What exactly have you seen/experienced?

BTW, thanks everyone for sharing.

And, WHOA! My boss DOES look like Jesus!!

Mike,

Great topic for a post, especially a first post!

I'm agnostic, more or less, but I tend to think of myself as a "hopeful agnostic". That is, I'm not sure if there's a God or not, but I sort of lean in the direction of thinking there is, and I definitely hope there is. I've prayed that God would show me some kind of sign of its existence, but the problem is that since I know I hope there is a God, I'm prone to interpreting any possible sign as simply my own wishful thinking. Which it may very well be, but then again it might also be an actual sign from God, and how am I to tell the difference? I know this isn't exactly the same as your experience, since you evidently do believe in God, but I do think it's similar.

I've had lots of small experiences like the one you had with the license plate. In fact, one thing that happened to me a number of times also involved license plates. At the time, I lived at home with my Dad and sister, and my sis and I spent the day with my Mom once a week (my parents were divorced, and we lived with my Dad, but my Mom lived about 1/2 hour drive away). I was going through some fairly serious depression, for a variety of reasons, and felt that I wanted God to show me some kind of sign of hope. I don't know if you know French at all, but the past tense of the word "believe" in French is "cru". Well, I started seeing "cru" all over the place in people's license plates, for a few months at least. Admittedly, this could simply be coincidence, but in any case it helped me.

Other times I've found bits of paper with things written on them that were either notes thrown at me by God, lol, or else amazing & amusing coincidence. For example, I used to work at a bookshop in a mall, and I was at work one day and feeling very down. I was straightening the poetry section, and saw a crumpled up piece of white paper on the floor, so I picked it up, and being nosy I wanted to see if anything was written on it before I threw it out. For the life of me I can't remember exactly what it said (I wish I could, but this was over 10 years ago), but I do know that it was something encouraging, like an affirmation of some kind only it wasn't corny/cheesy, and it was the only thing written on the paper, there was no other context. Yes, someone could have written it for themselves to make themselves feel better, and then just dropped it in our store accidentally -- in fact, that probably is what happened. Still, who's to say that if there's a God, God didn't plan it that way for me to find? Again, either way, it helped.

Another time -- more recently, this, about 7 years ago, and in the town where I live now -- I was walking along the street in town, feeling lonely, and written on the dark red brick facade of a shop I glanced at as I walked past someone had written something like "You saw the beauty, and you understood, and you were glad" in white chalk.?!?!? Again, it was entirely alone, out of any other context.

About a year ago I asked, rather randomly, that if there was a God would God please show me a blue star. Not an actual astral body, I mean a star representation -- you know, like you would draw. In blue. Every now and then I'd think of it, and look around me, but no blue star. Then one day my boyfriend and I were driving, and I wasn't thinking at all about God or the star, when I looked out the window and saw a huge blue star painted on the side of a building across the highway, for no reason that I could see (e.g., it wasn't a club called "The Blue Star", or anything like that). The star looked a bit faded, weathered as though it had been there a while. I was surprised and a little flabbergasted.

I hadn't actually made this connection until now, but -- where my boyfriend and I were driving that day was to the vet. A co-worker and I had found a cat at the parking garage at work, and though we asked around we couldn't find the owner, and couldn't find an animal shelter open to take him. We couldn't leave him in a parking garage, as he might get run over, so finally I took him home for the night. I was thinking about keeping him, and started looking for vets to have him checked out, get his shots, etc. He was a nice cat, quite affectionate, but you know how cats sometimes will let you pet them for 20 minutes and then when they decide that's enough they nip or scratch you? Or how they will hide behind a piece of furniture until you walk by, the run out and nip you and run away? Well, he nipped my calf and my knee. Not badly, only one drew blood, and then only a drop, and it didn't hurt -- but the problem was, I didn't know anything about this cat, if he'd had his shots, etc. So we were taking him to the vet to get him tested for rabies and other diseases, to be sure he didn't pass anything on to me. Long story short(ish) -- I didn't know you can't test for rabies unless you cut into the brain, so the vet had to put the cat to sleep and do that. I was extremely upset and bawling, as was my boyfriend. It was AWFUL. But now the connection that I'm making is that is was on that car ride that I saw the blue star I'd asked for. Which makes me feel better now.

I hope I haven't hijacked your thread, but once I got started I kept remembering more stuff. There are probably other things as well, but it's 11.30 pm and I've got to have a shower and go to bed.

Thanks for starting this thread!

I feel the same way.

Hi, Mike_Deuce, and welcome!

I have something very recent to share, that happened just last week. I've been going through some incredibly awful stuff, a lot of which I didn't think possible until now. Feeling very hopeless, scared, and not knowing what to do, I prayed like I've never prayed before. I have always believed in God, but am not active in any church and have slacked on the praying. I have asked for signs before, too, and felt ignored.

I'm thinking that it only works when you really pour your heart out, ask for forgiveness for whatever it is you might have done that you're not even aware of, and ask to be saved. I had this incredible sense of peace come over me, a euphoria. I asked that he send guardians to help me out with my situation. I smelled lilacs very strong, and knew that he did indeed send them. I know it sounds stupid, but it's true!

Since then, I'm still having problems, but it seems like the bad side's power has maybe lost some strength (I hope). I think maybe we're not supposed to demand proof of his existence, because we're supposed to have faith.

Goddamn! I cant look at that word without automatically thinking of Racer X. It drives me mad But Jeff Maritn is One Hot Bitch!

Not that anyone here would realise who Racer X is

I was taking the piss at his comment. Sorry mate.

Interesting story but i don't think it was a sign. Maybe a coincedence. I don't like putting everything down to conspiracy straight away. Its easier to find no posible alternative and THEN decide on conspiracy etc.

Oh, so you're just gonna set me up like that and not even tell me what you seen?

I know what it is! Ya CHEAP aintcha? YA CHEEAAPP!!

That's why no one ever wants to hang out with ya! Cuz ya CHEEAAP!!

...

Oh... Sorry... That was the alcohol talkin'...

i have to say this..


if that pic in your profile is really you... the card speaks the truth.



Must be a sign

[QUOTE]
well i hope you turn the other cheek saucy.
i can't believe in god presently, haven't for quite a while.
but if you look for signs hard enough, you can see them in anything.

but back to saucy, these people who would call you ignorant for your beliefs, must be very intollerant.
i for one, as i say, cannot believe. but i look at those who have faith and am almost jealous, because i feel i am still looking for a good spiritual centre.
i look at someone who has a faith, and instead of thinking, how can they be so stupid as to believe in that, think, i guess maybe i'm not smart enough to get it.
and possibly that is the case.
i'll always keep looking, but not for signs, or divine interventions, just find something that feeds my inner peace.

Thankyou...im truly flattered

Matter of fact huh? I cant take it when people talk like you. "Believe me, God does exist" as if its been proven. Its this sort of attitude that pisses me off the most sometimes. Would you like if I started talking "If you understood stuff and saw things like I do, then you'd have no doubt that God does not exist" or "Believe me, you're religion is wrong" huh? I have no doubt that others see it this way too.

Did I ever make the claim that I KNOW that (a) god (s) does not exist? I simply do not accept it because theres no reason to, what so ever. No reason to place (a) god (s) into science, and theres no evidence of it neither. Thats the difference. I dont go out saying "God does not exist. Its a fact!" while you go and say "Believe me, God does exist. Its a fact!"

Just curious, what do you mean by that. Right now I cant imagine of a way of proving he doesnt exist...

Todd, the frustration here is from a general misunderstanding of how scientific methodology works.

Stellar:

The first step to creating a theory of anything (including God) is to first verify that any such phenomena exists. This is an essential first step and cannot be avoided, not matter how many paranormal investigators would like to. So, the essential first question is asked, and the word "know', is used. As a scientific term, to "know" is to be aware of the factuality of a phenomena, i.e. to have a practical understanding of it. This implies the ability to objectively classify the various stages of it, and the ability to both replicate and predict present and future results.

From the very beginning we have a problem. A theory does not exists to disprove something. A theory is a formal explanation of a phenomena, including the formula that it follows and the methods with which the results can be reproduced. What your first question is asking, however, is that we prove a negative. This cannot be done. By definition, we cannot know that something is not, until we know that something is. In other words, until we "know" what causes the phenomena known as God, we cannot state that we "know" what isn't God.

That's the answer to the first part of your argument: Why can we "know" a positive, but not "know" a negative. This is why the second part of your post, concerning belief, is actually correct. Burnside (and myself) do not believe in God because of our personal opinions.

However...this is where it gets tricky...the source of our opinions is also being discussed here. And this is where most of the disagreement occurs.

When the case for God was presented, the evidence being presented was neither imperical nor objective, so Stellar clarified that the evidence is of an entirely different classification (which, in scientific terminology, would be referred to as a postulate; a statement of faith). "I beleive" was being used as the equivalent of "I know". Since, as I explained above, this is not considered scientific evidence, the argument as to wether one "knows" God is moot. No evidence = no "knowing" = no God (as a scientific theory).

In your counter, however, we do not "know" God isn't real, but we do "know" how several phenomena that have been attributed to Him can be explained scientifically. Once we "know" how every phenomena that is attributed to God works, then and only then can we claim to "know" God isn't real, by process of elimination. If there is no phenomena requiring the theory of God, then there is no need for the existance of God.

Therefore, the reason we have chosen not to "beleive" in God is because no evidence has appeared that would require God as an theory. Yes, that is our opinion, but our opinion was arrived at through statistics and logic, both objective and repeatable to anyone, regardless of personal bias or opinion. Your opinion, however, is derived from personal observation and reflection, which is, by definition, subjective, and cannot be repeated by anybody, even members of the same faith (as the saying goes, "Everyone must find their own path." This is what seperates the scientific opinion from the faith-based belief. And it is why, as was your original question, you cannot simply reverse the argument and use it as a counter.

Now tell me exactly how you "know" there is not a God. It goes both ways. No one "knows" either way, you either believe or you don't. In your own mind your not wrong, so why argue with someone on their religion? No one actually knows if their right, it's just what you believe to be right.

So just because some Russians didn't see God in space, then he doesn't exist. There is so much out there we haven't discovered yet, including other planets not in our solar system. Plus, God isn't supposed to be in "space" he lives in "the heavens".

Please, if youre gonna participate in the thread... read up on it. I never said I "know" theres no God. Sheesh

Yeah, there is so much out there we haven't discovered and uncovered yet... so why attribute some new things we witness to God? People look at the Galactic wall and say "See? We dont know the explenation for that, that proves God!"

previous threads have stated "facts" which have a very very high possibilty of being untrue....for example...the dinosaurs being killed in nohas flood...but there is 64 MILLION years between today and the time of the mass extinction. i dont even think an idiot could carbon date it and get it wrong by that much.

anyways...here is another "historical fact" adam and eves two sons...cain and abel....both took wives....and got married...but wait ...adam and eve were the frist humans...so what did those two take as wives....other humans?? that would mean that they wernt the first people.

the story of the bible...to me...in my non believer opinion, is flawed from the begining