When I was a young child, I have regularly seen a vision that was coming back to me from time to time. It was in the night and I considered it a memory of the past lives of my soul.

I saw a big forecourt and several ashlar stones on it that seemed to be moving by themselves. It looked like if some supernatural power was manipulating with them using an anti-gravity field and the power piled up the stones to a line on the forecourt. I was afraid of that power, which could so esily move the big stones and so I named for myself the forecourt "a forecourt of a terror" because of my fear from it.

The question is if you believe that human powers could build such giant pyramides that we know today or if they were build up by extraterrestrials.

I believe they were built by men and their Gods.

This isn't to say they couldn't have been built by aliens. It there were aliens then that would intercede then it would seem they'd still be around or at the very least visit once in a while.

The Pyramid Texts strongly imply that they were the result of men and gods. I won't argue with those who were there and saw it and even helped. While there's plenty enough untranslatable words to fit in aliens there really needs to be a lot more evidence than simply that they could have existed.

I see no reason not to believe in the Extraterrestrial authorship theories. None at all.

It would seem the fact that truly plausible sounding theories of how they were
built with primitive technology have not been advanced is a very remarkable
piece of evidence that there might be alien intervention. Why are there no de-
pictions of how they were built and references to "hidden places"? Actually if I
put a little thought into it I could probably come up with quite a few more good
reasons.

I don't believe it but until it is shown how they were built and some proof to sup-
port it, the pyramid will remain a 6 1/2 million ton albatross around the neck of
egyptology.

The building itself represents 'power' not of greed (well in some cases yes...but something more) it is the key to balance and a symbol that holds many valuable meanings. For this I believe it was built for the sake of humanity into a higher spirtuality, even though there was great suffering among the people from that suffering came salvation and creativity springing life into repression. Thus the triangle reaching out showing the connectedness between one another and the power of a higher being through healing.

Pyramides occur in more parts of the world and where they occur there are also historic texts witnessing a higher alien-like impact. But who knows what the aliens are doing now and where they are founding themselves.

what historic texts are you pertaining to?

Thhe areas where pyramids are found are egypt and its derivatives in sudan(ancient nubia), south america and china (these are burial mounds).

There are no so called historc texts indicating the so called alien-like impacts!

...hmm devils advocate eh, well about the pyramids being built in the time they say, that could be wrong, but could man have done it is the question?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lRRDzFROMx0

it aint' a pyramid, but does make one wonder indeed, given enough time the egyptians could have built the pyramids, though that does throw out the major consensus that it was a tomb built during the time of such said pharoah, doesn't it...

the whynsos ya can't have ya cake and eat it too...else ya won't have any cake silly

Many ancient texts speak about weapons and gods that remind alien-like creatures that were operating here, but the word "alien" was not there mentioned. Myths and legends about Beings coming from Pleiades, old Asian dragon-like creatures (possibly also space-ships), Indian Gods etc. It all reminds us that "they" were here so they also could build up the pyramides.

Actually you are wrong on all counts. The pyramids were built by thousands of egyptians.

http://www.nationalgeographic.com/pyramids/pyramids.html

http://www.touregypt.net/construction/

http://www.communityhigh.org/old/pyramids/...mltheories.html

http://www.catchpenny.org/howbuilt.html

http://www.wyattmuseum.com/how-the-pyramids-were-built.htm

http://www.rediff.com/news/2006/dec/01look.htm

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/...80328104302.htm

http://www.kingtutone.com/pyramids/building/


etc. etc. etc. etc.


Try using google.

LOL

Since we still can't construct a pyramid today, with modern technology I can't understand why people swallow that load of horsefeathers that orthodox Egyptology hands out. It's not just placing blocks like a kid would. It's the advanced engineering that was needed to know HOW to place the blocks and WHERE. These people supposedly were only at the Bronze age for tools, but yet SOMEHOW, the engineers could mastermind a building that can't be built with the technology of 2008. Yeah right.

And alien intervention is a more plausible explanation?

And where do you get the idea that we couldn't build the pyramids with modern technology? That's a load of 'Horsefeathers'

Try reading some of those web sites i posted. Either that or stay blissfully ignorant.

Pyramidiocy is characterized by having an outlandish, farfetched theory about the origin, nature or purpose of the Egyptian pyramids. The theories of pyramidiots are barely supported by slender threads of evidence. They serve little purpose except to stand as bad examples of speculative thought and fanciful imagination.

Some pyramidiots, such as Erich von Däniken and Zecharia Sitchin, claim that the ancient Egyptians were too backwards to have constructed the pyramids without the help of extraterrestrials. Edgar Cayce claimed that beings from Atlantis helped the Egyptians build the pyramids by showing them how to levitate stones. Charles Berlitz claimed that Atlantis lay beneath the Bermuda Triangle and had a pyramid the same size as the Great Pyramid at Giza.* Pyramidiots think Atlantis is the link between the pyramids of Egypt and the pyramids of Mexico. They are not dissuaded by the fact that the one was primarily funerary while the other was primarily used for ceremonies, including some which involved human sacrifice. Arguments demonstrating that the ancient Egyptians or Mexicans were intelligent and resourceful enough to build pyramids are to no avail.

Other pyramidiots ascribe super technological or paranormal powers to the ancient Egyptians. Traditional explanations in terms of religion, tombs for pharaohs and their families, belief in immortality, slave labor or paid workers, slipways, canals, etc. are rejected by pyramidiots in favor of theories claiming that the pyramids were power stations or water pumps.

Some pyramidiots claim that the pyramids were built according to some sort of mystical numerology to contain coded messages. Some believe that the Great Pyramid at Giza is at the center of the world. Some think the pyramids are a map of the heavens. Mystical mathematical notions about the pyramids abound. Some believe only God could have designed such a numerical mystery. Still others have believed that razor blades could be kept perpetually sharp by being placed under a pyramid of the same proportions as the Great Pyramid at Giza (by focusing cosmic energy and realigning crystals in steel!). That almost anything in the universe can be found to have interesting mathematical proportions or be related to several interesting mathematical formulae is of little interest to pyramidiots.

Some pyramidiots think pyramids have healing power and are foci of spiritual energy. That there is no evidence for such beliefs seems to cheer rather than dishearten pyramidiots.

No. Alien intervention is certainly not more plausible but just making
up means to build it with how you'd do it with ancient technology doesn't
get it built. You can talk about men struggling with the weight of 2 1/2
ton stones but it's a lot different to do it.

I'd love to see all the Egyptologist in the world plus anyone they can hire
raise even one single 2 1/2 ton stone to the top of the Great Pyramid.
I'd wager thay can't do it using ANY of the methods they suggest.

This is ONE STONE.

The Egyptians used 2 1/2 million stones.

Who says we cannot build it, or is our society just to freaking lazy? Come on, those weren't built overnight it took time and lots and lots of slaves. But seeing how a good portion of the world frowns upon brutal slavery (because there is still tons of slavery) it would be harder to construct that.

Back then you worked, built shelters, eat, drank, and education. There was not tv and other electronic equipment to distract, such as cars. From these distractions it takes longer time for people to do things because they are off in many locations. All of these people were in one common area, and worked together all the time. Now we have labor laws, they worked constantly most which cannot grasp a hold of because the work ethic in this younger generation just isn't here.

You want to say that it has to be advanced technology, some aliens to have built it, but you fail to see that it was just sweat and blood into the making of such things. If it isn't a building isn't built in a few years today the public gets all antsy and annoyed. Buildings back then, just churches took hundreds and hundreds of years to build, again most don't even comprhend why someone would build something they are never even going to see in their lifetime.

I think the patience factor alone as a lot to do with it

The 'alien' they might speak of only consists of a 'higher power' that runs through all of us, but touches only those who realize the freedom of it, hence why all the events happened the way they did, someone saw it, understood it and changed perceptions

LOL

And no evidence of ramps or burials seems to just reinforce egyptologists' claim, as well.

Let me ask this; How tall would one of these have to have been before you looked at it
and thought that it couldn't possibly be built by dragging around stones in the desert sun?

Seriously. How big?

Since Harte isn't around on weekends, I'm going to throw out what he would almost certainly say: Yes we can build a pyramid today. We just don't have a reason to. You saying that we can't doesn't make it true, any more than your claims that there aren't feasible explanations to how the pyramids were built is true.

--Jaylemurph

If I were Joe Q. Egyptian and I thought the living embodiment of god on Earth really wanted me to do it, size wouldn't matter very much. But then, whips are persuasive that way.

And -- coincidentally -- is "dragging around stones in the desert sun" as you say really so complicated it needs super-advanced aliens to do it?

--Jaylemurph

Wouldn't it be more efficient to just use a fresh crew every few hours.

The pyramids were not built with slaves. All these other things you
mention are irrelevant or red herrings.

There are things that are known as facts. There are things that are
left by the builders. If you really study this material you will see that
traditional explanations and the facts are at odds. Traditional expla-
nations also leave mysteries. ...mysteries and the inexplicable are
everywhere. Details are simply written off with the stroke of a pen.

Egyptology is primarily a 19th century science that has not kept up with
the times. Is it right? It's not out of the question but the evidence
points elsewhere.

If they want to be taken seriously they'll have to use the available
technology to study these and quit worrying about what they might learn.

You obviously didn't look at any of those webs sites i posted, so i'll just paste an extract from the Natgeo site. :-

Who Built the Pyramids?

Contrary to some popular depictions, the pyramid builders were not slaves or foreigners. Excavated skeletons show that they were Egyptians who lived in villages developed and overseen by the pharaoh's supervisors.

The builders' villages boasted bakers, butchers, brewers, granaries, houses, cemeteries, and probably even some sorts of health-care facilities—there is evidence of laborers surviving crushed or amputated limbs. Bakeries excavated near the Great Pyramids could have produced thousands of loaves of bread every week.

Some of the builders were permanent employees of the pharaoh. Others were conscripted for a limited time from local villages. Some may have been women: Although no depictions of women builders have been found, some female skeletons show wear that suggests they labored with heavy stone for long periods of time.

Graffiti indicates that at least some of these workers took pride in their work, calling their teams "Friends of Khufu," "Drunkards of Menkaure," and so on—names indicating allegiances to pharaohs.

An estimated 20,000 to 30,000 workers built the Pyramids at Giza over 80 years. Much of the work probably happened while the River Nile was flooded.

Huge limestone blocks could be floated from quarries right to the base of the Pyramids. The stones would likely then be polished by hand and pushed up ramps to their intended positions.

It took more than manual labor, though. Architects achieved an accurate pyramid shape by running ropes from the outer corners up to the planned summit, to make sure the stones were positioned correctly. And priests-astronomers helped choose the pyramids' sites and orientations, so that they would be on the appropriate axis in relation to sacred constellations.

From stone pusher to priest, every worker would likely have recognized his or her role in continuing the life-and-death cycle of the pharaohs, and thereby in perpetuating the glory of Egypt.

Really!?!

You could look at a 10,000 foot tall pyramid and say they obviously were
committed to building a great pyramid?

There's a story of Pancho Vila while returning from one his raids in the US
and having his handcar derail. All the men went out to pick it up and put
it back on the track but they couldn't budge it. He pulled half the men off
and the remaining men tried again. Still they couldn't move it. He again
pulled half the men off and the remaining men easily picked it up and set
it on the track.

This is nature. With no offense intended it is a phenomena that most peo-
ple who think for a living rather than work just can't seem to grasp, but it
is real.

Imagine a long cylinder that can easily be carried by four men. as you
continually double the weight you soon get to the point that it's impossible
to carry because you can't get enough men on it to support it.

It's the same way with the Great Pyramid and all the early pyramids;
they are simply too large to have been built by men and animal hauling
stones round. A two mile tall pyramid is a simple absurdity but I'd guess
you hit this point at about 200'. The pyramid is more than 10x this size.

If these guys were so motivated by their love and fear of the king or the
whip then how do you explain the fact that pyramids suddenly stopped
being so large. It was so sudden that they stopped right in the middle of
the last great pyramid. Were they suddenly not afraid of the king any
\longer. Was their allegiance suddenly distracted to their gods? There's
no evidence of a sudden change in the religion so why a sudden change
in their religious practices. Can you imagine the heartbreak of the archi-
tects and workers in having to stop on a pyramid they'd worked so hard
on.

No!!! A thousand times no. You can't just say something is real because
you don't know any other way. You might use it as a tentative hypothesis
but it is never a fact. This came out of 19th century science, not 20th or
21st.

While I think given human ingenuity we could construct a pyramid this guy here did some impressive lifting himself http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lRRDzFROMx0 I do think that of course today we could with "TODAYS" technology create the pyramid, what I would like to see is even a small version from start to finish actually constructed today using the supposed method of the egyptians or the one this guy employs, forget time scales, I just wanna see if it can be done at least on a small scale. Because there is nothing more embarrasing watching shows where they start out using primitive techniques but usually abandon one ancient tool for a modern one and "assume" that it was done and keep moving, kinda defeats the purpose. But all in all I think we could have done it, what it was for, well....

the whynsos chimes in during the time of awakening

Please read my post then I'll respond to your next one.

An answer would be appreciated but is hardly necessary.

So which 'theory do you go along with? Aliens, telekenisis, giants, the invention & subsquent loss of 'the anti-gravity machine'?

The spokemen for the Indiana Limestone Producers said they'd need 10 years
to ramp up production to the point thay could supply stone for a pyramid. There
would also need to be a huge infrastructure investment to get the stone out of
central Indiana. Railbeds would also need a great deal more maintenance with
so much freight traveling on them.

Of course you realize that this is the largest producer of limestone in the world.
They use electricity, gas, and all sorts of modern technology as do the railroads.

And this is just to get the stone. If you think stacking it is the easy part then you're
only partly right. With modern cranes we could achieve a pretty good delivery
rate but many of these would wear out. Cranes can be disassembled and lifted
higher.

To put it mildly, such a project would be a strain with modern technology.

Okay, buddy I can gurantee you that some of them WERE built with slaves, you cannot tell me that all hundreds of them said HEY LETS build a pyramid and it's going to be dandy. No, they were whipped and beaten to build this, and did they care if they died hell no they had more people. Just because it is large and looks mysterious...doesn't mean it was built by aliens...if you cannot see human hardship and torture being put into it as well, then you've had a very sheltered life.

Just like my Uncle who went over to China recently because he is an engineer and saw their hardhats the construction workers were wearing and couldn't believe himself. Telling us well they've obviously don't care if they die, because they have millions more to replace with, sad but true. Brought back one of the hats themselves, might has wear nothing with that on.

It might not matter what I think since I might well be wrong.


What we need to do is apply the technology we have to the question.


I believe they had counterweights and filled them with water under pressure to lift the stones. This was likely the same method used at most of the megalithic sites where large stones were lifted.

I agree. There were lots of pyramids and lots of techniques, etc.

I suspect that there is a very low probability that they were built by aliens but until there is evidence I refuse to rule it out.

Ya but what is your definition of an 'alien'. The US in some parts of the society term 'alien' as a person who is from Mexico and comes to the US...because they are 'foriegn' but they are still people. Some think aliens are in no way real, but believe in 'some God'. Maybe that belief is an 'alien' it is not physical, but a rather mental concept that helps the mind to grow. Have you ever thought of it in that way? Maybe it was some sort of determination that other cultures would deem 'alien' because of their values.

''I suspect that there is a very low probability that they were built by aliens but until there is evidence I refuse to rule it out.''

Or equally as valid ''i refuse to rule out fairies living at the bottom of my garden until there is evidence that they don't.''

I don't understand this sentance at all.
How can there be evidence of something that there is no evidence of?

I never suggested it would be easy, but nothing you mention makes it /impossible/.



Can I see some back-up for this?

--Jaylemurph

To clarify the meaning;

''I suspect that there is a very low probability that they were built by aliens but until there is evidence of exactly how they were built I refuse to rule it out.''

This is from Lehner that I just posted;

http://www.world-destiny.org/or/marklehner.htm

It's big, old, and mysterious. That sets it up for Aliens right there.

Built by aleins ? No I dont think so. Built by man? No it was built by people many people.
Were they stones lifted and placed into position? Hard to say for sure but a study was done not to long ago and it was found the limestone was not consistant with block cut from the earth. It looked more like it had been poured as cement is made.
I dont know anything anymore than you guys do but look into whats called Coral Castle here is the link:
http://www.crystalinks.com/coralcastle.html
This man once claimed he knew the answers to how the pyramides were built. He wrote a book on magnetics that is still for sale but you can do a search and Goggle has a link a man posted it upo for free in a pdf format. You can tell from reading it he had some education but not enough to be called a scientific mind. He had spent some time with magnetic fields or maybe just plain old magnets. But he figured out a few things that he felt strongly enough about to write about.
Could he have found a way to transport these large stones with a simple magnetic field ??? I dont know but I have heard everything has a source of being magnetic in its own aspect. Even plastic can appear to be magnetic with static elctricity. Theres the word "Electricity" The Bagdad Battery you ever heard of that one?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baghdad_Battery
Check that out.

Built by aleins ? No I dont think so. Built by man? No it was built by people many people.
Were they stones lifted and placed into position? Hard to say for sure but a study was done not to long ago and it was found the limestone was not consistant with block cut from the earth. It looked more like it had been poured as cement is made.
I dont know anything anymore than you guys do but look into whats called Coral Castle here is the link:
http://www.crystalinks.com/coralcastle.html
This man once claimed he knew the answers to how the pyramides were built. He wrote a book on magnetics that is still for sale but you can do a search and Goggle has a link a man posted it upo for free in a pdf format. You can tell from reading it he had some education but not enough to be called a scientific mind. He had spent some time with magnetic fields or maybe just plain old magnets. But he figured out a few things that he felt strongly enough about to write about.
Could he have found a way to transport these large stones with a simple magnetic field ??? I dont know but I have heard everything has a source of being magnetic in its own aspect. Even plastic can appear to be magnetic with static elctricity. Theres the word "Electricity" The Bagdad Battery you ever heard of that one?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baghdad_Battery
Check that out.

Mysterious sets it up to be investigated. If no one has figured this out in
4500 years then just maybe it's a little more complicated than on its face.

If you want to believe in aliens that's your right but I think we ought use
21st century science to try to prove one theory or another. Even if that
means that there were ramps or aliens.

This is why I'm so interested in showing this is definitely right or wrong.

If this is natural limestone as set down on seabed then it implies something
much different than if it's cement or naturally deposited stone.

Of course without knowing how it was built it's pretty difficult to know how
many people would be required.

Did I ever mention that a "saw palace" is referred to in the Pyramid Texts".
This might imply something by itself. Exactly what I'm not certain.

Summary:

Consider everything. Buy nothing.

Some of them could have been somehow built by people, but some surely not. Perhaps the first ones were built by extraterrestrials whereas the later ones by people who wanted to imitate the extraterrestrial's work. But who exactly knows all the details.

lol...excellent advise

the whynsos

I totally agree with Cladking. The orthodox theory is not logical. It doesn't have to be that "aliens" built it, but even if they did, so what?
It just could be that mankind is way, way older than - again - orthodox science is admitting. The theory is - that we have de-volved and have tried to copy what came before without the success.

Jalemurph has said there's no reason to build a pyramid. Yes there is. To PROVE it can be done. But it can't because Lehner tried it and couldn't do it. Why is this fact always conveniently ignored by folks like Jaylemurph - who in MY opinion, is paid to be on this forum to refute any theory that comes along?

I would point out, Qoais, that "unlogical" is not a synonym for "things I happen not to like". Perhaps you could walk us through a particular theory and tell us why it's illogical. In fact, maybe you could point out which one is the "orthodox theory"; as I understand it, there are several competing theories.



I take it you're going to foot the bill for it? Cladking was wrong when he said it'd be impossible to build one, but right when he said it's be difficult and expensive.

--Jaylemurph

I believe the only time I said it was impossible today was in my first
thread here on the topic (how the pyramids were built). I meant only
that with all our knowledge we could not duplicate this effort today. It
would take a very long time to redevelop the knowledge and tools they
used.

If you don't use it you lose it and this is true for most everything.

In a very real sense it is impossible today.

I think it is only desirable to build something of that stature if it is for a reason other than to please someone's ego. Such a monument has to be a message of some kind, rather than simply be an architectural and engineering marvel. If that is all the Great Pyramid is, then it was a huge waste of time and effort, in my opinion. That is why I always resonated more towards why the Pyramid may have been built rather than how. Obsessing over how it was built is akin to being in front of the Mona Lisa and pondering on what kinds of brushes and paint it took to create, along with the size and makeup of the canvas, etc. Almost pointless, IMO. The message is where it's at. The real wonder, as with all things in life, usually tends to be in the why of things.

Sometimes. But imagine how you would live if you've got the answer to all your "why's". Then one's life starts to be really strange but at least you don't wonder the things that happen around you as much as most of other people do.

I agree a great deal.

But in this case you're taking something familiar; we know the nature of art
and we know the nature of artists and their tools. I would maintain the the
pyramids are wholly alien to us. If they were mere monuments on a human
scle then we might not be concerned about the minutia of their construction.

They don't appear to be built on a human scale. The concepts of manually
moving and lifting such vast quantities of stone and doing it where smaller
structures would suffice is simply incredible. Add to this the fact that many
very knowledgeable people say it can't be done with any of the suggested
means and suddenly how they were built becomes an important issue. There's
every chance that answering this question will shed light on other very impor-
tant questions as well. Perhaps we can't know why they were built until we
know how they were built.

As the observer is unto himself...

So that's two mysteries staring each other in the face.

It's always been expensive, nothing has changed there. Lehner had the money, he had the tools, he had the skilled artisans, and.....what? He couldn't do it. It was only a small model, a pile of blocks really, not with the extensive engineering required to build a full scale pyramid, and they couldn't get it done with modern equipment. Helloooooo.

What you're implying Jaylemurph, is that the ancients DID have the technology to build these megaliths (which is obvious because they exist) but that we're all ignorant and stupid enough to believe the technology was bronze age when like I already said, the technique has defeated modern technology. Why do you keep beating that dead horse?



I totally agree. Many have tried to duplicate the feat and failed. So why can't orthodox science face these facts, and move on?