I was looking for some information that I had read before this morning on the earth's geomagnetic field when I came across a new article from NewScientiest.com. According to the article, Oleg Shumilov of the Institute of North Industrial Ecology Problems in Russia says that he has looked at activity in the Earth's geomagnetic field from 1948 to 1997 and found that it grouped into three seasonal peaks every year: one from march to may, another in July and the lst in October. Suprisingly he stated that the peaks matched up with the peaks in the number of suicides in Northern Russia over the same period. He stated that the correlation does not necessarily mean a causal link but points out that several other studies have suggested the same thing. For example a 2006 review of research on cardiovascular health in the geomagnetic field in the Surveys in Geophysics concluded that a link was possible and the effects were more pronounced at higher altitiudes. The reviews author stated that geomagnetic health probles affect 10 to 15 percent of the population. Psychiatrists too have noticed a correlation between geomagnetic activity and suicide rates. A review of 13 years in South Africa produced data on suicides and geomagnetic storms and in 1994 a study was published suggesting a 36.2 percent increase in the number of men admitted into hospitals for depression in the second week after geomagnetic storms. Even though scientists do not fully understand the link between these two, the theory that has risen to the top for the association is that geomagnetic storms can desynchronise circadian rhythms and melatonin production(makes sense) says Kelly Posner who is a psychiatrist at Columbia University.

A few months ago I wrote a post on the correlation of geopathic stress and cancer. Since then I have found reports saying that geopathic stress can cause "cancer" in trees and plants, as well as the humans that I first reported on. Looking at all of the available information, I am finding it hard to believe that these earthly and heavinly stresses do not have more to do with our healths as a human race than many people seem to imagine. I say look out for an outflow of information in these scientific fields in the near future.

Find this article at:



www.newscientist.com/article.ns?id=dn13769&print=true

I know to use a sunlamp for too much darkness, but what would people use do you think for magnetic induced depression? First thing that popped into my head were those pyramids people built back in the 70s to sleep in, but I doubt those would do any good.

What do you think might help them?

I have not a clue. Stupid logic concludes me to say that since in theory and with conclusive evidence from many people around the earth and my grandmother that since copper braclets protect against arthritis from geopathic stress that maybe using a similar technique would help. Maybe setting magnets at certain points on the body could "like the braclets and geopathic stress" interfere with the geomagnetic interference. Beats getting drugged...

Ah, like putting copper wires into structures to block wireless hacking.
Good idea.

Is there any evidence or theory on what causes the seasonal variations in electromagnetic fields?

Do you know if this is directly related to "ley lines" or if it affects their placement or intensity?

Sounds extremely dubious. You can find correlations between almost any two things, but it does not imply causality.

Also, there is no mechanism by which magnetism can affect humans, as far as I know.


Sunlamps make the skin produce vitamin D. It is not comparable to magnetism. And of course, you are baselessly assuming that magnetism does have some effect.

bogcreeper.... good post... I believe the earths (and sun) electromagnetic fields 'directly' affecting our moods and 'anything' that has an electric current/field ~ such as the human body, all our technology (from atm's to our living room lamp).... ever read Gregg Braden's work?

Why do you believe that?

Interesting, It wouldn't surprise me if this were true. After all, external influences is the reason we are who we are, and are what we are, and do what we do.

ok heres my thought about this topic
i have read somewhere that humans contains electricity, don't know how strong/weak it is
but if we do really contain electricity then magnets might have affect us in some way
as everyone knows magnets and electricity has something to do with each other

well just waiting for some thoughts
but keeping an open mind

Have not read it, guarantee that I will

It's a good hypothesis - with a major problem. We'd never be able to test it in a lab. You'd need to shield a control group from earth's B field for extended periods of time. We just can't pull that off.

That doesn't make any sense logically. Just because some other things influence our lives doesn't mean that magnetism does.

The net electrical charge of humans is zero. And it wouldn't even matter if it was more than that, because magnetism would not affect it. This is an argument from ignorance from your part.

Easy on the negativity bud. I have found that a lot of people on this board, close their minds if the science is not measurable. Notable scientists argue in the same way as both Einstein and other greats have been beat around for their theories, only to have them proven later. As far as the science goes, the greatest step in making a point valid is to find correlations that prove it's validity. Depression correlating with this geomagnetism may not be scientifically proven in the near future, but correlations are not a farce and few correlations are found to be non valid.

I didn't say magnetism does affect us, I said that I find this article Interesting and would not be surprised if it did. Im not trying to prove something here.

Your very offensive in this forum Wombat. But I guess thats just who you are.

A very interesting OP, Bogcreeper. I will have to check out your other thread about geopathic stress.

I think you nailed it when you said "look out for an outflow of information in these scientific fields in the near future." The near future is upon us with regard to natural and man-made energy fields. There have been numerous studies done to date. The geomagnetic field has been difficult to study because it's always fluctuating, as seen in graph below.



3 of many studies archived at PubMed.Gov:

Source

Source

Source

A large number of studies have identified significant physical, biological and health effects associated with changes in Solar and Geomagnetic Activity (S-GMA). Variations in solar activity, geomagnetic activity and ionospheric ion/electron concentrations are all mutually highly correlated and strongly linked by geophysical processes. A key scientific question is, what factor is it in the natural environment that causes the observed biological and physical effects? The effects include altered blood pressure and melatonin, increased cancer, reproductive, cardiac and neurological disease and death. Many occupational studies have found that exposure to ELF fields between 16.7 Hz and 50/60 Hz significantly reduces melatonin levels. They are also associated with the same and very similar health effects as the S-GMA effects. The cell membrane has an electric field of the order of 105 V/cm. The ELF brain waves operate at about 10-1 V/cm. Fish, birds, animalsand people have been shown to respond to ELF signals that produce tissue electric gradients of ULF/ELF oscillating signals at a threshold of 10-7 to 10-8 V/cm.This involves non-linear resonant absorption of ULF/ELF oscillating signals into systems that use natural ion oscillation signals in the same frequency range. A long-lived, globally available natural ULF/ELF signal, the Schumann Resonance signal, was investigated as the possible plausible biophysical mechanism for the observedS-GMA effects. It is found that the Schumann Resonance signal is extremely highly correlated with S-GMA indices of sunspot number and the Kp index. The physical mechanism is the ionospheric D-region ion/electron density that varies with S-GMA and forms the upper boundary of the resonant cavity in which the Schumann Resonance signal is formed. This provides strong support for identifying the Schumann Resonance signals as the S-GMA biophysical mechanism, primarily through a melatonin mechanism. It strongly supports the classification of S-GMA as a natural hazard. Source

The neurons involved in emotion, thinking, memory and reaction use oscillating calcium ion and neurotransmitter signals primarily in the frequency range below 50 Hz. The human EEG shares the same frequency range as a natural ELF signal, the Schumann Resonance, that propagate around the world with a diurnal and seasonal pattern that follows the human diurnal melatonin pattern. The intensity of the Schumann Resonance signal (frequencies between 6 and 50 cycles per second, specifically 7.8, 14, 20, 26, 33, 39 and 45 Hertz), with a daily variation of about +/- 0.5 Hertz, fluxes with Geomagnetic Activity (GMA) in a highly significantly correlated manner. Many animal studies find that ELF fields reduce melatonin. In 2001, more than 13 studies showed that people exposed to ELF fields have reduced melatonin. Since melatonin and serotonin are the primary circadian endocrine hormones, all vital organs, including the brain, hypothalamus, central nervous system, lymph system, immune system, heart, lungs, liver, kidneys, uterus, testes and fetus, have melatonin and serotonin receptors. Hence substances that alter the melatonin/serotonin balance can affect organs throughout the body.

I go into more detail in the links provided below. I’ve posted several studies showing the correlation of possible health risks when our bodies/brains are exposed and/or synchronize with these energy fields, both natural and man-made.

http://www.unexplained-mysteries.com/forum...p;#entry2221530

http://www.unexplained-mysteries.com/forum...p;#entry2224924

It's called reality.

What are you talking about? This is a purely falsifiable issue with a real truth value.

They were scientific theories - real science with evidence to back them.You're making crackpot guesses based entirely on ignorance with no evidence.

No. Correlation does not imply causation. Correlation by itself proves nothing.

Again, correlations do not imply causation. You can invent infinite correlations which do not imply causation.

Exactly. Why would you not be surprised? Because you are assuming that magnetism would affect us.

People on this forum generally hate logic.

[quote name='Inner Space' date='Apr 28 2008, 10:05 AM' post='2270044']
A large number of studies have identified significant physical, biological and health effects associated with changes in Solar and Geomagnetic Activity (S-GMA). Variations in solar activity, geomagnetic activity and ionospheric ion/electron concentrations are all mutually highly correlated and strongly linked by geophysical processes. A key scientific question is, what factor is it in the natural environment that causes the observed biological and physical effects? The effects include altered blood pressure and melatonin, increased cancer, reproductive, cardiac and neurological disease and death. Many occupational studies have found that exposure to ELF fields between 16.7 Hz and 50/60 Hz significantly reduces melatonin levels. They are also associated with the same and very similar health effects as the S-GMA effects. The cell membrane has an electric field of the order of 105 V/cm. The ELF brain waves operate at about 10-1 V/cm. Fish, birds, animalsand people have been shown to respond to ELF signals that produce tissue electric gradients of ULF/ELF oscillating signals at a threshold of 10-7 to 10-8 V/cm.This involves non-linear resonant absorption of ULF/ELF oscillating signals into systems that use natural ion oscillation signals in the same frequency range. A long-lived, globally available natural ULF/ELF signal, the Schumann Resonance signal, was investigated as the possible plausible biophysical mechanism for the observedS-GMA effects. It is found that the Schumann Resonance signal is extremely highly correlated with S-GMA indices of sunspot number and the Kp index. The physical mechanism is the ionospheric D-region ion/electron density that varies with S-GMA and forms the upper boundary of the resonant cavity in which the Schumann Resonance signal is formed. This provides strong support for identifying the Schumann Resonance signals as the S-GMA biophysical mechanism, primarily through a melatonin mechanism. It strongly supports the classification of S-GMA as a natural hazard. Source

The neurons involved in emotion, thinking, memory and reaction use oscillating calcium ion and neurotransmitter signals primarily in the frequency range below 50 Hz. The human EEG shares the same frequency range as a natural ELF signal, the Schumann Resonance, that propagate around the world with a diurnal and seasonal pattern that follows the human diurnal melatonin pattern. The intensity of the Schumann Resonance signal (frequencies between 6 and 50 cycles per second, specifically 7.8, 14, 20, 26, 33, 39 and 45 Hertz), with a daily variation of about +/- 0.5 Hertz, fluxes with Geomagnetic Activity (GMA) in a highly significantly correlated manner. Many animal studies find that ELF fields reduce melatonin. In 2001, more than 13 studies showed that people exposed to ELF fields have reduced melatonin. Since melatonin and serotonin are the primary circadian endocrine hormones, all vital organs, including the brain, hypothalamus, central nervous system, lymph system, immune system, heart, lungs, liver, kidneys, uterus, testes and fetus, have melatonin and serotonin receptors. Hence substances that alter the melatonin/serotonin balance can affect organs throughout the body.



WOW ~ What a Post 'Inner Space'.... Thank you for sharing ~ The comment .... "A large number of studies have identified significant physical, biological and health effects associated with changes in Solar and Geomagnetic Activity" ....and "The human EEG shares the same frequency range as a natural ELF signal (which is scarey in the respect of all those towers going up around us), the Schumann Resonance, that propagate around the world with a diurnal and seasonal pattern that follows the human diurnal melatonin pattern." ... is right on the mark! (I think I may want to share with you an experience that I have had that would knock your socks off.... but would never post it on this forum.

thanks very much for the info and data. When I recently found this information I had no idea that there would be so much data and relating evidence to support it. Many days of study and understanding ahead of me.

If you had any critical thinking skills, you would realize that that isn't evidence. All of it relies on irrelevant correlations.

Imagine that the sun is especially active I go into a city hospital during wartime.
1) A lot of people die
2) The sun is especially active
3) Therefore, the sun causes death.

This kind of thinking is a logical fallacy called non sequitur (does not follow). 1 and 2 might well be true, but 3 isn't necessarily true. Not only do you have to look critically at the facts, but also at the conclusions derived from the facts.

Also, just because it sounds scientific, it doesn't mean that it is. That kind of trash would not stand up to peer review in any refutable scientific journal.

Correlation do not imply causations I agree, but correlations let us take the next step to finding the truth. What do you mean there is no scientific evidence? Do some research before you make judgements and your a realist. I have known "realists" who are not arrogant and speak with a better more positive manner. Who are you to tell scientists that work in their field that their judgements do not have "real" science to back them up and have no real truth value? Your not a skeptic ... skeptics keep an open mind.

No, not necessarily.

That's exactly what I mean.

So what?

What does it matter who I am? If someone says that 1+1=3, they are wrong, reguardless of who they are or who I am.

I have an open mind. Unlike you, I attempt to follow evidence, logic and reason to find out the truth. Being close minded is to accept things unquestioningly for personal reasons. That's what you are doing.

And even if I did have a closed mind, what would it matter? 1+1=3 is still wrong, no matter how closed my mind is (it isn't).

opinions and assumptions with no scientific gumption. Anger is an weak emotion

I'd say that people would listen to you better without the "ego" rants and a calmer, more friendly disposition.

If my logic is indeed flawed, then provide some kind of counter-argument, instead of declaring it an ego-rant.

Wombat, with all due respect, I sympathise with your cause but in this case, Inner Space is doing some very good research and using the right tools which is more than I can say for some other claimants/claims on this forum.

Although it's early days, the research I-S has found is very interesting and granted many more properly controlled studies would have to be done to reach any conclusive grounds. At the moment it spells only a correlation but there could be some substance to it and it can be studied properly in the context of science.

I find this quite interesting...


You should take a look at her other thread - Does Our Brain/Environment Create God?, How can we know for certain it doesn't.. They are hypotheses at this stage imo, but they have a very good potential to turn into properly formed theories and/or further studies. It is good stuff. What she is trying to study is the influence of geomagnetic (and other man-made/natural) fields on our physiology, specifically the brain, and how they could possibly give rise, or at least in some cases be an instigator, to a number of phenomena usually classed as supernatural but all being natural ie. just in ones mind not actually existing in reality. In other words, alien abductions, ghost sightings, visions, god (delusion?) etc. could be just figments of imagination caused by fluctuations in these fields resonating with our natural brainwave fields. Although there may be other natural causes for these phenomena (including but not limited to neural dysfunction/disease etc.) what she has found could partly be responsible too, imo. We just need to do a lot more research.

Cheers

Humans do not have any particular electrical charge. We can charge ourselves up to be positively charged or negatively charged by scuffing our feet on the floor, by petting a cat on a dry day, by rubbing some kinds of plastic (a comb, for instance) or a rubber balloon in our hair. But we can just as easily discharge ourselves (ouch!) by touching something that conducts and has a different charge (like the Earth or something electrically connected to it, like water pipes).

As far as we know, nothing has a magnetic charge. There does not seem to be any evidence for the magnetic equivalent of an electrical charge, although the theories of physics are as far as I know consistent both with and without magnetically charged objects (we might learn some important things if we ever did observe a particle with a magnetic charge). These hypothetical particles are called "magnetic monopoles" and may be either North or South. All magnets we know of are at least "dipoles" -- they have a North and a South pole, and sometimes more than one of each. No monopoles have been observed, in spite of intense efforts to look for them. People also have essentially no magnetic dipole (the sort of paired North-South poles that ordinary magnets have.)

Nice wording. How much "if any" have you read on Dr. Michael Persingers Gods Helmet? He supposively has created a helmet that interferes with a persons natural geomagnetic fields to produce "delusions" much like the sense deprivation of caves and that associated with sacred sites. His counterpart Paul Deveraux has stated that these natural changes in the geomagnetic field only lets you see what is already there. Here is my point on these supernatural things being only in our heads and not reality. If two people saw a earthlight dancing in front of them, how could they be having the same delusion? Is "crazy" contagious? I have a really interesting attachment that was given to me by Dr. Michael Persinger somewhere that gets indepth about the God Delusion and geomagnetic phenomena. When I find it I will post it.

Thanks. I'll have to look into that, haven't heard of it. It's late here (4:40am) and I'm really tired but to this "If two people saw a earthlight dancing in front of them, how could they be having the same delusion" I would say that an appropriate detector (not necessarily of visible light) placed in that location should answer that question. If the detector does not detect it, it's a delusion.

Cheers

Whilst of course I support research on such ideas, this is all very dubious, seemingly consisting mostly of correlation. Which in itself may even be completely factual, but not enough to draw conclusions.

That's what I resist - the baseless assumptions that so many people are making.

Your the one assuming that I think it is affecting us, I never actually said that, you made it up yourself "Crazy people do that". I would not be surprised because theres plenty of other things that is affecting us, so yet another one no big surpries.

And why is this such a big deal for you anyways? Do you dislike that other people dont feel the way you do about things? Im open minded to this theory, you are sertently not. Parhaps you should keep it to yourself or go elsewhere if you cant debate this here in a rationally manner.

Thanks so much BlackFrost, and welcome to UM. I would love to here your experience if you care to share it with me via PM.



You welcome Bogcreeper, and thank you for your comments. The amount of studies/published research currently out there is mind-boggling, to say the least. I spend between 6 to 8 hours a day (sometimes more, scheduling permitting) doing research in this field, and it's been rather difficult to keep up. Also, I see you brought up Dr. Persinger. I have a great respect for his research and dedication to the neuroscience field. Here is a link to many of his studies.




ai-guardian Wow, thank you! I don't even know you, but I really appreciate you taking the time to read through my thread and for recommending it.

Oh, also for your kind comments and support.




Wombat, I understand where you're coming from. I was a skeptic at first, and still apply some healthy skepticism to help keep me objective. I work in the neuroscience field, and I am overwhelmed with the data(sometimes contradicting), however, as research continues, it is becoming apparent that the idea is not dubious. I think if you read the research yourself, you may come to the same conclusion, as many have already in the neuroscience field and beyond.

I agree with ai-guardian, research needs to continue, but scientist and physicians are no longer turning a blind eye to this anymore. The studies have got their attention.

Excellent, I hope it goes well

You're welcome I-S

Cheers

I echo your sentiments exactly but I believe I-S's assumptions are not entirely baseless

Cheers