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Kellalor
Subtitled! Its just not worth watching otherwise. thumbsup.gif

Hmmm, did I spell dubbed and subbed right? dontgetit.gif
Oh well.
Seraphina
It depends on the company doing the dubbing...

Until very recently, there has been this persistance in the states that "anime is a cartoon", and the tendancy is to not take it very seriously at all. I've sometimes been given the impression that some of the VAs they use are people they found by looking out of the window at casting time, and saying: "See that person at the bus stop? Ask them if they want this part."

In Japan, however, voice acting is considered a very serious and respectable career, and anime is a huge part of the culture; there are long running soap operas on a par with our own Coronation Street or East Enders that are entirerly animated tongue.gif Therefore it's no surprise that a far creator attempt to produce a well acted film is made.

A lot of imported anime dubbings have been...questionable at best.

However, the trend is changing grin2.gif With the market growing, most companies are starting to realise how much money is to be made from anime, and are making more of an attempt to dub it well. Recent releases like Full Metal Panic, Excell Saga (although obviously, it's hammed up beyond belief because of it's genre), Noir, Najika Blitz Tactics...as well as old classics like Trigun, Burnup Excess, and Tenchi (although granted, most of the supporting cast in Tenchi...with the exception of Kagato...were absolute Turkeys) and others have actually had some very good voice actors all round.

Overall, I prefer seeing things in dub for the most part...the only situations which I can remember finding the dub so unbearably aweful that I had to watch the Japanese version were the two most recently released DBZ movies (man did they butcher Brolly with that horrible dub...) and Azumanga Dio (absolutely amazing series...just...the dub kills it stone dead).

Since we're on the subject, here's bad dubbing at its worst...

In Japanese

Picollo: ....You're a monster...

Brolly (with saddistic grin): ...Monster?...heh....No...I'm the devil.

In English blink.gif

Picollo: (can't recall the exact line...something like: "What an animal...")

Brolly: Of course...what do you expect...from a true freak!



...what the hell is that!? blink.gif
aquatus1
I agree that Sub is the way too go...99%of the time.

Still though, I love accents, and when a character has an accent, I just fall in love with it. I watch Evangelion in English just to hear Asuka's German accent. I was very disappointed with the new Secret of Blue Water, because they did away with Nadia's French accent.
Angelfish
I prefer dubbed, just cus I like to know what's going on and subtitles confuserate me **remembers watching MKR** mmmhmm...
chico del nacho
QUOTE
"anime is a cartoon"

yup
Seraphina
QUOTE
yup


No, no it's not tongue.gif By cartoon, I mean the genre of entertainment...while both are animations, cartoons are not anime, and anime are not cartoons wink2.gif

Anime is its own distinct genre, very seperate from the cartoony animation of the west. Anime, with its near infinite variety, caters to just about any demographic imaginable and, when taken seriously by dubbing companies and marketing, the only real difference between it and a live action movie is that one just happens to use animations for its characters.

However, there was this enduring idiocy in the west that anything animated must be intended for children: i.e. a catroon. Anime was therefore not taken very seriously at all, neither in what was actually imported (Pokemon!!?) or the effort put into the voice acting, or the aquisition of half decent talent.

That's changing...but some companies still do really smeg up their dubs huh.gif *coughs*blueocean*coughs*

Companies that can usually be trusted to make good dubs are Pioneer (although they're recently changed their name), ADV, and most of those that are coming to the forfront right now.
chico del nacho
i just see all things animated as being cartoons *shrug*

i'm not saying it's all childish. as there are childish anime along with adult ones, there is also adult cartoons with childish ones.

anime isn't really an untouchable amount of seriousness. but i like how it's far reaching int hat there's something for everyone, like ya say.
buggyelfmaiden
QUOTE (chico del nacho @ May 16 2004, 05:44 PM)
QUOTE
"anime is a cartoon"


NONONO Anime has a plot... Cartoons don't...

Oops... blush.gif I didn't mean it that way... But Seraph got it... Heheheh

*Thinks she should hush now*

Though I prefere the subs because some of the Japanese VAs... *Purs and fans herself* Hot...

The American VA's need help... But it would help if Animation was taken more seriously here in the states.

The only real animation studio we have is *Cough*Disney*Cough* And they butcher everything they put their hands on.
Xenojjin
The only anime I ever watched in which case I liked the dub was hellsing .


Everything else however ( such as the DBZ bullsh*t of a dub ) is almost always crap dubbing . disgust.gif
Seraphina
Xeno - you should keep an eye out for some of the newer releases I mentioned above thumbsup.gif You might be pleasantly surprised grin2.gif The VAs are not only pretty good, but there's actually an active attempt nowadays to make as direct translation as possible from the japanese script.

buggyelfmaiden
Totally agree with you on Azumanga...

Osaka seemed... well. too smart for Osaka in the dub

*Watches Osaka again in the SUb and laughs.*
Seraphina
lol, it was her accent I couldn't deal with...I know it's as close as comparrison as they could make to the western version of an Osakan dialect, but it was just....so badly done huh.gif I can't think of a single VA in the dub who wasn't either wooden, or hamming.

The Japanese VAs, on the other hand, all did an excellent job....Osaka's a real show stealer, and I love Yomi's dead pan counter to Tomo...it's just a great series overall, and I want to string up whoever dubbed it, given they managed to utterly butcher one of the best comedies of the past decade disgust.gif
buggyelfmaiden
Thank ADV

They screw up almost everything they touch.
doomgirl
I'd rather dubbed, more time watching and less time reading tongue.gif
Janiel
dubbed. only because subtitles distract me and i miss something... crying.gif
AndyThorley
They hack anime to pieces when they bring them to the UK.

Pokemon, for instance, is a 15/18 certificate in Japan. The pokemon dont get KOd...they die.
Bloodily.

Card Captor Sakura? One of the most perverse things I ever saw O_O

Anyhow.
Dubbing can be good if it's done right.
As of yet, I have seen one show when they've dubbed it right. Cowboy Bebop.
Seriously, Cowboy Bebop is the only show where I'd recommend the dub over the sub.

Generally I prefer subs...but only if theyre done right.
Again drawing on cowboy bebop, the DVD I have is horribly subtitled.
"Subeiko, what be you go?"
["Spike, where are you going?"]

wink2.gif
buggyelfmaiden
It wasn't dont that bad over here in the states....


I watched it both ways.

And I can't beleive what they did to CCS.... I'm a magoc CLAMP fan and I was totally appalled by how they edited it. They took out all the cute scenes with Touya and Yuki.

*Grumbles* And don't get me started on FAKE.

The sub on that one is worth watching... The Dub.... Gah....
Talon

I prefer dubbed, so I can actually watch the thing without having to be constantly reading. However, there are some great anime which you have no choice in the matter with, e.g. Magical Project S and Card Captor Sakura are only avialable in Japanese.

And although I agree that certain animes do need to watched in Japanese because the English dubbed killed them dead e.g. Azumanga, the Canadian DBGT, Sailormoon etc There are very goods dubs out there. Older animes on the market such as Tenchi, Escaflowne, Evangelion, Cowboy Bebop (although I hate that show), Oh My Goddess and so forth I think are very good, Tenchi's cast in particular have more character in the English version than the Japanese (feel free to criticise me if you disagree), others such as Slayers have awful supporting cast but good main character VAs. And like Sera says, of the new animes which have appeared over the last few years such as Excel, Noir, FMP, Fruits Basket, Angelic Layer, Burn Up Excess, Najica Blitz Tactics, Die Guard etc are treating anime seriously and putting effort into the voice acting with one or two exceptions when dealling with supporting cast members.

QUOTE
Thank ADV

They screw up almost everything they touch.


Personally I think almost all the good voice acting is in shows released by ADV (if we just ignore Azu) and Pioneer. Now Funimation... theres a company who persist in wiping out good titles.


QUOTE
And I can't beleive what they did to CCS.... I'm a magoc CLAMP fan and I was totally appalled by how they edited it. They took out all the cute scenes with Touya and Yuki.


I was more upset when I heard they removed any ambigious scenes of Tomoyo's feelings for Sakura... oh well. I simply don't watch Cardcaptors, CCS might not be aviable in English, but its better to watch the Japanese version than its inferior hack-job US version.

buggyelfmaiden
QUOTE (Talon S. @ May 23 2004, 11:18 AM)
I was more upset when I heard they removed any ambigious scenes of Tomoyo's feelings for Sakura... oh well. I simply don't watch Cardcaptors, CCS might not be aviable in English, but its better to watch the Japanese version than its inferior hack-job US version.

True...

You know they can't show same sex couples to the little kids... even if it's hinted at... Noooo That's a bad thing... Then.. OH MY! We'll have the kids agreeing that same sex couples are okay!

Sorry for that. It's just I'm sorta tired of the censorship here in the states, which now that the FCC has more control... Is only going to get worse...

Don't know how it is in Canada or elsewhere though. Please forgive this pathetic little elfie for that okay?

Thankies!
Seraphina
Since the UK doesn't dub its own anime, we recieve the american or candian dubs of anime, and suffer the same censorship you do. And much of it is sad...

One of the shows that really got me into anime was Dragon Ball Z....it's so delightfully simple, has fantastic fight scenes, and none of that wishy washy plot garbage cool.gif The characters just go from one jaw dropping fight scene to the next, and it's the sorta thing that'll get a bored teenager's attention cool.gif

However....the dub is utter rubbish. Not quite as bad as Dragon Ball GT, or more recently the absolute slaughtering they've done of Dragon Ball, but DBZ was just...badly done. When they had to exchange every mention of death for "moving to the next dimension" it's just...bah, way too uptight.

Fortunately, the funimation dub was actually a vast improvement....I still do stand amazed that funimation managed to dub something without completely screwing it up, and Pioneer were the ones who released the Turkey huh.gif It's like...stepping into a parallel universe....
Byuu94
As anyone will tell you the only anime I have the chance to watch is on tv, so guarnteed it is dubbed. I would reccomend subbed though, unless you've already seen it dubbed. Once i get used to a voice, I don't like it to be changed. When they showed DBZ on Cartoon Network, every time they would show new episodes two or three characters would have different voices. Also the editing on tv is usually strict. Like cartoon network showed evangelion for three days and there was no blood in sight.

Oddly enough, even though I haven't seen any anime for over a year, whenever I draw a character it looks like anime. (even when I drawn Ernst Stavro Blofeld)
MrScuzzles
I am a dubbed man all the way. I hate it when people are anime purists and think that the subs are that better. I figure that if I don't speak Japanese and I'm not learning Japanese than there's no point in watching it in Japanese.
AndyThorley
QUOTE (Byuu94 @ Jun 2 2004, 01:33 AM)
Like cartoon network showed evangelion for three days and there was no blood in sight.

whoa...that's a lot of editing wink2.gif

I trust they didn't also take out the excessive whining? Cause if they did then you, sir, did not watch evangelion tongue.gif

Mr.S: It's not a matter of whether you're learning Japanese or want to speak the language, but which set of voices you prefer.

Love Hina, for instance...all the girls talk normally in the original. But in the dubbed version they messed up big.
One of the girls comes from southern america, for some reason (ah, Kay-taw-ro, ah jez' lurve whatch'all dun hyah), one of the girls had an awful indian accent (which went against what people said in the series anyway...she looks indian but isnt), they fluffed up on the intonation patterns/pronunciation times (often's the time when a character would be like "ohit'snothingwejustcameheretoseewhatwasgoingon" beause the Japanese line was half that length and they didnt bother changing the animation (IE: Slowing it down for a couple seconds)

Also if you watch the subs then the chances are youre going to get an awful lot more in your episodes than you would if you watch the edited dub.
Talon
QUOTE
I hate it when people are anime purists and think that the subs are that better.


Yeah, I never understood the purists. They want anime in the west to return to a few fans trading subbed eps over the internet, and seem to shun any attempt to make it mainstream or dubbed. Personally my remark to them is, Get stuffed! Now I know that in part it was because of purists that anime has become known to the west, but for the love of god, I'm glad that shows like DBZ were dubbed brought over here and shown to a larger population. In 1996 they bring out Ghost in a Shell, and only a handful of people raise their heads and notice, in 2003 they bring over Spirited Away and it gets an Academy Award. Personally I see that as an improvement, it means less chance of people who find out I like anime saying 'you watch cartoons?!', but more importantly more anime has been released in the west the last 4 years than the 10 years before that. Anime is everywhere, we have a vaster selection to get hold of without relying on internet DL times and what the subbers decide to do. Price is also changed, I remember Oh My Goddess was sold at £25 per episode on video, now its £16 for 3 eps on DVD.

The life on an anime fan has changed for the better since anime became mainstream, and now it is enjoyed and appreciated by a far greater population that was previous. And I am so sick of purists who liked anime when it was just them watching Akira and Overfiend over and over in the dark of their bedrooms while everyone else in house is asleep. Furthermore, I have an anime collection of about 600 odd DVDs, I spend half my pay check on the stuff and merchandise, and yet I'm so sick of purists on the internet saying I can't be a true anime fan because I only started watching anime in 2000 as opposed 1990!
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