Unexplained Mysteries Discussion Forums

Urisk

Jul 9 2006, 07:46 PM

QUOTE(Hotoke @ Jul 9 2006, 08:34 PM) [snapback]1263492[/snapback]

that is not the kind we are discussing, we are talking about the creatures from slavic folkore

Well in that train of thought- no there are no Vampires. Leastwise not the kind based upon, as you said "creatures from slavic folklore". Mind you, really every culture has their vampiric entity. So I don't see why it should be restricted to slavic mythology. Probably inspired by mundane, natural sources.

RKD

The Skeptic Eric Raven

Jul 9 2006, 07:46 PM

QUOTE(thecreeper @ Jul 9 2006, 02:44 PM) [snapback]1263504[/snapback]

simple my friend genetic modicaftion, you mix vampire bat DNA with a humans and you got a vampire, and I know this is possible

Vampire bats. Oh my god. So now they were mixing DNA thousands of years ago.

thecreeper

Jul 9 2006, 07:48 PM

QUOTE(ericraven2003 @ Jul 9 2006, 03:46 PM) [snapback]1263507[/snapback]

Vampire bats. Oh my god. So now they were mixing DNA thousands of years ago.

no, I am talking about recently

Hotoke

Jul 9 2006, 07:49 PM

QUOTE(Roadkill Demon @ Jul 9 2006, 09:46 PM) [snapback]1263506[/snapback]

Well in that train of thought- no there are no Vampires. Leastwise not the kind based upon, as you said "creatures from slavic folklore". Mind you, really every culture has their vampiric entity. So I don't see why it should be restricted to slavic mythology. Probably inspired by mundane, natural sources.

RKD

Common mistake, not every culture has myths about vampires

so far there is only the babylonian and slavic ones i encountered and their descriptions are very different. The only thing all these cultures have in common is that it drinks blood

SO they are not the same creature discussed here

QUOTE

simple my friend genetic modicaftion, you mix vampire bat DNA with a humans and you got a vampire, and I know this is possible

That is not how evolution works. This proofs you dont know anything

anyways. you ignored my post about the origin of vampires.

thecreeper

Jul 9 2006, 07:53 PM

QUOTE(Hotoke @ Jul 9 2006, 03:49 PM) [snapback]1263511[/snapback]

you ignored my post about the origin of vampires.

sorry

Urisk

Jul 9 2006, 09:11 PM

QUOTE(thecreeper @ Jul 9 2006, 08:44 PM) [snapback]1263504[/snapback]

simple my friend genetic modicaftion, you mix vampire bat DNA with a humans and you got a vampire, and I know this is possible

No you don't. You get nothing but a void pile of DNA. It's not as easy as that. Sure we've mapped out the human genome. The -pick a species... any species-

QUOTE(Hotoke @ Jul 9 2006, 08:49 PM) [snapback]1263511[/snapback]

Common mistake, not every culture has myths about vampires
so far there is only the babylonian and slavic ones i encountered and their descriptions are very different. The only thing all these cultures have in common is that it drinks blood

SO they are not the same creature discussed here

Essentially the most basic description of a vampire is a being that ingests blood. Now, if I remember correctly, in Norse legend trolls or giants (or one of these beasties) were sometiems told as drinking blood (maybe not quite feeding on though), while in Celtic lore, the Kelpie, Each Uisge and Kucklave all tend to have stories that revolve around blood-drinking, if I'm not mistaken. Also, you find legends of Azeman which is a female vampire, from Surinam (although this might have stemmed from slavic... dunno how though). If we're talking about vampires, not just of blood (as the subtitle points out) then the Japanese Baku can be described as a vampire of sorts as it feeds upon the bad dreams of humans, thus feeding off a part of our subconscious mind. Also, unless I'm also mistaken, the ancient Aztec/Inca sacrifices of blood were aimed at offereing Sotek the blood and heart of sacrificial victims in order for the son to rise. What would he do with the blood?
I mean I'm sure there's more... but vampires really aren't my thing.

RKD

frogfish

Jul 9 2006, 09:41 PM

QUOTE

No you don't. You get nothing but a void pile of DNA. It's not as easy as that. Sure we've mapped out the human genome. The -pick a species... any species-

If you just mix DNA, it won't recombine...

Just recombining DNA is 'complicated'.

Urisk

Jul 9 2006, 09:58 PM

Tell me about it! I remember doing practicals in 2nd and 3rd year at uni with strands of DNA and the buggers never did what they were told! Either that or my centrifuge technique was bad...

RKD

frogfish

Jul 9 2006, 10:00 PM

QUOTE

strands of DNA and the buggers never did what they were told! Either that or my centrifuge technique was bad...

Plasmid and Comsid hybes are the easiest

Ever had any luck with FISH? Its one of the easiest hybes...

Urisk

Jul 9 2006, 10:27 PM

It was mostly just microbial work. Making pellets of DNA and stuff I'm afraid. Can't remember much of it, although I suppose I could go and try draggin out all my old coursework. Would take a while though.

RKD

frogfish

Jul 10 2006, 12:30 AM

QUOTE

It was mostly just microbial work. Making pellets of DNA and stuff I'm afraid. Can't remember much of it, although I suppose I could go and try draggin out all my old coursework. Would take a while though.

Oh, I see...I do a range of work...Functional proteomics and genomics, bioinformatics, arrays, etc.

thecreeper

Jul 10 2006, 12:57 AM

QUOTE(frogfish @ Jul 9 2006, 08:30 PM) [snapback]1263816[/snapback]

Oh, I see...I do a range of work...Functional proteomics and genomics, bioinformatics, arrays, etc.

Iam not sure what this has to do with vampires so could we get back on topic

frogfish

Jul 10 2006, 12:59 AM

Fine, back on topic....Vamipres don't exist

thecreeper

Jul 10 2006, 01:00 AM

QUOTE(frogfish @ Jul 9 2006, 08:59 PM) [snapback]1263852[/snapback]

Fine, back on topic....Vamipres don't exist

your opinion, not fact, and no before you say it is, it is NOT FACT!

Hotoke

Jul 10 2006, 01:04 AM

QUOTE(Hotoke @ Jul 9 2006, 09:36 PM) [snapback]1263495[/snapback]

read The Real Vampire. Natural History by paul barber
Paul Barber (1990) offers an explanation of the origin of the vampire, however, that is perhaps grounded in truth. It is his contention that village people may have first conceived their notions of the undead from the actions of the real and unembalmed dead. The body does not lie still after death. There are movements of the fluids within the body and involuntary contractions of muscles even though the heart is no longer beating and the lungs are no longer pumping. Other movements of the corpse can be caused by the processes of decomposition itself or the actions of microorganisms that result in shifting organs. These are natural occurrences to the forensic scientist that even now may cause those without such knowledge to wonder if the death has really been complete. Most frightening of all, there may have been premature burials of people in deep comas who, before the prevalence of embalming, awakened in the grave under the crushing weight of the earth. Later, if they are exhumed, these dead who were not quite dead may show signs of having moved in their graves. Other exhumations have given evidence of a lack of decomposition of bodies long buried. Even for people who can account for this by the conditions of soil and climate, this may have been taken as a sign of continuing existence. Villagers in places of rural Greece still dig up the remains of the dead and look for such evidence.
Perhaps observations such as these were an origin of stories of those who do not die. But would they have led to ideas that these unfortunate creatures were evil? Barber and others suggest another way in which history may help us to understand the nature of the vampire in the stories that come from the villages of Europe, There were periods in all of Europe when contagious death was epidemic. The terrified people did not have the knowledge that we use today to understand the causes of such plagues. They would have been more likely to see them, as they were taught , to be the result of sin and evil. Death, it is still sometimes thought, can come from death. The evil dead were perhaps even more to be feared when a corpse was observed and evidence of continuing life was present. This fear had a positive side. It provided the tormented people with explanations, even scapegoats, that could stir action in relief of anxiety. Rulers and the clergy may have fostered these beliefs to avoid blame and reaffirm their authority in the midst of chaos. In this time of fear, if the vampire could represent a hope of life, it was not by becoming the loathsome creature but by providing a tangible agent whose destruction might conquer death itself.

frogfish

Jul 10 2006, 01:04 AM

QUOTE

your opinion, not fact, and no before you say it is, it is NOT FACT

Then what are you? Opinion

thecreeper

Jul 10 2006, 01:09 AM

QUOTE(frogfish @ Jul 9 2006, 09:04 PM) [snapback]1263860[/snapback]

Then what are you? Opinion

HUH?

psyche101

Jul 10 2006, 04:43 AM

QUOTE(thecreeper @ Jul 10 2006, 05:48 AM) [snapback]1263510[/snapback]

no, I am talking about recently

Recent Vampires. Good Lord. Where did that little gem come from?? Why on earth would someone try to attempt to make a Vampire. They are pretty lame by todays monster standards. Predator or Alien would shred it to bits. Be much cooler to make a Sully from Montsters inc. Much more marketable and easier to slot into today's society. Good worker too.

This is such a stupid notion, dead set - you do have a clear lid on your luchbox, don't you? DNA mix meh, can't even get the Mammoth clone up and running yet and you are talking Frankensteins? I reckon you have been trying to mate with a bat or small rodent-like animal and got caught out. This is your best excuse isn't it.

Blood is empty. One does not source nourishment from it. That is not opinion it is FACT. People cannot survive on blood only or they will suffer malnutrition. FACT. If one attempts to survive wholly on the blood of others, they will die sickly and prematurely.

The statement "Vampires do not exist" is fact, not opinion. Show me otherwise (one FACT proving the existance of this fantasy story creature) and I will be happy to admit that you were right in here

I get real narky when you come in here saying stuff like this is fact. We know it not, you know it is not but you feel this need to rile the Frogfish. No need to come in here and have the same arguments with him time and again filling the boards with useless stupid posts like "IS NOT" or "That's your opinion". Can't you get this crap of your chest in a PM with him? We don't really want to log and read 6 pages of this rubbish followed with an endless banter of "is not is so" over mermaids, hybrids, Werewolves/Vampires or any unlikely cause you find with an empty seat on the bandwagon.

capoeiranger

Jul 10 2006, 07:43 AM

Bio engineered vampires suits Hollywood movies!

I agree with Frogfish, as much as I have followed this forums and started to mad about cryptozoology as far as I was still on 6th grade when I had internet for the first time in my country, I uses these three simple ways to decide wheter a cryptids are real or fake (legends or myth based)
1. Photographic or recorded evidence in a clear or valid form, analyzed by valid experts and in abundance amount.
2. The expert scientist analyze the habitat and proof them possible to live there
3. Never judge the existence of a cryptid simply based on MY OWN argument, coz I know I know nothing still.

Here, I conclude that Frogfish fall into my catagory of experts, at least in this forum!

Therefore, back to the topic again, I simply agree that the mythological vampires are unreal!
My country is a very superstitious country, where ghost, goblins and vampires roam everyday lives and norms and possesed people are as easy to find everyday just like McDonald's!

Sorina

Jul 10 2006, 01:50 PM

Oh my god, I can NOT believe, that you guys are arguing about opinions here!

One advice to you all - GROW UP.

Aren't we supposed to discuss sophisticatedly here, or what?

The Skeptic Eric Raven

Jul 10 2006, 03:40 PM

QUOTE(Sorina @ Jul 10 2006, 08:50 AM) [snapback]1264444[/snapback]

Oh my god, I can NOT believe, that you guys are arguing about opinions here!

One advice to you all - GROW UP.

Aren't we supposed to discuss sophisticatedly here, or what?

Grow up. You are the one that believes in something that does not have a possiblility to exist. Whos the one that really needs to grow up?

thecreeper

Jul 10 2006, 03:49 PM

QUOTE(ericraven2003 @ Jul 10 2006, 11:40 AM) [snapback]1264570[/snapback]

Grow up. You are the one that believes in something that does not have a possiblility to exist. Whos the one that really needs to grow up?

you

The Skeptic Eric Raven

Jul 10 2006, 03:53 PM

QUOTE(thecreeper @ Jul 10 2006, 10:49 AM) [snapback]1264580[/snapback]

you

Mermaid says what?

coldethyl

Jul 10 2006, 03:56 PM

Ugh ya'll stop fighting.

Or at least make it an interesting one.

thecreeper

Jul 10 2006, 03:57 PM

QUOTE(ericraven2003 @ Jul 10 2006, 11:53 AM) [snapback]1264584[/snapback]

Mermaid says what?

okay, call the mental hopistal this guy is insane

capoeiranger

Jul 10 2006, 06:16 PM

Uhm...back to vampires, shall we?

Sweetpumper

Jul 10 2006, 06:26 PM

They exist. My neighbor is one and his roomate is a mummy.

thecreeper

Jul 10 2006, 06:43 PM

QUOTE(Sweetpumper @ Jul 10 2006, 02:26 PM) [snapback]1264735[/snapback]

They exist. My neighbor is one and his roomate is a mummy.

not,

The Skeptic Eric Raven

Jul 10 2006, 07:19 PM

QUOTE(Sweetpumper @ Jul 10 2006, 01:26 PM) [snapback]1264735[/snapback]

They exist. My neighbor is one and his roomate is a mummy.

Thats just the proof I need.

thecreeper

Jul 10 2006, 07:26 PM

QUOTE(ericraven2003 @ Jul 10 2006, 03:19 PM) [snapback]1264799[/snapback]

Thats just the proof I need.

dude, get real, his joking (very badly I might add)

Urisk

Jul 10 2006, 07:43 PM

QUOTE(frogfish @ Jul 10 2006, 01:30 AM) [snapback]1263816[/snapback]

Oh, I see...I do a range of work...Functional proteomics and genomics, bioinformatics, arrays, etc.

Yeah I could only stand one module of Genetics, although a lot of the microbial stuff incorporated genetics. Genetics practicals played about with DNA more but I didn't find it all that interesting to be honest. I tended to focus more on physiology, enviro bio and evo & devo, which is ironic really since genetics and heredity are both strong players in evolution

What!? well it's more of an interesting discussion than vampires anyways!

RKD

gryffin1

Jul 11 2006, 02:43 AM

lol sounds like one of my friends

jobot37

Jul 11 2006, 07:13 AM

QUOTE(ericraven2003 @ Jul 10 2006, 08:53 AM) [snapback]1264584[/snapback]

Mermaid says what?

This is wuite possibly the most ingenious statement I have read in the past twenty minutes or so...

Sorina

Jul 11 2006, 11:58 AM

QUOTE(ericraven2003 @ Jul 10 2006, 03:40 PM) [snapback]1264570[/snapback]

Grow up. You are the one that believes in something that does not have a possiblility to exist. Whos the one that really needs to grow up?

This has nothing to do with my opinions, I just said that shouldn't we be polite?

robbieb

Jul 11 2006, 01:13 PM

QUOTE(thecreeper @ Jul 9 2006, 04:29 PM) [snapback]1263282[/snapback]

unless, there DNA is different from normal

the dna being diffrent from normal will haven outhing to do with the nutrients that the human body needs to sustain itself that blood does not have so wow ur wrong

QUOTE(thecreeper @ Jul 9 2006, 04:38 PM) [snapback]1263292[/snapback]

right sure

, unless you have a PHD in genetics I can't take you seriously

how about a degree in zoolgoy?

QUOTE(thecreeper @ Jul 9 2006, 04:58 PM) [snapback]1263319[/snapback]

oh what most kids know at 11 grade, and frogfish for the most part you where wrong like oh i don't know the ti-liger thing I proved you wrong on that on

and what i knwo as a grad trumps ur 11th grade knowledge. next ti-ligers havent happend but i belive it is possible for it to happen li-ligers and ti-tigons happen and its just the extreme difrence and confusion that the tiger and liger would face that makes it so difficult to happen artifical insemenation could make it possible.

QUOTE(thecreeper @ Jul 9 2006, 07:40 PM) [snapback]1263499[/snapback]

uh dude, I am in the 10th grade I know more than a thing or two about bio, and a person with long K9 teeth and a need for blood sounds possible

who cares about long canines means nouthing just because u have longer then normal ones doesnt mean that u need to go bite people and everyone needs blood bro or else u die. no one needs to drink blood

QUOTE(thecreeper @ Jul 9 2006, 07:44 PM) [snapback]1263504[/snapback]

simple my friend genetic modicaftion, you mix vampire bat DNA with a humans and you got a vampire, and I know this is possible

dumb dumb dumb first off what would u be taking from the bat? its canies and need of blood? ok that still doesnt mean that a human body givien these genes would be able to survive off of blood.(and i dont think that the bat drinking blood is a gene its a instinct.)

QUOTE(Hotoke @ Jul 9 2006, 07:49 PM) [snapback]1263511[/snapback]

Common mistake, not every culture has myths about vampires
so far there is only the babylonian and slavic ones i encountered and their descriptions are very different. The only thing all these cultures have in common is that it drinks blood

SO they are not the same creature discussed here
That is not how evolution works. This proofs you dont know anything

anyways. you ignored my post about the origin of vampires.

original scriptures involving adam lilath and eve had lilath turning into a vampire liek creature and feeding off of adam and eve's kids blood so theres another one and theres more but it still doesnt mean there real at all i mean u dont see dragons flying around either

QUOTE(frogfish @ Jul 9 2006, 10:00 PM) [snapback]1263663[/snapback]

Plasmid and Comsid hybes are the easiest

Ever had any luck with FISH? Its one of the easiest hybes...

the coolest one was puting the jelly fish gene i nthe mouse that makes it glow in the dark

The Skeptic Eric Raven

Jul 11 2006, 03:27 PM

QUOTE(thecreeper @ Jul 10 2006, 02:26 PM) [snapback]1264819[/snapback]

dude, get real, his joking (very badly I might add)

Really.

snuffypuffer

Jul 11 2006, 08:29 PM

Umm, unless they're played by Gary Oldman, no.

~Onyx~

Jul 12 2006, 01:11 PM

QUOTE(snuffypuffer @ Jul 11 2006, 04:29 PM) [snapback]1266311[/snapback]

Umm, unless they're played by Gary Oldman, no.

Precisely....the "Hollywood Vampire" is a myth...a fabrication....a fanciful whimsy..nothing more.

isis-999

Jul 12 2006, 01:35 PM

Could a vampire really exist.... Well yes but only if your talking about the type that drink blood due to the fact they have a medical reason.....

There are no walking dead.......

~Onyx~

Jul 12 2006, 01:55 PM

QUOTE(isis-999 @ Jul 12 2006, 09:35 AM) [snapback]1267149[/snapback]

Could a vampire really exist.... Well yes but only if your talking about the type that drink blood due to the fact they have a medical reason.....

There are no walking dead.......

You are also correct, Vampyres(in a blood drinking sense) do exist...but it is not due to a medical problem, it is due to a craving or fetish...nothing more.....and there is DEFINITELY no walking dead...uless your refering to me after getting in the "doghouse" with my wife....DEAD-MAN-WALKING...

thecreeper

Jul 13 2006, 11:20 AM

QUOTE(isis-999 @ Jul 12 2006, 09:35 AM) [snapback]1267149[/snapback]

There are no walking dead.......

well, I never thought vampires were the undead, that part is not real

~Onyx~

Jul 13 2006, 01:05 PM

QUOTE(thecreeper @ Jul 13 2006, 07:20 AM) [snapback]1268414[/snapback]

well, I never thought vampires were the undead, that part is not real

So what exactly do you believe today's Vampyre to be?

thecreeper

Jul 13 2006, 01:46 PM

QUOTE(Onyxdk @ Jul 13 2006, 09:05 AM) [snapback]1268503[/snapback]

So what exactly do you believe today's Vampyre to be?

people who have a need to drink blood and have sharp caine

~Onyx~

Jul 13 2006, 02:02 PM

QUOTE(thecreeper @ Jul 13 2006, 09:46 AM) [snapback]1268526[/snapback]

people who have a need to drink blood and have sharp caine

Now firstly, I don't want you to feel as if I'm talking down to you beacuse that is not the case or my intention.....that being said....the "need" to drink blood by the Vampyre of today is not a "need" at all...just a "want"...it is not medicinal in nature. Today's Vampyre also does not take blood by force, they have willing "donors" who supply them with blood...it is a bit of a "sub-culture". If any Vampyre of today has elongated canines it is beacuse they have had their teeth ground into fangs by a dentist or are wearing "caps" or "extensions"....I have yet to meet anyone who could prove to me that their pointed teeth were something that they were born with.

Hope these facts help you with your understanding.

thecreeper

Jul 13 2006, 02:08 PM

QUOTE(Onyxdk @ Jul 13 2006, 10:02 AM) [snapback]1268542[/snapback]

Now firstly, I don't want you to feel as if I'm talking down to you beacuse that is not the case or my intention.....that being said....the "need" to drink blood by the Vampyre of today is not a "need" at all...just a "want"...it is not medicinal in nature. Today's Vampyre also does not take blood by force, they have willing "donors" who supply them with blood...it is a bit of a "sub-culture". If any Vampyre of today has elongated canines it is beacuse they have had their teeth ground into fangs by a dentist or are wearing "caps" or "extensions"....I have yet to meet anyone who could prove to me that their pointed teeth were something that they were born with.

Hope these facts help you with your understanding.

it helps me understand that you are clearly ingoring eyewitness's

~Onyx~

Jul 13 2006, 02:18 PM

QUOTE(thecreeper @ Jul 13 2006, 10:08 AM) [snapback]1268549[/snapback]

it helps me understand that you are clearly ingoring eyewitness's

Not at all...I am merely relaying MY eyewitness accounts....and questions....and research for the past year. What "eyewitnesses" are you refering to? and please do not mention anything to me about books that were written about monsters that have been "documented" since the days of Vlad and Elizabeth Bathory etc....those types of Vampires are fiction.

thecreeper

Jul 13 2006, 02:28 PM

QUOTE(Onyxdk @ Jul 13 2006, 10:18 AM) [snapback]1268558[/snapback]

What "eyewitnesses" are you refering to? and please do not mention anything to me about books that were written about monsters that have been "documented" since the days of Vlad and Elizabeth Bathory etc....those types of Vampires are fiction.

no, I was not, I just saying there are a lot of people and OTHER NONFICTION books you are ingorning

~Onyx~

Jul 13 2006, 02:39 PM

QUOTE(thecreeper @ Jul 13 2006, 10:28 AM) [snapback]1268571[/snapback]

no, I was not, I just saying there are a lot of people and OTHER NONFICTION books you are ingorning

Who?

thecreeper

Jul 13 2006, 02:41 PM

QUOTE(Onyxdk @ Jul 13 2006, 10:39 AM) [snapback]1268584[/snapback]

Who?

look, this debate is getting no where ,so can we agree to disagree?

~Onyx~

Jul 13 2006, 03:07 PM

QUOTE(thecreeper @ Jul 13 2006, 10:41 AM) [snapback]1268588[/snapback]

look, this debate is getting no where ,so can we agree to disagree?

Absolutey....I just don't think that we "disagree" per say, I just have first-hand information that some who have not had the chance to interact with "today's Vampyre" are not privy to. Remember my friend, education on all things has to start from a beginning....for example....do you really believe that the people who invented "colleges" went to college????....that would be no....therefore, what would be their grounds for claiming that they could "educate" anybody?.....just an example...

.