A stay in jail represents the secular example of Christianity's dance with sin and redemption: you are admitted because you have done something wrong, punished until you acknowledge your errors, and finally released, supposedly purified of the impulses that made you do wrong in the first place. The fact that prisons are also awash with members of the clergy - from rehabilitation programs to the last rites before execution - only cements the metaphor.
http://blogcritics.org/archives/2006/02/25/204702.php


I looked for some jailhouse religion articles but in the end just decided to ask my question.....

What do you think of those who find God in prison/jail they wait until they are down and out and have no other place to turn before they give God a chance. I am not saying they are any less of a christian or that they don't deserve God in anyway I am just wondering if they would have had a chance to meet God under any other circumstance would they? Do you think that they are in the positions they are now because it was their last chance, that they have ignored all the other calls God has given them and their lives are in such total ruin they are given the chance to listen in a place where they have no choice but listen? I know they are there for crimes committed and some do really find God as a result just as some pretend just for personal gain.
We have all seen TV and movies that depict the picture of prison/jail, it is an awful place to be some use this time wisely while some use it to figure out their next crime and how they can commit it without being caught.
Does religion really belong in jail and prisons, Does it help or does it just give some a tool to use to fool those who hold their fate in their hands( the parole boards and jailers and wardens)?
Maybe the prisons and jails are the perfect place as they are usually desperate then and can see what is missing in their lives and spend the time looking for it, they would probably never know that somethings missing if they were not in jail.
I know people who give their time to minister to the ones in jail and they are very much respected for their involvement and even by the inmates too. This made me think about my question.
Always a pleasure

The right to religion is not stripped when one becomes incarcerated in this country.

I'm sure it helps some, and I'm sure it is used as a tool to gain priviledge and early release by others.

I think religion in jail systems is a perfect place to find God. There is enough solitude and confinement to really reflect on what you should be doing in this life. I do not think less of people that find their religion while incarcerated. Religion has no bounds on inspiration. You can find the truth in prison as much as you can find it in a church, masjid, or synagogue.

I'm currently working on a project of sending Islamic information into the prison systems here in cooperation with the Texas Prison Dawah Project.

Look at the number of born again christians in prison that early release. Then comitt another crime. So just how far does religion go. I way I look at it is : If was on Death Row getting ready to be put out. I like I would find religion real fast.

Look at the number of non-born again Christians that early release and then commit another crime. So how far does not having religion go?

Please provide us with a comparison chart for recidivism rates for religious and non-religious criminals.

It is strange how these prisoners find god in prison ,in my opinion it is just to try and impress the parole board .Once they are out ,they forget all about religion and go back to their old ways



fullywired

Most convicts end up back in prison. Does anyone want to find information on the number of religious recividists compared to non religious recidivists?

It's not surprising that when one is thrown into a horrible place like prison, one would seek any type of help they could get, including religion.

When an inmate is on death row, and right before execution they have a clergyman come into their cell..Is this because they are looking for forgiveness at that point, or is the clergyman preparing him/her for the afterworld....I've read transcripts where those found guilty of hideous crimes, are asking for God's forgiveness...A little late I think....

Most religions that teach divine forgiveness teach that it is never too late.

As a society, we hold religion in high esteem, and we are not willing to chance sending a convict to hell if he can make peace with God through a clergman. I don't know how much sense that makes, but there you have it.

Someone in my extended family is in prison right now. He was raised a very casual catholic - church on Christmas kind of thing - but became much more into it in prison. He says that prison gives you tons of time to think, and its better to think about something good than something bad you did in the past. Also, going to the chapel there gave him something to do with others who were trying to focus on something positive instead of getting into more trouble.

I personally see no problem with inmates being allowed to practice their faith. Lying to the parole board? These people look at records of everything the inmate did while in prison, not just listen to him moon about 'finding god.' If they didn't have that to lie about... they would probably find something else.

You think !!!

Although i agree that there are quite a few who use religion as a con when they are in front of the parole board, i have seen some who really have had genuine conversions to faith. Sometimes people need to find themselves in a bad place in life to discover what is important, and if faith can help them to get their priorities staightened out then why not?!

I am looking into finding some info on the repeat offenders and how many of those did claim to find religion in jail, although everyone does make mistakes not just prisoners the purpose is to learn from them, do you agree?
If a inmate does find God in jail then it is harder to keep his/her faith on the outside of jail because they are faced with the temptations that put them in jail to begin with so I would imagine it is harder to keep their beliefs in the eye of temptation. We all have our vises and if we turn them over to God it is much easier to deal with them or I should say without them. The ex prisoner has a harder time of keeping the beliefs they found because when they did find God they did not have to turn the other cheek or turn down the drugs in jail they really had it easy , no temptation but as they learn when they get out their faith has to be Much stronger. I believe thats why so many do lose their faith.
Always a pleasure

I had a friend go to prison, she follow a Native American path, when she came out the only thing I can say is she was brain washed in Christianity. I think a person should be allowed to follow their own religion in prison, but brain washing Christianity on some one is wrong.

You know as I was posting my last post that came to mind, there really is only one option as far as religion in jail. Being christian I am fine with that but as you say there are people who have different beliefs in jail. I wonder who decides this?
Always a pleasure

I have a close friend who was in a max security prison for 10 years.

I doubt that he'd define himself as a "christian" but merely just a believer of some sort. There's a lot of down time in prison with nothing to do except get in trouble, read, or watch TV. Not much else. He chose to read, but says that he was never really confronted with religion unless he chose to seek it out on his own. He did take the opportunity to talk to a lot of different volunteer clergy though. Mormon ministers, christian ministers, non-denominationals, Quakers, priests, Imam's. The reason you don't see a lot of native/shaman/wiccan's in prisons is because they don't generally have prison outreach programs like a lot of other faiths do.

Parole boards aren't stupid. They don't really care if you've found religion or not, it has no real bearing on whether they release you or not. Parole boards aren't easily conned either--they've seen it all.

What I can say, is that in my state at least, parolee recitivism is very high... 86%. Basically, 86% of the inmates released from prison violate their parole within 18 months. Another 64% criminally re-offend within 3 years of release. I'd be willing to guess that there are no reliable studies on their religious affiliation if only because the States won't do studies on prisoners religions and beliefs. You know, that old separation of Church and State thing.

If you really search deep, you might find something from Catholic Services or the Quakers (Quakers are big on prison reform) on what they've found about people who leave prison with a renewed faith, but don't expect their results to be entirely unbiased.

When I get home, I'll look for the Department of Corrections PDF document I have discussing this. I'm pretty sure I still have it on one of my laptops.

This study examines the impact of religious programs on institutional adjustment and recidivism rates in two matched groups of inmates from four adult male prisons in New York State. One group had participated in programs sponsored by Prison Fellowship (PF); the other had no involvement with PF. PF and non-PF inmates are similar on measures of institutional adjustment, as measured by both general and serious prison infractions, and recidivism, as measured by arrests during a one-year follow-up period. However, after controlling for level of involvement in PF-sponsored programs, inmates who were most active in Bible studies were significantly less likely to be rearrested during the follow-up period.

In this study, we sought to determine whether religiously involved inmates, as measured by participation in volunteer-sponsored religious programs, would be less likely (1) to violate prison rules, and especially to commit more serious infractions, and (2) to break the law or commit an act that could lead to an arrest during community supervision in the first year after release from prison.

We found no overall difference between PF inmates and non-PF inmates on measures of institutional adjustment or recidivism. Certain differences emerge however, after controlling for level of participation in PF programs. Participation in two of the PF programs, the in-prison seminars and the life plan seminars, failed to influence either institutional adjustment or recidivism. However, the inmates most actively involved in PF Bible studies (high participants), operationalized as attending as few as 10 or more Bible studies over the course of one year, differed not only from the non-PF matched group but also from medium and low PF participants. High PF participants (1) were as likely to commit infractions as either low or medium PF participants, but were less likely than their non-PF counterparts to commit any institutional infractions; (2) were slightly less likely than their non-PF matches to commit serious institutional infractions, but were significantly more likely than low or medium PF participants to do so; and (3) were significantly less likely than low or medium PF participants as well as their non-PF matches to be arrested during the one-year follow-up period.

High PF participants, as measured by 10 or more Bible studies, were less likely to be arrested during the year-long follow-up period, but only 22 of 201 inmates (11 percent) were in the high participation category. In addition to the small cell size, we do not necessarily recognize that the measure we used--attending only 10 or more Bible studies in a one-year period--is a religiously acceptable definition of high religious participation. Most studies in the clinical research literature, for example, use measures such as weekly (or higher) church attendance (Gartner et al. 1991; Levin and Vanderpool 1987). With these issues in mind, we are impressed by the significant reduction in recidivism among PF inmates who participated in as few as 10 Bible studies during the one-year study period. Another possible interpretation is that because high participants were more likely to be "already committed in their faith," we may be observing a selection effect. Consequently one could argue that participation in Bible study is most frequent among inmates most strongly committed to succeeding after release. Even such an interpretation, however, would suggest that religious commitment may be related to other factors that enhance postrelease success.

There are graphs that clearly show the results @
http://www.leaderu.com/humanities/johnson.html


The Bureau of Justice Statistics conducted this study in the summer of 199 i, conducting face c face interviews with 13,986 inmates from 277 correctional facilities in 14 states. The sampling design used a stratified two-stage selection process whereby the prisoners interviewed were selected from more than 711,000 adults held m state correctional facilities throughout the United States. Similar surveys were conducted in 1974, 1979, and 1986.

Thanks Sandee, that was a good read, and about as unbiased as it could be. Interesting study for sure, and rather confirms what I thought would be the case.

Thanks!

I don't want any one to feel like I'm preaching, but I don't like to open my mouth with out providing my evidence/proofs/source,etc.

Sometimes God has to bring us pretty low to wake us up.

We don't "find" God. God "finds" us, so to speak. No one goes looking for God.
Romans 3:11
10 As it is written:
"There is no one righteous, not even one;
11 there is no one who understands,
no one who seeks God.

If a person has a desire for him, it's because the Father called them;
John 6:44
"No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him, and I will raise him up at the last day.
John 6:65
He went on to say, "This is why I told you that no one can come to me unless the Father has enabled him."

It's up to us to respond to the call. Sometimes we have to fall pretty hard to wake up. Sometimes multiple times. Regardless, we are all guilty sinners.
We are all guilty and fall short of the kingdom of God;
Romans 3:22-24
22This righteousness from God comes through faith in Jesus Christ to all who believe. There is no difference, 23for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, 24and are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus.
James 2:10
For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it.

We see certain sins as worse than others. But as far as God is concerned, any single sin makes us guilty.

Jesus said its not the healthy who need a doctor
Matthew 9:12
11When the Pharisees saw this, they asked his disciples, "Why does your teacher eat with tax collectors and 'sinners'?"
12On hearing this, Jesus said, "It is not the healthy who need a doctor, but the sick. 13But go and learn what this means: 'I desire mercy, not sacrifice.' For I have not come to call the righteous, but sinners."

So, where does God/religion belong? Every where. It's the Fathers desire that all repent and be saved.
John 6:40
For my Father's will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in him shall have eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day."

And there's always the story of the prodigal son;
Luke 15:22
21"The son said to him, 'Father, I have sinned against heaven and against you. I am no longer worthy to be called your son.'
22"But the father said to his servants, 'Quick! Bring the best robe and put it on him. Put a ring on his finger and sandals on his feet. 23Bring the fattened calf and kill it. Let's have a feast and celebrate.

Also;
Luke 15:10
In the same way, I tell you, there is rejoicing in the presence of the angels of God over one sinner who repents."


We don't deserve anything. We receive by grace, just as inmates do. The sins of each of us leads to death. If the penalty for murder is death, and the penalty for lying is death, who is better off?
Remember, Paul was first Saul, who murdered many Christians. God called him and he repented.

I think its good for prisoners to be able to speak to people about religion if they choose too. I'm not sure how else to answer any questions because I've only skimmed through the thread to be honest.

For me though.. I actually found God way before I was sent into remand(the jail before jail). I had been reading a book called A Course In Miracles and it connected with me very well. I had also had a dream I had walked with God basically and chatted with Him. In this very vivid dream(blue light dream).. He had told me that I was about to go through a very hard time in my life and that everyone would hate me, and that I should always remember to keep faith and to remember.. "Everything will work out in the end". That was like a key thing He told me to remember and to not forget. He told me alittle more about my life and basically said it would be very hard. He said after my son was born(who was born about 8yrs after this dream), it would get easier but then I would go through another hard time because I remember kinda laughing and saying something like "yay(sarcastically)". lol.. Like it didnt sound like much fun but I was asked if I wanted to help Him or have a normal life like everyone else. I chose to go through the hard times because I was told it would be more rewarding in the end and I wanted to help Him.

Anyway a few months later I think it was I was charged with murder(Ihad just turned 19) and had to go through a murder trial(preliminary hearing). Which was very hard on myself and my family. My dad had a heart attack from stress and stuff and everyone hated me but my close friends and family. After almost half a year in remand I was aquitted with no charge to answer, but the whole time I was told by all the other prisoners that I would have to spend years inside. But I kept my faith like I was told and remembered that saying, it was what kept me going.. and I told the other prisoners about the blue triangle ect. After my son was born I ended up getting devorced 2 years later, which I'm pretty sure was the other hard time He talked about.

Anyway when I was in remand I had a Christian youth worker who had worked at the youth center my friends and I would go to after school, and he gave me a Bible and stuff and was like a counselor I guess. He visited me and was trying to get me into Christianity but I was just trying to get him into A Course In Miracles. lol. So I was trying to convert him kinda. He wouldnt really listen though and kept saying it was like wolf in sheep clothing. Which I didnt care much about.. I just liked the visit.

Anyway I guess some people find God when they are given the chance to sit in a quiet place and to think about things but others find Him first and are then put through tests. imo anyway. I dont know if that answered anything that you asked, and I hope you's didnt mind me rambling on.. its just I think sometimes people think I got my faith from being in remand, when really I had it before that.. its just remand and the events afterwards made it more solid. Especailly having my son.

Some of the friends I grew up with found them selves in jail on many occasion. They loved drug money how great it was and how much they got from selling yea what ever....anyway they told me how muslims would try and talk them into their religion and they were in jail because the "white man" wants them there.? Well I cant say that would be the right anwser but they never did convert.

Spam spam spam spam spam spam............

I have been in jail myself & its an option to talk to a preacher each Sunday but they do hold service where everyone can hear it. Let us be honest when you are in jail & someone from the outside comes in & is willing to talk to you about anything you talk to them, if for no other reason out of boredom. I think it is somewhat sad that someone would go & preach to someone while they are going though a bad spot in their lives. Seeing that someone could take advantage of another person is very said to say the least.

All homage to Monty Python aside (that is the source of your amusement, I think???), I do not think this constitutes as spam. Come to think of it, I vaguely remember you making a similar accusation towards someone else, and all protestations of jest aside (as happened last time), I don't think telling people who quote the Bible are "spamming" is exactly going to contribute to worthwhile discussion (likely the exact opposite, come to think of it). Quoting the Bible is not against Forum Rules, and it certainly does not fall into any category of spam I have ever known. Thank you,

~ Regards, PA

It's a joke this is what I meant in another thread about people taking things the wrong way.....

I really enjoyed reading your post here, And I don't think it really matters what other people think of your faith and where you got it. Thats between you and God.
I too think we are put through test and the things we find that were really hard in our lives usually have something good come from it or we can see where the bad things have happened we learned valuable lessons. Some may say thats life but as for me I know its God,
Always a pleasure