about everything so in fairness to the new members (and we get them everyday) I think the older ones will have to endure a rehashing of subjects

And I thought that when you've just joined a forum, before posting anything new Maybe you could just use the search function and see if there are already topics made before you joined the forum. not just make a new thread right away.

I remember when I was a new member, posted a topic, and someone mentioned that it had been on before....my answer was that there are new members that may not have seen it, so I totally agree with you...I get more mad at myself because I don't read the original date and that's when two pages later, I say oops....

I don't know, I hope no one takes this the wrong way... truly.

I belong to another forum as well as UM. I like the features at UM, I like the content for the most part. Mostly, unlike a lot of forums, UM is physically easy to read and post. Kudos on choosing board software that actually works well.

One of the things the other forum I belong to has is a subforum; a subforum where flaming, within a certain set of rules is acceptable--you can even call out another member and have a debate or knock down drag out argument (they don't let it get any worse than say PG13 rated, language is filtered). And, because they have this forum, they're extremely strict about how people behave in the regular forums. More strict than UM. If you feel the need to really get down and dirty and argue about a topic, you do it in their forum designed for that. What that's done for their entire board is eliminate the type of difficult passive aggressiveness we see on UM here a lot.

People try to stay in the rules here on UM and in doing so they throw their little passive aggressive barbs around. I've been known to do it myself out of sheer frustration with other members who are making veiled attacks against groups or even myself--but, that's ok with UM because it's within the rules. We have some posters here who are very good at being horribly obnoxious within the rules. So obnoxiously passive aggressive that I've had it I think.

Honestly? I've been spending more time at the other forum lately. I hate their user interface, but their topics are near identical to UMs and their traffic is just as high, if not higher (on top of that, I even paid a yearly fee to access their board). I don't like going there to be honest, but for some reason, their community of posters is far less passive aggressive. Probably because they've given their community an outlet to be openly frustrated. Their regular forums are a real joy to read, like Chauncy suggested, they're full of good information, and no personal attacks, veiled or overt.

I thought I'd give my feedback, I don't expect that anything will change, but I wanted to give my input. I'm a highly tolerant person when it comes to others beliefs, what I can't tolerate is poor behavior of some members, and it's driving me from UM. Not even the ignore function works, people just quote posts, which makes ignore useless.

I've stopped reporting posts to be honest; most of them I find objectionable are technically within the rules.

Thanks for letting me vent for a moment.

SaRuMaN

I can totally understand how you could infer subjectivity from the description of these issues SaRuMaN, but is this really the case? UM has grown ginormously over the years and there is now alot less of Mod presence than there was when it was less populated with less activity. One Mod in this thread had mentioned that keeping control over things is a daunting task as a result of the increase in traffic.

These issues are everyone's responsibilities, as AtlantisRises had stated there are ways that members can assisit in the continuous improvement of UM by "reporting" such threads that tangent off, burying the original point of the thread in a heap of finger wagging.

It seems , as you stated, that only a small number of threads experience any problems......but it seems to be the most popular threads , with the most traffic. So wouldn't it assist with the continuous improvement of UM by having a higher Mod presence in these high traffic areas?

Fully respected. Common sence and genuine interest is what I come to UM for. Humor is much apart of nature.
But sometimes I feel that some of the topics are totally out of this world and somewhat immature.
In this I say there could be a criteria put in place to monitor decent conversation on relivent constructive chat.
I myself go of on a tangent sometimes admmitedly.
We have a wide range of members very young, and mature alike.
It would be nice to see a mentor of sorts placed to those that are still very young and still learning about whats important and guided to see relivance and down to earth knowleged as constructive. Not In a dream world of discovering ones self.

I think this does the exact opposite which is why we have double ups of topics so often. Just adding my two cents.

Velied attacks are not within the rules, anyone who is going out of their way to be inflammatory, offensive or generally disruptive would be subject to moderator action.

It's a primary factor in any complaint or concern of this nature, how one person views something will be different to another's. As an example some people have commented that we have too many skeptics, others claim we have too many believers. Some think we are too lenient with people and others think we are too strict; we have to try and aim for a happy medium while at the same time accepting that it's impossible to please everyone and that trying to do so is an exercise in futility. There are too many differing views to meet everyone's expectations.

There are plans to bring on additional moderators in the near future to address the increase in activity on the boards.

We have implemented something like this for example in the metaphysics board where we maintain criteria which disallow certain types of threads in order to remove common problems from that section, similar criteria may also be implemented in other areas too.

Not neccessarily; there are over two million posts, and a new member - or someone unfamiliar with the topic - may not have sufficient information to accurately format a search. In such a case, I think it entirely reasonable to start a new thread. If the 'old hands' then post saying "this is covered in an old thread.. read here ", then they are doing a great service to that new member by signposting them to the relevant thread.

In a similar vein, if that new member reads the old thread and then decides that they have experience or information that pertains to said thread, then it is surely right that they post, and bring the topic back to the top of the list for people to review. Just because a topic is old, doesn't mean it is irrelevant. Merely that it is on-going. Ideally, the 'new' thread should then - perhaps - be removed, or merged, or even deleted. (via the ever-handy 'report' button.)

I've always found the Guild of Moderators to be very responsive to reported posts; I've never had a feeling of them being 'overwhelmed' .. they certainly react rapidly and professionaly. (that's not to say they always agree with my report, but that's fair enough.)

As other people have noted in this thread; people come to UM for a number of different reasons. Some wish to discuss something that's happened to them, or idea's that they've only recently been exposed to. Others might want to do research. Personally, I don't regard the UM as some sort of static Reference Library; it is an organic entity. You can use it as a reference or research tool if you wish. The search function is there. However, more importantly, so are the other members.

Which brings me to my final thought. We're all on this journey together. If we see someone struggling, or posting in the wrong area, or re-hashing a topic, then we should help them, not sneer at them or belittle them on screen. Surely we're here to share knowledge, not act as a snobby clique. As a great man once said.. "We where all noobies ourselves once.. ".

Meow Purr

Well said Mr Cat ^^



I think that was Bob

SaRuMaN

Sure. I mean there is no possible way to amend the convictions of an individual prior to memebership to UM, but once they are here their behavior should be managed or bridled in accordance with forum guidelines.



These plans will definetly rectify alot of the displeasing conduct of late, taking place in these forums.

Out of interest am I right in thinking that this is primarily about the Spirituality vs Skepticism board ?

Like I say mostly, "you really do learn something new everyday here on UM". I got me some reading to do. Thank's S-man!

Actually, I don't think so. It's a real problem in S vs S, however, it's starting to happen in Beliefs as well... I notice it in other's as well, however, I don't read the other sub-forums as frequently. And because I don't read the other forums as frequently, I have a really hard time telling when people are somewhat joking with one another or really being snotty and spiteful.

I do agree, these forums have to be better moderated, especially the S vs S forum, by someone that's really reading those threads and understanding the personalities posting to them.

Just out of curiosity....are moderaters allowed, as per guidlines, to post their opinions in boards such as SvsS? Are moderaters with strong religious beliefs able to moderate a board that deals with skepticism towards their beliefs?

So this is about the Spirituality vs Skepticism board.

The moderators are as welcome to post their opinions as anyone else.


Is a moderator who is an atheist able to moderate a board that deals with strong religious beliefs ? All our members and moderators alike have their own beliefs, an individual shouldn't be penalised from moderating any given section of the forum due to a belief for or against what is being discussed. We have boards covering a vast number of controversial subjects for which almost everyone is going to have a strong belief one way or the other, I have no reason to doubt that our moderators are able to moderate the boards without letting their personal beliefs get in the way.

Absolutely yes on both counts. Which would you prefer, moderators who are open and honest about their opinions and beliefs or those that are secretive and hide them? We moderators are, first nad foremost, members of this board. We were drawn here in the same way as every other member. That means we have strong opinions on at least one section of this site. We can not turn off those beliefs or opinions. What's more the opinions we expressed before we became moderators is still there for all to see, so what would be achieved in us refraining from expressing them once we become moderators?

If this is the S v S board we are talking about then I would say their are two very honest and very good moderators that do most of the work there. Irish and PA are open about their beliefs and hide nothing. Despite this they treat believer and non-believer alike when it comes to enforcing the rules.

What you don't see is what goes on behind the scenes... both of these gentlemen will ask the advice of others if they feel that their own beliefs may be conflicting with their jobs as moderators. I have seldom, if ever, disagreed with their assessment of a situation or their handling of it... and I speak as an absolute atheist.

When SaRuMaN made Irish and PA first forum leaders and then moderators I thought he had made an excellent choice. Nothing I have seen since has altered my opinion on this.

Whoa... I think everyone believes Irish, PA, Tiggs and Fluffybunny (who are most seen in SvsS) do their jobs as best they can with the time they have to dedicate to it, and they do it within the rules. There's no question about that, ever--at least from my perspective, I don't want to speak for anyone else.

The mods aren't the problem, in fact, the mods are remarkably good here on UM.

SaRuMaN


This clarifies alot SaRuMaN...... Iappreciate it, thnx

That is a good question... I spend more time in the World Events end of town but I think that you can broaden that to cover any part of the board really, every single person has their own set of beliefs regardless of how strong they may be or what direction they may point we have to do our best to try to work through those beliefs to be as fair as possible.

I cant speak for anyone else, but I know that it is something that I always consider. I try to do the best I can to make sure that I filter my own issues out of a matter the best I can when making a moderator decision; is it perfect? no, no one is. Everyone has issues that are hot buttons for them or get the fired up, that is why they come to this forum in the first place. Moerators are no different. If a person doesnt care about any of the topics in this forum they arent going to be around very long.

It ends up being a balancing act, where you have to really try to give thought to your own issues and make sure that you are not making decisions with a quick gut reaction on those hot button issues that might end up being a really unfair result.

Being the perfect human specimen I am, I have never made a mistake in this aspect...but I can understand where the average person might be concerned... It happens.

No problem, if anyone has any additional questions in relation to this please feel free to drop me a PM.

As the points raised here have been addressed for now I think we can safely close this thread down.